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UPDATED: Josh Duggar Part 13 - No longer missing, Still a Jerk


Boogalou

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Maybe he doesn't want to leave. In there he's just another guy with whatever issue... He's not in any spotlight, his dad can't get to him as easily, & he doesn't have to go home & play an expected role. As long as he tells counselors or his family that he's still tempted or he's still being convicted by God, he is good to stay there. 

Who would want to go home to a small town where everyone knows your ugliest secret, face the parents who continue to skew your perception, & a family you now have to fight & scratch to support... Who's gonna hire him now? The money train can only go so far with a dozen littles still up & coming. 

Oh, & Anna doesn't look pg to me either. 

 

(Edited:  I'm sorry y'all, my posts are erratic. School & work keep me bogged down so I read the threads in bulk then answer what I can when I can put a coherent thought together)

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4 hours ago, MatthewDuggar said:

As far as the happy birthday posts, it reads with a disdain that seems pretty uncommon for these people.  Usually they gloss-over any negatives or pretend they didn't or are not happening.  

I thought so too. I think they're distancing themselves from him (publicly, anyway...privately, probably not) because now they have no more illusions that he's going to be a good boy in the future and they're not willing to gamble their reputation on it anymore. Next time something comes out, they want to just be able to express sadness and disappointment, without anyone suspecting it might reflect on them and their lifestyle. They acknowledge him as the family screwup now, and hope everyone will just think, "A shame about the oldest one, but 18 out of 19 is still good!" and leave it at that. It's really the smartest way they could have played this. So kudos to their slimy PR team for that.

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15 hours ago, Coy Koi said:

And it's likely that a real treatment place wouldn't take him anyway. I don't think he probably has an addiction problem, I think he's just a selfish asshole. The treatment for that is to stop being a selfish asshole (and perhaps get some legit therapy on an outpatient basis, without abandoning your family), not run away and hide for 6+ months.

Exactly.  I mean.  WTF did he do that would merit six months of fucking INCARCERATION?  Well... what did he do LATELY that would merit six months?  I mean, it's so bizarre and over the top.  

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Well, if he's still at Jesus camp, what Anna probably gave him for his birthday was "the secks".... surely that would merit a conjugal visit... so the possibility exists that a pregnancy could emerge. 

 

I, too, miss the aviation thread.

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Interesting that he's still at RU.  I am not that surprised now that I think about it.  Not just because of the new show but maybe after being hidden away for six months, maybe he's preferring not to go back to where, as other posters noted, where everyone knows your darkest secrets. your relationship with your family is broken and prospects are not that great.    He might feel more protected at RU, perhaps even more useful than if he did if he went home.   I wouldn't discount the possibility of depression in his case either.

At some point he's going to have to face the music and move on but after being exalted as the Golden Child with the bright future doing great things (molestations and SOTDRT notwithstanding) the mighty fall from grace, being shamed by the media and his family of origin, his darkest secrets exposed, he may not able to cope.  At least not in any mature way.   He's still a boy in a man's body, and he certainly would not learn any effective coping mechanisms at RU.

I wonder if it was Josh who wanted to stay and did the necessary things to ensure it rather than it being RU's decision.  

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I really feel for the M kids in this situation. Kids don't generally remember much at the age they are at, so I recon (I'm just grasping at straws here) only Mackynzie will remember who he is. When (if?) he goes back to them the 3 youngest probably wont even recognise him. It's just a horrible situation.

Argh! The last couple of days I have really started to feel sorry for Josh. I must remember why it's so screwed up and sad...it's almost completely his own fault (Boob and J'chelle can get some of the blame too).

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3 minutes ago, Bushes of Love said:

I really feel for the M kids in this situation. Kids don't generally remember much at the age they are at, so I recon (I'm just grasping at straws here) only Mackynzie will remember who he is. When (if?) he goes back to them the 3 youngest probably wont even recognise him. It's just a horrible situation.

Argh! The last couple of days I have really started to feel sorry for Josh. I must remember why it's so screwed up and sad...it's almost completely his own fault (Boob and J'chelle can get some of the blame too).

I bet Michael will remember him too.  I wouldn't be surprised if Anna or other family members shows them all pictures of Josh every day and remind them "that's daddy".  I'm guessing they've also made up a reason why he's gone.  Or at least I hope they did - I can't imagine my dad just suddenly being gone at that age.  Even with an explanation, it would be so sad and confusing.  Poor kids. 

 

If Josh wants out to be free/be with other women (possible eventually) and Anna stays in cult (also possible), I hope at least that Josh still wants to see his kids and exposes them to the world outside Gothard.  Then at least maybe something good could eventually come of Josh's selfish behavior (the cheating, not the molestation)

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He can't hide forever though, at some point he has to face reality. After all, Anna has had to deal with it all by herself (with the in-laws) for 6 months.

Prayer can only get you so far (says the atheist :kitty-wink: ) before you have to drag yourself up by the boot straps and get on with life.

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2 minutes ago, CoveredInBees said:

He can't hide forever though, at some point he has to face reality. After all, Anna has had to deal with it all by herself (with the in-laws) for 6 months.

Prayer can only get you so far (says the atheist :kitty-wink: ) before you have to drag yourself up by the boot straps and get on with life.

Agree.  At this point one would think Josh would have made a decision.  He really is at a crossroads and during this "time out" he's had time to think about what he's going to do next.  Can he really ever go home again?  His brokenhearted wife may stand by him, but she'll hover endlessly because she'll never trust him again,and she's probably not what he really wants anyway.  His youngest daughter doesn't know him, youngest son has probably forgotten him, and the two oldest probably feel personally abandoned.  His parents are disgusted and furious over the brand damage and even his siblings repeatedly threw him under the bus on freakin' television.

What's a Smuggar to do?  I can only say what I think I'd do.  Say thanks but no thanks to the Duggar circus and move to an isolated area of the country where TMZ isn't likely to camp out for the first few weeks and where I could find honest work to support myself and provide child support.  And I'd try to re-establish whatever relationship I could with my kids through non-Duggarsville visits.  Before you know it, they'll be old enough to travel themselves.

Does he have the balls to do anything like this?  Probably not, but if he's staying away of his own accord, hopefully he's weighing some realistic options that don't land him back in that dysfunctional mess of a family.

 

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2 hours ago, Coy Koi said:

I thought so too. I think they're distancing themselves from him (publicly, anyway...privately, probably not) because now they have no more illusions that he's going to be a good boy in the future and they're not willing to gamble their reputation on it anymore. Next time something comes out, they want to just be able to express sadness and disappointment, without anyone suspecting it might reflect on them and their lifestyle. They acknowledge him as the family screwup now, and hope everyone will just think, "A shame about the oldest one, but 18 out of 19 is still good!" and leave it at that. It's really the smartest way they could have played this. So kudos to their slimy PR team for that.

I agree - they're not going to give him another chance to hurt them, and I'm sure he knows it.  Unlike last time, he's not going to become front and center (or anywhere) on the family show or be handed another executive director job.  I doubt he'll ever be left alone in a room with younger, female family members.  His children will eventually know at least some version of what he did.  I find it hard to not feel a bit sorry for him, especially considering the choices Jim Bob and Michelle made when he was a teenager.

Still think he's going to end up at Big Sandy with a flip phone. 

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5 hours ago, CoveredInBees said:

I don't like him, I don't like what he's done, but I don't believe for one moment that he needed in patient therapy for cheating on his wife. They needed to work through that together (either trial separation, divorce or counselling if that's what they both want) whilst he found work and supported her with the kids. He undoubtedly needs therapy for a whole host of things, but I wholeheartedly believe he could've done that without it being residential.

I think Josh's upbringing has royally screwed up his mind.  If he was ready to make some changes, then I believe real long-term counseling could help him figure out why he behaves the way he does, and develop some tools to truly change his ways.  It seems the main goal of Jesus Jail is to force the participant to hide his or her real needs/desires/urges even deeper, paint on a very thick coat of "I'm Saved!", and then go forth pretending everything is all right.

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I think that the way Josh and Anna were raised has a lot to do with how they will handle this situation. 

In my way of thinking, they are operating in a teenage state of mind. Josh spent 6 months in Jesus rehab, he's OK!

Anna has spent 6 months praying for everything to be OK, so it is. 

Ugh, adolescence is a drag. I wouldn't want to go through it again, much less married with children. ;p My heart goes out to them, truly. 

I'm not excusing their parents who should know better! :(

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I have no familiarity with rehab programs but to my untrained eye it looks like six months or more is too long for an in-patient stay.  Just keeping him there for no reason would be medical malpractice in a legitimate rehab environment.  Don't they usually try to ease them into the real world through out-patient programs? I live close to the Betty Ford Center but I don't know if there is any rule set in stone about the length of stay. I know there is a 30 day minimum and that their patients do end up as out-patients, sometimes in a residential setting where they come back in the evening after being out and about all day.

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Josh has not been committed or sentenced to "rehab"; if he is still there it's because he's choosing to stay. As for when he gets out, I wonder if SS will even allow him to stay at TTH? And if so, will he be bunking in the boys dorm since Anna has been staying with the girls? I would think if there had been a spare bedroom in that place then it would already have been offerred to Anna.

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Being that RU isn't a legitimate treatment program (meaning not by real world aka non fundie standards) I  guess they can pretty much do what they think is necessary or right with their participants.   In Josh's case, he's a high profile participant, most likely being paid by JB's money, so that is probably a factor in whether or not they can keep him longer.   And it also gives Josh more leeway in wanting to stay if that's what he wants.

The RU program with heavy emphasis on work couldn't have been fun for Josh, but it's been a safe haven from the outside world.who knows all about him and from family who obviously are still angry at him.  He successfully escaped his parents and tasted freedom for a time.   I can see him not wanting to go back to the life he escaped and under worse conditions than when he left.  Conditions that would make him feel more of a prisoner than at RU.  I can see why he would voluntarily stay.  

I agree that he could forge a better life outside of Duggardom.   It would mean going against all that he's been raised with but he's done enough of it already.  At this point he probably doesn't have much to lose all things considered.  And it might be a more honest life for him.  

Granted, he's done some awful things but there's a point where everyone needs to move on.  It does no good to keep on shaming him for the rest of his life, either for him, for Anna and this kids, and his FOO.   That's not to say it's all OK but keeping his sins at the forefront, something which I think the family is more than willing to do, day in and day out for an indefinite period, only reinforces the hurt and the trauma for everyone.  

 

 

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41 minutes ago, Becket70 said:

I have no familiarity with rehab programs but to my untrained eye it looks like six months or more is too long for an in-patient stay.  Just keeping him there for no reason would be medical malpractice in a legitimate rehab environment.  Don't they usually try to ease them into the real world through out-patient programs? I live close to the Betty Ford Center but I don't know if there is any rule set in stone about the length of stay. I know there is a 30 day minimum and that their patients do end up as out-patients, sometimes in a residential setting where they come back in the evening after being out and about all day.

I am only slightly familiar with rehab.  I had a friend who was alcoholic and went through rehab several times.  The usual length of stay seems to be around 30 days, and then the person either transitions home or to a halfway house with others who are also working on their sobriety.  I just hope Josh isn't somehow being held somewhere basically against his will.  We know there are religious groups that have camps for "wayward" children where this sort of thing happens - basically held against your will until you are deemed healed or whatever.  As an adult, I would think it less likely he'd be held somewhere against his will because if and when he got out, he could sue them for false imprisonment.

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1 hour ago, Dandruff said:

I agree - they're not going to give him another chance to hurt them, and I'm sure he knows it.  Unlike last time, he's not going to become front and center (or anywhere) on the family show or be handed another executive director job.  I doubt he'll ever be left alone in a room with younger, female family members.  His children will eventually know at least some version of what he did.  I find it hard to not feel a bit sorry for him, especially considering the choices Jim Bob and Michelle made when he was a teenager.

Still think he's going to end up at Big Sandy with a flip phone. 

I do have to disagree in that I don't think the family will have a problem leaving Josh with little girls. They have done it for years. His screwing around on Anna won't change that. They believe he is cured of being a child molester. Why limit his contact with children now? Their primary concern is Josh looking at porn or being unfaithful, not hold molestation. That family is not concerned about the safety of its daughters in relation to Josh. Let's not forget the child molestation was not as not a big deal to them as it would be to us. Their actions prove that, as do the repeated excuses they have made for his behavior.  They believe he was just a curious boy and that its normal behavior. 

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If RU is allowing him to stay just because Josh doesn't want to face the real world, this so-called "treatment facility" is doing him no favors.  Or, perhaps, it is Jim Bob who is pulling Josh's puppet strings and forcing him to stay longer, which would be really sad since Josh is a 28 year-old man.  Or, worst case scenario, they are training Josh to be a "therapist" so he can help others at RU and that would be his new vocation. The entire situation involving RU is sick and sad.

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30 minutes ago, EmmieJ said:

The usual length of stay seems to be around 30 days,

I think the 30 days is what insurance will pay for.

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6 hours ago, ksgranola1 said:

She doesn't look pregnant to me. Jennifer Aniston is supposed to be pregnant w/twins but I saw her pic recently, *Oscars?* & she didn't look pregnant w/anything.

Jennifer Aniston has had more pregnancies than Michelle and Kelly combined according to those magazines.

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6 hours ago, ksgranola1 said:

She doesn't look pregnant to me. Jennifer Aniston is supposed to be pregnant w/twins but I saw her pic recently, *Oscars?* & she didn't look pregnant w/anything.

Speaking of Anna she has sure come along way. From Mousy to Glam. TLC must have paid for a makeup artist for the Duggar Girls and Anna. Anna did not have any style nor class until she and Joshie moved to Washington then she really started to evolve. She even got her teeth fixed. Are Gothard Women taught to look like Barbie Clones?  Another Question. Does Jimbob Duggar wear a hairpiece?

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21 minutes ago, Becket70 said:

If RU is allowing him to stay just because Josh doesn't want to face the real world, this so-called "treatment facility" is doing him no favors.  Or, perhaps, it is Jim Bob who is pulling Josh's puppet strings and forcing him to stay longer, which would be really sad since Josh is a 28 year-old man.  Or, worst case scenario, they are training Josh to be a "therapist" so he can help others at RU and that would be his new vocation. The entire situation involving RU is sick and sad.

I can see JB calling the shots here too which would be pretty sad indeed.  Josh is an adult and can walk out of there if he wanted.   Come to think of it, if Josh is realistically assessing his options and does not want to return to the Duggar fold (couldn't blame him if he were) than maybe that's enough for JB to consider he's not reformed enough and keep him there longer.   I have no doubts that it's JB's money that's paying for this.  

 

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I can believe he'd stay on to become a "therapist". There are no qualifications needed at RU, and SOTDRT should get him in. JB can say he has a son who is a counselor along with his concert pianist daughter.

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