Sarah Maxwell took a plane trip and Mary posts OCC

[teachergirl]

Who wants to pool our money together and next time get her a one way ticket anywhere she wants to go...... How can anyone in this movement look at that and think this is normal? For the love of God, she is a 34 year old woman!!! Good job Maxwells on your stellar parenting skills. Free Sarah!

[Hane]

1 hour ago, Black Aliss said:

Someone pointed out in the comments about the grammar error. How much you want to bet that comment doesn't stay up there, and the post gets corrected? Can't have the Maxwell SOTDRT looking bad.

Thaaaaaat would be me. I'm amazed my comment was posted (I never did see it), but surprised that Steve didn't swoop in and change the "I's."

[Dru]

Man, I thought Sarah's writing was bad. I'd like to see Abby write a post and, spelling aside, see how it compares to this mess. 

[socalrules]

Why does everyone think Sarah traveled alone? She doesn't say she went alone, just that she was going to see a friend. For all we know, Sarah went with with a brother as an accountability buddy because he is courting someone. 

[Dru]

An aside, I was looking back at old Kentucky blog posts to see if I could find anything interesting and I came across a pic of Mary with Elizabeth Munck. I felt happy for her all over again that she managed to dodge the Maxhell bullet.

Back on topic, yay Sarah for getting to get on an airplane like a big girl. I hope you got wild and crazy and had yourself a Coke.

[SolomonFundy]

21 minutes ago, socalrules said:

Why does everyone think Sarah traveled alone? She doesn't say she went alone, just that she was going to see a friend. For all we know, Sarah went with with a brother as an accountability buddy because he is courting someone. 

While I'm all for maintaining a high level of skepticism about anything reported by and from Maxhell, this seems about as clear as it gets. As evidenced by Mary's utterly abysmal efforts in describing the time she spent with her brother and Alyssa at the Operation Christmas Child center, the Maxspawn lack the grammatical sophistication necessary to pull off deliberate misdirection. They will fall all over themselves to document the movements of every person involved in a given trip or activity. Had Sarah traveled with a sibling (especially a brother), they would have been included in either the text or the photographs, even if it were merely by the use of "we" instead of "I".

All of that aside, there was an extraordinary amount of effort put into describing Sarah's connection to her host family and friend. Had this been a shared trip, there probably wouldn't have been such an emphasis on establishing her friend's relationship with the family. 

[SolomonFundy]

5 hours ago, twin2 said:

Somewhere out there, there is a Mom's Corner that said that she chose workbooks, because that meant she didn't have to do any prep work.  I  don't know how she can wear her "I home-schooled for 30 years Merit Badge" with such pride.  Basically it seems all she did was buy workbooks, make a schedule and listen to them read for a half hour once every few days.

Don't forget that she spent several excruciating hours every year taking pictures of them the week BEFORE school started, because taking the picture the actual first day of school would send her into a tailspin of disorganization that would throw off their entire week.  

[albanuadh_1]

Planned trip on Valentine's Day weekend... hmmm. lol. ;-)

[MamaJunebug]

I don't see a comment correcting Mary's grammatical error, but I've screen capped the original version of her post,  just in case it does get changed. 

P. Sarah's smile looks a little less forlorn in the shopping photo, but I hope she & Tiffany got to take in a movie or browse some sites without precious siblings along. Selfish of me, I know. 

[samira_catlover]

7 hours ago, Odd1Out said:

She tells us to consider sending gifts for 'the older boys' or 'the younger boys'. Then later says the middle age group gets more donations. Maybe tell the age range of those groups, Mary, for it to make more sense. And yes, "Joseph and I's trip" is very telling of her education. 

*curls up on ground, alternating between hissing viciously and whimpering pathetically*

Look, I can see occasionally splitting infinitives, a dangling infinitive does not always make me stabby, and no real objection here to ending a sentence with a preposition (Hullo, Winnie C: "up with which I will not put") or even beginning a sentence with a conjunction.

But "Joseph and I's trip"??!??!

"I's going to Europe!" ? 

Don't any of these folk READ lots of real books to get a feel for how the language moves?

[DaffyDill]

31 minutes ago, samira_catlover said:

Don't any of these folk READ lots of real books to get a feel for how the language moves?

No.

[samira_catlover]

7 minutes ago, DaffyDill said:

No.

URGHHHHH. KIds cannot LEARN and GROW without lots of books! Trying to raise them (IMNSHO, and honestly, all I have are four-legged babies who go MEOW, so pretty limited here) without books----uggghhhhh.

Are these folk crazy, or is it just me being weird?

How in heck, unless you are raising WolfCubs from the Wild, manage without lots of print material? CHILDREN NEED BOOKS, LOTS, ALL KINDS!

*curls up in corner and does a LOT of SEVERELY majorly hissy stuff*

Good heavens....

[DaffyDill]

5 minutes ago, samira_catlover said:

URGHHHHH. KIds cannot LEARN and GROW without lots of books! Trying to raise them (IMNSHO, and honestly, all I have are four-legged babies who go MEOW, so pretty limited here) without books----uggghhhhh.

Are these folk crazy, or is it just me being weird?

How in heck, unless you are raising WolfCubs from the Wild, manage without lots of print material? CHILDREN NEED BOOKS, LOTS, ALL KINDS!

*curls up in corner and does a LOT of SEVERELY majorly hissy stuff*

Good heavens....

Oh you're absolutely right! Books give you SO much! In fact, reading anything is good, and never a waste.

The thing with the Maxwells is, the Bible is everything. I don't know that they read for fun and enjoyment at all.

Erika Shupe is also very dismissive of reading just "for fun". She thinks that is a waste of time, so will let her kids read autobiographies etc, so at least they are spending their time productively. *eyeroll*

The BEST books are those which transport you away somewhere magical, wonderful, scary or adventurous! Not to mention how books give you a feel for language, teach you comprehension, etc etc etc

I feel for fundy kids not allowed to read, what a dull, stunted life.

[Myfanwy]

Did not one of the hundreds of other adults who live in that house cast their eye over her post before she hit send? Where's the oversight? Where's the protection? More importantly, where's the hiding the poor girl's appalling lack of education? She can clean a fan like a boss but the girl can't put together a sentence for shit. What must her 'outline' ( or whatever the useless hell thing it was) of the bible looked like? 

Me's got so many questions! 

[Vex]

Oh my god.

I consider my grammar to be fairly poor so I always feel a bit guilty criticising another person's grammar, but her writing is atrocious. It's not Mary's fault; she was educated by Teri and wasn't allowed to read books (which is pretty much how I learned grammar) so she never really had a chance.

I'm used to Sarah's writing style, but this just kind of blew me away.

I fucking hate fundie homeschooling. Seriously, fuck them for not giving kids the tools to write basic sentences with correct grammar and spelling in their native language.

[AliceInFundyland]

I don't know how any of you managed to get through one of the Moody books. I couldn't make it through a page.

[Paperplate]

That post ... 

Mary clearly never studied the grammar of her own language nor read any (non-bible, non-Moody) books to familiarise herself with it. So sad.

Since she doesn't really have anything to do all day now she could read some books to learn English. Or even study a foreign language. (Really study it, not just memorise a couple of phrases.) Learning about the grammar of a foreign language teaches you a lot about grammar in general and – by comparison – how it works in your mother tongue.

 

And about OCC:

Candy is allowed, but no chocolate, as @diplomat already pointed out. OCC sucks and people should spend their time and money on better charitable efforts.

[Foudeb]

1 hour ago, Paperplate said:

Since she doesn't really have anything to do all day now she could read some books to learn English. Or even study a foreign language. (Really study it, not just memorise a couple of phrases.) Learning about the grammar of a foreign language teaches you a lot about grammar in general and – by comparison – how it works in your mother tongue.

That's an idea.

Hey Steve, why don't you have them study Greek or Hebrew? It could be -officially- to read the Bible in the original.

Unless of course they truly believe Jesus dictated the KJB himself and the real Bible is only a bit of Jewish propaganda or something. With these people any whacko theory is very much possible.

[Foudeb]

Here's to hoping Sarah and Tiffany can encourage each other to leave the cult. Possibly together.

I imagine fleeing (even in a tiny way like getting paid employment outside the home) would be a lot easier with someone from the same cult background, ie who understands the difficulty of doing so.

Other theory: maybe John did something really outrageous like move out to live on his own for a while. Or start a business that isn't directly controlled by Steve. Or had two Pepsis in a row followed by three animal crackers. Maybe the puppy and the trips are Steve's way of limiting the risk of someone else following suit...

[nastyhobbitses]

2 hours ago, Paperplate said:

That post ... 

Mary clearly never studied the grammar of her own language nor read any (non-bible, non-Moody) books to familiarise herself with it. So sad.

Since she doesn't really have anything to do all day now she could read some books to learn English. Or even study a foreign language. (Really study it, not just memorise a couple of phrases.) Learning about the grammar of a foreign language teaches you a lot about grammar in general and – by comparison – how it works in your mother tongue.

<snip>

To the second point - HELL YES! (And I'm not just saying that because I'm currently studying linguistics)

Actually, right now I'm doing Duolingo and finishing up the French course (I don't think my speaking is very good, but I can understand a lot and I think I have an OK command of a good amount of grammar and vocabulary now), and I've always sort of wondered if any fundie types have considered using it. Sure, it has female voice-overs talking about having jobs and wearing pants and gives you an option to learn phrases for flirting, but it's a pretty easy way to pick up the basics of a new language. Maybe Mary could try learning German, Spanish, French, or maybe Italian or Ukrainian.

[Paperplate]

23 minutes ago, nastyhobbitses said:

To the second point - HELL YES! (And I'm not just saying that because I'm currently studying linguistics)

Actually, right now I'm doing Duolingo and finishing up the French course (I don't think my speaking is very good, but I can understand a lot and I think I have an OK command of a good amount of grammar and vocabulary now), and I've always sort of wondered if any fundie types have considered using it. Sure, it has female voice-overs talking about having jobs and wearing pants and gives you an option to learn phrases for flirting, but it's a pretty easy way to pick up the basics of a new language. Maybe Mary could try learning German, Spanish, French, or maybe Italian or Ukrainian.

(Fellow linguist here.)

While using Duolingo and the like can be a great introduction to a language and help with memorising vocabulary and phrases, it doesn't teach you grammar rules properly or prepares you to actually speak a language. Repeating phrases isn't speaking. (I've seen this approach used in class rooms as well – mainly in English-speaking countries where the study of foreign languages isn't the norm and in countries where the standard style of teaching is chalk and talk. It just doesn't lead to fluency in talking.)

And another point: I'm not sure whether this applies to Duolingo as well, but on other language apps/courses I saw that they just translate the lessons from one language into the other and call it a day. But learning Russian isn't like learning Spanish. It just doesn't work this way.

Back to the topic: Mary needs to learn English. And then it'd be great if she'd study a foreign language as well, even if it's just from an app. (In this day and age, it's super easy to find language tandem partners on the internet!)

[Sundaymorning]

11 hours ago, sparkles said:

That was one of the most abysmally written posts to ever have graced their blog. Seriously. 

English isn't my mother tongue, and yet I cringe when I read their posts, and this one is particularly bad. Seriously, when even non-native speakers laugh about your English skills, you know that your superb SOTDRT education went down the drain. 

[nastyhobbitses]

3 minutes ago, Paperplate said:

(Fellow linguist here.)

While using Duolingo and the like can be a great introduction to a language and help with memorising vocabulary and phrases, it doesn't teach you grammar rules properly or prepares you to actually speak a language. Repeating phrases isn't speaking. (I've seen this approach used in class rooms as well – mainly in English-speaking countries where the study of foreign languages isn't the norm and in countries where the standard style of teaching is chalk and talk. It just doesn't lead to fluency in talking.)

And another point: I'm not sure whether this applies to Duolingo as well, but on other language apps/courses I saw that they just translate the lessons from one language into the other and call it a day. But learning Russian isn't like learning Spanish. It just doesn't work this way.

Back to the topic: Mary needs to learn English. And then it'd be great if she'd study a foreign language as well, even if it's just from an app. (In this day and age, it's super easy to find language tandem partners on the internet!)

Yeah, that's my big issue with Duolingo. I think it's great for getting vocabulary and getting a feel for grammar rules, but I feel like I'd retain the grammar so much better if they'd explain the rules more. Even just a pop-up on a new unit that gives you a rundown of how complete past/subjunctive/whatever works would be great. Doing the exercises with lots of different sentences that build on the vocabulary you've already learned is helpful, but sometimes I feel like I'm just guessing and learning by waiting for it to tell me I screwed up. Really not good when you get into irregulars or exceptions.

And the speaking is frustrating, since you're just sort of repeating phrases into the microphone. It's very limiting, but that's just the limits of the app. I'm basically using it so I can understand signs, count, interact with service workers, and maybe hold a basic conversation when I travel to France this spring, so I'm not THAT bothered by it, but I tell everyone who uses Duolingo to use it as a gateway or a supplement, not your only language learning method, especially if you want to go beyond the basics. If I wanted to work towards actual fluency in French, I'd probably pick a different approach and just use Duolingo to practice and reinforce skills. Right now, it's fun and helps me get down some basic phrases and get a foundation for if I want to go further.

As for the lessons, they do customize the lessons for different language speakers (Arabic for French speakers, Swedish for Russian speakers), but I'm going to wait until I'm done with French to see if they change stuff for different languages. I'm thinking of trying Russian next, since I want to see how they incorporate teaching the Cyrillic alphabet.

[Foudeb]

Fellow Duolingo fan here. It really depends on the language you're learning - the Turkish from English course has really amazing grammar notes.

To learn any language though you need more than one source - Duolingo is great with a textbook on the side and before a proper language course with a real teacher, imho.

[nastyhobbitses]

2 hours ago, Foudeb said:

Here's to hoping Sarah and Tiffany can encourage each other to leave the cult. Possibly together.

I imagine fleeing (even in a tiny way like getting paid employment outside the home) would be a lot easier with someone from the same cult background, ie who understands the difficulty of doing so.

Other theory: maybe John did something really outrageous like move out to live on his own for a while. Or start a business that isn't directly controlled by Steve. Or had two Pepsis in a row followed by three animal crackers. Maybe the puppy and the trips are Steve's way of limiting the risk of someone else following suit...

Maybe Sarah presented him with a sadistic choice: give me a puppy and let me go on a plane by myself, or I'll use my Moody book earnings to buy pants....or put actual spices in our burritos next week!