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Mandatory Fitness


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24 minutes ago, moodygirl86 said:

My last workplace were considering taking our chairs away from our desks and making us do our work standing up as they think office workers don't get enough exercise. I left some feedback making it clear that I walked 35 minutes to the office there and back every day and that I came to work to have a rest!

I've read it's not much better to be standing stationary all day, that it's best to be moving around (bit of sitting, walking, standing) at an office job. One of my former workplaces subsidized people getting those balance ball chairs, but it was optional. That's crazy your old workplace wanted to take away chairs like everyone has the same health needs -- seems like a lawsuit waiting to happen!

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14 hours ago, Curious said:

This is sort of bugging me.  I was going to just let it go, but decided to address it.

Overweight/Fat does NOT equal lazy.   I am fat.  I graduated, many moons ago,  with a 3.93 (fucking stats class), while pregnant (had the baby before I graduated) and working 2 jobs.  My academic standing had absolutely nothing to do with my weight or physical activity.    This is not a unique phenomenon.

Also 10,000 steps can be A LOT of steps for some people.  The ability to walk x amount of steps does nothing to correlate to how healthy a person is.   Despite having been overweight for many years and the fact that I have a lot of health issues (mostly...structural for lack of a better description), my overall health is quite good (ie: liver function, kidney function, nutrition values, blood values...I know this because they are tested every 3 months maximum due to various factors).

 

I don't know why it's bugging you. 

I am aware that fat does not equal lazy. There are, however, studies that show that exercise has an effect on brain function. And it makes sense. Exercise help other organs, why not the brain? 

I don't know why you are taking it so personal. It's not. 

And I said that 10,000 steps isn't a lot for a healthy college student. It's not a lot for anyone who actually walks more than to their house, to their car, to their desk, to the lunch room, to their desk, to their car, to their house, to their couch. 

I personally think this is a pretty cool way to try and get young people moving again. Americans are ridiculously sedentary. I'm not talking about people with disabilities, of course. Just the average US office worker. 

I'm not sure about tying it to grades. It's really easy to forget to put on the fitbit, and I don't know if the new ones are waterproof, but I've destroyed a few myself. 

16 minutes ago, nastyhobbitses said:

I went to a hippie college that just vaguely told you "take some arts classes, some social science classes, and some STEM classes when you get around to it, no pressure, whatevs, man", and I'm still bitter that I got a B in Javanese Classical Dance because, per the teacher, I wasn't a very good dancer. But apparently I have the thighs for Balinese Dance. I was just dancing the wrong island, I guess.

I'm still mad i got a B- on my final for Drawing I. Apparently I looked nothing like my self portrait.  Pretty sure I also have body dysmorphia, because I don't look like myself in photos, either. 

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So, for anyone wanting to look more closely at the details, I checked the 2015-16 ORU catalog.

http://www.oru.edu/academics/catalog/pdf/catalog-2015-2016.pdf

On page 33 (printed), the following text occurs:

56b3a5be2f360_ORUhealth1.png.d7ce7d22b85

56b3a5cbea3e7_ORUhealth2.png.ca1fd1dfeeb

56b3a5cd3995e_ORUhealth3.png.f27bd53906f

Then I went back and spot-checked - this is essentially the same text as 14-15; and as 10-11.  It omits information about course titles and credits - but the underlying principle is the same.

The REQUIREMENTS are not new/have not really changed.  The process of documentation - how it's being measured and evaluated - is all that changed.

So, anyone interested in attending this institution presumably would know up front that exercise was considered an integral and required element of attendance.

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11 minutes ago, December said:

I've read it's not much better to be standing stationary all day, that it's best to be moving around (bit of sitting, walking, standing) at an office job. One of my former workplaces subsidized people getting those balance ball chairs, but it was optional. That's crazy your old workplace wanted to take away chairs like everyone has the same health needs -- seems like a lawsuit waiting to happen!

One of my colleagues was on crutches following an unspecified injury, and she made it clear they could prise her chair from her cold dead hands! After she'd sued their arses off.

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On the one hand- I am glad to see a fundie organization focusing on health- but yes this does seem a bit too Big Brother for me.  I would love to see what the meal plan looks like at ORU- are they feeding students a healthy diet or just pumping them full of more cheap carbs? Also, what kind of health services are available to students?  It's great to focus on fitness but it's not going to do much in the long run if students have poor nutrition and no access to basic healthcare.  

I adored the cafeteria when I moved to college- fresh salad, veggies or fruit was available at every meal.  I never had that growing up- all the vegetables and fruit we ate were canned.   If it didn't come in a can- we didn't eat it.  My younger brother was tested to see if he had a learning disability because he could not identify basic household items and  fruits and vegetables by sight.  My mother was insulted and said that it was because my brother had never seen a fresh strawberry or broccoli before. 

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36 minutes ago, Maggie Mae said:

I personally think this is a pretty cool way to try and get young people moving again. Americans are ridiculously sedentary. I'm not talking about people with disabilities, of course. Just the average US office worker. 

I'm curious if you also think it would be a good health incentive for a college to require students to abstain from alcohol or refrain from smoking in order to graduate from the university.  And I really don't mean that as a snarky question (because I'm afraid it might sound like one!).

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Put it on the dang dog. I am disaabled, haven't walked that in a year. Eff 'em.

I agree, I'd put it on my cat. Even though I love exercise, I don't like being forced. Besides, my cat is geriatric and has a heart murmur, trade 2. If either of us needs to have her heart monitored, it's probably not the relatively healthy 20 something year old who regularly shows up to the ER with anxiety symptoms that mimic a a heart attack and so gets tested.

Actually, I wonder if they do make these things for cats.....

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I had my Fitbit for a month before it crapped itself. They're offering to replace it for me but my husband can't find the receipt (he gave it to me as a gift - I wanted one, he wasn't giving it to me as a back handed jab). I was so excited - I'm a bit of a gym junkie and I was so disappointed to find that it didn't track when I was working out. What a waste of money.

Multiple studies have shown that Fitbits don't record sleep, activity or heart rate accurately, so what is the point of having one? Except to see if you do 10,000 steps ... and you can find that out with a $5 pedometer.

i wonder if kids at this university are allowed to buy a jawbone or other similar fitness tracker, or whether it must be a Fitbit.

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16 minutes ago, Firiel said:

I'm curious if you also think it would be a good health incentive for a college to require students to abstain from alcohol or refrain from smoking in order to graduate from the university.  And I really don't mean that as a snarky question (because I'm afraid it might sound like one!).

I do think there should be incentives to refrain from alcohol, especially in college. Not ban it, but some sort of incentive to encourage people to drink moderately. I think Americans have some weird (or fucked up) relationships with alcohol. I'll be the first to say that I too, have a weird relationship with booze. I think binge drinking is a problem on most US campuses, and it think it comes from alcohol being treated like this huge big bad horrible thing. Some sort of encouragement to drink moderately instead of the "all or nothing" approach would be something I'd like to see. 

And I'd like to see smoking banned completely. Especially from college campuses, hospitals, schools, shopping centers, offices, pretty much anywhere that isn't in your own house on your property with no shared walls and at least 1000 ft from any other humans. 

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49 minutes ago, Firiel said:

I'm curious if you also think it would be a good health incentive for a college to require students to abstain from alcohol or refrain from smoking in order to graduate from the university.  And I really don't mean that as a snarky question (because I'm afraid it might sound like one!).

Don't a lot of fundamentalist Christian universities essentially already do that?

For example, the honor code of Brigham Young University (one of the biggest private universities in the US by the way): https://policy.byu.edu/view/index.php?p=26

Honor Code Statement

We believe in being honest, true, chaste, benevolent, virtuous, and in doing good to all men....If there is anything virtuous, lovely, or of good report or praiseworthy, we seek after these things. (Thirteenth Article of Faith.)

As a matter of personal commitment, the faculty, administration, staff, and students of Brigham Young University, Brigham Young University-Hawaii, BYU-I, and LDS Business College seek to demonstrate in daily living on and off-campus those moral virtues encompassed in the gospel of Jesus Christ, and will:

Be honest

Live a chaste and virtuous life

Obey the law and all campus policies

Use clean language

Respect others

Abstain from alcoholic beverages, tobacco, tea, coffee, and substance abuse

Participate regularly in church services

Observe Dress and Grooming Standards

Encourage others in their commitment to comply with the Honor Code

Specific policies embodied in the Honor Code include (1) the Academic Honesty Policy, (2) the Dress and Grooming Standards, (3) the Residential Living Standards, and (4) the Continuing Student Ecclesiastical Endorsement Requirement. (Refer to institutional policies for more detailed information.)

 

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Good Honor Code Standing

Students must be in good Honor Code standing to be admitted to, continue enrollment at, and graduate from BYU. The term "good Honor Code standing" means that a student's conduct is consistent with the Honor Code and the ideals and principles of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. Excommunication, disfellowshipment, or disaffiliation from The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints automatically results in the loss of good Honor Code standing. Further, a student is not in good Honor Code standing if his or her ecclesiastical endorsement has either lapsed or has been withdrawn, or if the Honor Code Office has placed a "hold" on the student's records.

All students, upon admission to BYU, are required to observe the standards of the Honor Code at all times, whether on or off campus. When the Honor Code Office receives reports of misconduct prior to a prospective student's admission or readmission, those reports are referred to the Admissions Office for appropriate action. When the Honor Code Office receives reports of student misconduct after admission or readmission, but before registration for classes, the Honor Code Office typically notifies the student, indicating that a "hold" will be placed on the student's registration if the matter is not resolved to the satisfaction of the Honor Code Office by a specified date. The Honor Code Office also reserves the right to place a "hold" on the record of any student based on reports of student misconduct prior to notifying the student.

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I like the idea of fitness being encouraged and having lots of options of things to try. Dance classes, yoga, outdoor activities like canoeing as someone mentioned. Kayaking, cross country skiing, ice skating. I am grateful to companies like LLBean because they have gone to my kids school and done a free snow shoeing demonstration during their recess. It was optional, and I don't think they would of had that opportunity unless I went out and bought all that equipment. It's nice to be able to try things you can keep up with for the rest of your life. Exercise, or not exercising, can make or break my day. 

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@HereticHick, yes, they do.  That's why I was curious about what MaggieMae thought of those instances.

Personally, I'm all for "your body, your choice" regarding exercise, and in regard to smoking and alcohol (despite absolutely hating what alcohol often does to people).  Any governing body forcing exercise is getting too close to a nanny state (or college) for my taste.

EDIT: BTW, I'm all for programs that encourage or even incentivize healthy habits.  I'm strongly against punitive programs that punish people for not exercising.

Edited by Firiel
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14 minutes ago, Firiel said:

@HereticHick, yes, they do.  That's why I was curious about what MaggieMae thought of those instances.

Personally, I'm all for "your body, your choice" regarding exercise, and in regard to smoking and alcohol (despite absolutely hating what alcohol often does to people).  Any governing body forcing exercise is getting too close to a nanny state (or college) for my taste.

EDIT: BTW, I'm all for programs that encourage or even incentivize healthy habits.  I'm strongly against punitive programs that punish people for not exercising.

For smoking, it's more of a "I can't choose not to breathe, just because someone else chooses to smoke" situation. The effects of smoking are well known and studied. Second hand smoke is not good for people. There is evidence that even "third-hand" smoke (residue that you can smell on people who are not actively smoking, chemicals on their hands) is harmful. And with alcohol, I think moderate use is best. The stigma we have about teens using alcohol is part of what leads to the binge drinking on campus. (Which is harmful, and not just to the students who partake) 

I think it's also important to note that Oral Roberts is a private school. Students who choose to go there are expected to sign an honor code, which includes dress code and a million other things. People should have the right to enter into these contracts. Honestly, I love the idea of Oral Robert's "Full person" approach to education. I do not love their doctrine and I'm not worried about my spiritual growth, and I hate evangelism. But I DO believe in "well-rounded" type of education. That means art, music, foreign language, physical education, on top of reading, writing, math, science, history. I think that we've gotten away from a balanced approach. 

 

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1 minute ago, Maggie Mae said:

For smoking, it's more of a "I can't choose not to breathe, just because someone else chooses to smoke" situation. The effects of smoking are well known and studied. Second hand smoke is not good for people. There is evidence that even "third-hand" smoke (residue that you can smell on people who are not actively smoking, chemicals on their hands) is harmful. And with alcohol, I think moderate use is best. The stigma we have about teens using alcohol is part of what leads to the binge drinking on campus. (Which is harmful, and not just to the students who partake) 

I think it's also important to note that Oral Roberts is a private school. Students who choose to go there are expected to sign an honor code, which includes dress code and a million other things. People should have the right to enter into these contracts. Honestly, I love the idea of Oral Robert's "Full person" approach to education. I do not love their doctrine and I'm not worried about my spiritual growth, and I hate evangelism. But I DO believe in "well-rounded" type of education. That means art, music, foreign language, physical education, on top of reading, writing, math, science, history. I think that we've gotten away from a balanced approach. 

 

Oh, I know it's a private school and that people have a right to enter into private contracts.  I still think it's dumb and overreaching, just like I think it's dumb and overreaching that women in Gothardism were not allowed to wear pants until recently.

I'm not sure at what level smoking should be controlled.  Obviously, people should be able to be free of second-hand smoke. And I support businesses' decisions to ban smoking.  But not being able to smoke outside in the parking lot during your lunch break seems like a little much to me.  I'm pretty sure my car creates more of an air pollution danger to people than the third-hand smoke you would get from a couple office workers who smoke (outside and not within 25 feet of a building).

I guess it depends on what your opinion on personal freedom is.  Maybe I'm more libertarian than I thought! :my_blush:

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2 hours ago, Maggie Mae said:

I do think there should be incentives to refrain from alcohol, especially in college. Not ban it, but some sort of incentive to encourage people to drink moderately. I think Americans have some weird (or fucked up) relationships with alcohol. I'll be the first to say that I too, have a weird relationship with booze. I think binge drinking is a problem on most US campuses, and it think it comes from alcohol being treated like this huge big bad horrible thing. Some sort of encouragement to drink moderately instead of the "all or nothing" approach would be something I'd like to see. 

And I'd like to see smoking banned completely. Especially from college campuses, hospitals, schools, shopping centers, offices, pretty much anywhere that isn't in your own house on your property with no shared walls and at least 1000 ft from any other humans. 

I agree that Americans have a weird relationship with alcohol. IMO, it's because society sends mixed messages to children/teens/young adults about alcohol. Anti-drug and anti-alcohol education starts in elementary school. Children are taught from a young age that alcohol and drugs are bad for you. I remember coming from school one day in elementary school and telling my mom (who was drinking her one glass of wine at dinner) that she was going to get really sick and could die because she was drinking. She had to explain to me that like almost anything in life alcohol is fine in moderation. Pair the message of alcohol is always bad for you message that is taught in schools with the movie and tv shows that seem to glorify alcohol and drinking, and that leaves you with a very messed up relationship with alcohol. 

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3 hours ago, SpoonfulOSugar said:

The REQUIREMENTS are not new/have not really changed.  The process of documentation - how it's being measured and evaluated - is all that changed.

So, anyone interested in attending this institution presumably would know up front that exercise was considered an integral and required element of attendance.

Very interesting.

I think the process of measuring and evaluating is a pretty key issue, though. I enjoy being physically active and I make an effort to get regular exercise. I still would not be comfortable sharing Fitbit data with school administrators (or an employer, etc.) because it records information I feel is private.

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3 hours ago, Quivering Uterus said:

Put it on the dang dog. I am disaabled, haven't walked that in a year. Eff 'em.

Ditto!  Having a disability myself, exercise and I have never really gotten along.  I won't even mention gym class and the Presidential Fitness Test...

Edited by smittykins
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Our school was a lot passive in regards to fitness enforcement. We had a huge campus, subpar public transportation, and parking police out for blood. Your best option was walking. 

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I have a Fitbit, because I wanted to track my sleep and heart rate.  Many people make fun of them, but I mostly like mine.  The reason I say mostly is if I have to drive a large bus at work, it messes with the distance and flights climbed for the day.  I think cause I'm sitting 5 feet off the ground screws it up.  

 

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I also am for "your body, your choice" in most things, even hard drugs that are not smoked- sure, I think they're bad, but as long as they don't cause you to injure your partner/kids/other people, it's your choice to make. But, as said above, smoking creates negative effects not on just the smoker, but all around them. Secondhand smoke can have immediate effect on others even if one does it outside- because little kids' lungs are still growing and some people have asthma or other lung problems that can be immediately triggered by smoke. And, secondhand smoke is still a thing with pot and other drugs too.

I also think that people who decry the war on obesity don't consider the actual lives people lead. For example, poverty is a huge factor in being fat (food deserts are common in bad neighborhoods, the cheapest, most calorie-dense foods are nutritionally crap, chronic stress from hard, low-paid jobs leads to less self-control when it comes to food choices, and having the multiple jobs needed to make it on low pay leads to little or no time to cook- and thus $1 fast food items). And even if not struggling financially, people may have other priorities (like working more hours, whether for the overtime or to catch up on tasks, taking care of children or elderly relatives, a hobby that they're passionate about), which aren't conducive to an hour a day at the gym. (sure, workouts themselves may not take an hour,  but when you add time to get dressed, go to the gym, get to your machines, plus the time afterwards where you are, of course, tired and gross and need to shower and be a lump for a while, it's a time-suck).

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1 hour ago, busdrivingmom said:

I have a Fitbit, because I wanted to track my sleep and heart rate.  Many people make fun of them, but I mostly like mine.  The reason I say mostly is if I have to drive a large bus at work, it messes with the distance and flights climbed for the day.  I think cause I'm sitting 5 feet off the ground screws it up.  

 

I live in a very flat area and the one goal I often don't hit is stories climbed.  The day that Jonas came to town, I did get my steps in, but more of a "I have to have an Instagram moment and get snowy beach pics). 

Well I won a 50 flights climbed badge that day.  Maybe it was the use of a snowshovel?

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7 hours ago, Maggie Mae said:

I don't know why it's bugging you. 

I am aware that fat does not equal lazy. There are, however, studies that show that exercise has an effect on brain function. And it makes sense. Exercise help other organs, why not the brain? 

I don't know why you are taking it so personal. It's not. 

And I said that 10,000 steps isn't a lot for a healthy college student. It's not a lot for anyone who actually walks more than to their house, to their car, to their desk, to the lunch room, to their desk, to their car, to their house, to their couch. 

I personally think this is a pretty cool way to try and get young people moving again. Americans are ridiculously sedentary. I'm not talking about people with disabilities, of course. Just the average US office worker. 

I'm not sure about tying it to grades. It's really easy to forget to put on the fitbit, and I don't know if the new ones are waterproof, but I've destroyed a few myself. 

I'm still mad i got a B- on my final for Drawing I. Apparently I looked nothing like my self portrait.  Pretty sure I also have body dysmorphia, because I don't look like myself in photos, either. 

I can't speak for the person you quoted, but I feel that you're making an awful lot of assumptions and generalizations. "10,000 steps isn't a lot for a healthy college student" being one of them. So if a college student can't  or doesn't walk 10K steps every single day, they're not healthy? Many people, including myself, have to consciously make an effort to get to 10K steps and I'm a graduate student. Every day I walk across a rather large campus from one building to another, to the library, to a bus stop 5 blocks away and back, etc. and I still often am shy of 10K steps by the evening. "It's not a lot for anyone..." just comes across as presumptuous. Its not easy for everyone, especially people who are overweight (speaking for myself, here). Hell, I have many thin friends who either dislike walking or themselves feel uncomfortable walking for longer distances. 

I think you're speaking with good intentions, but try to see this from a different perspective. The only reason I've butted in is because I wanted to explain why some people might take those statements personally. 

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