Josh Duggar Part 11 - The End of Rehab Is in Sight

[InThePrayerCloset]

11 hours ago, justoneoftwo said:

I think you are probably right, I'm not sure what restrictions should be put on it, how to regulate it, and so on.  As with any large policy change its complex.  

Prostitution and brothels are legal in many states of Australia, with sex work being decriminalised since the early 1990s. Local, state and federal governments regulate various aspects of the sex industry including:

• Sex workers must be 18 or over, even though age of consent is generally 16;
• Brothels must keep copies of ID and proof of age of all workers;
• Serious controls are in place to try to prevent and identify human trafficking
• Brothels are subject to specific zoning and development laws and can only operate in certain areas;
• Strong OH&S laws that cover everything from workers compensation insurance to "training of new employees" to STDs to condoms to how often sheets and towels must be washed to cleaning and storage of sex toys to how many people can get into a hot tub... 

Interestingly, it is still illegal to advertise for sexual services, but this is almost never enforced (and is generally used as a lesser offence in a plea bargain for other criminal acts).

Our tax office (like the IRS or Internal Revenue) even produce this handy guide of the tax deductions available to adult workers... it makes for eye-opening reading https://www.ato.gov.au/Individuals/Income-and-deductions/In-detail/Deductions-for-specific-industries-and-occupations/Adult-industry-workers---claiming-work-related-expenses/?page=3#Common_expenses_for_adult_industry_workers

[sawasdee]

8 hours ago, vienna said:

 

 

<snip>

“Any counseling the family has gotten over the years,” explained a source to InTouch, “from when they discovered Josh molested his sisters until now — will be admissible in court.”

(Quotation is from: http://www.wetpaint.com/danica-dillon-duggars-secrets-revealed-1469139/)

But honestly, I can not imageine that the Content of counseling is admissible in court in general and if it could only be the one Josh had. Since his "counseling" was not done by a real professional it would be "normal" people  from the Duggar church and I expect them to lie without even beeing ashamed since they have to do something to defend themselves against this obvious agenda....

The 'legal expert' quoted says that in civil, as opposed to criminal proceedings, notes from therapy sessions are admissible. I find this horrifying if true, but i don't see that Josh has a great deal to worry about - has he ever had any therapy formal enough to have generated notes? Surely only prayers .......

[sophie10130]

47 minutes ago, sndral said:

Nothing better for getting through a long plane flight than a fairly simple knitting project. Added bonus - TSA has to let my knitting needles on the plane, somehow that gives me a thrill every time, warped I know.

<snip>

 

i think these days you are also allowed scissors with blades less than 4 inches, but ive never been brave enough to try. usually i bring a clean set of fingernail clippers, and that works for what i need (embroidery/cross stitch)

[Bethella]

4 minutes ago, sophie10130 said:

i think these days you are also allowed scissors with blades less than 4 inches, but ive never been brave enough to try. usually i bring a clean set of fingernail clippers, and that works for what i need (embroidery/cross stitch)

They didn't take my plastic 1 1/2 inch scissors when I flew last fall.

[Bad Wolf]

I had a small pair of scissors with a protective cover  over the points. They went through fine here but were confiscated in Frankfurt. I think the agent took a liking to them. Now I carry nail clippers or a cheap pair of baby scissors. I was told I couldn't knit on take off or landing.

[InThePrayerCloset]

12 hours ago, Whoosh said:

I don't know much about this, but I know in many jurisdictions you can be arrested and incarcerated for having sex with unknowing partners if you are HIV positive - it doesn't have to be for money.  I can't recall what the charge is, but it is more in line with assault or something related to a deadly weapon.  Don't quote that or repeat it, cause that isn't really a good way to say it at all.  LOL.  Anyway, that is as much as I know.

The "criminal transmission of HIV" occurs in many jurisdictions when someone knowingly and recklessly exposes another to HIV without their consent. This is distinct from not disclosing HIV status and having sex whilst using "reasonable precautions" (condoms and antivirals) with an unknowing partner. As @Whoosh stated above, this can occur regardless of whether the exposure occurred during a commercial sexual encounter. 

In many US states and Australia the specific charge of "criminal transmission of HIV" can be pursued through both public health provisions and the criminal law. In other jurisdictions like the UK and parts of the European Union, HIV transmission is dealt with under existing generalist charges such as attempted or actual murder/manslaughter, GBH, or common assault. 

More info on an Australian example of this charge can be found at this news site http://www.starobserver.com.au/news/local-news/new-south-wales-news/nsw-man-charged-with-alleged-hiv-transmission-to-other-man/144144

27 minutes ago, Bethella said:

They didn't take my plastic 1 1/2 inch scissors when I flew last fall.

Knitting needles are generally prohibited on international flights... but clearly that's not enforced... 

[Whoosh]

1 hour ago, sawasdee said:

The 'legal expert' quoted says that in civil, as opposed to criminal proceedings, notes from therapy sessions are admissible. I find this horrifying if true, but i don't see that Josh has a great deal to worry about - has he ever had any therapy formal enough to have generated notes? Surely only prayers .......

I don't want to try to speak to this as any type of former professional or expert, as the rules and laws surrounding the client-therapist privilege can get quite complex and I don't want to misspeak.  So, take everything I am going to say with a grain of salt.

To the best of my knowledge and recollection, the client-therapist privilege does indeed apply to civil cases.  I agree that it is horrifying to think otherwise.  If a therapist receives a subpoena for therapy records, I believe the standard practice is to either obtain permission from the client to share those records OR to file a motion to quash citing client-therapist privilege and any other privilege that may possibly protect the record.  The court will then typically hold a hearing to determine if anything about the situation warrants overriding any privilege and forcing the disclosure of those records.  Again, I am not entirely clear on the details of this and I do know that situations can arise where a therapist might have to chose between following the ethical imperative to maintain confidentiality vs complying with a court order to disclose.  I think that would be a very rare situation, but again I don't really know. A similar situation people may be more familiar with is when a reporter is ordered to disclose or reveal a source.  If they are ordered to inform the court of something like that and they opt to follow the ethical guidelines of their profession and refuse, they can be jailed for contempt of court until they comply with the court order.

Mental health professionals are often trained in record keeping methods that place the rights and privacy of the client at the forefront.  From my experience, therapists are advised to keep official records in a manner that would protect the right to privacy of their client should those official records somehow wind up in the hands of the court or opposing counsel.  So, for example, a therapist might keep official records of treatment in the official computer system of the hospital or clinic that are very vague and general and contain information needed for insurance, etc.  At the same time, they may keep a personal or private diary in which they record thoughts from their day, personal to-do lists, doodles, and quick notes on client sessions that they wish to record for some personal reason.

Like I said, it can get complex and I am just speaking generally here.

[paganhomeschooler]

18 hours ago, church_of_dog said:

Toe-up socks vs. top-down socks?  And in a really amusing (well, to me at least) coming together of two normally-unrelated topics, the standard yarny argument is generally over knitters vs. crocheters...  who are otherwise known as... hookers.  I'll just show myself out...

Bistitchual here, as well!  I'm also a left-handed knitter (the horror!!), and I prefer top down, DPN socks.  I also do the knife grasp for my hook.  I also make a ton of stuff out of good ole' Red Heart Super Saver. 

[curlykate]

1 hour ago, paganhomeschooler said:

Bistitchual here, as well!  I'm also a left-handed knitter (the horror!!), and I prefer top down, DPN socks.  I also do the knife grasp for my hook.  I also make a ton of stuff out of good ole' Red Heart Super Saver. 

Confession time......I've been knitting since I was a child, and I have never knit a pair of socks, or even attempted to!  I've just recently taught myself to knit the round with DPNs, although I still prefer to knit on two needles and then darn it all together.  My mom only taught me the basics, and Google and YouTube have really helped me to expand my knitting repertoire.  As I don't make  anything fancy, I also use Red Heart Super Saver for the majority off my projects.

My current project is taking a bunch of yarn scraps from my husband's late grandmother's yarn stash and turning them into patch quilts for all of her great-grandchildren. It's going to take a while....

And now, we can return to Joshley.....

[paulypepper]

Dammit!! I don't have hardly any free time as it is and now I feel the need to pick up knitting again (I dabbled a bit about 15 years ago ) Thanks FJ!!! ...No, I really love you guys..what with the coloring, learning how to make candles Bates style and now knitting I'm looking forward to retirement in a few years...I'll be keeping my mind busy!

[karen77]

3 hours ago, paganhomeschooler said:

Bistitchual here, as well!  I'm also a left-handed knitter (the horror!!), and I prefer top down, DPN socks.  I also do the knife grasp for my hook.  I also make a ton of stuff out of good ole' Red Heart Super Saver. 

Bistichual here too!! I THINK I do the pencil grip though  and right handed all the way, because my left hand is dumb... hehe

 

FYI, We have and FJ Ravelry group going (its' quiet though)

[Artemesia]

Maybe the whole point of DD's side requesting therapy records is to force Josh and co. to admit that there are none. If there was real therapy there would be real records.

 

[justoneoftwo]

9 hours ago, Whoosh said:

I don't want to try to speak to this as any type of former professional or expert, as the rules and laws surrounding the client-therapist privilege can get quite complex and I don't want to misspeak.  So, take everything I am going to say with a grain of salt.

To the best of my knowledge and recollection, the client-therapist privilege does indeed apply to civil cases.  I agree that it is horrifying to think otherwise.  If a therapist receives a subpoena for therapy records, I believe the standard practice is to either obtain permission from the client to share those records OR to file a motion to quash citing client-therapist privilege and any other privilege that may possibly protect the record.  The court will then typically hold a hearing to determine if anything about the situation warrants overriding any privilege and forcing the disclosure of those records.  Again, I am not entirely clear on the details of this and I do know that situations can arise where a therapist might have to chose between following the ethical imperative to maintain confidentiality vs complying with a court order to disclose.  I think that would be a very rare situation, but again I don't really know. A similar situation people may be more familiar with is when a reporter is ordered to disclose or reveal a source.  If they are ordered to inform the court of something like that and they opt to follow the ethical guidelines of their profession and refuse, they can be jailed for contempt of court until they comply with the court order.

Mental health professionals are often trained in record keeping methods that place the rights and privacy of the client at the forefront.  From my experience, therapists are advised to keep official records in a manner that would protect the right to privacy of their client should those official records somehow wind up in the hands of the court or opposing counsel.  So, for example, a therapist might keep official records of treatment in the official computer system of the hospital or clinic that are very vague and general and contain information needed for insurance, etc.  At the same time, they may keep a personal or private diary in which they record thoughts from their day, personal to-do lists, doodles, and quick notes on client sessions that they wish to record for some personal reason.

Like I said, it can get complex and I am just speaking generally here.

It is complex.  In my experience if a party puts their mental health at issue in some way the records are fair game.  There can be protective orders to avoid the records getting to the press, and if there is an objection the judge will sometimes review them and then let the other party see only some of the records.  I don't know how Josh put his mental health at issue in this case, although he might have and still might.  

[xlurker]

Jealous of all you knitters!  I have tried many many times, just can't get the hang of it!  I am, however, quite the crocheter...blankets, bags, bikini's...doilies, sweaters, coats and tablecloths!  I can practically crochet ANYTHING 

[nokidsmom]

On 1/27/2016 at 11:40 PM, isarhenne said:

Oh yes he DID lie at least at one instant:

When he was working for the FRC he quoted his lesbian aunt saying that she, too, is not for gay marriage because of the bible and that she is very much against it.

She came forward a few weeks later and told the press that she had never said such a thing.

I'm sorry, I know it has nothing to do with Danica, but here you see he is capable of lying on a big scale, in the media for the whole world to see and then not even apologize for it after his aunt came forward.

I don't think he can feel remorse for anything he did...

For me, as far as Danica's case who knows who is telling the truth, Danica or Josh or neither.  I don't know and don't have a read either way.  FTR, I don't care about Danica's profession as far as whether she's telling the truth or not.

But we do know that Josh is very, very capable of lying even if it's not happening in this case.  Speaking for his aunt was one example, he would have to lie through his teeth to Anna,  I am sure there are many other situations where he did which is why I don't think even JB has the full story on his Golden Child's escapades.

[sophie10130]

13 hours ago, Bethella said:

They didn't take my plastic 1 1/2 inch scissors when I flew last fall.

that's why i didn't want to try. although TSA does say scissors less than 4 inches are allowed in carry on or checked luggage, i think it is often up to the discretion of the TSA agents.

[FloraKitty35]

Danica Dillion is a sex worker, not a prostitute or a whore. She probably has done more work than Smuggar ever did for FRC or at the car lot.  

[justoneoftwo]

Just now, FloraKitty35 said:

Danica Dillion is a sex worker, not a prostitute or a whore. She probably has done more work than Smuggar ever did for FRC or at the car lot.  

Even if she were a prostitute that would be true.  

[Alicja]

Continental knitter here. I was taught top-down and failed miserable (I was in 5th grade)

[Fundie Bunny]

Even if it's not her main job, she is still a prostitute. Let's call things by their names.

[littlehouse]

Could it be possible that he has the lock (can't think of the right word) on the information because his only real concrete alibi is he was with a mistress?  He doesn't want it leaked to the world?  I have watched too much Legally Blonde.  

Just something went through my head.

[sophie10130]

24 minutes ago, Fundie Bunny said:

Even if it's not her main job, she is still a prostitute. Let's call things by their names.

i think prostitute is actually not the proper name anymore. from what i've seen sex workers say, it's sex worker unless a person has said "yes, you can call me a prostitute" ymmv though. i've only ever seen it discussed in one very small facet of society.

[justoneoftwo]

1 minute ago, sophie10130 said:

i think prostitute is actually not the proper name anymore. from what i've seen sex workers say, it's sex worker unless a person has said "yes, you can call me a prostitute" ymmv though. i've only ever seen it discussed in one very small facet of society.

Not the proper name because its not PC?  Is there an accurate definition?  Just curious.

[gustava]

31 minutes ago, Fundie Bunny said:

Even if it's not her main job, she is still a prostitute. Let's call things by their names.

Way way back in the day, adult black men were called "boys."  Times change, fundie bunny.  Deal with it.

[sophie10130]

1 minute ago, justoneoftwo said:

Not the proper name because its not PC?  Is there an accurate definition?  Just curious.

from what i understand, yeah. just like how we don't use the word f*ggot or colored etc. anymore