Josh Duggar Part 11 - The End of Rehab Is in Sight

[2manyKidzzz]

Wow. That article is really something. 

[socalrules]

I never thought Josh was addicted to porn. Josh likes porn but so do millions of other people and it doesn't mean that they are addicted to it. I think Josh just likes to have sex with people who aren't his wife. In Duggarland, the fact that he views porn is directly correlated to his cheating on his wife. If he gets "help" for the porn then he won't cheat on Anna and only have marital missionary procreation sex. 

[Trynn]

And too, the fundy definition of porn addiction is what the rest of the world defines as "likes to watch pork and jerk off on occasion." I speak from experience.

[MayMay1123]

10 minutes ago, Trynn said:

And too, the fundy definition of porn addiction is what the rest of the world defines as "likes to watch pork and jerk off on occasion." I speak from experience.

there's a joke about pork and jerk in there somewhere, but i'm too exhausted to find it...

[DuggarWatch]

58 minutes ago, socalrules said:

I never thought Josh was addicted to porn. Josh likes porn but so do millions of other people and it doesn't mean that they are addicted to it.

Josh said in his own words that he was addicted to porn.  This is part of his confession: "I have been the biggest hypocrite ever. While espousing faith and family values, I have secretly over the last several years been viewing pornography on the internet and this became a secret addiction and I became unfaithful to my wife."

Josh began sexually molesting his sisters in 2002 when he was 14 years old.  The response by Jim Bob and Michelle was to find him a wife.  At age 14, Josh was formally engaged to another 14-year-old, Kaeleigh Holt.  Josh continued molesting his younger sisters for at least another year and then he molested at least one other minor child who was not a family member.

In 2004, Josh was caught viewing pornography on the Internet while working at the campaign office of Jim Holt when Holt was running for the U.S. Senate.  (Josh was 16 at the time and was underage to view porn websites.)  That same year, Josh started a Facebook page under an alias and every one of his Facebook friends were local stripers.  He continued posting on that Facebook account the entire time he was married to Anna (married in 2008) and his last post was in January, 2014.

Josh is addicted to porn and deviant sexual behavior, just like he says he is.  And, he has been that way at least since puberty.

The National Council on Sexual Addiction and Compulsivity has defined sexual addiction as “engaging in persistent and escalating patterns of sexual behavior acted out despite increasing negative consequences to self and others. In other words, a sex addict will continue to engage in certain sexual behaviors despite facing potential health risks, financial problems, shattered relationships or even arrest."

[gustava]

6 minutes ago, DuggarWatch said:

Josh said in his own words that he was addicted to porn.  This is part of his confession: "I have been the biggest hypocrite ever. While espousing faith and family values, I have secretly over the last several years been viewing pornography on the internet and this became a secret addiction and I became unfaithful to my wife."

Josh began sexually molesting his sisters in 2002 when he was 14 years old.  The response by Jim Bob and Michelle was to find him a wife.  At age 14, Josh was formally engaged to another 14-year-old, Kaeleigh Holt.  Josh continued molesting his younger sisters for at least another year and then he molested at least one other minor child who was not a family member.

In 2004, Josh was caught viewing pornography on the Internet while working at the campaign office of Jim Holt when Holt was running for the U.S. Senate.  (Josh was 16 at the time and was underage to view porn websites.)  That same year, Josh started a Facebook page under an alias and every one of his Facebook friends were local stripers.  He continued posting on that Facebook account the entire time he was married to Anna (married in 2008) and his last post was in January, 2014.

Josh is addicted to porn and deviant sexual behavior, just like he says he is.  And, he has been that way at least since puberty.

The National Council on Sexual Addiction and Compulsivity has defined sexual addiction as “engaging in persistent and escalating patterns of sexual behavior acted out despite increasing negative consequences to self and others. In other words, a sex addict will continue to engage in certain sexual behaviors despite facing potential health risks, financial problems, shattered relationships or even arrest."

[Whoosh]

I think the reality here is that, if somehow the version of this debacle outlined in the Fashion & Style article managed to make it's way into courtroom, it seems highly unlikely that anyone would be buying at face value any denials from Duggar with regard to sex/porn addiction considering he did admit it publicly before the edits occurred AND he appears to have been in treatment for this type of addiction for 5+ months.  He would have to work his way out of that one.

Several of us have our doubts as to whether this type of theory of the case could ever see the inside of the courtroom, but it is already out there to some extent in terms of the media circus that largely drives the court of public opinion.

ETA - according to the results of the poll at the end of that story, exactly 7 people seem to care at this point.

[TheJewAmongUs]

On 2/3/2016 at 10:09 PM, EmCatlyn said:

If you will read back over the last five or six months on this topic, you will see that a lot of us believe that Josh is at some form of Fundie rehab, almost certainly RU.  

The Duggars genuinely believe in prayer therapy, they like to talk about being "totally broken" with repentance, and they are obviously  angry at Josh. While one can never be certain of anything, I believe your scenario that the family has just hidden Josh away in comfort is improbable.   

But we've argued  "where is Josh?" pretty thoroughly already. I kind of like the abducted by aliens theory myself.

<need icon of beating a dead horse>

I haven't kept up with all 250 pages of Josh speculation. The last time I checked in, everyone was convinced he had left RU after a few days, if he was ever there at all. And some speculated that he was at an IBLP office near an RU facility to throw people off. Did you seriously just suggest that someone read 6 months worth of posts? How friendly and welcoming. I'll go back to lurking now.

[Trynn]

And too, the fundy definition of porn addiction is what the rest of the world defines as "likes to watch pork and jerk off on occasion." I speak from experience.

there's a joke about pork and jerk in there somewhere, but i'm too exhausted to find it...

DAMN YOU AUTOCORRECT!

[Fascinated]

2 minutes ago, Trynn said:

there's a joke about pork and jerk in there somewhere, but i'm too exhausted to find it...

 

DAMN YOU AUTOCORRECT!

It would be worse for you if it autocorrected pork to porn though. 

[2manyKidzzz]

Well, I guess we can look forward to ReleaseDay. First pictures, first pictures with his loving wife and children. People mag, or In Touch, or grainy photos on the internet. 

We'll have to serve refreshments. 

[EmCatlyn]

7 hours ago, NotAnIncubator said:

My line of thinking is he got addicted to porn, saw Danica's, and saw a chance to 'riteously fulfill' the lust. Therefore he had to have sex with her. 

As far as the lawsuit, I've already said I think he did it. His prior bad acts make it look more and more likely. Its not a guaranteed thing but that's my thoughts on it.

What you suggest about Josh being attracted to Danica because he'd seen her porn is certainly possible.  However, a married man cannot "righteously" do anything about his "lust" with anyone other than his wife.  

[EmCatlyn]

4 hours ago, TheJewAmongUs said:

I haven't kept up with all 250 pages of Josh speculation. The last time I checked in, everyone was convinced he had left RU after a few days, if he was ever there at all. And some speculated that he was at an IBLP office near an RU facility to throw people off. Did you seriously just suggest that someone read 6 months worth of posts? How friendly and welcoming. I'll go back to lurking now.

No, I did not suggest that "someone read 6 months worth of posts."  I said that if you were to read back you would see the topic had been thoroughly discussed.

There is actually a fair amount of evidence that Josh is at RU (though he may not be with the "general population") and apparently no evidence that he is anywhere else.  

If you have such evidence, it would be most interesting.  

[TheJewAmongUs]

On 2/3/2016 at 10:09 PM, EmCatlyn said:

If you will read back over the last five or six months on this topic, you will see that a lot of us believe that Josh is at some form of Fundie rehab, almost certainly RU.  

 

1 hour ago, EmCatlyn said:

No, I did not suggest that "someone read 6 months worth of posts."  I said that if you were to read back you would see the topic had been thoroughly discussed.  

I suggest that instead of telling someone else to read months worth of posts that you read your own post from two days ago.

It seems like what you want is to circle jerk with the other people who post 30 or more times per week. A lot of your posts are also telling other people that they're wrong. I also suggest you learn how to read snark, learn to let other people's opinions go without replying and stop trying to come off as faux intellectual and dominate threads. Because we've been through that before here, and it's not good for membership.

[EmCatlyn]

42 minutes ago, TheJewAmongUs said:

I suggest that instead of telling someone else to read months worth of posts that you read your own post from two days ago.

It seems like what you want is to circle jerk with the other people who post 30 or more times per week. A lot of your posts are also telling other people that they're wrong. I also suggest you learn how to read snark, learn to let other people's opinions go without replying and stop trying to come off as faux intellectual and dominate threads. Because we've been through that before here, and it's not good for membership.

Wow!  How did we get here?  

I never said you should read back five or six months.  I said that if you were to read back five or six months (that is, through the course of the thread) you would see ... etc.

I wasn't telling you what you should do.  I was suggesting that if you wanted more than the brief answer I was giving, you could look at the earlier messages in the thread.   I also gave it as my opinion that the question of "Where is Josh" is a bit of a dead horse.   So what?

As for the rest, it is news to me that it is against FJ culture to post more than 30 times a week.   If I am mistaken, and if I have transgressed against the community in some way, I trust one of the moderators will let me know.

 

[TheJewAmongUs]

9 minutes ago, EmCatlyn said:

Wow!  How did we get here?  

I never said you should read back five or six months.  I said that if you were to read back five or six months (that is, through the course of the thread) you would see ... etc.

I wasn't telling you what you should do.  I was suggesting that if you wanted more than the brief answer I was giving, you could look at the earlier messages in the thread.   I also gave it as my opinion that the question of "Where is Josh" is a bit of a dead horse.   So what?

As for the rest, it is news to me that it is against FJ culture to post more than 30 times a week.   If I am mistaken, and if I have transgressed against the community in some way, I trust one of the moderators will let me know.

 

It's not FJ culture to feel like you're the only truth giver and respond to everyone that you disagree with as if it's your responsibility. Posters like that chase away anyone other than their fellow circle jerkers.

You did not need to tell me that I was beating a dead horse making a snarky post about what constitutes "rehab" in the fundie sense. You did not need to lecture me on what the Duggars genuinely believe. You sure as hell didn't need to suggest I read back 6 months WHEN YOU HAVEN'T EVEN BEEN REGISTERED FOR THAT LONG. You did not need to correct NotAnIncubator about what can and can't be righteously fulfilled. You didn't need to go around telling people their opinions on the therapist thread were wrong. Like telling MatthewDuggar not to speculate that Michelle might withhold sex or correct OodOnTheLoo for not completely agreeing with you and then telling her she wasn't entitled to her opinion on misogyny. You did not have to correct PennySycamore for interpreting your comment that "reversing the ban on DDT" was not the same as "bring back DDT" in the Jill thread. And you did not need to attempt to school Cleopatra7 on what type of clothing would be proper sun protection because you didn't agree with her defense of what Israel was wearing.

Not everything everyone says has to agree with your opinions or highlight your superior knowledge in all things. Not every post is serious or claiming to be 100% truthful/backed up by Wikipedia links. You really need to get over yourself and stop trying to put people in their places with your condescending responses.

And based on how long you've been a member and your post count, you post way more than 30 times per week. And most of your posts that I've seen are correcting other people. Just learn to let things go, it will put the rest of us out of your misery.

[hollywood]

Well at least we won't have anymore stupid instagram photo posts from him, randomly selfie photo posting in a Chick-Fil-A

[Charliemae]

5 hours ago, TheJewAmongUs said:

It's not FJ culture to feel like you're the only truth giver and respond to everyone that you disagree with as if it's your responsibility. Posters like that chase away anyone other than their fellow circle jerkers.

You did not need to tell me that I was beating a dead horse making a snarky post about what constitutes "rehab" in the fundie sense. You did not need to lecture me on what the Duggars genuinely believe. You sure as hell didn't need to suggest I read back 6 months WHEN YOU HAVEN'T EVEN BEEN REGISTERED FOR THAT LONG. You did not need to correct NotAnIncubator about what can and can't be righteously fulfilled. You didn't need to go around telling people their opinions on the therapist thread were wrong. Like telling MatthewDuggar not to speculate that Michelle might withhold sex or correct OodOnTheLoo for not completely agreeing with you and then telling her she wasn't entitled to her opinion on misogyny. You did not have to correct PennySycamore for interpreting your comment that "reversing the ban on DDT" was not the same as "bring back DDT" in the Jill thread. And you did not need to attempt to school Cleopatra7 on what type of clothing would be proper sun protection because you didn't agree with her defense of what Israel was wearing.

Not everything everyone says has to agree with your opinions or highlight your superior knowledge in all things. Not every post is serious or claiming to be 100% truthful/backed up by Wikipedia links. You really need to get over yourself and stop trying to put people in their places with your condescending responses.

And based on how long you've been a member and your post count, you post way more than 30 times per week. And most of your posts that I've seen are correcting other people. Just learn to let things go, it will put the rest of us out of your misery.

I have no specific problems with Whoosh but have had some "mega posters" get under my skin.  I feel like this thread could use a reminder of the ignore function. I finally used it on someone for the first time and my fj experience is much improved.  

[Whoosh]

1 hour ago, Charliemae said:

I have no specific problems with Whoosh but have had some "mega posters" get under my skin.  I feel like this thread could use a reminder of the ignore function. I finally used it on someone for the first time and my fj experience is much improved.  

Just to clarify, the quote you are responding to wasn't addressed directly to me, but to another poster.  I fully realize my behavior in this thread is less than attractive at this point and I also realize I am a super frequent poster.  I completely see why people would read the post and apply it to my behavior in this thread and in a few other instances - so that is fine.  Since August, people who don't join in lock-step in some of the theories of this case get summarily humiliated, bashed, and slapped down.  Certain "experts" see that something totally random happened which we have no explanation for and spin it to "prove" their theory of the case.  Myself and others have continued to try to give a different perspective on things - for the most part quite nicely and politely.  We have continued to be aggressively slapped down (often with false statements or random and sometimes offensive assumptions about the case).  People toss out random accusations as to the motives of others and insist they said things that were not said.  

I pretty much announced that if I saw people aggressively slapping people with differing opinions down and/or aggressively attacking Dillon using falsehoods or baseless assumptions and/or spinning each and every blessed little detail of everything against her I would be aggressively calling them out on that.  People don't have to like it - that is fine.  I am pretty much just reflecting people's behavior back on them a lot of the time, though I try to be factually accurate when doing so.

The only reason I am responding to this is because the specific examples given in that post are not things I, personally, posted.

 

[AmazonGrace]

I have a problem with the porn addiction claim because sometimes it seems like just a way to avoid personal responsibility. It wasn't me, it was the addiction, it was the evil porn industry.

"The National Council on Sexual Addiction and Compulsivity has defined sexual addiction as “engaging in persistent and escalating patterns of sexual behavior acted out despite increasing negative consequences to self and others. In other words, a sex addict will continue to engage in certain sexual behaviors despite facing potential health risks, financial problems, shattered relationships or even arrest.""

 

I would like to know if or how the frequency, the intensity or the quality of his porn consumption differs from some regular guys who may also watch a lot of porn but aren't  in trouble for it because they're not celebrities  and because they live in more permissive environment.  Sure, he has had negative consequences,  but does he watch more porn in more destructive patterns than the average porn watcher who is not classified as a sex addict? It's not like watching just a little bit of porn here and there would be okay in the Duggarworld since they can't even see women in Nike sportswear without getting all hot and bothered.

A fundie could face more negative consequences  if he watches any porn and gets caught than a regular joe whose family does not freak out about it,  even though the regular joe may invest more time and energy in his porn watching.

I guess what I'm trying to say that if you define sex addiction with the consequences, the consequences aren't equal for everybody. One man's fall from grace is another man's great Saturday night for which he gets pats on the back from his drinking buddies. Some people's brothers give tearful interviews lamenting your ungodliness if you get caught watching porn and some people's brothers will borrow the tape. Some people will divorce you if you get busted and some partners will watch it with you.

[MayMay1123]

13 hours ago, Fascinated said:

It would be worse for you if it autocorrected pork to porn though. 

porn fried rice, roast loin of porn, porn chops, pulled porn, barbecue porn 

[Fundie Bunny]

33 minutes ago, MayMay1123 said:

porn fried rice, roast loin of porn, porn chops, pulled porn, barbecue porn 

I am certain "Barbecue porn" is the title of some movie. It has to be.

[MarblesMom]

8 minutes ago, Fundie Bunny said:

I am certain "Barbecue porn" is the title of some movie. It has to be.

"pulled porn"   OMG  

[AmazonGrace]

Don't eat porn, it's not kosher. *stern SMH*

[EmCatlyn]

8 hours ago, TheJewAmongUs said:

It's not FJ culture to feel like you're the only truth giver and respond to everyone that you disagree with as if it's your responsibility. Posters like that chase away anyone other than their fellow circle jerkers.

You did not need to tell me that I was beating a dead horse making a snarky post about what constitutes "rehab" in the fundie sense. You did not need to lecture me on what the Duggars genuinely believe. You sure as hell didn't need to suggest I read back 6 months WHEN YOU HAVEN'T EVEN BEEN REGISTERED FOR THAT LONG. You did not need to correct NotAnIncubator about what can and can't be righteously fulfilled. You didn't need to go around telling people their opinions on the therapist thread were wrong. Like telling MatthewDuggar not to speculate that Michelle might withhold sex or correct OodOnTheLoo for not completely agreeing with you and then telling her she wasn't entitled to her opinion on misogyny. You did not have to correct PennySycamore for interpreting your comment that "reversing the ban on DDT" was not the same as "bring back DDT" in the Jill thread. And you did not need to attempt to school Cleopatra7 on what type of clothing would be proper sun protection because you didn't agree with her defense of what Israel was wearing.

Not everything everyone says has to agree with your opinions or highlight your superior knowledge in all things. Not every post is serious or claiming to be 100% truthful/backed up by Wikipedia links. You really need to get over yourself and stop trying to put people in their places with your condescending responses.

And based on how long you've been a member and your post count, you post way more than 30 times per week. And most of your posts that I've seen are correcting other people. Just learn to let things go, it will put the rest of us out of your misery.

As I said, it is for the administrators to let us know when we have transgressed against the forum culture or rules.  I think that since you find my messages so annoying, you should use the "ignore" feature.