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Josh Duggar: Part 10- Will "Rehab" Ever End?


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OldFadedStar
Just now, Mercer said:

It may have been accidental if he was trying to log onto a different site that authenticated using Facebook credentials.

I will say there are many a sites that do this now days...

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I thought college was bad and no one should go. Why are they using an evil, worldly college-going lawyer? Can't Josh just represent himself using what he learned from Bill Gothard's Wisdom Booklets?

That article makes it sounds like the Duggars either paid the sister to say that stuff so Josh wouldn't look so awful, or she's saying it to get HER 15 minutes of fame. Why would a porn star follow a

What makes no sense to me is that while both the molestation and cheating are bad things; the Duggar's believe that Josh cheating on Anna is MUCH MUCH worse and he needs to go to rehab and have treatm

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Becket70
1 hour ago, Mrsaztx said:

Quick poll: how many people here think JB actually believes what he's spewing re: God? I often wonder that about these religious/cult leaders. I think very few of them actually believe, they just see it as the easiest way to control people. 

I am no expert but it seems to me that people like JB are addicted to their fundamentalism and are unable to view anything outside their bubble. So, yes, I think JB does believe what he preaches.  And I believe he views people like us as enemies rather than people he wants to convert.

 

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Mrsaztx
12 minutes ago, Cleopatra7 said:

ATI is so restrictive that I can't imagine anyone doing it and not being convinced of its efficacy when there are many, less restrictive forms of Christianity out there. If nothing else, only someone wearing some seriously distorted faith goggles would look at those worthless Wisdom books and think that they could provide a halfway decent education.

But it's not restrictive to jimbob, it's fantastic for him. He gets to rape his wife whenever, gets to have all his whims catered to all the time, his kids aren't allowed to bug him, it's aces for him, and all the other head's of households, so I wonder what percent of them actually felt this was biblically correct, and how many of them are just using it as a means to their desired end 

 

@Kjaerringa it was mentioned up thread, but a lawyer will always file a motion to dismiss a lawsuit as one of the first steps, it's doesn't mean that they feel they have a snowball's chance that it actually will get thrown out, it's just part of the protocol. And they have to have "grounds" for why they are filing that motion so they basically spun a wheel and it landed on "get a dig in at the plaintiff by pointing out she's a whore"

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EmCatlyn
8 minutes ago, Mercer said:

It may have been accidental if he was trying to log onto a different site that authenticated using Facebook credentials.

If he did, he was careless.   (But then, he is Josh.).

 I don't have to hide from the world, but I never use my Facebook "credentials" for anything.  (Privacy and Facebook just don't go together.)  There are other ways.

One would think he would know better after the Ashley Madison mess. (But then, he is Josh.)

 

 

 

 

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OldFadedStar

Any log in to Facebook will cause your deactivated account to be reactivated...

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EmCatlyn
17 minutes ago, Mrsaztx said:

But it's not restrictive to jimbob, it's fantastic for him. He gets to rape his wife whenever, gets to have all his whims catered to all the time, his kids aren't allowed to bug him, it's aces for him, and all the other head's of households, so I wonder what percent of them actually felt this was biblically correct, and how many of them are just using it as a means to their desired end .

 

While I agree that JB gets a lot out of being the "headship" in an ATI family, I do think that he has accepted restrictions.  For example, he is not supposed to drink.  He is not supposed to watch porn. He is not supposed to hire prostitutes or stripers or enjoy lap dances.  He is not supposed to gamble. He has to do a lot of Bible reading and show up for church on Sundays etc.  He is expected to support a large family and, before TLC, this seems to have been a bit of a challenge.

My take on it is that he is totally okay with most of the restrictions because he gets a lot out of ATI teachings.  I suspect he may occasionally transgress (maybe a glimpse at porn, maybe a stripper) then repent and make it ok with Jesus-in-Gothard's-image.  Beyond that, he is grateful to have clear cut rules of do's and don'ts.  He is glad to be a headship and to have it confirmed that all men suffer excruciatingly from lust caused by all those defrauding cheer leader types. He sees himself as a much wiser and holier man than he is, and he is seriously invested in convincing the world of his own specialness.  He rationalizes things so that he and his can always look good and look down on others.  He is a hypocrite, but most of the time he probably doesn't know it.

I think he believes, but he emphasizes what suits him and doesn't bother with what is too hard when he "serves the Lord."   Many of these "Only the Bible" folks tend to pick and choose the bits of the Bible and the interpretation that suit them.  I suspect they tell themselves that God is inspiring them.

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I don't have mutual.friends with Josh but was shocked to see that 4 of my friends have mutual friends wuth him and Facebook was suggesting I may know some of his friends based on that. It's a small and somewhat creepy world sometimes!

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I didn't see this posted yet. Apologies if it has been. Josh posted a response to the lawsuit. He claims he has never even met Danica:

Duggar claims in new legal docs he has an air-tight alibi ... he was not even in Pennsylvania, the state where the alleged encounter went down. He also says he has never in his life been to the strip club or hotel in question.

Link to TMZ article

Edited by SledCat
changing the woman's name from "the stripper" to Danica. sounded a bit unsavory the way I had it before.
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Gimme a Free RV

IF this is true, it ought to be easy enough to validate via credit card/bank statements.  I mean, I doubt Josh was carrying thousands in cash at the time of the strip club and hotel visits.  He's already admitted to cheating on his wife and being addicted to porn.  If he's lying to cover his slimy rear, then why?  It's not like one less thing is going to make him look any better.

Oh, wait.  I know.

$$$$$$

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Bad Wolf
9 minutes ago, SledCat said:

I didn't see this posted yet. Apologies if it has been. Josh posted a response to the lawsuit. He claims he has never even met the stripper:

Duggar claims in new legal docs he has an air-tight alibi ... he was not even in Pennsylvania, the state where the alleged encounter went down. He also says he has never in his life been to the strip club or hotel in question.

Link to TMZ article

Thanks for the link @sledcat. I guess we'll all have to wait and see.

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Whoosh
31 minutes ago, SledCat said:

I didn't see this posted yet. Apologies if it has been. Josh posted a response to the lawsuit. He claims he has never even met the stripper:

Duggar claims in new legal docs he has an air-tight alibi ... he was not even in Pennsylvania, the state where the alleged encounter went down. He also says he has never in his life been to the strip club or hotel in question.

Link to TMZ article

I have been waiting for him to make this argument.  I may be wrong on this, but I believe if he had clear and convincing proof of this that Dillon could not poke even small holes in and/or raise small amounts of doubt I think this will be thrown out by the judge or failure to state a claim.  If that were going to happen, I would have thought it would have happened by now?  I really am not sure on that and if I am wrong someone please correct me.  The prosecution would drop charges in a criminal trial if there was clear proof he was elsewhere and nothing or not much to show that untrue.  I don't know what would happen in civil court under the applicable standard of evidence, but if someone tries to sue me for something I did in California and I can provide something like video evidence of myself at an event in Boston at that same time, I thought that meant case closed.

Anyway, my thinking about this stemmed from thoughts of "what if people are right and he can prove beyond a shadow of a doubt that he was NOT there".  If that is TRUE but Dillon is moving forward anyway and the case isn't thrown out, I will be expecting a long-lost evil twin reveal to end the whole thing.  They will prove it was the evil twin and not Josh that did these things by matching fingerprints from the beer bottle Dillon saved from the evening to the long-lost evil twin rather than Josh.  Anything for publicity, right? ;)  Seriously, I would love to know what is really happening.

Edited by Whoosh
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karen77

If he didn't do anything with her, then why is he in rehab.... just for having an AM account? I seriously doubt that.

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Buzzard

I REALLY want to read whatever pleading TMZ is talking about.  What on earth is his alibi? What about the admission that he was unfaithful? 'Unfaithful' now means he looked at naughty pictures?  If that was the case why would Anna be as upset as she is, and why would she have gotten tested for STDs?

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Whoosh
4 minutes ago, Buzzard said:

I REALLY want to read whatever pleading TMZ is talking about.  What on earth is his alibi? What about the admission that he was unfaithful? 'Unfaithful' now means he looked at naughty pictures?  If that was the case why would Anna be as upset as she is, and why would she have gotten tested for STDs?

I was thinking he could argue that while he has indeed had sordid affairs with numerous good Christian women, he has never been anywhere near this Jezebel who is clearly SATAN in wolves clothing.  Also, I could easily see him arguing that his apology and any rehab was all about online activity only - this is Josh Duggar after all.

ETA - but seriously, who knows.  I agree with you - give me a court document.

Edited by Whoosh
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2manyKidzzz

I don't know the answers to any of the above, but it is going to be very interesting to see it all play out. If, there are for instance, credit card charges from PA at that time. 

Hard to see that he would deny it completely if there were a charge acct. paper trail. 

Entertaining for all but Anna. 

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Buzzard

If thats really the stance he's taking then this isnt going to settle.  The depositions will be AMAZING!

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singsingsing

As slimy as Josh is, I lean toward believing him on this one. Her story has always sounded off, and she has plenty of motive to lie. When it first broke, of course some of us immediately went to his social media accounts to see if we could prove that he was or wasn't where she said he was at the time. There were gaps that made that impossible, but the gaps were incredibly small. Within a day or two, he was somewhere completely different with his family. Of course it's not impossible that he sneaked off to another state, hit up a strip club, propositioned a porn star, had sex with her in a hotel room, and then sneaked away back to his family before anyone noticed, but I personally feel it's more likely that he was never with her at all.

Truth will out, anyway. One of them should be able to prove pretty definitively whether he was there or not. This is the 21st century, not the middle ages. There has to be some proof, somewhere.

Edited by singsingsing
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Cleopatra7
22 minutes ago, Buzzard said:

I REALLY want to read whatever pleading TMZ is talking about.  What on earth is his alibi? What about the admission that he was unfaithful? 'Unfaithful' now means he looked at naughty pictures?  If that was the case why would Anna be as upset as she is, and why would she have gotten tested for STDs?

I'm now starting to wonder if Josh used run of the mill streetwalkers to satisfy his curiosity. These are the most devalued and powerless women in our society, and the least likely to complain if mistreated by a client. There's more of a risk for getting an STD compared to a pornography star, but more likely to be discreet or not even care who they're with because of their dire conditions (e.g. drug addiction, homelessness, mental illness). However, Josh's Ok Cupid profile also suggests an interest in obtaining a long-term mistress. I feel like there is a lot to Joshley Madison that we don't know about.

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justoneoftwo
36 minutes ago, Whoosh said:

I have been waiting for him to make this argument.  I may be wrong on this, but I believe if he had clear and convincing proof of this that Dillon could not poke even small holes in and/or raise small amounts of doubt I think this will be thrown out by the judge or failure to state a claim.  If that were going to happen, I would have thought it would have happened by now?  I really am not sure on that and if I am wrong someone please correct me.  The prosecution would drop charges in a criminal trial if there was clear proof he was elsewhere and nothing or not much to show that untrue.  I don't know what would happen in civil court under the applicable standard of evidence, but if someone tries to sue me for something I did in California and I can provide something like video evidence of myself at an event in Boston at that same time, I thought that meant case closed.

Anyway, my thinking about this stemmed from thoughts of "what if people are right and he can prove beyond a shadow of a doubt that he was NOT there".  If that is TRUE but Dillon is moving forward anyway and the case isn't thrown out, I will be expecting a long-lost evil twin reveal to end the whole thing.  They will prove it was the evil twin and not Josh that did these things by matching fingerprints from the beer bottle Dillon saved from the evening to the long-lost evil twin rather than Josh.  Anything for publicity, right? ;)  Seriously, I would love to know what is really happening.

Generally a motion to dismiss for failure to state a claim (which is what was filed, though we haven't seen it) assumed the plaintiff's pleadings are all factually correct, and says that even if all of those facts were true there is no claim as a matter of law.  If there are undisputed facts which make her story impossible it would usually come up later, after some discovery has occurred.  This would close the case, based upon a motion.  She can either fight it and say the evidence is not undisputed and they may have to do discovery to find out if it is, or she can let it go, or she can say the undisputed facts don't show that as a matter of law he couldn't have done it and the court could disagree.  In a criminal case the prosecution would probably decide not to fight it (which is like her deciding not to fight it) but they wouldn't actually have to, it would just be odd to continue.  Further air tight may not mean the same thing to both sides, or to the judge.  

If anyone has access to his pleadings please send links, I would love to read them.

Edited by justoneoftwo
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Buzzard
2 minutes ago, justoneoftwo said:

Generally a motion to dismiss for failure to state a claim (which is what was filed, though we haven't seen it) assumed the plaintiff's pleadings are all factually correct, and says that even if all of those facts were true there is no claim as a matter of law.  If there are undisputed facts which make her story impossible it would usually come up later, after some discovery has occurred.  This would close the case, based upon a motion.  She can either fight it and say the evidence is not undisputed and they may have to do discovery to find out if it is, or she can let it go, or she can say the undisputed facts don't show that as a matter of law he couldn't have done it and the court could disagree.  In a criminal case the prosecution would probably decide not to fight it (which is like her deciding not to fight it) but they wouldn't actually have to, it would just be odd to continue.  Further air tight may not mean the same thing to both sides, or to the judge.  

If anyone has access to his pleadings please send links, I would love to read them.

Thats what I was thinking, its odd for him to show his cards this early in the case.  I'm assuming that TMZ has the actual pleadings, though.  

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justoneoftwo
Just now, Buzzard said:

Thats what I was thinking, its odd for him to show his cards this early in the case.  I'm assuming that TMZ has the actual pleadings, though.  

Yes, its really odd.  I would also add it doesn't mean its not heading for settlement.  My firm will often file motions for summary judgement and then have settlement talks while the court is reviewing the arguments.  It just means both sides have put forth their arguments and your choosing to bet on the judge's decision, or not.  

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socalrules

I have always thought that if Josh was having an affair, it was with someone he met through ATI, his political travels or through the hate group he worked for. I have no doubt that there are fundy groupies. Why else wouldn't any of the other women have come forward? If they truly sell sex like Danica, I would think they might want a quick payday for an interview. Look at all the women that came out of the woodwork with Charlie Sheen. I think whoever Josh had an affair with does not want it publicly revealed for fear it may damage her marriage, career, etc.

Even if Josh has evidence he never knew Danica, unless he filed something like a motion for summary judgment, he is in the case until the end if there is no settlement or if Danica doesn't drop the case. They would still have to go through the discovery process. If he was not there, Danica may be banking on his settling to avoid being deposed. 

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Cleopatra7
12 hours ago, Mrsaztx said:

But it's not restrictive to jimbob, it's fantastic for him. He gets to rape his wife whenever, gets to have all his whims catered to all the time, his kids aren't allowed to bug him, it's aces for him, and all the other head's of households, so I wonder what percent of them actually felt this was biblically correct, and how many of them are just using it as a means to their desired end 

ATI is restrictive for Jim Bob because he can't go to the movies (unless it's one of those bad by definition movies aimed at evangelicals), read classic or popular literature, listen to secular music, have hobbies, or even have privacy as most people understand it. Sure, he's the "leader" of the Duggar home, but he isn't allowed to have a personal life or a real personality. He's completely defined by how many children he has. Most men, even religious conservative men, would not want to be part of an organization that strips them of any personality or individuality.

21 minutes ago, socalrules said:

I have always thought that if Josh was having an affair, it was with someone he met through ATI, his political travels or through the hate group he worked for. I have no doubt that there are fundy groupies. Why else wouldn't any of the other women have come forward? If they truly sell sex like Danica, I would think they might want a quick payday for an interview. Look at all the women that came out of the woodwork with Charlie Sheen. I think whoever Josh had an affair with does not want it publicly revealed for fear it may damage her marriage, career, etc.

Even if Josh has evidence he never knew Danica, unless he filed something like a motion for summary judgment, he is in the case until the end if there is no settlement or if Danica doesn't drop the case. They would still have to go through the discovery process. If he was not there, Danica may be banking on his settling to avoid being deposed. 

I think Josh probably had a local hook-up in Arkansas that we don't know about and is staying quiet because she lives in a small town and doesn't want to be run out on the proverbial rail. There were always plenty of leghumpers coming to the car lot, so it's not hard to imagine that Josh could have met someone there.

Edited by Cleopatra7
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2 hours ago, karen77 said:

If he didn't do anything with her, then why is he in rehab.... just for having an AM account? I seriously doubt that.

Josh admitted being unfaithful to his wife. He did not mention with whom he had been cheating, so it doesn't necessarily have to be Danica Dillon. SHE claimed to have had sex with Josh. Since he never admitted being with her or anyone else, specifically, I do wonder who the other(s) were. I thought if he had been with prostitutes or strippers that they might have come forward, especially after Danica's story. No one has. Maybe he actually cheated with someone from work, a neighbor, someone he  picked up in a bar, the usual ways to have affairs.  Danica made him seem aggressive and violent, but perhaps Josh is just a run of the mill cheater.

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karen77
3 minutes ago, Letgo said:

Josh admitted being unfaithful to his wife. He did not mention with whom he had been cheating, so it doesn't necessarily have to be Danica Dillon. SHE claimed to have had sex with Josh. Since he never admitted being with her or anyone else, specifically, I do wonder who the other(s) were. I thought if he had been with prostitutes or strippers that they might have come forward, especially after Danica's story. No one has. Maybe he actually cheated with someone from work, a neighbor, someone he  picked up in a bar, the usual ways to have affairs.  Danica made him seem aggressive and violent, but perhaps Josh is just a run of the mill cheater.

This is true. I'll be very interested to see what the evidence proves for him or her.

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