Netflix's 'Making of a Murderer'

[meep]

I am binge-watching this Netflix docu-series because ohhhhhh mannnnnnnn.

Steven Avery is a man who sat in prison for 18 years......for a rape it comes out through DNA testing that he DID NOT commit. The series shows ample evidence on how he was deliberately FRAMED for this.They show Steven Avery enjoying his freedom and some of the steps he is taking to sue the state and hold accountable everyone who was involved.

You think, "Okay. It's over. Happy ending!" Nope. It's just beginning. What the show is REALLY about is how Steven "allegedly" gets framed A-FUCKING-GAIN. No documentary has made me as flaming mad as this had. Wow. 

I'm hoping someone else is watching it too so we can talk about it. I started watching yesterday and I'm on episode 8. 

[DaffyDill]

Husband is downloading it for me, so I'll have to get back to you when I get a chance to watch it. Probably in the next day or so when he's on nightshift (he's even working Christmas eve  )

[meep]

On 12/22/2015 at 10:40 PM, DaffyDill said:

Husband is downloading it for me, so I'll have to get back to you when I get a chance to watch it. Probably in the next day or so when he's on nightshift (he's even working Christmas eve  )

That's okay, I still haven't watched the last two episodes because it's something both my boyfriend and I are watching together. He's working like mad and hasn't had time to finish it yet. He'd be so mad if I watched it by myself, LOL.

[DaffyDill]

12 hours ago, meep said:

That's okay, I still haven't watched the last two episodes because it's something both my boyfriend and I are watching together. He's working like mad and hasn't had time to finish it yet. He'd be so mad if I watched it by myself, LOL.

I totally get that. We have some shows we watch together too, and God help me if he finds out I watched some eps by myself. Works the other way round, too.

[mebeforee]

I started watching this after seeing it mentioned here, and oh my god. It's incredible. Normally I am more interested in real murderers than police corruption, but this is really getting to me. I'm on episode 5 right now and I'm so tempted to look up the outcome of the case, but while I'm hugely willing to read spoilers for every fiction I've ever loved, I want to retain some hope here. I can't imagine the frustration on part of the defense with all the counts against the police being immediately discounted (but I actually said 'good!' aloud when they said that the judge denied their request to exclude the blood vial as evidence), because when you see it all together it seems insane that it apparently didn't warrant a closer look in the eyes of the judicial system. And that they could look at Brendan's interview videos and not think he was coerced is crazy to me.

I weirdly feel a little sympathy for the judge, too, though I think he should have taken the criticism against the police more seriously because there is so much bizarre behavior on their part (and Brendan should have absolutely been allowed to change lawyers). But what a complicated case where you have to make such significant calls that affect so many. I know that's his job, but I imagine most cases are easier to make judgment over and this is one that would have so much pressure there.

Still I'm super disturbed by this series and I can't stop watching it.

[mebeforee]

Also I feel like Teresa's ex boyfriend is kind of creepy. He smiled while talking about figuring out her password and getting access to her account, idk. Maybe he's just nervous being on the stand but he has some weird reactions.

[withaj]

I saw this pop up on my Netflix the other day and thought "oh magic algorithm, you know me too well..." but I haven't dived in yet. Sounds suuuper aggravating.

[mebeforee]

It is definitely aggravating, but also super addictive. I don't want to be too suspicious of anyone but it also feels like a lot of power abuses may have happened in this case and so little attention is given to that kind of thing. And they make a good point that, while legally one is innocent until proven guilty, that doesn't really happen when a case is so heavily covered by the media. People are subject to public opinion whether it's legally objective or not.

[SledCat]

I just finished watching the series yesterday. Man. I think (apart from the victim Theresa), the person I felt the most sorry for was the nephew Brendan. He didn't have a chance, did he? It was an unbelievable nightmare from the start: watching the interrogation tapes, and seeing him ask if he could make a class at school after "confessing" to playing a part in a murder was just horrifically sad. He thought he was going to be able to walk out of there.

I don't know if Steven played a role in Theresa's murder, or not. I do think that if he did, it certainly didn't happen the way the cops claimed.

Btw, that Ken Kratz, the DA, made my skin crawl.

[halcionne]

On 12/25/2015 at 6:23 PM, mebeforee said:

Also I feel like Teresa's ex boyfriend is kind of creepy. He smiled while talking about figuring out her password and getting access to her account, idk. Maybe he's just nervous being on the stand but he has some weird reactions.

I got creepy vibes off her brother, too. 

I don't have much to say about the show; I'm mostly just speechless.

I went to Steven Avery's wikipedia entry and just glancing at the first couple of paragraphs I noticed a very different tone in the article than the documentary, which has me thinking about how different each version of a story can be, and where the truth is in all of them. 

[Buzzard]

I watched it, and noted how heavily it showed the defense case, including driving around during the trial with the defense attorneys.  Until I read a file and a transcript I wont form an opinion on a case, especially one where the filmmaker is pushing an opinion. Editing is magic, just ask the Duggars. 

[PennySycamore]

I saw a program on Discovery ID about this case and it was slanted to Avery being guilty of the second murder. I am interested in the opposite view, however, and Teresa's family seemed rather vengeful. It made me a bit uncomfortable.  I need to watch this. ID did have a show the other day about a miscarriage of justice and about a corrupt DA in Florida.  I find miscarriages of justice both fascinating and tragic.

[mausi]

I've been binge-watching this too, and reading some other articles about the case and evidence presented during the trial that didn't make it to the doc series. I'm no longer nearly as convinced of Steven Avery's innocence as I was when watching the documentary -- although I still do not believe the murder occurred the way the prosecution presented it, and I do believe the police planted and tampered with evidence to ensure a guilty verdict. The Dassey case was just mishandled from the outset; that boy did not stand a chance. 

But still, despite the doubts I have now regarding Avery's involvement, it was a gross miscarriage of justice and abuse of power within the legal system.

[SledCat]

Yes, I started reading after I watched the series and quite a few incidents in the documentary seemed to be a bit "glossed over", for lack of a better term. The incident with the family cat was quite a bit more troubling than Steven Avery made it out to be in the film, for example.

I think they showed a brief excerpt of the report on the screen as he was telling the story but there wasn't time to read the entire report, of course.

[Fascinated]

Ok, agree about bias and editing and such.  I think there are many reasons to believe that both these men are innocent. I would like to know why, if Steven killed Theresa at his home and then burned her body in the firepit, he would, at some point, drive her around in her car and then 'hide' her car on his property. There are many things that don't add up here. I truly think the cops railroaded them.

I don't know (obviously) who killed her. But I do believe those two cops are complicit either in her death, or in framing Steven after finding her body in the car. I didn't like her brother too much and I wonder about her ex-boyfriend.

Riveting programme, though. My son and I binge watched over the last two days. We were enthralled. 

[Pixiedust1960]

Oh sounds good!  I will have to check it out. 

[DaffyDill]

OMG - just watched ep 3 where they show how the detectives led the nephew into saying what they wanted. Wow. 

And it would be good if spoilers in this thread were under the spoiler tag, seeing as I think I caught part of one before scrolling to the end of the thread. Sheesh!

[Fascinated]

1 hour ago, DaffyDill said:

OMG - just watched ep 3 where they show how the detectives led the nephew into saying what they wanted. Wow. 

And it would be good if spoilers in this thread were under the spoiler tag, seeing as I think I caught part of one before scrolling to the end of the thread. Sheesh!

Shit. Sorry!  I think it's too late to edit my post now.  I don't think anything we (I) have said here will actually ruin your viewing, though. At least I hope it won't. (I can't find the embarrassed smilie.)

[Chach1984i]

On 12/30/2015 at 2:10 PM, Buzzard said:

I watched it, and noted how heavily it showed the defense case, including driving around during the trial with the defense attorneys.  Until I read a file and a transcript I wont form an opinion on a case, especially one where the filmmaker is pushing an opinion. Editing is magic, just ask the Duggars. 

There's an interview with the filmmakers on buzzfeed. They state that the asked the prosecution to be interviewed for the documentary but that he declined. He's  (prosecutor) is all over social media saying that he wasn't asked to be in the series. Their response is that he's lying, apparently they had to submit all requests in writing as motions to the judge.

It is interesting to watch everything unfold though.

[DaffyDill]

On 1 January 2016 at 2:27 AM, Fascinated said:

Shit. Sorry!  I think it's too late to edit my post now.  I don't think anything we (I) have said here will actually ruin your viewing, though. At least I hope it won't. (I can't find the embarrassed smilie.)

Sorry @Fascinated  I read something, and now that I've finished watching the show, it's not really a spoiler after all. I guess I was so worried about getting it spoiled, I over reacted. I'm sorry  .

I watched it by myself cos hubby was working nights and I couldn't wait any longer lol, and I came in here after Ep 3 (I think?) to just go OMG, OMG all over the place as I had no one to tell and talk about it with.

I really don't know whether SA killed Teresa or not, but I DO think that there was definitely room for reasonable doubt, and in that case, shouldn't the jury have given a "Not Guilty" verdict?

So much about the whole scenario bothered me. So many details and evidence missing, and the jury situation seemed a little weird, with the way the initial voting went, to how it finished up. Could there have been tampering, or bribery?

That Len Kachinsky, Brendon's Lawyer - ewww what a worm with his smarmy smile he'd give the TV cameras. And Kratz just made my skin crawl.

[molecule]

I know several people who live in Manitowoc and a few others who have known the Avery family in the past.

What I am hearing from everyone is that the justice system dropped the ball on this one in terms of process--but that Steven Avery is a disturbed individual and that the community is safer with him behind bars. The consensus is also that Brendan Dassey was not treated fairly.

Several of these folks have shared this article on Facebook. It includes a link to the full transcript of the interview with Brendan Dassey. (Links to the original coverage by the Milwaukee Journal Sentinel can be found here.)

[ClaraOswin]

Spoiler

I am putting this in a spoiler thingy just in case.

I know that editing can be magic and obviously the film makers skewed toward Avery being innocent.

But a few things are nagging at me....

If Steven killed her in the garage like the state said....then why was there no blood?

If he killed her elsewhere...where was it? And why would he then bring the car and things back? Is it possible he killed her in her car?

Why were the bones in multiple locations?

Why was none of her hair/dna/anything found in the garage or his trailer?

How could blood from his finger end up in the car but no finger prints?

Why was the roommate never questioned? (I also found the ex to be a bit sketchy.)

Something about Theresa's brother really bothered me but I don't know why.

I have a hard time believing Brendan had any involvement. Though there was that one phone call with his mom that made it seem like he did. 

My theories based on just what I saw on the show....If Avery killed her, he did it somewhere else. But I do think the cops planted evidence to try to secure a conviction. Or it's possible someone else, like the roommate, killed her, knew he could pin it on Avery so dumped her remains and car. And then cops planted evidence thinking Avery was guilty. 

One thing that seemed consistent with Brendan was that he was at the fire pit. So if her remains were really there...wouldn't Avery have known?? That part makes me think maybe Avery DID kill her.

Ugh...I just go back and forth with it.

Things that I keep thinking about are posted above.

[Imaginary_Wonderland]

I started watching this yesterday with my Mum. I've only seen two episodes so far, so I am going to avoid reading this thread until I finish it (I hate spoilers). I hope to get a few more episodes in tonight. So much has happened already in just 2 episodes, I can't imagine what the rest could be filled with!

It has been fascinating so far but not what I was expecting when I turned it on. My brother recommended it to us over Xmas or New Years when he popped in for dinner. I wasn't really listening too much to him or even read the info on Netflix before I played it. I assumed it was a drama series and fictional, not a real life documentary. I have lots of thoughts on it already but gonna wait til I watch the 8 other episodes, I will probably change my mind on it with more info.

[molecule]

A Milwaukee reporter who covered the Avery trial is live tweeting his viewing of the show. 

[Buzzard]

18 hours ago, molecule said:

I know several people who live in Manitowoc and a few others who have known the Avery family in the past.

What I am hearing from everyone is that the justice system dropped the ball on this one in terms of process--but that Steven Avery is a disturbed individual and that the community is safer with him behind bars. The consensus is also that Brendan Dassey was not treated fairly.

Several of these folks have shared this article on Facebook. It includes a link to the full transcript of the interview with Brendan Dassey. (Links to the original coverage by the Milwaukee Journal Sentinel can be found here.)

The link to the transcript has "too much traffic" and dropbox disabled it.  From speaking to people that read it, though, the interview was not nearly as leading as the snippets they showed.

I'm disturbed by people that think that there was reasonable doubt or not enough evidence based on watching a documentary that was made by people who were pretty tight with the defense.  This trial was weeks long, we simply dont know what the evidence was.  Was it good tv? Sure, but I dont think that we know enough to make legal determinations based on what little we've seen.