Jim and Bobye Holt Had A Baby....

[Mela99]

I wonder if she spells it "Bobye" because it would be too masculine and unwomanly to spell it "Bobby". 

[SolomonFundy]

3 hours ago, SoybeanQueen said:

I haven't ever read much about the Holts, so I don't have a past behavior radar to compare things. Is it possible that this is a rare moment when the mother is content to stay quiet about her own pregnancy because she doesn't want to take away from her older child's time in the spotlight? That would be a crazy thought in Duggar-world, yes, but maybe possible for others.

You're right about the combination of sketchy factors, though.

I always read Bobye's name like she's related to Kanye.

I will never NOT read it as "Bob-yay" from now on. 

Honestly, I don't know enough about the Holts to know if Bobye's behaviour is common for her or not. Her daughter Kaeleigh's most recent pregnancy was announced at about 19 weeks on the Holts' instagram account, apparently at Bobye's discretion. I do know that Bobye had around 5 miscarriages in a row before Seth was born (he's the second youngest now). My guess would be that the miscarriages caused her to be cautious about her expectations.

The "sketchy factors" portion of my post was definitely meant to be a fan conspiracy rather than a genuine belief. I don't think that this is really a cover-up for an illegitimate pregnancy/birth. I DO think that they've handled this in a weird way, and have left the door open to quite a lot of conjecture on their motives. I like your theory about Bobye giving her daughter the spotlight, but I think it's probably not the case here. Kaeleigh seems to keep a tight reign on her internet presence, and doesn't have a public blog or website (that I know of). Furthermore, this is her second pregnancy in two years, which would make the event a little less unique than her first birth. Both of those factors lead me to believe that Kaeleigh probably isn't seeking the spotlight for her sons or herself. If that's true, then we're back to Bobye and Jim intentionally drawing a veil of secrecy around Scottlin's birth.

[AmazonGrace]

5 hours ago, EmmieJ said:

Not just back in the day.  About 8 years ago, I was working at a firm and we had a client come in.  She came in with her husband, her 20 year old daughter, and her 4 year old daughter.  After the family left, my boss told me that the 4 year old was actually the older daughter's child, born out of wedlock.  I was horrified.  I cannot imagine that this would remain a secret forever.  One day, the little girl will learn that her "parents" were really her grandparents and that her sister was really her mother, and feel totally betrayed.  

 

Did your boss have knowledge that they wanted it to remain a secret forever? Not such a well kept secret if your boss knew and gossiped about it.

Because I think just because they didn't think that you needed to know the details of their family affairs doesn't mean they hadn't told the girl or weren't planning to...

[snowfootwaltz]

A 45-year-old woman at my church recently gave birth. She didn't tell her parents or any relatives about the baby until the child was born, due to a previous stillbirth. She didn't want them worrying for months. I could see Bobye withholding the info for the same reasons...although it is so strange that people that see her often didn't know.

The funny part is, this family from my church lives on a farm. When they called relatives to tell them there was a new member of the family, the response was, "What did you get; another goat or a calf?"

[elliha]

6 hours ago, snowfootwaltz said:

A 45-year-old woman at my church recently gave birth. She didn't tell her parents or any relatives about the baby until the child was born, due to a previous stillbirth. She didn't want them worrying for months. I could see Bobye withholding the info for the same reasons...although it is so strange that people that see her often didn't know.

I tend to think it is this as well. The risks of complications or stillbirth are higher in older mothers and she might have felt she didn't want to discuss a loss online. People don't always act the same way during all stages of life and having a late baby like this could have made them pretty scared. The risk of miscarriage after 45 is 50%(!) so being more scared is not strange at all.

I have tried to see how many women have children after 40 and in my country Sweden about 4 percent of all children in 2011 were born to mothers 40 years old or older. Probably most of them were to mothers under 45 though. I read that in the 19th century 12 percent of children had mothers above 40 so when you don't use birth control is probably much more common so in the fundie group we should se more of these pregnancies than in the part of the population who uses birth control. 

The hidden grandchild happened in my paternal grandfather's family. My mother's youngest "uncle" was really her cousin which she found out when she was in her teens. She kept calling him uncle his whole life though as this is what she was used to but my siblings and I call his daughter our (second) cousin as that is how we see her. One thing I heard her "uncle" say about the situation was that he saw his grandparents as his real parents and that he had a good upbringing, the only thing that was a bit bitter was that out of all his "siblings" the one that was really was his mother was the one he felt the least connected to and the least loved by even as a "sibling". Given that his bio-mother had some mental health issues what happened was probably the best for both of them but I think he would have preferred to have grown up knowing the truth. He found out himself in his teens when his parents died and he found out he had no right to inherit as he was not their real child. He had heard the odd word whispered which he in retrospect understood was about him but he had never suspected the truth. 

[keen23]

Add me to the list of people who have family members raised as siblings to their parents. My two youngest great uncles were actually the sons of the oldest son. He ran away at 15 with an also young neighbor girl (it was the 1920's). Came back 4 or 5 years later with 2 kids. The girl went back to her family, never saw the boys again. My great grandmother raised the boys as her sons. I think it was an open secret. Everyone knew of the relationship, but the "boys" all called each other brothers, even the one who was the Dad.

[apandaaries]

6 hours ago, elliha said:

The risks of complications or stillbirth are higher in older mothers and she might have felt she didn't want to discuss a loss online. People don't always act the same way during all stages of life and having a late baby like this could have made them pretty scared. The risk of miscarriage after 45 is 50%(!) so being more scared is not strange at all.

I have tried to see how many women have children after 40 and in my country Sweden about 4 percent of all children in 2011 were born to mothers 40 years old or older. Probably most of them were to mothers under 45 though. I read that in the 19th century 12 percent of children had mothers above 40 so when you don't use birth control is probably much more common so in the fundie group we should se more of these pregnancies than in the part of the population who uses birth control. 

<snip>

A great-grandmother of mine (from Sweden! Hejsan!) had 8 kids here in the States and didn't get started having kids until she was 33.  They were all singletons, so a few of those babies were birthed in her 40s.  My own mother had her last at 38, but she also had a miscarriage before that.  It's certainly possible, but the fact that so many people had seen Bobeye (rhymes with Kanye forever now) but didn't know she was expecting is really odd to me.  Obviously, I wasn't there, but that so few people knew AND that she had Venessa deliver as a homebirth situation make for an oddly shady and suspicious birth announcement...

[elliha]

18 minutes ago, amandaaries said:

A great-grandmother of mine (from Sweden! Hejsan!) had 8 kids here in the States and didn't get started having kids until she was 33.  They were all singletons, so a few of those babies were birthed in her 40s.  My own mother had her last at 38, but she also had a miscarriage before that.  It's certainly possible, but the fact that so many people had seen Bobeye (rhymes with Kanye forever now) but didn't know she was expecting is really odd to me.  Obviously, I wasn't there, but that so few people knew AND that she had Venessa deliver as a homebirth situation make for an oddly shady and suspicious birth announcement...

It would have been interesting to see how she was dressed at the end of the pregnancy, I assume some things can be done with how you dress if you are not carrying too large. I had a classmate at the university who had a baby and most of us thought it was a joke but she had found out she was pregnant a couple of weeks before it happened and I saw her about 2 weeks before she gave birth and if someone had told me she was pregnant I would have thought they were out of the mind. She didn't look pregnant at all, perhaps a little bloated but not pregnant. I on the other hand when I was pregnant looked like a bowling ball with legs so I could not have hidden it even in a burqa. 

Off topic: My mom gave birth at 37 and my sister at 38, mom's was an oops pregnancy after she had to pull out her coil and my sister got pregnant her first cycle without birth control. My mom had ovulation even after 50, the eggs are usually too bad then but it happens that one is good enough. I assume both mom and my sister could have easily had children in their early 40s given their high fertility in their late 30s. It gives me hope, I am 33 and I have one and one "baking" so hopefully I can have proper spacing and still be able to have 3 or 4 if I like. I don't know if my mom ever had a miscarriage but I know my sister had one and one ectopic, both were when she was relatively young. 

[Free2BeMe]

On 12/19/2015 at 0:41 AM, Heathen525 said:

Names the could have used: Simon, Scott, Sean, Saul, Solomon, Stuart. 

Sheldon

[RosyDaisy]

Oops, double post.

I read that in the 19th century 12 percent of children had mothers above 40

According to my great-grandmother's midwife journal, she delivered quite a few babies to mothers over 40. Sadly, there were some bad outcomes.

[WeArndtMarried]

On December 21, 2015 at 2:12 AM, AmazonGrace said:

Did your boss have knowledge that they wanted it to remain a secret forever? Not such a well kept secret if your boss knew and gossiped about it.

Because I think just because they didn't think that you needed to know the details of their family affairs doesn't mean they hadn't told the girl or weren't planning to...

I know of a situation like that. The teenager gave birth around 16 and her parents adopted the little girl (I think she's about 6 now). But they have never tried to keep it a secret. That seems like the better way to do it, but I'm sure it's a hard situation.

[Jana814]

1 hour ago, WeArndtMarried said:

I know of a situation like that. The teenager gave birth around 16 and her parents adopted the little girl (I think she's about 6 now). But they have never tried to keep it a secret. That seems like the better way to do it, but I'm sure it's a hard situation.

Glad they are not trying to hide it. But that does sound like a hard situation. 

[nelliebelle1197]

On 12/19/2015 at 9:07 PM, Rachel333 said:

Haha, I didn't even notice the "isle" mistake.

We are so used to SOTDRT spelling, it probably never crossed your mind this was incorrect

[EmmieJ]

On 12/21/2015 at 0:12 AM, AmazonGrace said:

Did your boss have knowledge that they wanted it to remain a secret forever? Not such a well kept secret if your boss knew and gossiped about it.

Because I think just because they didn't think that you needed to know the details of their family affairs doesn't mean they hadn't told the girl or weren't planning to...

Well, my then boss tended to tell me a lot of things.  He was a talker.  I shared the story here but with no specific identifiers.   The little girl called her grandparents mama and daddy so it seems likely that is what she believed them to be.  It is such a big falsehood that the idea of it makes me uncomfortable.

[SoybeanQueen]

I know a family who has a similar situation. Oldest daughter had a child, could not take care of her, and now grandparents are raising the little girl. She was legally adopted, and calls her biological grandparents mom and dad, because that's who they are to her. She knows about her birth mother. It's sometimes hard for people outside of a family to understand how that works, but it does. My children call me mom, whether I gave birth to them or not. A grandparent adoption can be very similar to a non-kin adoption, or for some it may be very different.

tl:dr - Whether or not the kid calls them mom and dad may not have anything to do with knowledge of one's birth parents.

[keepercjr]

Add me to the camp... My neighbor is raising her 9yr grandson as her son and I am fairly certain he doesn't know that his big sis is really his mom.  One day several years ago I asked her where her grandson was (we were at a neighborhood party) and she said quietly "you mean you son".  I said "oh ok" and left it at that.  He talks about visiting said sister in another town a few hours away.  When sisters dad left her mom the kids (and mom) kind of went out of control.  She got pregnant at 16 or 17 and it was not hidden.  Boyfriend was always around.  Interesting note the family is mostly Hmong and Mexican and the boy is blonde like his dad.  Looks nothing like his "brothers and sisters".  I don't think dad is in the picture at all.  I see the boy fairly regularly and he is friends with my daughter.  I can't see this ending well at all.

[desertvixen]

We have a similar situation, only it was my aunt and uncle adopting a baby that was born to one of her cousins at 16.  He found out at 15 or 16 and it was a little rough for him, but he said later that he always felt like something was different about him.  All is good now, 5 years later.

[Jana814]

My mother's cousin is raising her grandson (son's son) as her own.  This is the LAST thing she needed at 64.  He calls her mom.  He has a ton of issues. His mother ran off before he was a year old and his father is not around much. 

[rainbowbabycakes]

On ‎12‎/‎21‎/‎2015 at 9:05 PM, Jana814 said:

That's very odd that this would happen now. Do you mind me asking what area was this in. 

I was born in 82, in Houston, and knew of at least 2 of these situations that I remember

[Anonymousguest]

On 12/21/2015 at 0:30 AM, snowfootwaltz said:

A 45-year-old woman at my church recently gave birth. She didn't tell her parents or any relatives about the baby until the child was born, due to a previous stillbirth. She didn't want them worrying for months. I could see Bobye withholding the info for the same reasons...although it is so strange that people that see her often didn't know.

The funny part is, this family from my church lives on a farm. When they called relatives to tell them there was a new member of the family, the response was, "What did you get; another goat or a calf?"

How do you know that people who saw her often didn't know?

[SolomonFundy]

43 minutes ago, Anonymousguest said:

How do you know that people who saw her often didn't know?

Bobye's instagram has a couple of posts up that include comments from her friends such as "I didn't even know you were expecting!"  She's acknowledged that the family chose not to tell people since she was concerned that her age could affect the outcome of the pregnancy.

 

[Anonymousguest]

2 hours ago, SolomonFundy said:

Bobye's instagram has a couple of posts up that include comments from her friends such as "I didn't even know you were expecting!"  She's acknowledged that the family chose not to tell people since she was concerned that her age could affect the outcome of the pregnancy.

 

That doesn't necessarily mean those people saw her recently and couldn't tell. I have lots of people on my instagram and fb lists who never see me in person. And I'm pretty sure I got those shocked sorts of responses to my last birth announcement, also over 40, lol. 

 

Eta, I looked at their instagram, and one person, who according to her fb page (which was linked on her instagram) lives in Tx, commented she didn't know Bobye was expecting. It's a bit of a stretch to say based on that information that people who saw her often didn't know.

[Jana814]

I can see them not saying anything because of her age. 

 

I have a friend who had a late term miscarriage in 2008. When she had her first child in November of 2009 & announced it on facebook their were many message from people who posted that they didn't know she was even pregnant. 

[halcionne]

Venessa gave Scottlen his two week checkup. There's no doubt in my mind she was Bobye's midwife. 

 

[twinmama]

On 12/20/2015 at 7:11 AM, 19 cats and counting said:

I'm currently reading a book called "The Girls Who Went Away" about unwed mothers (teens and 20s) in post WWII era until Roe v Wade.  It mostly centers around the girls who were sent away to maternity homes and forced to give their kids up for adoption, but a few cases of the paretns raising the baby.   Fascinating read.

 

http://smile.amazon.com/Girls-Who-Went-Away-Surrendered-ebook/dp/B008RMF4GS/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1450624265&sr=1-1&keywords=the+girls+that+went+away

I know this is replying to an older post, but I just finished reading this because you posted it and it was wonderful (I mean, it was fascinating, not in a good or happy way). Thanks for the rec!