60 year old pastor takes on teen as his second wife

[Inthemadhouse]

On ‎12‎/‎6‎/‎2015 at 8:06 AM, Gossamer1 said:

Ok, snarky logic now.  If none of the men in our matriarchal fantasy land know which kid is theirs then they would have to treat each kis as their own. Wouldn't that strengthen the group as a whole?

Actually, this is how it works with the group I know.  One child is known (before the other husband came along), but they have chosen not to find out the paternity of the other two.  When the kids are 18, they can find out if they choose.  All the kids are under 8 right now, so that's quite a way in the future.

 

Doesn't make this situation any less creepy, though

[Geechee Girl]

On 12/1/2015 at 3:09 PM, Pseudoname said:

I highly doubt that anyone who identifies as polyamorous is a practising Christian.

I know a few poly Christians. There's also forums on lifestyle boards for Christians & other people of faith. 

[Cleopatra7]

On 12/1/2015 at 8:19 AM, Gossamer1 said:

Why is it always the men who can have more than one wife? Why can't a wife have more than one husband? The men could share the "burden" of supporting the family.

For the record, as a woman, I find the thought of brother-husbands to be both comical and horrifying. I have an image of a pack of men in matching flannel shirts and baseball caps eyeballing each other because Wife was nicer to one husband and another one feels put out.

According to Ludwig Ott's magisterial Fundamentals of Catholic Dogma, "The primary purpose of Marriage is the generation and bringing up of offspring. The secondary purpose is mutual help and the morally regulated satisfaction of the sex urge. (Sen. certa.)" Regarding the possibility of having your own man-tourage, Ott says, "Polyandry (having several men) is prohibited by the natural law, as it hinders or at least gravely endagers the primary purpose of marriage." However Ott -- or anyone else for that matter -- does not explain why polyandry is against the natural law. If the purpose of marriage is having children and having morally sanctioned sex, it's unclear why polyandry doesn't do that, whereas Ott says that polygyny is frowned upon by god, but not unnatural. Really, I think the men who devised Christian theology just thought the idea of women having more than one husband to be icky, like Kody Brown, and so therefore it's "unnatural."

[BackseatMom]

Polygamy, polygyny, polyandry, polyamory - they all have historical and cultural precedence. They are all susceptible to abuses, but so is monogamy. You don't have to go very far to find examples of the horrible abuse perpetrated and protected by monogamous cultures. The real issue is how power is culturally vested. 

I find it interesting how many people defend their choice by calling the opposite unnatural. At the end of the day, isn't all of human culture (relationships and religion included) an unnatural construct?

That guy is scary looking. Yuck.

[Mela99]

This was the episode today. 61 year old man -- a pastor with 52 felonies -- married and impregnated a 19 year old, his second wife.

huffingtonpost.com/entry/pastor-marries-pregnant-teen-girlfriend-with-wifes-blessing_5673c257e4b014efe0d50216

I'm a little flabbergasted because the children were taken away from them solely for the fact that they're polygamists. No abuse, no neglect... 

Anybody have more deets on this?

[Queen Of Hearts]

Here's a link to the discussion: http://www.freejinger.org/topic/24905-60-year-old-pastor-takes-on-teen-as-his-second-wife/

 

I did not realize their kids were taken away.

[Mela99]

They were on Dr. Phil today.

Apparently the first wive's children were taken away solely because they're poly .... 

I'm partly suspicious of that - no abuse and neglect and just because he has two wives? Surely there was something else going on...

[Jennifer Hart]

oh wow, they took the kids?

[Jennifer Hart]

13 minutes ago, Mela99 said:

They were on Dr. Phil today.

Apparently the first wive's children were taken away solely because they're poly .... 

I'm partly suspicious of that - no abuse and neglect and just because he has two wives? Surely there was something else going on...

Yeah, there has to be more to that story

[Howl]

Headline translation: 

Long term violent criminal, ex-con con man, serial wife/child abandoner, non-child-support paying, multi-bigamist (is there a word for that?), fake Christian sociopath minister fake marries pregnant 19 year old. 

Pre-emptive strike on the part of CPS?  

[FJismyheadship]

Question

What is it called if a female has two wives? Do we have a term for that? Is it the same as if a man has two wives? Genuinely curious

[Tikobaby]

It's all called bigamy.

[BackseatMom]

Wait, where did you see they took the kids?

[Mela99]

It was on the episode yesterday. It was discussed at length. The man said the judge told him he was an affront to God and took the kids. 

Also, sorry, Mods. Didn't realize there was already a thread

[paganbaby]

7 hours ago, FJismyheadship said:

Question

What is it called if a female has two wives? Do we have a term for that? Is it the same as if a man has two wives? Genuinely curious

Polyandry. It's accepted in some cultures, but rarer than polygamy.

[BackseatMom]

1 hour ago, paganbaby said:

Polyandry. It's accepted in some cultures, but rarer than polygamy.

Nope. That is multiple husbands. Polygyny is the specific term for multiple wives. Polygamy is actually the generic term.

[paganbaby]

1 minute ago, BackseatMom said:

Nope. That is multiple husbands. Polygyny is the specific term for multiple wives. Polygamy is actually the generic term.

You're right. I misread the question. Oops.

[BackseatMom]

Though, to be honest, I'm not sure that either of those terms apply outside of heterosexual marriage. Maybe stick with the general polygamy. Or polyamory if they aren't married.

[apandaaries]

However we define it, this "patriarch" had a lot of problems and issues before wedding and bedding (maybe not in that order) the 19 year old.  I'm suspicious of any and every "family" situation he has set up, so I'm okay with CPS taking custody.  If all is well and good, the children will be returned, and if things are not going well, they will at least have the attention of the authorities and the hopes of a more stable foster home. 

[Jingerbread]

On 12/9/2015 at 7:03 PM, Cleopatra7 said:

Really, I think the men who devised Christian theology just thought the idea of women having more than one husband to be icky, like Kody Brown, and so therefore it's "unnatural."

I think they're threatened.  If a single man takes a woman out of the pool, eventually he'll be chosen because there'll be a lack of options.  If a woman can take several men, then he has to earn a place.  If a man can take several wives, he still has a good chance because there's more prestige being the first wife.  At least in groups like that.

[Howl]

The thing that really pisses me off about this guy is that he is constantly, throughout his life, fathering children and then abandoning them in every sense of the word. 

Return of kids, if considered, should be provisional pending his vasectomy or he could end up at 19 kids and counting.....

[Cleopatra7]

I saw the Dr Phil episode with this pastor,and the nineteen year old definitely isn't the sharpest knife in the drawer. However, for a much older man, I could see why that naivety would be appealing. I don't think the young woman has really thought through what she has gotten herself into, and we'll probably hear from her again when she has four kids under five and is trying to escape.

[Howl]

1 hour ago, Cleopatra7 said:

I saw the Dr Phil episode with this pastor,and the nineteen year old definitely isn't the sharpest knife in the drawer. However, for a much older man, I could see why that naivety would be appealing. I don't think the young woman has really thought through what she has gotten herself into, and we'll probably hear from her again when she has four kids under five and is trying to escape.

...has been abandoned and is trying to get child support.  Abandonment has been his consistent style. 

[closetcagebaby]

On 12/9/2015 at 9:20 PM, Inthemadhouse said:

Actually, this is how it works with the group I know.  One child is known (before the other husband came along), but they have chosen not to find out the paternity of the other two.  When the kids are 18, they can find out if they choose.  All the kids are under 8 right now, so that's quite a way in the future.

 

Doesn't make this situation any less creepy, though

This has a historical and cultural precedent too! I believe there are a few asian cultures that have often practiced polyandry, mostly with multiple brothers marrying the same woman.

[AmazonGrace]

On 9.12.2015 at 4:20 AM, Inthemadhouse said:

Actually, this is how it works with the group I know.  One child is known (before the other husband came along), but they have chosen not to find out the paternity of the other two.  When the kids are 18, they can find out if they choose.  All the kids are under 8 right now, so that's quite a way in the future.

 

Doesn't make this situation any less creepy, though

Who has custody? Do the children have no legal father? What happens to them if the mother dies? Do the kids have the right to inherit their fathers?