What do you all think of Josh's 'porn addiction'?

[hockeymoo]

What do you think 'porn addiction' means in fundie circles?

Do you supposed Josh removed this mention from his statement because he doesn't want to open the door to questions about what kind of porn would be found on his computer?

There was recently a blind item mentioned about a former reality TV star's relationship being called off due to the male party's porn addiction/wanting to sext, and I know some people here - jokingly - suspected it was Josiah and Marjorie. Now that Josh's behavior has come to light, do you think this rumor might truthfully have been about Josiah after all?

How many more skeletons are in the Duggars' closet?

[Toothfairy]

Porn in fundie land is the biggest sin next to homosexuality. Porn in the real world isn't that big of deal. Married people look at porn too. Now an addiction is a different story. If Josh has an addiction he needs professional help. I sure hope someone exposes JimBob and J'chelle

[Mylnijya]

I think a person who looks at porn everyday has a porn addiction. And yes I think a lot of men do that. Unfortunately it is just everywhere and very easy to access.

Why was it removed? I have no idea why they edited that part out. Maybe because we were all horrified enough that he's been cheating on his wife with a human person, but the porn addiction was a new revelation that just piled on to the already horrible stink of his life choices.

[doggie]

Porn addiction could be masterbating to one video in the fundy world. Most guys fap because they are horny and don't have access to a girl at the time his wife has to be avaliable at all times so can you imagine him making her act out his Porn feddish?

[RootBeerFloat]

I think Jim Boob probably had a porn problem or they wouldn't be so damn paranoid about the interwebs.

[SportsgalAnnie]

maybe if he looked at playboy it wouldnt be so bad? If a teenager can figure out how to hide it surely he could have.

[MalteseBaby]

IDK why the edit but again, how much shit to you want to admit to at one time? Knowing Josh's personality type, as little as he can get by with.

He may also not KNOW what a "porn addiction" is.

The first symptom of ANY addiction is that it disrupts your normal everyday life. I think he may have been really hot to look at porn, but not addicted because of the time constraints placed on him by his job, his family in DC, and his family in Arkansas.

Also, with the news about Jared Fogle just coming out, I'd be extremely worried that people would think " child porn" when coupled with the molestation revelation regarding the 5 minors when he was 15.

He's going to lie and minimize as much as he can. It's his personality.

Look through what he says to what he doesn't say or do. Most of us have thought for a few years that Josh stopped living an overall healthy life when he got married and left home. We were so right.

[Rachel333]

Porn addiction means looking at porn at all, I think. Maybe at least twice, to call it an addiction.

I think people really can have porn addictions, but fundies apply the term way too liberally. I've heard so much talk about porn addictions, and I don't think it's likely that every fundie/Evangelical man who admits to having looked at porn has a real addiction.

[MalteseBaby]

Porn addiction means looking at porn at all, I think. Maybe at least twice, to call it an addiction.

I think people really can have porn addictions, but fundies apply the term way too liberally. I've heard so much talk about porn addictions, and I don't think it's likely that every fundie/Evangelical man who admits to having looked at porn has a real addiction.

If your definition of " porn" is adult to adult nudity and/ or simulated sex acts, then a huge percentage of US males are or have been porn addicts.

Your viewpoint is not realistic. Most men love porn at some point in their lives. They are visually stimulated in ways that most women aren't.

[Rachel333]

If your definition of " porn" is adult to adult nudity and/ or simulated sex acts, then a huge percentage of US males are or have been porn addicts.

Your viewpoint is not realistic. Most men love porn at some point in their lives. They are visually stimulated in ways that most women aren't.

Ah, sorry, I should have specified there that I was talking about porn addiction in fundie terms.

I'm not sure where I would say a porn addiction begins, personally. Like I said in my second paragraph, I don't think just looking at porn sometimes, like most men, constitutes an addiction. The stories I've seen of porn addiction involved men (or women, actually) spending hours and hours a day viewing porn to the point where it severely impacted their ability to function in everyday life. I don't know that something has to be that bad to be an addiction, but I don't think it's a word to be used loosely either.

[Sundaymorning]

I don't think we can tell if he really has an addiction. My uneducated guess would be that he is a typical, horny young man in his 20s, who likes to look at porn and pretty ladies, and wants to have some casual sex with different women. Nothing out of the ordinary, really.

Of course, after his cult-upbringing, he might be truly convinced that he has an addiction.

However, I'd say the chances of him really having one are not that high.

[mfch]

So- thank god this is anonymous- I'm a woman and I sometimes look at porn. I find mainstream made for men porn pretty gross, but some porn for women is okay, and there are some interesting female friendly sites around. Not just films, also erotica etc. For me it'd be a few times a month? I have never had a boyfriend who hasn't watched porn. It's normal and healthy and I don't really have an issue with it (besides the ethics of who is involved in making it) but I am in my early 20s. I consider it a normal part of sex and life for people of my generation.

Addiction to porn for me is hours and hours a day. Or it's that they begin to seek out more and more hardcore stuff in order to get off- they find it harder to get turned on.

Look up Gail Dines, it's some interesting stuff. Porn is actually responsible for a lot of erectile disfunction because they are no longer aroused by real women!

For Josh ... I don't know. My feeling is- he started watching it sometimes after they got married when they were in Arkansas. Then after they moved to DC he had much more freedom, so he probably started to watch more, and more. Then maybe he saw the Ashley Madison ads? And he thought why not ... and it spiralled from there.

[DeFrauder]

Porn addiction means looking at porn at all, I think. Maybe at least twice, to call it an addiction.

I think people really can have porn addictions, but fundies apply the term way too liberally. I've heard so much talk about porn addictions, and I don't think it's likely that every fundie/Evangelical man who admits to having looked at porn has a real addiction.

I agree with this. They believe that porn is always bad and have a very low tolerance for any kind of porn. Sometimes what gets onto prime time network TV is considered porn. I doubt that most of them can even imagine the content of hardcore porn.

Although I would say that looking at it once or twice and never looking at it again would not be considered an addiction to Fundies. It would have to be habitual---although reading Playboy every month would probably be considered porn addiction to many Fundies.

And people can be addicted to anything. I have read about internet addicts having physical symptoms withdrawal when losing access. It is also possible to drink excessively, long term, and not have physical symptoms when the liquor stops flowing.

[DeFrauder]

I don't think we can tell if he really has an addiction. My uneducated guess would be that he is a typical, horny young man in his 20s, who likes to look at porn and pretty ladies, and wants to have some casual sex with different women. Nothing out of the ordinary, really.

Of course, after his cult-upbringing, he might be truly convinced that he has an addiction.

However, I'd say the chances of him really having one are not that high.

Yes, I think there is a high chance that he believes he is addicted to porn due to the fundie attitude about it.

I would think that an actual addiction to porn that is considered "clinical" would have to involve NEEDING to view porn on a regular (daily) basis and (like substance abuse), looking at porn that is increasingly "hardcore" or extreme.

Wikipedia outlines types of disordered porn viewing behavior: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pornography_addiction

It also includes this tidbit:

Religion effect[edit]

A 2014 released study identified a connection between a subjects religious beliefs and their self perception of pornography addiction.[8][9][10] The study's lead author is Case Western Reserve University psychology doctoral student Joshua Grubbs; the study is titled "Transgression as Addiction: Religiosity and Moral Disapproval as Predictors of Perceived Addiction to Pornography" and was published in the journal Archives of Sexual Behaviour.[9] One of the findings of the study is that the results strongly indicate a predilection in religious people to believe they are addicted to pornography regardless of how much they watch or whether it negatively impacts their lives.[10][11]

[Janes Heir]

When one brings in erotica frequency seems a little more grey *ahem*, although maybe this idea is just from my strange combination of fundie horror of porn (usually constructed as a male-only problem) and idea that mainstream porn is demeaning to women. One poster up-thread seemed to see daily porn viewing as a possible sign of addiction. What about the young woman who has just discovered orgasm and who has an urge to experiment frequently? Are couples whose sex drives lead them both to want sex daily addicted? It seems that interference with normal life is probably a more solid criteria than frequency in determining sexual addiction. However, is it fundie of me to think that Josh's obsession with sex could have been fed by porn and subsequently have largely contributed to his betrayal of his wife?

[Rachel333]

I agree with this. They believe that porn is always bad and have a very low tolerance for any kind of porn. Sometimes what gets onto prime time network TV is considered porn. I doubt that most of them can even imagine the content of hardcore porn.

So this isn't really related, but my mom once said that Calvin Klein ads are "hard core porn." I'm not sure she knows what porn actually is. :lol:

[TuringMachine]

I think whatever Josh's relationship to porn is would probably be normal for anyone else but to the fundies it's just as bad as the cheating.

[DeFrauder]

When one brings in erotica frequency seems a little more grey *ahem*, although maybe this idea is just from my strange combination of fundie horror of porn (usually constructed as a male-only problem) and idea that mainstream porn is demeaning to women. One poster up-thread seemed to see daily porn viewing as a possible sign of addiction. What about the young woman who has just discovered orgasm and who has an urge to experiment frequently? Are couples whose sex drives lead them both to want sex daily addicted? It seems that interference with normal life is probably a more solid criteria than frequency in determining sexual addiction. However, is it fundie of me to think that Josh's obsession with sex could have been fed by porn and subsequently have largely contributed to his betrayal of his wife?

I do not think it is Fundie of you to think that, but it is something that Fundie's preach. Josh certainly does exhibit disordered behavior and attitudes about sex and sexuality. I personally would do not think his problems are because he looked at some porn, however.

Here is a link to some Fundie ideas about porn and porn addiction for anyone who is interested: focusonthefamily.com/marriage/divorce-and-infidelity/pornography-and-virtual-infidelity/stages-of-porn-addiction

[Mylnijya]

I think whatever Josh's relationship to porn is would probably be normal for anyone else but to the fundies it's just as bad as the cheating.

See I lean towards the opposite. Given how terrible his other transgressions have been, it would not surprise me at all if it is a real and true addiction that was a part of his daily workday. He tends to minimize his bad behavior, and to call it a porn addiction when it really wasn't would be maximizing it. Anyways, just a thought.

[MalteseBaby]

OK, going to put on my Psychologist's hat for a minute here.

It is speculation to state that Josh Duggar is a porn addict. We do speculate on FJ. :)

He retracted that part of his statement= who knows what Josh really thinks about Josh?

I think he honestly doesn't know if he is a porn addict, a sex addict, or just what right now. Think of where he was living in Ark. with his family, then off to DC, a whirlwind life with temptations and a cheating website and OK Cupid and who knows what else he got into while there. He must have acted like a kid in a sex candy shop.

I am not a defender of Josh Duggar, I loathe him. I am not a defender of men watching or viewing porn,

It's all in the perspective as far as lay people go, but to the psychological profession, there are criteria to determine if someone is addicted to something or not. The first question, because it's the most important is: "Has this activity significantly adversely affected your work, your home life, your friendships or any other part of your life that you value?"

The way and degree to which the client ( along with significant others if an intervention is underway) perceives the activity to have adversely affected their life largely determines whether it is an addiction or not.

[blessalessi]

It is wrong to speculate or to state that Josh Duggar is a porn addict. He retracted that part of his statement. I think he honestly doesn't know if he is a porn addict, a sex addict, or just what right now.

I think it is perfectly reasonable for people to discuss and speculate on what Josh meant by the term "porn addiction" that he chose to use to describe himself on the internet, yesterday.

He revised his statement in several ways, in a short space of time. That is in itself pretty fascinating, and worthy of discussion, IMO, especially given the other ways in which he and his family have presented information about him over the past months/years, and the ways they have blamed others for portraying their family.

I think it would be inaccurate for anyone here to state definitively that Josh is a porn addict, because we don't know the precise details of his behaviour.

But "wrong to speculate" about behaviour and words that an adult has made in a deliberate public statement? Hell, no.

[MalteseBaby]

I think it is perfectly reasonable for people to discuss and speculate on what Josh meant by the term "porn addiction" that he chose to use to describe himself on the internet, yesterday.

He revised his statement in several ways, in a short space of time. That is in itself pretty fascinating, and worthy of discussion, IMO, especially given the other ways in which he and his family have presented information about him over the past months/years, and the ways they have blamed others for portraying their family.

I think it would be inaccurate for anyone here to state definitively that Josh is a porn addict, because we don't know the precise details of his behaviour.

But "wrong to speculate" about behaviour and words that an adult has made in a deliberate public statement? Hell, no.

You're right. It's not wrong to speculate. However, we can't know what he is or isn't. Going to edit my post. :)

[blessalessi]

You're right. It's not wrong to speculate. However, we can't know what he is or isn't. Going to edit my post. :)

You're kidding, Josh-style, about editing your post, right? :lol:

Edited to add: nope, you actually went back and rewrote your post, even though it is quoted here.

As a psychologist, why not set an example to Josh and own your words?

[goldfishgoddess]

Josh has had a problem with porn addiction for a long time. As a teen, he watched it while working for a political campaign and he was caught in the act. He had his Ashley Madison account while living in his grandmother's house with Anna, and then opened a second account with Ashley Madison when he got to DC.

What's the difference between liking something and it becoming an addiction? When your life begins to become dysfunctional due to the substance or thing you like. I'd say that Josh risking his character by watching porn on a political campaign's computer would be a sign of that. When he got his own house with Anna, I think things really spiralled for him because he had control over Internet and the house and could watch porn without anyone knowing. In DC, he had further control because he now had an office away from home plus probably an office at home where he could watch porn for even more hours under the guise of "working long hours."

Also I agree that non-fundie porn addiction might look different from a fundie one. Out of the fundie world, many non-addicted people turn to porn now and then, even watching it as a couple for a little inspiration or turn on. The difference is-- if someone told you you could not watch it tomorrow or next week, or for a month, would you feel stressed out by that?

Josh's double life was spent sneaking porn into his life whenever he could get away with it. I think it must have soured his relationship with Anna because she did not live up to the unrealistic fake sexuality of the female porn stars (and remember she has been pregnant or dealing with postpartum recovery for four years out of the last seven or so they've been married). Pregnancy and childbirth may also have impacted Josh and made him turn to his porn addiction even more. With his sex life less reliable due to pregnancy and childbirth, he could not get his "fix" and so he turned more and more to porn to satisfy himself (not an excuse for a "real man," but for an addict who finds porn satisfying and addicting, it could be the case he became closer to it than his own wife.)

The vast majority of guys who watch porn aren't like Josh, so it's no excuse. He needs serious treatment and is unlikely to get in the culture he lives in.

[goldfishgoddess]

Regarding Josh or someone editing his statements... remember the Duggars are working with a PR disaster control firm in Little Rock. Josh may have written the first statement and then someone at the PR firm panicked and it was hastily edited.

By the way, DUGGARS if you are reading this? Might as well lay off the PR firm because nothing will save or restore your reputations now. Give them money to Anna so she can get some counseling and go away with her kids for awhile, while her vile husband gets lengthy rehab.