John Shrader in Zambia Pt 5: Witnessing, Weeping & Wondering

[Gimme a Free RV]

Oh, good grief!

He must be missing his opportunity to pontificate in the pulpit. I'm surprised anyone could make it through that. After he "signs off" from his sleep-inducing sermon, he goes on even further! The interesting read is in the comment section. John just refuses to let anyone have an opinion other than his. He must be lots of fun to be married to.

I'm wondering if he's blasting away to get back at David Rhea, maybe? Remember, Rhea had an issue with the message that John was spreading. It is so obvious that John's fangs are out, trying to get back at someone. You see the myriad of "likes" he got on his arguments, right? *insert sarcasm* :roll:

John, you have been, you are, and probably always will be a self-righteous, condescending, annoying little

[formergothardite]

From the comments:

John:

I'm just so saddened by the departure from the Historic Baptist position on this Doctrine...by Independent Baptists!

Greg(who apparently disagrees with John but I can't really figure out what they are arguing about):

Making statements in return such as, "It's not hard brother. Just believe the Bible" is the height of churlishness.

Either you are being glib, or believe anyone who dissents or disagrees with you is going out of their way to not believe the Scriptures.

You seem to have made that abundantly clear. Now you have assailed mine and others belief in the Bible, what's next, our intellect and standing with God?

1. Seize the moment with a premise.

2. Diminish dissenters and marginalize them by attacking their belief and study.

3. Use them as examples of poor exegesis and garner those who agree with you into a small core of exalted friends you verbally back slap and praise enthusiastically on the posts to show growing support.

[slickcat79]

I find absolutely nothing compelling about John's doctrinal disputes. I still cannot believe that some minor point of scriptural interpretation is what lost him so much of his support. It's fine if he's a total leech on the face of humanity, but start using the wrong definition of "repent" and IT'S ON :roll:

Anyway, this part of his screed stuck out to me:

The study of the English word "repent" is fascinating (see footnote from the 17 volume OED* at the end of the post. If we take Strong's as our authority, as those do who want to define "repent" as solely a "change of mind" with no resulting action, then we must also accept Strong's definition that the "wine" Jesus made at the wedding in Cana was alcoholic!)

Noooo, not ALCOHOLIC WINE :lol: I mean, if anyone could figure out how to keep grapes from fermenting in the desert with no modern refrigeration/preservation techniques, it would be Jesus, right?

PS - Accepting an authority's definition of one word in one context does not mean you have to accept his authority in every area.

PPS - Interpreting wine to mean something that is not wine while insisting that other people "just read the Bible" strains your credibility.

[slickcat79]

Also, he includes TONS of references that are not the Bible.

JFC, that's really long. I don't think I'm going to finish :shrug:

ETA: I love Greg though. I have no particular opinion on which of them is right, but I think he is far smarter than John.

[formergothardite]

Did some FB comments get deleted?

John says this:

My pastor has instructed me not to discuss their actions publically sir

I think we're done

But the comments these would be addressing seem to be gone. I wonder if someone asked about David Rea.

[formergothardite]

In the missionary printing wars, David had made it to Zambia.

We have arrived safely in Zambia. Our first week was consumed with setting up our home. The time quoted for the transit of the container was 5 weeks less than the actual arrival time. This means we are living with only what we could carry on the plane for the first five weeks in Zambia

Things are not going as planned:

We purchased a small Chinese oven that runs only on propane gas – no electricity. This is because everyone in Zambia is now under load sharing. Not enough power exists to meet the demand. This means we are without power for about 8 hours each day. The problem with the stove is the lack of propane! It has been sold out for the last month. But the first Tuesday we were here propane arrived. I got to stand in a line for 4.5 hours just to pay! It took another hour or so to fill the tank

Sadly they are having to RATION tracts. :violin:

We are rationing the few tracts (700) we brought on the plane with us. They could be handed out in under an hour if we did not do this.

They managed to find someone who had never even heard of Jesus. Even David seems a bit incredulous about this claim.

I was able to tell a sweet lady about Christ. She had never heard of Jesus. This is rare in Lusaka – most consider themselves to

be Christian

David does seem to be tiny bit more realistic than John and realizes that most of the people who say they will come to a Bible study are not actually going to show up.

My notebook is filling up with men who desire to study the Bible. Many will not pan out – but SOME will!

They are basically really going to be busy trying to convert Christians to being Christians all while learning a new language, homeschooling, planting a garden and raising chickens.

The combination of soul winning and discipleship, printing, language learning, homeschool, setting up a garden and chicken (broiler and layer) operation will keep us VERY busy

The printing wars have officially started. :popcorn2:

[Peas n carrots]

I'm convinced the Zambian woman has heard of Jesus - she is probably f'ing with Rhea

[happy atheist]

I'm convinced the Zambian woman has heard of Jesus - she is probably f'ing with Rhea

Or maybe they pronounce it differently and she didn't understand his accent?

[slickcat79]

Or maybe they pronounce it differently and she didn't understand his accent?

It's true, he hasn't been there long enough to start mocking the locals with Shrader's patented "Zambian English" :roll:

[slickcat79]

Is it just me or does this sound like a drug deal? I mean, I'd be surprised if it was, but it might explain how he went from losing all his support to making enough money for traveling and whatnot :lol:

[countressrascal]

In the missionary printing wars, David had made it to Zambia.

Things are not going as planned:

Sadly they are having to RATION tracts. :violin:

They managed to find someone who had never even heard of Jesus. Even David seems a bit incredulous about this claim.

David does seem to be tiny bit more realistic than John and realizes that most of the people who say they will come to a Bible study are not actually going to show up.

They are basically really going to be busy trying to convert Christians to being Christians all while learning a new language, homeschooling, planting a garden and raising chickens.

The printing wars have officially started. :popcorn2:

I hope he is only printing on one sides the kids can use the tracts for their school work which is a better use of them. :cracking-up:

Also I hope they have a secure area for their chickens or they will be missing with in a couple of weeks-either by humans or animals.

[formergothardite]

John has written another epic post on the subject of salvation and repentance. He apparently also has the flu.

[mirele]

Oh, because I have no life (even though I'm going on a trip in four hours), I went over to John's FB page to try and dip my toe into the arguments. His latest post is actually interesting, if you know a little bit of what's going on in the background. Let me try to explain.

The first thing, of course, is that John is taking on this argument that repentance is a work. Since salvation is only by grace, these people say, telling people to repent goes against the gospel of grace. (One person who preaches this is the PP, btw.)

The second thing is that he's trying to point out that the newer versions of the Bible are not accurate like the King James Bible because they don't include the words εἰς μετάνοιαν (to repentance) in Matthew 9:13. What John is riffing on here is a known textual variant. The reason modern versions don't include "to repentance" is because it simply does not exist in the oldest and best manuscripts. That's why the two words are relegated to a footnote in Society for Biblical Literature's Greek New Testament.

To confirm for myself that the words didn't exist in older manuscripts, I went to the Codex Sinaiticus online (http://www.codexsinaiticus.org/) and looked at the transcribed text. The words εἰς μετάνοιαν are not there. Sinaiticus is important because it dates from the mid 300s and is the first complete compilation of the New Testament. And, when the King James Bible was being translated, it was not available (because people didn't know it existed).

The tl;dr is that John is basing an entire doctrine on two words which don't exist in the best manuscripts and he's trying to bolster the KJV at the same time. It may work on uneducated people, but is a big fat FAIL from my perspective.

[16strong]

John has written another epic post on the subject of salvation and repentance. He apparently also has the flu.

It's amazing what that colloidal silver can do.

[formergothardite]

Oh, because I have no life (even though I'm going on a trip in four hours), I went over to John's FB page to try and dip my toe into the arguments. His latest post is actually interesting, if you know a little bit of what's going on in the background. Let me try to explain.

The first thing, of course, is that John is taking on this argument that repentance is a work. Since salvation is only by grace, these people say, telling people to repent goes against the gospel of grace. (One person who preaches this is the PP, btw.)

The second thing is that he's trying to point out that the newer versions of the Bible are not accurate like the King James Bible because they don't include the words εἰς μετάνοιαν (to repentance) in Matthew 9:13. What John is riffing on here is a known textual variant. The reason modern versions don't include "to repentance" is because it simply does not exist in the oldest and best manuscripts. That's why the two words are relegated to a footnote in Society for Biblical Literature's Greek New Testament.

To confirm for myself that the words didn't exist in older manuscripts, I went to the Codex Sinaiticus online (http://www.codexsinaiticus.org/) and looked at the transcribed text. The words εἰς μετάνοιαν are not there. Sinaiticus is important because it dates from the mid 300s and is the first complete compilation of the New Testament. And, when the King James Bible was being translated, it was not available (because people didn't know it existed).

The tl;dr is that John is basing an entire doctrine on two words which don't exist in the best manuscripts and he's trying to bolster the KJV at the same time. It may work on uneducated people, but is a big fat FAIL from my perspective.

Thank you for taking the time to read John's ramblings. Reading the comments John really struggles to be able to logically defend his stance.

John posted this to a guy who is disagreeing with him:

Acts 20:21 "Testifying both to the Jews, and also to the Greeks, repentance toward God, and faith toward our Lord Jesus Christ."

Guy: Never says to turn from sin. It does say to turn to God, and trust Christ however.

John: You don't see where it says to turn from "darkness"? :doh:

John mentions in another comment that he will be coming back to America for six weeks next spring but Esther and the kids will be staying in Zambia.

[SPHASH]

John is just a shit stirrer.

[FloraKitty35]

John is just a shit stirrer.

And a shit for brains.

[Gimme a Free RV]

Of course they will. :roll:

I can't think of any international missionaries that I know of (except Jill and Derrick Dillard) who leave their assigned countries SO soon after their arrivals. I know John has been there well over a year now, but this will make his second trip back home in that time. Esther and the poor kids are, once again, left to fend for themselves.

The international mission board of the world's largest protestant, evangelical denomination only allows their career missionaries year-long furloughs every four years or 6-month furloughs every two years. They pay for the whole family to travel. The money these missionaries receive comes from the denomination itself. The missionaries never need to worry about going out on deputation to raise their support. The mission board staff in the States operates off of the interest alone, of the donated money that is deposited into an account. In other words, if your offering is earmarked for the mission organization to support its missionaries, the staff at the board doesn't touch that money. It all goes to the missionaries. The interest alone is enough to keep the organization running.

John doesn't have accountability of how his donated money is being used. And I'm kind of surprised that no family from the States has traveled to Zambia to at least see the kids. Even if resources are tight, I would think their churches would surely offer them a bit of financial support so they could see their grandkids, son, daughter, nieces, nephews, brother, sister. Maybe this will still happen. If I was Esther, I'd be so homesick, tired, and depressed from having been away from family for so long. Shoot, I'd be depressed from having John as my only source of American fellowship.

[formergothardite]

John(who spends a hell of a lot of time on FB for a missionary and father of a brood of young children) is now explaining why KJV only is the true way and all others are wrong.

I don't claim to be an "expert"', but I have devoted 20+ years of diligent study on the topic.

I rather think that by "diligent study" John means that he only read books and listened to people who confirmed what he already believed.

So you basically have two source texts. One from the historical heritage of those shedding their blood to preach and translate and spread the Word of God, the historical and spiritual heritage of the Baptists, and the other...the Ones slaughtering, burning, imprisoning, and persecuting them, meaning through Catholics who killed and soaked the ground countless times with the blood of the Baptists, and filled the air with their ashes.

:?

Until a few hundred years ago, you had the source Greek texts from Antioch, called the "Received Text," and representing 95+% of the mss., used by true Christians that never persecuted anyone but sought to preach that Word, and then you had the text from those killing and suppressing the Word of God, the Catholic texts, which are clearly edited and don't even agree among the two Codexs, representing roughly 5% or less.

The Catholic text has never been used by true Bible believers until the devil pulled a spirited coup and blinded so many with the humanistic and rationalist "textual criticism" that sprang from German Rationalism and "Higher Criticism."

I remember in Bible College when they attacked the King James Bible and it's underlying Greek Text. They (other students) mocked me for actually believing the promises of Preservation of God's Word. According to "textual criticism," man treats the Bible like any other book to "determine" according to "rules" made up by Westcott and Hort what they "think" is the "best text."

John, always the martyr and lone True Christian, even at a conservative fundamental Christian Bible college. :roll:

[DowntownAbbey]

As a grad student in history, can I just say:

[Milly-Molly-Mandy]

He's such a tool, of course he is going home but no one else.

[Curious]

He's probably afraid if Esther and the kids come back to the US, he will never get them back to Zambia.

Although, their quality of life seems to be better there than it was in the US, so perhaps they prefer staying to returning to the US and the pop-up camper.

[Gimme a Free RV]

He's probably afraid if Esther and the kids come back to the US, he will never get them back to Zambia.

Although, their quality of life seems to be better there than it was in the US, so perhaps they prefer staying to returning to the US and the pop-up camper.

But...but...John's favorite foods (superior, of course to Zambian cuisine) are in the States!!! *whine, whine*

[Ali]

I am trying to picture what it would have been like to be in a class with John. If he lasted more than a semester at Bible College, I could see other students groaning when they realized that they were going to have another class with him.

[slickcat79]

Well, let's be serious about John's claims of "bible college" education. I'm not sure if he attended elsewhere, but on his FB page he identifies that he "Studied Master of Biblical Studies at Emmanuel Baptist Theological Seminary". I can't find much info about EBTS because I can't even find a website for them. But I did find an old thread on a Baptist forum where a member is trying to promote the school:

baptistboard.com/showthread.php?t=30566

Even the other members of BaptistBoard are like, dude, your school sounds unaccredited and terrible :lol: One member checked out the now-defunct school website and found that only one member of the faculty is credentialed...with a PhD from Bob Jones. And of course the original member will not answer any questions, but keeps insisting that the school is great because they teach from the bible and that's all you need. I wouldn't be surprised if "dallas" were actually John, as a matter of fact, except that I'm not sure he ever lived in NH.