Free Anna Duggar and the M Kids - Part 2 - Merge

[purplehair]

Anna's gonna stay, forgive Josh, and absorb the blame. That's the party line and she's sticking with it. That's all she knows, unless she has some chance to get on the internet and check out the real world. Joshie Boy sure did! I'd like her to leave, but she won't. Feel so sorry for her and the Mkids.

[MarsGirl]

It's just depressing. It's not your fault if your douchebag husband cheats on you!! :angry-banghead:

[December]

Is there any evidence or suggestions as to what kind of internet access the married Duggar children and their spouses have (except Josh, for obvious reasons)? Specifically the women like Anna? I'd assume for situations like this one, they're not enjoying unfettered access to dissenting opinions.

Either way, she's probably going to stay... for now, at least. Especially if she's never been made aware of how to start the divorce process. It's too bad they're back in Arkansas, as I'd imagine it's harder to consider leaving when you're surrounded by family and no other outsiders again.

[NormalBikiniWearingMom]

On paper she has a path out. She has 3 siblings who have left ATI (one before marriage). Given her husband's past behavior, I don't think there's a court in this country that would not give her full custody of the M kids.

As for income. Aside from the fact that she should enroll in community college and make herself marketable, she has an X factor here. She could be the one to write the tell-all about what it is really like to be married to a sleaze ball like Josh Duggar. I said in another thread, she should contact 'Who the Bleep did I marry?" on ID and get her story featured. She's also (semi) famous, and her plight would have a go fund me for her legal expenses and childcare go viral. I'd contribute to it.

Same here. I'd support her in a heartbeat.

But she needs to leave Arkansas. Jim Bob still has way too much clout and could easily buy a judge, even after the scandals.

[treemom]

Arkansas has given custody of children (shared usually) to their fathers who rated their mother. So yeah unless the can demonstrate that his molestating has continued he would likely get joint if he wanted it.

[DeFrauder]

According to the Daily News she is blaming herself.

nydailynews.com/entertainment/gossip/anna-duggar-absorb-blame-cheating-hubby-report-article-1.2332918

Unless Anna makes her own statement---these articles have no credibility.

[DeFrauder]

Thank you! Also, even if he was addicted to drugs if he went to rehab he would get shared custody eventually. Courts take the right to have access to your children and your children's right to a relationship with both parents very seriously.

You people are confusing custody with access. Custody is about where the child resides and which parent has the final say in decisions about the children. IE-where they go to school.

Access is about the the right to see the children. I am sure that Josh would get his kids every second weekend and on Wednesday nights, and a month during summer holidays--just like a million other non-custodial parents.

If Anna got full custody (which I believe she could easily get in these circumstances due to the instability of the Duggar situation and their extreme beliefs), it does not mean that Josh would not be allowed to see his children.

Anna has the upper hand in this situation--not JB Duggar.

[treemom]

Rapists father have gotten custody in Arkansas. And yes I understand the difference between custody and visitation. Joint custody is the standard here. (I live about 15 minutes from Arkansas..)

[luv2laugh]

I feel horrible for Anna right now... She's so isolated down in DC at the Duggar Compound... Do you think Josh has been banished to the guest house? If I were her, I wouldn't even want to look at anyone in the family, it would just hurt to much. She only has Michelle, Jana, and the rest of the Duggar sisters to comfort her and that must be super awkward and uncomfortable for her. I do know that she's good friends with Sierra the party planner right? Maybe she can escape to Sierra's house with the kids???? Hopefully?

[DeFrauder]

Rapists father have gotten custody in Arkansas. And yes I understand the difference between custody and visitation. Joint custody is the standard here. (I live about 15 minutes from Arkansas..)

Joint custody is the standard because it is standard for people to want that. People that do not have substantial problems other than getting a divorce seek a joint custody arrangement.

People with more substantial problems--will have a more difficult problem getting joint custody if their former partner contests it. If Anna decides that she wants to seek full custody, she would have a very good case.

Some people have said that JB would stop Anna from leaving because she would lose her kids. That would not happen.

If Anna were to go to Family Court and her lawyer says look, her husband's family is insane. They have extreme and repressive beliefs about sexuality. There is constant negative media attention on them. They have been on national television speaking about how incestuous sibling abuse is very common and the fact that it happened in their family is no big deal. The story has been reported in the international press. They are publicly promoting bizarre remedies for sexual abuse such as hard labor for the abusers and excessively modest clothing for little girls. None of the children are permitted to attend public school and instead are home schooled in a curriculum that promotes bigotry against certain fellow Americans and is anti-science. Anna's husband has shown himself to possibly suffer from delusions by suggesting that his actions are influenced by "Satan". Your Honor, the Duggar household is not a safe place for children and the Mkids are at risk of suffering social isolation, indoctrination into extreme religious views and will lack access to the universal public education provided by the State, which could negatively affect their ability to grow into productive and independent adulthood. It would be best if Anna is awarded sole custody of the children and thereby be able to protect them from additional harm from the Duggars and their problems.

^^ and that is the nice argument. If that meets resistance the custody fight has every potential to get truly ugly.

[DeFrauder]

I feel horrible for Anna right now... She's so isolated down in DC at the Duggar Compound... Do you think Josh has been banished to the guest house? If I were her, I wouldn't even want to look at anyone in the family, it would just hurt to much. She only has Michelle, Jana, and the rest of the Duggar sisters to comfort her and that must be super awkward and uncomfortable for her. I do know that she's good friends with Sierra the party planner right? Maybe she can escape to Sierra's house with the kids???? Hopefully?

She has her own house. There is no reason why she has to stay with anyone else.

[Rescuejosiah]

I wish Anna would go back to Florida and get away from the Duggars. I bet her mom would love to be able to spend more time with the grandchildren. She could make it. Her mom could watch the kids while she goes back to school. They could help set her up in an apartment. She would most likely be eligible for government assistance and maybe even housing assistance. Also I am sure if she started a go fund me page many people would help her. She is not stuck. Because she is well known, she has a lot more options than someone else who is not so well known would be.

[nastyhobbitses]

I wish Anna would go back to Florida and get away from the Duggars. I bet her mom would love to be able to spend more time with the grandchildren. She could make it. Her mom could watch the kids while she goes back to school. They could help set her up in an apartment. She would most likely be eligible for government assistance and maybe even housing assistance. Also I am sure if she started a go fund me page many people would help her. She is not stuck. Because she is well known, she has a lot more options than someone else who is not so well known would be.

Considering her dad essentially sold her like a prize horse to the Duggars even after finding out about the molestation incidents and taught Anna all her life that the onus is on her to please her husband, I doubt she'd find much solace at home. Though at this point it may be her only feasible, not-as-awful-as-the-others option.

[Lewy]

There is literally nothing Boob and J'Uterus can do to stop Anna filing for divorce. It's legally between Josh and Anna, the law doesn't give a shit if the husband's Mommy and Daddy don't want it to happen.

I also highly doubt there is a judge out there who won't give custody to Anna, especially with the child molestation issues.

[luv2laugh]

I so badly want Anna to take the kids and get out. She's been drug through the mud with Josh these past couple of months. When the molestation scandal came out, she supported him immediately, kissed him in front of the Youtube video camera, and was so supportive. Now, 3 weeks later after giving birth, she finds this out and is publicly humiliated by him. She has so much support she doesn't even know. She deserves SO much better!!!

[alphagirlzk]

How on earth is she supposed to get the money to hire an attorney?

[Hisey]

Joint custody is the norm and the standard. It is granted in most divorces because that is what is thought to be best for the kids.

You can't seek full custody to punish an adulterer. Courts won't allow custody to be used as a punishment. The standard is always "what is best for the kids"

There's no evidence that Josh was bad to his kids. So there's no justification for giving full custody to Anna. And why would she want it, anyway? Wouldn't it mean that she'd give up her right to child support? And most importantly, if the kids love Josh, and he has been a reasonably good father, then joint custody is the best for the kids.

Now, it is likely, given the kids' young age, that they will live with Anna most of the time, and Josh will have visitation. But that has nothing to do with the custody situation. The custody will still be joint. When the kids are older (say 10-14), they can have a say about who they want to live with.

[nelliebelle1197]

Anna does not have as much of an upper hand as you seem to think. For one parent to get full legal and physical custody, the situation would have to be much more extreme. There would have to be a demonstrable danger to the kids or some compelling neglect of the children for Anna to get full custody. There is nothing public that would indicate Josh should lose parental rights. The molestation incidents happened years ago and would likely not be admissible unless there is something recent- he was a minor and a judge would get access to a DHS file for details if something done when he was a minor is even allowed in. Cheating or being a member of a cheating website is not even germane to a custody hearing.

In addition, custody would have to be contested for these things to even come up. Custody is about what has happened recently that impact the child or the parental ability to parent; affairs do not play into custody unless the child was exposed in some way. Parental rights and access are preserved as much as possible in a family situation.

Every family law situation is unique. Anecdotes and Internet lawyering and opinion don't way in to the ultimate adjudication of a custody hearing. And as I said, for this sort of thing to even reach trial stage and go beyond mediation there would have to be major issues or very recalcitrant parties involved. There is nothing here.

Treemom is right. You are confusing the way the system works with your own opinion.

Eta- Hisey, Anna would not lose her right to child support. Josh would have to willingly give up parental rights and disappear and Anna would have to agree to that. It is very difficult for a man or woman to get out of that obligation.

You people are confusing custody with access. Custody is about where the child resides and which parent has the final say in decisions about the children. IE-where they go to school.

Access is about the the right to see the children. I am sure that Josh would get his kids every second weekend and on Wednesday nights, and a month during summer holidays--just like a million other non-custodial parents.

If Anna got full custody (which I believe she could easily get in these circumstances due to the instability of the Duggar situation and their extreme beliefs), it does not mean that Josh would not be allowed to see his children.

Anna has the upper hand in this situation--not JB Duggar.

[nelliebelle1197]

JimBob does not have a lot of influence in Arkansas and he cannot buy a judge. Judge buying and influencing is not something that happens that often outside of the movies. I don't know why people think every judge in America is for sale. That is just stupid.

And JB was a one term state rep nearly 20 years ago. He is not some powerfully connected player in NWA.

Same here. I'd support her in a heartbeat.

But she needs to leave Arkansas. Jim Bob still has way too much clout and could easily buy a judge, even after the scandals.

[YoshiCat]

I don't think Anna will leave him. But if she does, they could also come to a custody agreement on their own. Anna could leverage the possibility of her doing some sort of tell-all to get the custody arrangement she wants and a nice check from Jim Boob.

Public sympathy is with Anna and if the Duggars still think there's any possibility of getting back on TV, they will not want to treat Anna badly in any way or have her struggling.

Despite their many faults, I believe JB and DQ do actually love their grandchildren and wouldn't want to lose access to them. That will also compel them to treat Anna well.

[treemom]

I don't think Anna would lose the kids. I do think that it is likely she would get joint custody.

I am pretty sure most of the arguments you are making Defrauded would not get in front of a judge. First the family would be pushed into mediation. They would work out their parenting plan, etc.

Homeschooling isn't considered abuse. And neither is bigotry against gays, or being pro life or not believing in evolution. In fact here, in the Bible Belt, it's likely the judge actually feels that way. They would be pushed into mediation if there is a disagreement about custody. After that if they can't resolve the parenting plan it would go to the judge.

Rapists have been given primary and joint custody in Arkansas. So I think my anecdata represents a likely propensity to get joint custody than your massive speculation.

[Marissap]

How on earth is she supposed to get the money to hire an attorney?

No doubt there are dozens of attorneys waiting in line to take up her side for free. She would surely not have to pay anything.

[jacduggar]

The father of my niece (my best friend's daughter) busted out a window, kicked in her front door, broke her phone and pinned her up against a wall while their child lay in the crib crying until the neighbor called 911. He was on felony probation as well. He skipped 3 court dates for custody. She has sole physical but they still have joint legal. Meaning she still needs his permission to do certain things.

What makes you think Anna can get sole custody? He got caught cheating, that has nothing to do with his parenting skills. I'd also like to point out that his record of the molestation is legally sealed and couldn't be used in court.

Seriously, the court really tries not to take kids from their parents.

[nelliebelle1197]

I don't think Anna would lose the kids. I do think that it is likely she would get joint custody.

I am pretty sure most of the arguments you are making Defrauded would not get in front of a judge. First the family would be pushed into mediation. They would work out their parenting plan, etc.

Homeschooling isn't considered abuse. And neither is bigotry against gays, or being pro life or not believing in evolution. In fact here, in the Bible Belt, it's likely the judge actually feels that way. They would be pushed into mediation if there is a disagreement about custody. After that if they can't resolve the parenting plan it would go to the judge.

Rapists have been given primary and joint custody in Arkansas. So I think my anecdata represents a likely propensity to get joint custody than your massive speculation.

Yep, as long as he is not raping the kids or beating the kids, it is not a reflection of his parenting skills.

[luv2laugh]

Anna will NOT divorce him or separate. She is super fundie and will believe he can overcome this sin. Unfortunately, I see Josh leaving somewhere down the line. The problem is, I do not think Josh truly wants to change. Someone around here said that if Josh had been allowed to have normal hormonal feelings and normal dating experiences, he would not have acted out. He would have been that guy that we "all know" who never grows up, parties as if he's in college into his mid-life, and is always hanging around at the bar with women. If Josh sees an actual real licensed psychologist, I believe it will help him understand why he's behaved this way and been acting out (largely due to his upbringing and ATI). I truly believe that he will need to make a decision: embrace his true self as that "sleazy" bachelor type guy always hanging out with a lot of women or be the fundie family man that Anna wants. Unfortunately for Anna, I think he will choose the former option and end up divorcing her sometime in life because he will realize himself that they are not compatible sexually, goal-wise (he clearly is not living up to the ATI Fundie lifestyle) and hopefully realize that Anna deserves better, someone that will be faithful to her which what she wants--> not him.