Josiah Duggar - Part 3 Now with lost heart pieces

[GeoBQn]

I feel the need to stick up for my people. Not all theatre people want to be on TV, and not all theatre people are opportunistic famewhores who exploit personal relationships to get in front of a camera. We are normal people, too.

[princessmahina]

A broken courtship might be a good thing for the family as a whole, though I'm sure Josiah would be devastated. It made the Bates family re-evaluate (not enough, but some). I think it would be nice if some of the younger kids didn't have to go through such a rigamarole.

[16strong]

A broken courtship might be a good thing for the family as a whole, though I'm sure Josiah would be devastated. It made the Bates family re-evaluate (not enough, but some). I think it would be nice if some of the younger kids didn't have to go through such a rigamarole.

Nope. They'd just sweep it under the rug, pretend it never happened, and continue on as they have before.

[ADoyle90815]

Count me in the camp that if Marjorie decided to end things with Josiah, even if she were in because of being on TV and now that the show was over she had no more interest, that would still be a good thing, she would be avoiding a bullet. Would feel sorry for Josiah but really I think anyone should steer clear of marrying into that mess of a family.

I agree, while I would feel sorry for Josiah if the courtship was broken, I feel even more sorry for anyone who marries into that family. The fewer Duggar granchildren, the better since they have the creepy child molester uncle.

[HarleyQuinn]

I'm really irked at Josiah for begging for money on his Youtube page, but I'm not sure I'd wish a broken courtship on him. Before Smuglestergate, Josiah seemed like the bastard child of that family. If his courtship failed, I could see JB giving him a lot of grief over it.

[nokidsmom]

I agree, while I would feel sorry for Josiah if the courtship was broken, I feel even more sorry for anyone who marries into that family. The fewer Duggar granchildren, the better since they have the creepy child molester uncle.

It's not just because of Josh that I feel anyone with a lick of sense should avoid the family, though no doubt the whole thing with him is troublesome on many levels and it shows some screwed family dynamics that should give a person pause. It's also the gender roles that would be expected, accepting JB's authority (yep, accepting the authority of someone who royally screwed things for his own son by making some really bad decisions about it, that's someone one should follow??) and sacrifice their own potential and goals to what this messed up family wants. That last point has to do more with Derick and Ben who have mainstream education under their belts as well as work experience. They both could go on further in their schooling (Ben) and careers (Derick) and get into careers and lives that are not driven by either JB or the family brand. In other words, take control of their own lives rather than go down with the diminished family brand.

[DeFrauder]

There is a reasonably good chance that Marjorie's family has influenced her to break it off. The scandal breaking just as they start a courtship may even be viewed as a sign from God to run away. Remember the "sin in the camp" metaphor. Not only is the consequence of sin considered to effect one's family and descendants, but uncovered scandals are a sign that something is amiss.

For example, back in the day, a family could be ejected from a Calvinist congregation because their business had failed and they were bankrupt. The failure of the business was a sign from God that the family (or patriarch) was not truly saved. At the same time, a flourishing business was seen as a sign that the family was saved and the more successful the business the more favored by God the owners were.

Not all fundies believe that sexual abuse is nothing. In fact, they hate it a lot. Even the Duggars hate it--when it comes to other people doing it. Imagine how this would have played out if some creep from outside of the family had been the offender.

Because the offender was Josh, the whole family is now "tainted". I don't mean the victims are "tainted"--I mean that JB's status as a Godly man is questioned. They will ask themselves if JB produced Josh--are all his sons having these problems? The more Calvinist a Fundie is the more they will question the family's salvation.

[IReallyAmHopewell]

There is a reasonably good chance that Marjorie's family has influenced her to break it off. The scandal breaking just as they start a courtship may even be viewed as a sign from God to run away. Remember the "sin in the camp" metaphor. Not only is the consequence of sin considered to effect one's family and descendants, but uncovered scandals are a sign that something is amiss.

For example, back in the day, a family could be ejected from a Calvinist congregation because their business had failed and they were bankrupt. The failure of the business was a sign from God that the family (or patriarch) was not truly saved. At the same time, a flourishing business was seen as a sign that the family was saved and the more successful the business the more favored by God the owners were.

Not all fundies believe that sexual abuse is nothing. In fact, they hate it a lot. Even the Duggars hate it--when it comes to other people doing it. Imagine how this would have played out if some creep from outside of the family had been the offender.

Because the offender was Josh, the whole family is now "tainted". I don't mean the victims are "tainted"--I mean that JB's status as a Godly man is questioned. They will ask themselves if JB produced Josh--are all his sons having these problems? The more Calvinist a Fundie is the more they will question the family's salvation.

So has Marjorie broken it off?

[DeFrauder]

We don't know. The guess is yes as they haven't been advertising their every move.

[MiddleAgedLady]

A broken courtship might be a good thing for the family as a whole, though I'm sure Josiah would be devastated. It made the Bates family re-evaluate (not enough, but some). I think it would be nice if some of the younger kids didn't have to go through such a rigamarole.

How did the Bates re-evaluate courtship?

[CaptainFunderpants]

How did the Bates re-evaluate courtship?

They no longer required it. Zach Bates had a broken courtship and then the Bates standards relaxed a lot. The kids can be by themselves, hold hands, and hug prior to getting engaged, or something thereabouts. Zach is now married to Whitney (a girl he met at Sonic) and they have a super cute son and Zach is apparently now attending the Police Academy. Their oldest daughter Michael(la) is about to marry Brandon Keilen, other ATI royalty.

Check the Bates thread. It's a good group.

[sophrosyne]

Picture posted '4 hours ago' on the Siah_Marjorie Instagram shows Siah and Marj together. Seems to be answering our wondering about their courtship--they're still 'on,' or they want us to think they're still on.

[halcionne]

Picture posted '4 hours ago' on the Siah_Marjorie Instagram shows Siah and Marj together. Seems to be answering our wondering about their courtship--they're still 'on,' or they want us to think they're still on.

I'm guessing that pic is from the ATI convention in April.

[NotALoserLikeYou]

I dont think siah_marjorie is really them.

[TheJewAmongUs]

Not all fundies believe that sexual abuse is nothing. In fact, they hate it a lot. Even the Duggars hate it--when it comes to other people doing it. Imagine how this would have played out if some creep from outside of the family had been the offender.

Because the offender was Josh, the whole family is now "tainted". I don't mean the victims are "tainted"--I mean that JB's status as a Godly man is questioned. They will ask themselves if JB produced Josh--are all his sons having these problems? The more Calvinist a Fundie is the more they will question the family's salvation.

Or other fundies don't want their precious children exposed to those defrauding girls who tempted their brother when they should have been guarding his heart.

[sophrosyne]

I'm guessing that pic is from the ATI convention in April.

I dont think siah_marjorie is really them.

Yeah, I think you're both right. Sorry for the dud post!

[ShepherdontheRock]

I also if JB might be somehow behind the sudden stop in posts from Josiah somehow. Or if Josiah's in the prayer closet.

[imjustasteph]

Personally, my theory was that Josiah created (or had created for him) an instagram simply because it was the next stage in marketing. It was a live-action ad service to make everyone interested in his courting season.

(Okay, that part isn't theory so much as reasonable deduction.)

The theory part is this: he wasn't into it, and took advantage of the opportunity to stop. He doesn't have to do it now, because he doesn't have a season of episodes to sell, and so he's not doing it.

[grandmadugger]

They no longer required it. Zach Bates had a broken courtship and then the Bates standards relaxed a lot. The kids can be by themselves, hold hands, and hug prior to getting engaged, or something thereabouts. Zach is now married to Whitney (a girl he met at Sonic) and they have a super cute son and Zach is apparently now attending the Police Academy. Their oldest daughter Michael(la) is about to marry Brandon Keilen, other ATI royalty.

Check the Bates thread. It's a good group.

From what I have gleaned it truly is up to the kids how they want it handled. Texts don't have to be a group message but there is an open phone policy, or the texts can be a group with parents or with a sibling. I think each one of the three married kids picked something different and so has Michael(la). We all know that when the Duggars say "The kids set the standards" it's utter bullshit but from what we've seen of the Bates that actually mean it.

[morri]

the recent photos fro the duggar fb, they havent got marj in it.(even though josiah is there)

[greycat]

I hope no ones heart was broken if they did break up. I know in their lives a courtship means sooooo much and can be defining for the rest of their lives.

I hope both of they just realized they were way to young to be doing this. They seem like they were close and compatiable but just kids not ready for marriage and babies. Too much pressure. If they were allowed to have a normal dating, not courtship, life I could actually see them making it.

[morri]

https://scontent-fra3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/hp ... e=56530621 they are from picjles so via instagram..

https://scontent-fra3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/hp ... e=564E0835

[TheJewAmongUs]

I also if JB might be somehow behind the sudden stop in posts from Josiah somehow. Or if Josiah's in the prayer closet.

My first thought was that he lost access to the account/phone/internet when the scandal broke and the wagons circled. But then I also assumed he would have been the one to open the YouTube channel for donations. Maybe it was Jim Bob, I don't know. Is it possible the donation link was always there and just went unnoticed until this week? I think it's possible that none of the courting Duggars managed their own Instagram prior to getting married. I just can't figure out if Josiah runs the YouTube account or if there's an accountability person overseeing that too.

[Mela99]

I'm feeling super cynical tonight so I'll toss this in -- since there's no chance of a proposal or wedding being filmed and paid for, JB has put it on Josiah's heart to dump her, cause he doesn't wanna pay for a wedding.

[JenniferJuniper]

I'm feeling super cynical tonight so I'll toss this in -- since there's no chance of a proposal or wedding being filmed and paid for, JB has put it on Josiah's heart to dump her, cause he doesn't wanna pay for a wedding.

Aren't the fathers of fundie daughters supposed to pay for their weddings?

Maybe her parents were skeeved out by the whole affair and how Jim Bob and Michelle handled it. Or feared Jim Bob's control over their daughter's life.

Or maybe when she found out she would not be on a TV show and mulled over the prospect of marrying a teenager with no job and limited education, she told Josiah that they should probably just be good friends.