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Shooting at a Black Church


Kira

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I’ve been waiting for Doug Wilson’s post, and it’s a doozy, although he denies it’s about the shootings. Because unlike that maybe-sorta-heretical Baptist Russell Moore, he believes “it is unseemly to politicize these horrors when the families are still weeping.†But then he goes on to do just that, of course. Here are some choice quotes:

“What percentage of the shooters were on prescribed psychotropic drugs? What drugs? How long had they been on them? And, most importantly, why do you not have immediate access to the answers to these questions? I will tell you why — it is because the industry that promotes better living through chemistry is a politically protected class, in a way that gun manufacturers and Sons of Confederate Veterans are not.â€

“And if you don’t understand how the battle over symbols is being conducted, the chances are excellent that the flag at the state capitol will be taken down, a rainbow gay flag will replace it in a couple years, and the shootings will continue apace.â€

“So why doesn’t the American flag represent abortion on demand? …So there is a shooting in South Carolina, and a number of evangelicals scramble to call for the removal of a museum piece flag, but we think it would be in bad taste rather to say something about the Planned Parenthood centers in South Carolina that will —today — kill a black child for you for ready money.â€

dougwils.com/s7-engaging-the-culture/old-glory-and-abortion.html

Oh, and Krazy Kanye wore a Konfederate flag patch on his jacket one time, so it’s all even.

ETA: a link to Russell's post.

russellmoore.com/2015/06/19/the-cross-and-the-confederate-flag/#.VYRhdWdpnbM.twitter

Really.

Allow me to show all of you the difference between what it means to lose a 12-week-fetus - and what it means to have someone shoot you in the face.

(NSFW) Fetus

(*R*NSFW) THIS

And that is tame.

Want more? Because I'm tempted to post what remains of my scrap book.

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This kid went into a church and shot nine innocent people dead because they were black. That. Is. It.

My only, only nitpick:

Dylann Storm Roof is 21. He can legally drive, vote, enlist in the military, and buy and use tobacco and alcohol products. He can rent a car.

He isn't a kid. He's an adult. This adult man deliberately murdered nine people because they were black.

I agree with everything else -- but he's not a kid. This wasn't a dumb mistake. He deliberately committed murder because of his victims' race.

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My only, only nitpick:

Dylann Storm Roof is 21. He can legally drive, vote, enlist in the military, and buy and use tobacco and alcohol products. He can rent a car.

He isn't a kid. He's an adult. This adult man deliberately murdered nine people because they were black.

I agree with everything else -- but he's not a kid. This wasn't a dumb mistake. He deliberately committed murder because of his victims' race.

18 is adult. 19 is adult. 20 is adult. 21 is adult.

Mix off-brand medication and whatever else he was high on with racism so poisonous he sat with those people an hour before killing them.

Oh no, this was no minor mistake; no youthful indiscretion: This is a killer. Deliberate. Hateful. Exceptionally dangerous.

But compared to what he may become, looking back on this act - this one has the mind of a demented teenager, down to the smug scowl and the bowl-cut.

No child - but I don't think that is the mind of an adult.

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According to presidential candidate, Rick Perry, this shooting was an accident caused by drugs.

http://www.rawstory.com/2015/06/rick-pe ... -not-guns/

No , Rick, an accident is something that one doesn't mean to happen, this shooting was deliberate and planned and well thought out.

BTW, Frothy has walked back his comment that this was an attack on Christianity; he said that he didn't have all the facts before he spoke.

These Repubs are idiots who shouldn't be considering trying to run anything bigger than a rural post office if that.

Well, this is the same guy who's proud of the fact that he presided over the executions of 200+ people. A good number of whom have a high chance of being innocent.

Fuck him.

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18 is adult. 19 is adult. 20 is adult. 21 is adult.

Mix off-brand medication and whatever else he was high on with racism so poisonous he sat with those people an hour before killing them.

Oh no, this was no minor mistake; no youthful indiscretion: This is a killer. Deliberate. Hateful. Exceptionally dangerous.

But compared to what he may become, looking back on this act - this one has the mind of a demented teenager, down to the smug scowl and the bowl-cut.

No child - but I don't think that is the mind of an adult.

Of course. The adult brain isn't fully mature until the mid-20s, I think. And he's young enough that he could very well "reform" -- kick the drugs, unlearn the racism, and become a decent human being. (There's enough lingering Pollyanna in my personality to hope that everyone could become a decent human being, even despite all contrary evidence.) He certainly doesn't seem to have an abundance of maturity right now, but he is still responsible for murdering people.

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yeah, there was an article in today's Austin American Statesman about Rick's comments. Apparently, he meant to say incident, instead of accident, but maybe not. An academic political analyst said his mind skittered around this issue like butter in a skillet. In other words, he was incapable of forming a coherent response to the shooting.

As I like to say, He's trying to get his foot out of his mouth so he can be ready to step on his own d**k at the earliest possible moment.

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I I hate I hate this fucking country. I really do. How the hell do you make excuses for this?

Maybe if the chruch was armed this would've never happened.

He's just a kid.

Mental illness

He's black

Its Obama's fault

it was an accident.

This was a hate crime against christians

wtf? I swear white christian people can get away with anything in this country. All these damn excuses on why he did. Didn't see any excuses for Trayvon Martin, Eric Holder, or Tamir Rice.

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So much for Juneteenth at its 150 mark. Ugh.

So much carnage that it took hours just to identify the dead.

And the young man, son of a father who beat at least one woman (his step mother, who raised him) until she left. And gave him a gun to celebrate his manhood in a hate-filled culture.

Meanwhile, elsewhere I blog, the libruls are being blamed for forcing the krezzies onto the streets and shutting down access to mental health care (as if the righties have protested. . . .).

I, who normally think of myself as a mild woman (I don't even believe in the death penalty--ever), found myself fantasizing medieval tortures. . . . But finally, I can't get my head around this: what kind of monster can sit with an 87 year old grandmother, and then shoot her, spouting nonsense about rape?

sigh

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So much for Juneteenth at its 150 mark. Ugh.

So much carnage that it took hours just to identify the dead.

And the young man, son of a father who beat at least one woman (his step mother, who raised him) until she left. And gave him a gun to celebrate his manhood in a hate-filled culture.

Meanwhile, elsewhere I blog, the libruls are being blamed for forcing the krezzies onto the streets and shutting down access to mental health care (as if the righties have protested. . . .).

I, who normally think of myself as a mild woman (I don't even believe in the death penalty--ever), found myself fantasizing medieval tortures. . . . But finally, I can't get my head around this: what kind of monster can sit with an 87 year old grandmother, and then shoot her, spouting nonsense about rape?

sigh

What you said. Every single word.

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Of course. The adult brain isn't fully mature until the mid-20s, I think. And he's young enough that he could very well "reform" -- kick the drugs, unlearn the racism, and become a decent human being. (There's enough lingering Pollyanna in my personality to hope that everyone could become a decent human being, even despite all contrary evidence.) He certainly doesn't seem to have an abundance of maturity right now, but he is still responsible for murdering people.

A lot of people are likely going to disagree with me, but I actually do believe this man could become a decent human being one day. I don't think it's Pollyannish; I think it's legitimately possible - to a point.

Once this person has been sentenced I may even write him - tell him, yeah, you really can be human again (after a fashion, anyway); give him a certain piece of advice I once got.

Whether that will help him or not, who the fuck knows?

But he will never entirely rid himself of the racism, no matter how hard he tries - and he will always be a murderer who can never pay back any part of what he has done.

He killed nine people - smashed their families - annihilated his own family.

To use religious language, this...man child...committed a blasphemy within his own soul. And where others shine bright, he never will again. Bad or good as he may one day be, murder is forever.

Colours will never again be as bright. He'll still care about a few things, but compared to a normal and an innocent person, that list will be as paltry as whatever life purpose he has left.

What a waste, in every possible way.

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This morning at my church the pastor honored the nine victims lighting a candle for each of them and the liturgist read a mini bio of them. The sermon was "when the storm blows in" the storm being hate. She said this was a sermon she didn't want to do but felt compelled to because the victims were her Methodist colleagues.

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Sheriff Joe Arpaio: 'In the wake of the South Carolina church shootings, I will send my deputies out to patrol black churches in Phoenix." Black church leaders: "Uh, thanks, but we're good"

PHOENIX (KPHO/KTVK) -

Inside Phillips Memorial CME Church this weekend, the Reverend Reginald Walton invited other faith leaders who shared this message: "Sheriff Arpaio, hear me well. Thank you, but no thank you."

Walton and others say it's offensive that Sheriff Joe Arpaio's office, which has been ordered by a federal judge to stop profiling Latinos, will now send posse members to patrol predominantly African-American churches. Their frustration is also directed at the Reverend Jarrett Maupin, whom they accuse of exploiting the attack in Charleston by calling for more security.

"We will not allow any more lives that are taken in Arizona or the nation to be propagated by these publicity stunts and so we ask you to stop and to stand down," said the Rev. Warren Stewart of the Church of the Remnant in Phoenix.

The response from Rev. Maupin was, "We are exercising our God-given common sense."

Less than a mile away, Rev. Maupin, who stood with Sheriff Joe Arpaio on Friday when he announced the volunteer posse patrols, stood beside Deon Alexander 24 hours later. The Phoenix resident is the grand-nephew of Susie Jackson, the oldest victim in the Charleston church murders.

"We are all devastated," Alexander told reporters.

He expressed appreciation for the sheriff's patrols and says he understands they won't last forever, "You do have these copycats around here and they do try to imitate what they see on TV. They try to imitate what they see on the Internet. They try to imitate thing they hear in music, you know. So definitely until tomorrow, yes, maybe until the next Sunday, at least until things feel like they're starting to die down."

While Maupin says the threat is real, his critics say they are protected by God and have confidence in the Phoenix Police Department.

We asked Sheriff Joe Arpaio's office to respond to the critics who don't want the patrols, but did not hear back. Instead, the office tweeted the following on Saturday afternoon:

Read more: http://www.kpho.com/story/29369424/crit ... z3didg5Gjz

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Fun fact about the Confederate Flag in South Carolina: it's been illegal to fly that flag at the State House since 2000.

It is, however, mandated that the Confederate Flag must be flown in the Confederate Soldiers' cemetery, on the State House side.

See, they don't fly it at the State House! There's no problem!

http://www.scstatehouse.gov/sess113_199 ... s/4895.htm

http://www.infoplease.com/spot/confederate4.html

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yeah, there was an article in today's Austin American Statesman about Rick's comments. Apparently, he meant to say incident, instead of accident, but maybe not. An academic political analyst said his mind skittered around this issue like butter in a skillet. In other words, he was incapable of forming a coherent response to the shooting.

As I like to say, He's trying to get his foot out of his mouth so he can be ready to step on his own d**k at the earliest possible moment.

Does anyone really want a president that is so dumb that he can't tell the difference between accident and incident.

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James McDonald: A guy in China killed 33 people with a knife so more guns.

facebook.com/james.mcdonald1/posts/10206647230837937?pnref=story

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James McDonald: A guy in China killed 33 people with a knife so more guns.

facebook.com/james.mcdonald1/posts/10206647230837937?pnref=story

He killed 33 people with a knife and injured another 130? What a trooper *snerk*

History lesson time.

For reasons that make sense to me, that reminds me of this:

The worst atrocities, strange as it may seem, were carried out by members of the intelligentsia. The case of Peter Brzica is undoubtedly one of the most incredible in this category. Peter Brzica had attended the Franciscan College at Siroki Brijeg, Herzegovina, was a law student, and a member of the Catholic organization of the Crusaders (Krizari). In the concentration camp at Jasenovac, on the night of August 29, 1942, orders were issued for executions. Bets were made as to who could liquidate the largest number of inmates. Peter Brzica cut the throats of 1,360 prisoners with a specially sharp butcher's knife. Having been proclaimed the prize-winner of the competition, he was elected King of the Cut-throats. A gold watch, a silver service, and a roasted sucking pig and wine were his other rewards. A doctor, Dr. Nikola Kilolic, himself a Croat, was an eyewitness in the camp when the event took place, and subsequently testified to the authenticity of this astonishing deed.

If they ban guns or knives, people will use rocks and sticks.

Sorry, FJ, but gun culture isn't entirely responsible for this one.

One man - Roof, age 21, life essentially over now - is.

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Doug Wilson: Lots of people, including Jimmy Carter and Bill Clinton, love the Confederate flag, so...

dougwils.com/s7-engaging-the-culture/a-stars-and-bars-oddball-gallery.html

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RC Jr.: “A man killing 9 people isn't news. It happens daily in every American city. The news is the power of the gospel in forgiveness.â€

facebook.com/rcsprouljr/posts/832960813452115

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He killed 33 people with a knife and injured another 130? What a trooper *snerk*

History lesson time.

For reasons that make sense to me, that reminds me of this:

If they ban guns or knives, people will use rocks and sticks.

Sorry, FJ, but gun culture isn't entirely responsible for this one.

One man - Roof, age 21, life essentially over now - is.

Well, I don't entirely blame gun culture for this (even though a lot of gun culture has very sexist and racist undertones) I'd just like to say that it's easier and more efficient to kill people with guns than rocks and sticks, or even knives.

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RC Jr.: “A man killing 9 people isn't news. It happens daily in every American city. The news is the power of the gospel in forgiveness.â€

facebook.com/rcsprouljr/posts/832960813452115

Depressingly, the first two sentences are very close to truth. I hate that this is what my country has become.

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I need to ask for some advice about preventing racism. I spent some time with my 9 year-old nephew (he lives in another state so I don't see him often) and while my sister is not racist, her husband is a huge non-tolerant bigot. His views of homosexuals is clear; they're "deviants" and he's extreme right-wing. My nephew has had friends of various ethnicities since daycare and never distinguished based on skin color, though the school he goes to now is predominantly white.

My nephew is now at the age where everything his dad says is right. Last week, my BIL made a comment about someone being rude to him. My nephew asked "what color was he?" I just about fell over - my dad and BIL both say that exact thing. My dad is 80 and from a different time, and while I'm not excusing his thoughts, my concern is my nephew. My sister and I were both quick to reprimand him and I talked to him a lot about how judging people based on what they look like or believe is racism and being a racist is the ugliest kind of person you can be. He's into history and knows Hitler was a "bad guy" so I used him as an example of why being a racist is so terrible.

I plan on talking to my sister about this - while she doesn't agree with her husband, I think she needs to be a lot more outspoken about his comments. I also plan on telling my Dad to knock off the comments and of course will do my best to promote open thinking when I'm with my nephew. But what else can I do? I'm really, really upset about this and the thought of my nephew growing up this way makes me sick. I'm going to look for an age-appropriate book but would love any other suggestions.

Thanks in advance.

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I need to ask for some advice about preventing racism. I spent some time with my 9 year-old nephew (he lives in another state so I don't see him often) and while my sister is not racist, her husband is a huge non-tolerant bigot. His views of homosexuals is clear; they're "deviants" and he's extreme right-wing. My nephew has had friends of various ethnicities since daycare and never distinguished based on skin color, though the school he goes to now is predominantly white.

My nephew is now at the age where everything his dad says is right. Last week, my BIL made a comment about someone being rude to him. My nephew asked "what color was he?" I just about fell over - my dad and BIL both say that exact thing. My dad is 80 and from a different time, and while I'm not excusing his thoughts, my concern is my nephew. My sister and I were both quick to reprimand him and I talked to him a lot about how judging people based on what they look like or believe is racism and being a racist is the ugliest kind of person you can be. He's into history and knows Hitler was a "bad guy" so I used him as an example of why being a racist is so terrible.

I plan on talking to my sister about this - while she doesn't agree with her husband, I think she needs to be a lot more outspoken about his comments. I also plan on telling my Dad to knock off the comments and of course will do my best to promote open thinking when I'm with my nephew. But what else can I do? I'm really, really upset about this and the thought of my nephew growing up this way makes me sick. I'm going to look for an age-appropriate book but would love any other suggestions.

Thanks in advance.

I think you and your sister are doing a great job already. I know your nephew is getting it from his dad, but if he idolises his father that much then "undermining" him might only make the son defend/copy him more. (I put "undermine" in inverted commas, as I don't actually think that's what you'd be doing if you challenged your BIL in front of your nephew; just that that's what the boy might see it as). But what I'm clumsily trying to say is, although he hasn't developed that attitude by himself and had to learn it, he's growing up now and needs to start taking responsibility for his beliefs as his own man. You did great - you explained why racism is wrong and used examples he could relate to, in what I assume was an age appropriate manner. His dad is another issue, and again needs to be challenged individually when he says something ignorant.

Keep on doing what you're doing!

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I didn't want to start another thread but I recently came across this...

Anne Graham Lotz Says Terrorist Attacks Are Just God's Way Of Demonstrating His Love

Anne Graham Lotz, the End Times preacher and daughter of evangelist Billy Graham, joined Jan Markell on her radio show “Understanding the Times†last week to discuss her claims that the Last Days have arrived. Luckily for us, there is still time to save humanity because “that’s why God sends us wake up calls.â€

According to Lotz, God “allows the terrorists to strike or a tornado to rip through our city†to get our attention, “because, for whatever reason, we don’t seem to give him our attention until we’re desperate. And, so, if we don’t give him our attention then he’s going to allow things to happen to make us more and more desperate until we do cry out.â€

Lotz suggested that a potential Supreme Court decision legalizing marriage equality may be a sign that the end is near: “I think that Supreme Court decision, and I agree with you that the Enemy is coming like a flood, and that’s one of his tactics. They hit us at every level, at every angle, so that we feel overwhelmed and so we just want to retreat and say ‘just don’t come near me.’†Such a “retreat,†Lotz said, would only hasten the arrival of the End Times, warning that gay people are asking "to join an institution that, actually, by its very definition, they can’t join. So if the Supreme Court changes that legally in America, they are very seriously defying God.â€

Lotz concluded that “there are three reasons that we could pass that tipping point, and one is that reason. The second one is abandoning Israel, and the third one is the abortion, you know, aborting babies for convenience. And women can scream and holler about it and say they don’t do that, but the statistics show that they do. They use it for birth control. And those three reasons alone would demand that God judge America.â€

http://www.rightwingwatch.org/content/a ... 88Lin.dpuf

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I didn't want to start another thread but I recently came across this...

Anne Graham Lotz Says Terrorist Attacks Are Just God's Way Of Demonstrating His Love

Anne Graham Lotz, the End Times preacher and daughter of evangelist Billy Graham, joined Jan Markell on her radio show “Understanding the Times†last week to discuss her claims that the Last Days have arrived. Luckily for us, there is still time to save humanity because “that’s why God sends us wake up calls.â€

According to Lotz, God “allows the terrorists to strike or a tornado to rip through our city†to get our attention, “because, for whatever reason, we don’t seem to give him our attention until we’re desperate. And, so, if we don’t give him our attention then he’s going to allow things to happen to make us more and more desperate until we do cry out.â€

Lotz suggested that a potential Supreme Court decision legalizing marriage equality may be a sign that the end is near: “I think that Supreme Court decision, and I agree with you that the Enemy is coming like a flood, and that’s one of his tactics. They hit us at every level, at every angle, so that we feel overwhelmed and so we just want to retreat and say ‘just don’t come near me.’†Such a “retreat,†Lotz said, would only hasten the arrival of the End Times, warning that gay people are asking "to join an institution that, actually, by its very definition, they can’t join. So if the Supreme Court changes that legally in America, they are very seriously defying God.â€

Lotz concluded that “there are three reasons that we could pass that tipping point, and one is that reason. The second one is abandoning Israel, and the third one is the abortion, you know, aborting babies for convenience. And women can scream and holler about it and say they don’t do that, but the statistics show that they do. They use it for birth control. And those three reasons alone would demand that God judge America.â€

http://www.rightwingwatch.org/content/a ... 88Lin.dpuf

Good Lord, the "kids" are all complete lunatics except for one, and now he's in disgrace because of an affair. Lovely family.

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