Shooting at a Black Church

[ADoyle90815]

I swear, I'm so fucking sick of how this is horrible RACIST HATE CRIME is being misrepresented and twisted by right-wingnuts to suit their agenda. This was NOT an assault on religious liberty. This was NOT persecution of Christians. This was a RACIST HATE CRIME. Committed by a RACIST. It took place in a church as a matter of convenience for the murderer because he knew it was a place where many potential victims would be gathered at once. RACIST. HATE. CRIME. Why is this so difficult to understand?

Same here, I'm so fucking sick of the religious assholes saying this was an "attack on religious liberty." If anything, the RACIST was most likely a Christian who went to a CHRISTIAN CHURCH to kill people because of their skin color because he's a RACIST. IF it were a religious hate crime, this racist would have picked a Black mosque instead. If he had killed Muslims, those religious right assholes would be secretly happy he did that. :angry-banghead: :wtf: :angry-screaming: :angry-cussingblack:

[TeaELSee]

Jon Stewart hit it out of the park as usual during his show.

It is all over the internet, so I don't feel like I need to post a link. Just google it.

I'm going to miss him.

[Toothfairy]

The NRA are blaming victims for their death. http://thinkprogress.org/justice/2015/0 ... tim-death/

[Imagine20]

I can't figure out why he'd drive ask the way to Charleston, since he lived in the Columbia/Lexington area. That's a good couple of hours to ponder what you're about to do.

Went to the University of SC at the time Maurice's all flew the flag. Race relations in that state are all kinds of of fucked up, and I'm from South Dakota.

[Burris]

Agree!!

A drugged-up young racist shooting a bunch of people? That's actually not a new thing.

But the internet fan sites are certainly an ugly little twist. *snerk*

[Jana814]

Jon Stewart hit it out of the park as usual during his show.

Was just going to post about this! Completely agree w/ u.

[Howl]

Tim Bayly at first seems to admit that the murders were completely race based, but then at the end he throws this in: “Thus the assault and murder of Christians in Charleston last night is the assault and murder of you and me. The bell tolls for us.â€

But Tim’s very first commenter seems to doubt that these were true brothers and sisters in Christ: “Perhaps their only compromise is their female 'reverends' on their staff list, or maybe it was worse... Please don't misunderstand me, what has happened is horrible, no less grieving if this wasn't a true church, but knowing of such churches (not this one) I really wonder where they are, not whether they are calvinistic or arminianian or such things, but were they a faithful light....unlike most 'historic' churches?â€

baylyblog.com/blog/2015/06/nine-brothers-and-sisters-murdered-charleston-church

Actually, Tim, the bell isn't tolling for you, but you can't stand for one minute to think that you might be excluded, even for a moment, from the Christian Persecution Industry's A list.

and his guy chafes my chaps no end

no less grieving if this wasn't a true church....but were they a faithful light....unlike most 'historic' churches?

because the first things you did in response to 9 people being shot down in their place of worship is to doubt the correctness of their theology. So, no, you aren't grieving the painful loss of brothers and sisters in Christ. That is not how grief, or true fellowship, works...

because I'm guessing that the scare quotes indicate historic African American churches, churches whose members understand, first hand, what persecution, prejudice and racism actually mean, and have managed to be steadfast in their faith. You are a perfect example of how of having a 'correct' (see what I did there?) understanding of theology destroys your fundamental decency as a human being...

[DomWackTroll]

Matt Walsh took time from his vacation to post on Facebook: “In the coming days, this terrible event will be politicized and exploited in a thousand different ways. It will be used to prove various points and solidify various narratives… Sometimes I feel like I can't bear any more of this.â€

Matt can't bear the fact that the Right Wing's spin is being rejected by all sane Americans.

One of Matt's commenters reminds us of the real problem—the War on Men!

“The continued violence is a symptom. We have so much unresolved anger and a population full of boys who lack strong male leadership in the home to guide them to real purpose in their lives. We also lack the help in school for struggling boys and mental health services. Our boys and young men of all races are hurting. We continue to see violence as signs of internal distress and a broken society. My heart aches as we continue to ignore the root of the problem here. Single mom households on the rise. Way more boys than girls being labeled ADHD and discipline problems at school. Significantly more boys drop out of school. More girls than boys in college. In more cases women are earning more than their husbands. I am reminded of a quote I heard but cannot attribute, ‘A society that destroys its men, destroys itself.’ God please help us!â€

Never mind that Dylann Roof's daddy was right there, modeling manhood and handing him a gun.

facebook.com/MattWalshBlog/posts/987522744614169

[PennySycamore]

Matt Walsh is an A#1 ASSHOLE! And so is Senator Graham, for that matter.

I'd meant to add this last night to my earlier post, but Amy Wood, one of the new sanchors at WSPA in Spartanburg, SC had the ovaries to ask why the Confederate flag was still flying at the Statehouse. According to my daughter, people in Spartanburg really let the hate rain down on Amy after she said that. Amy Wood, btw, is white. Bravo for Amy!

[Howl]

Thanks DomWackTroll, for the Matt Walsh link:

facebook.com/MattWalshBlog/posts/987522744614169

At the other end of the spectrum, keep scrolling down to the Krystal Marx comments. Very interesting and she points out that there are at least 19 identified hate groups centered in South Carolina. Definitely worth a read for her perspective.

[sparkles]

The response to this tragedy has made me angrier than anything in recent memory. Why, WHY are these idiots refusing to see this for what it is…the murder of African Americans by a racist white man? A HATE CRIME! It is, as Jon Stewart said, a black and white issue in more ways than one. I'm a middle class, middle aged white woman with all of the unearned and undeserved privilege that comes with it and although I try to understand how if feels to be instantly viewed with suspicion simply because you're a person of color, I'll never know exactly how that feels. But I'm seething with anger and frustration right now and it brings me that much closer to truly getting what it must be like to have to live with being marginalized, mistrusted and outright hated every single day of your life.

This county is headed for disaster and the rightwing idiots will be largely responsible.

[DomWackTroll]

Thanks DomWackTroll, for the Matt Walsh link:

facebook.com/MattWalshBlog/posts/987522744614169

At the other end of the spectrum, keep scrolling down to the Krystal Marx comments. Very interesting and she points out that there are at least 19 identified hate groups centered in South Carolina. Definitely worth a read for her perspective.

Yes, Howl, and then some idiot completely disregards her arguments simply because her last name is "Marx." (And LOLOLOLOL it's so funny! Because Karl Marx, get it?) :roll:

[moodygirl86]

Yes, Howl, and then some idiot completely disregards her arguments simply because her last name is "Marx." (And LOLOLOLOL it's so funny! Because Karl Marx, get it?) :roll:

They're probably the same kind of eejit who thinks Obama and Saddam are related because...OMG Hussain/ein.

[lovemygsp]

Matt Walsh is an A#1 ASSHOLE! And so is Senator Graham, for that matter.

I'd meant to add this last night to my earlier post, but Amy Wood, one of the new sanchors at WSPA in Spartanburg, SC had the ovaries to ask why the Confederate flag was still flying at the Statehouse. According to my daughter, people in Spartanburg really let the hate rain down on Amy after she said that. Amy Wood, btw, is white. Bravo for Amy!

I always thought she was a horrible reporter(constantly stuttering or losing her spot on he telepromter) but to hear this moved her up just a tad.

We were stuck living in the upstate for a few years and I hated it. So glad to be out of there.

[Lillybee]

According to presidential candidate, Rick Perry, this shooting was an accident caused by drugs.

http://www.rawstory.com/2015/06/rick-pe ... -not-guns/

No , Rick, an accident is something that one doesn't mean to happen, this shooting was deliberate and planned and well thought out.

BTW, Frothy has walked back his comment that this was an attack on Christianity; he said that he didn't have all the facts before he spoke.

These Repubs are idiots who shouldn't be considering trying to run anything bigger than a rural post office if that.

[mamallama]

Apparently the judge who sentenced him has quite a history:

"Charleston County Magistrate James B. Gosnell began Friday’s bond hearing for mass-murderer Dylann Roof by declaring that the killer’s family members were victims as well.

At least he did not repeat an opinion that he offered in another proceeding a dozen years ago.

“There are four kinds of people in this world—black people, white people, red necks, and n---rs,†Gosnell advised a black defendant in a November 6, 2003 bond reduction hearing."

http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2 ... judge.html

not broken because it's news

[NotALoserLikeYou]

Erica Shupe just posted this article, which blames rx drugs and feminism for the shootings.

breitbart.com/big-government/2015/06/19/how-our-touchy-feely-feminised-society-creates-young-male-killers/

These young men were all on prescribed medication. Feminism helped to get them there. In particular, female teachers who either dislike men or are completely ignorant of healthy behaviour norms for boys are creating a generation of emotionally stunted, drugged up young men.

Millions of young American men are prescribed powerful drugs after being diagnosed with the phantom condition “ADHD,†better known as a mixture of natural boisterousness and poor parental discipline. The mere fact of being male has become pathologised.

When they get into their teens and early twenties, they graduate onto drugs like Zoloft and Prozac, drugs that can produce a powerfully dissociative effect in the mind, muddying the distinctions between reality and fantasy. All this, because boys are now treated as though they are defective girls.

Dylann Roof’s actions are unlikely to have been primarily motivated by race, even though he may have identified as a white supremacist. For one thing, half his Facebook friends were black.

Men, in particular introverts, and especially highly intelligent introverts who sit near the top of the autistic spectrum, are routinely ridiculed in society, cast out as “manbabies†and “privileged oppressors.†The lived experience of such men is precisely the opposite of privilege: they are punished for being boys at school, branded “creeps†or, worse, rapists for showing sexual interest at college, and after all that – assuming they even graduate – they are discriminated against in job applications.

If “Dylann†“Storm†“Roof†deserves ridicule for anything, it’s his ridiculous name and that 1990s lesbian pudding-bowl haircut, not the fact that he is a man struggling to find his place in an increasingly feminised culture. What was his mother thinking?

[Toothfairy]

I read that people are trying go say he's black. Wtf? And no drugs didn't do this. An evil person did fools! I'm not even surprised by the Republicans response. According to them only blacks and Muslims commit crimes. White people are pure and innocent.

[GiggleOfGirls]

I read that people are trying go say he's black. Wtf? And no drugs didn't do this. An evil person did fools! I'm not even surprised by the Republicans response. According to them only blacks and Muslims commit crimes. White people are pure and innocent.

Well, that's why they're white, obvs. Because evil and terrorism come out in the skin pigmentation :penguin-no:

/sarcasm

It's drinking time :cracking-up:

[Lillybee]

Erica Shupe just posted this article, which blames rx drugs and feminism for the shootings.

breitbart.com/big-government/2015/06/19/how-our-touchy-feely-feminised-society-creates-young-male-killers/

I don't say this lightly but fuck her and her high horse. He said that he wanted to start a race war.

[Burris]

Apparently the judge who sentenced him has quite a history:

"Charleston County Magistrate James B. Gosnell began Friday’s bond hearing for mass-murderer Dylann Roof by declaring that the killer’s family members were victims as well.

Actually - and as the bastard who did this thing will have years and years and years to find out - he did victimize his own family. He now gets to watch as all of them, parents, grandparents, siblings - the family, whatever it once was - turn into a non-family: They'll fracture. They'll disintegrate. They'll scatted to the farthest parts of the world they can afford - and they do it, without speaking to him or to each other for years and years, because they believe they somehow produced this multiple murderer. And every kid his siblings have, if they choose to have any at all, they'll be watching them for signs of whatever evil moved in their brother.

Don't doubt that, at least: He ruined his family with the precision of a wrecking ball.

He didn't kill because he was high on drugs.

He didn't kill because his dad was a racist - although it was awful nice for the man to poison the mind of his son.

He didn't kill because his victims weren't carrying gungs; because his victims were or were not Christian.

He didn't kill because of feminism.

He killed because he was a racist who chose to act on his hatred - alone - by killing nine people. He alone is responsible for that act.

This kid went into a church and shot nine innocent people dead because they were black. That. Is. It.

Observe.

Witnesses to the killings said the gunman asked for the pastor when he entered the church, and sat next to Mr. Pinckney during the Bible study.

They said that almost an hour after he arrived, the gunman suddenly stood and pulled a gun, and Ms. Washington’s cousin Tywanza Sanders, 26, known as the peacemaker of the family, tried to calmly talk the man out of violence.

“You don’t have to do this,†he told the gunman, Ms. Washington recounted.

The gunman replied, “Yes. You are raping our women and taking over the country.â€

The gunman took aim at the oldest person present, Susie Jackson, 87, Mr. Sanders’s aunt, Ms. Washington said. Mr. Sanders told the man to point the gun at him instead, she said, but the man said, “It doesn’t matter. I’m going to shoot all of you.â€

never dies just comes up in one place or anything everywhere

everywh

[DomWackTroll]

I’ve been waiting for Doug Wilson’s post, and it’s a doozy, although he denies it’s about the shootings. Because unlike that maybe-sorta-heretical Baptist Russell Moore, he believes “it is unseemly to politicize these horrors when the families are still weeping.†But then he goes on to do just that, of course. Here are some choice quotes:

“What percentage of the shooters were on prescribed psychotropic drugs? What drugs? How long had they been on them? And, most importantly, why do you not have immediate access to the answers to these questions? I will tell you why — it is because the industry that promotes better living through chemistry is a politically protected class, in a way that gun manufacturers and Sons of Confederate Veterans are not.â€

“And if you don’t understand how the battle over symbols is being conducted, the chances are excellent that the flag at the state capitol will be taken down, a rainbow gay flag will replace it in a couple years, and the shootings will continue apace.â€

“So why doesn’t the American flag represent abortion on demand? …So there is a shooting in South Carolina, and a number of evangelicals scramble to call for the removal of a museum piece flag, but we think it would be in bad taste rather to say something about the Planned Parenthood centers in South Carolina that will —today — kill a black child for you for ready money.â€

dougwils.com/s7-engaging-the-culture/old-glory-and-abortion.html

Oh, and Krazy Kanye wore a Konfederate flag patch on his jacket one time, so it’s all even.

ETA: a link to Russell's post.

russellmoore.com/2015/06/19/the-cross-and-the-confederate-flag/#.VYRhdWdpnbM.twitter

[louisa05]

I’ve been waiting for Doug Wilson’s post, and it’s a doozy, although he denies it’s about the shootings. Because unlike that maybe-sorta-heretical Baptist Russell Moore, he believes “it is unseemly to politicize these horrors when the families are still weeping.†But then he goes on to do just that, of course. Here are some choice quotes:

“What percentage of the shooters were on prescribed psychotropic drugs? What drugs? How long had they been on them? And, most importantly, why do you not have immediate access to the answers to these questions? I will tell you why — it is because the industry that promotes better living through chemistry is a politically protected class, in a way that gun manufacturers and Sons of Confederate Veterans are not.â€

“And if you don’t understand how the battle over symbols is being conducted, the chances are excellent that the flag at the state capitol will be taken down, a rainbow gay flag will replace it in a couple years, and the shootings will continue apace.â€

“So why doesn’t the American flag represent abortion on demand? …So there is a shooting in South Carolina, and a number of evangelicals scramble to call for the removal of a museum piece flag, but we think it would be in bad taste rather to say something about the Planned Parenthood centers in South Carolina that will —today — kill a black child for you for ready money.â€

dougwils.com/s7-engaging-the-culture/old-glory-and-abortion.html

Oh, and Krazy Kanye wore a Konfederate flag patch on his jacket one time, so it’s all even.

ETA: a link to Russell's post.

russellmoore.com/2015/06/19/the-cross-and-the-confederate-flag/#.VYRhdWdpnbM.twitter

It isn't a museum piece as long as pretty new ones are flying at the state capitol. It should be a museum piece. They can build all the Civil War Museums they want and fold that damn flag behind glass--but let's make sure that their museums tell the real story. Let's put the quotes about slavery being part of the moral order above that flag, no obfuscating about "states rights" in those museums. And make sure to tell in the museums about how they drug that flag back out when the federal government had the audacity to require them to let black kids go to school with white kids, that they wrapped themselves in it as they defended segregation and that is when they began flying it at their capitol. I have no problem with it as a museum piece in a real and accurate museum.

But get it off your capitol grounds.

[formergothardite]

It isn't a museum piece as long as pretty new ones are flying at the state capitol. It should be a museum piece. They can build all the Civil War Museums they want and fold that damn flag behind glass--but let's make sure that their museums tell the real story. Let's put the quotes about slavery being part of the moral order above that flag, no obfuscating about "states rights" in those museums. And make sure to tell in the museums about how they drug that flag back out when the federal government had the audacity to require them to let black kids go to school with white kids, that they wrapped themselves in it as they defended segregation and that is when they began flying it at their capitol. I have no problem with it as a museum piece in a real and accurate museum.

But get it off your capitol grounds.

This will never happen because it hurts way too many white people's feeling to admit that their ancestors fought to defend slavery. They have built up this imaginary past where it was all about a noble cause of fighting for state rights and that slavery was just a minor issue that the "good white Southerners" would have gotten rid of. They want the Confederate flag to remain a flag that they can view as something to be proud of. They don't want to face the truth about the history of the South, the Confederacy and the Confederate flag.

It is amazing that this guy can admit it was all about race but so many people are jumping through a million hoops to try and say it was about something else. Apparently that is easier than discussing the issues of race in America. :angry-banghead:

[Jana814]

Can't believe the comments these people r saying. So wrong on so many levels.