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Growing up ATI and the truth about Wisdom Booklets


formergothardite

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This is why I hold out hope for a Josh Duggar tell all once the TLC money dries up.

Josh had dreams and ambitions. He was sold (via his parents) a bill that told him that this method of schooling would TOTALLY prepare him for those dreams and ambitions. He was vivacious. Hopeful. And punch-drunk on kool-aid. This is the Josh Duggar of the early seasons who earned the nickname Smuggar. He was SO CONVINCED his parents' way and his was right and that it would TOTALLY pan out for him. In his insular community, this was never or rarely challenged. Man, remember the Josh of the specials and the early seasons? The guy with dreams, ambitions and hobbies? The confident eldest child who was totally going to do things and had no question of his own success?

Then he got to the real world. Failed as a car salesman. Got to DC and realized that due to his education, he was completely unprepared for the jobs he wanted, his career prospects were low, and his dreams were far off. Josh has been drastically humbled, and seems to realize that he has been cheated out of the life he dreamed of.

Now, he seems depressed and disillusioned. He seems bitter over the nice weddings and homes his sisters get while his own was a cheap affair. He goes along with TLC largely I think because he has realized that it's really the only way he has right now to support his family.

My hope is that when the TLC money dries up, Josh will talk about all this. Talk about how his parents' choices basically took his dreams away. Talk about how without the show, he's trapped and unqualified for the jobs that would support his family. Because Josh is what happens with ATI: you take smart kids with dreams, and you crush them.

I think that anyone on here would still qualify me as fundie, but I really relate to what was written above. Life was supposed to--for the most part--be good. Our rules were supposed to keep us safe as long as we followed the rules. Then things started to unravel. How was I supposed to teach in a Christian school if our church did not have one? So I quit my unaccredited correspondence classes in my "junior" year. While none of the churches we attended followed the same courtship model as Gothardites do, there's a lot of similarity. In a family that kindof straddled the fence between IFBX and Gothardism, a pregnant girl was murdered by her husband of 4 months. This was not supposed to happen! If you followed all the rules, you didn't end up getting murdered by your husband. Things continued-and continue-to unravel from there. While after 20 years I am finally graduating from an accredited university, it will not actually improve my class status in life. What I wanted then out of life, didn't happen, and what I want now is too late for that to happen. So, yes, I think that Josh is probably experiencing some disillusionment. The question is if that will set him free from legalism or if he will hold all that much tighter to ATI beliefs blaming himself that he must have somehow done it wrong and that is why life didn't turn out like it was supposed to.

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Now, he seems depressed and disillusioned. He seems bitter over the nice weddings and homes his sisters get while his own was a cheap affair.

I don't think that he's got "the poor end of the stick."

His wedding wasn't as big as those of his sisters', but it's still relatively traditional for the bride's parents to foot the bill for the wedding/reception/dress/flowers/cake/etc. and for the groom's family to host the rehearsal dinner.

Second, his father gave him the car dealership. His father took him to car auctions (and probably paid for them) to keep his supply going.

His family gave him and Anna a place to live rent-free (the same exact house that Jessa and Ben live in).

It doesn't sound too shabby to me. Sure, it may pale in comparison to what JB has given to Jill and Jessa (rent-free homes, one of which is a mansion), furnished Jill's house (remember the auction?) funded wedding/receptions for 1,000+ people. But consider the fact that women are not meant to work, they are entering a marriage and home with nearly nothing of their own and no way to make money to buy things themselves. There is no way - in their world - for Jill or Jessa to have contributed in the way that Josh would be expected.

Something along the same vein but a bit off-topic, I wonder if JB furnished Jessa and Ben's house the same way that he did for Jill and Derrick.

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Josh's wedding wasn't as nice as the girls' because it's traditional for the bride's family to foot the bill and Jim Bob wasn't about to pay for anything he didn't have to. Most of the wedding costs were probably on the Kellers' heads.

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Josh's wedding wasn't as nice as the girls' because it's traditional for the bride's family to foot the bill and Jim Bob wasn't about to pay for anything he didn't have to. Most of the wedding costs were probably on the Kellers' heads.

IIRC, the Kellers even paid for suits for all the Duggar boys to wear to the wedding. Can't recall if it was on a Duggar site or in a book, but I remember being shocked that those grifting Duggars would allow the obviously poor Kellers to spend that much on their kids. Then I remembered JB is the headship of the Duggars, and it all made sense.

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JB has money. He could've at least helped out and not leave all of it to Pa Keller. And at least Josh's wedding had real food.

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I don't agree with your assessment of Josh's car lots. I don't know if moving to a bigger lot was driven by JB or necessity. Remember, these are the Duggars, famous homefolks in NWA, plenty of people probably went to Josh because of the family fame.

Don't know where 5-6 employees comes from, I remember Josh having that other couple work with (for?) him but can you verify he had that many employees?

Most businesses that small would not be offering benefits like insurance, and any sales people probably on commission. Worker comp is most likely a state requirement. Josh didn't even have someone hired to answer the phones.

JB wouldn't run that car lot himself. He was big TLC star by that point. After Josh is JD, does JD strike you as a used car salesman? He worked with Josh for the towing part of it, but I can't see JD selling cars. The next boy was Joseph, who turned 18 a few months before the dealership was sold - hardly a candidate to take over a car lot and again, Joseph does not strike me as someone who could sell used cars. Any boy younger than Joseph was a minor so clearly off-limits.

The business was sold to Dobbs Motor Company. People sell profitable businesses all the time, just because it was sold to DMC does not mean it failed to turn a profit.

duggarfamilyblog.com/2013/06/duggar-automotive-sold.html

IMO it is safe to say Josh probably fared pretty well with his used car business simply because Duggar name implies honest Christian and I bet there are leghumpers a'plenty in NWA who would feel that God led them to buy a car from Josh Duggar.

During Josh's social media food picture posting he started to show some of his employees and then finally during an episode he admitted to the staff he had. Orginally it was Josh and Anna and then another Josh and his wife. Then he hired RD Chapman to be the manager, he had several salesman including the other Josh, a carwasher and detailer and a mechanic. At first I thought all commission or part time workers. The RD started to complain on his social media a few times about the long hours and how Josh was not around. RD worked 40+ hours. Then what about the mechanics and car detailers? I doubt they were commission only. I remember looking at Josh's business so closely because 5 years ago my husband opened a successful small business but going from a just himself to 2 employees was such a incredible cost with insurance and workmans comp, my husband ends up working up to 18 hour days. I wondered how Josh could afford to pay all the other business costs when he was selling a handful of low cost junk cars?

I agree Josh made money off his name selling cars but how much? only as much as his inventory and he had so few cars to offer. It seemed like he had more customers/fans wanting to buy cars then cars. Selling 10-12 cars a month would have been great if it was just Josh and Anna but with employees and higher overhead I can't see the profit on cars under $2500 (Josh's speciality since you avoid AR state tax?) being that high to make payroll and whatever required insurance/Workers comp he needed. I never understood with a large lot why he didn't buy more inventory? Lazy, low cash flow, not enough junkers in NWA?

I was saying if the lot made enough money to support Josh, why would JB sell a business that could provide an income to a future son? He had 9 more coming and if JD or Joseph didn't want the business, JB could have paid RD to run it until another boy was old enough? I have always found the sale to Dobbs a bit odd. Dobbs motors kept the same Duggar hours of closing at 6pm everyday and has almost the same inventory today, a few old junkie cars and 1 or 2 older luxury cars. The Dobbs company had their dealership license revoked in the past, is into lots of similar businesses as JB, it just doesn't add up.

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JB would sell a business bc the offer was better than keeping the business. This does not in any way mean the business was failing. It is a common business tactic. Are you familiar with Minecraft's sale to Microsoft?

I don't see Josh failed at car sales. I do see that he lucked out by getting offered the FRC gig - he didn't do anything to deserve it but he was still touted as the New Face of Faith and Politics by FRC - name recognition due to 19kac fame.

Josh didn't go to DC looking for his dreams. His dream flew from Washington DC to Arkansas and carried him and his little family right back to DC.

Josh is totally winning. He has a high profile job and a fancy title. He is way far up the ladder for a 20something with only a GED backed up with a questionable and mediocre homeschool, and he didn't have to work and scrabble and suffer salad days to get there. It dropped into his lap.

Personally I don't put a lot of stock into what the Duggar kids say their dreams are/were. When Josh was a teen at home in Duggarland, how would he have any realistic idea of what an attorney does? I mean this kid did not even watch Matlock or Perry Mason or anything. Almost completely isolated and sheltered from the real world, how would Josh have come in contact with the legal world to gain any kind of understanding of what lawyers do?

It was just something to say when asked about his future plans. There was never going to be college or law school for Josh, and it is highly unlikely he harbored a lot of secret hopes and dreams about it. The Duggar kids weren't raised to imagine and think and dream. They were raised to obey.

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I suspect josh saw attornies in Little Rock when his dad was in polotics and thought it was a cool job as a kid. His currentj

job Has lastedlong enough that his contacts and experiEnce should keep him employed past the end ofthe show.l

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I think Josh will be okay past the end of the show. Anna is never gonna be in the laundry room washing up her thrift store finds and having a mental meltdown, one thing these people have got going for them is a support system.

Josh will continue political consulting, heck he could probably set himself elected in AR politics. There are other people out there who want Josh to succeed, because Josh is the visible face of Christian homeschool and that Christian way of life. Those people are going to help Josh afloat and even help push him to success.

Just look at the leghumpers who came to the weddings despite being treated very poorly as wedding guests. Every one of them could be pulled to support Josh as a politician in the state capitol. Anna has cut her teeth in Washington DC, she will probably be an excellent political wife at the state level.

Josh might even attempt his father's goal of US Senate.

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Josh is totally winning. He has a high profile job and a fancy title. He is way far up the ladder for a 20something with only a GED backed up with a questionable and mediocre homeschool, and he didn't have to work and scrabble and suffer salad days to get there. It dropped into his lap.

^^^ This. That kid lucked out. If it weren't for his family's TV show fame, no way would he ever have swung that job on his own. (And I suspect he gets paid a pretty penny for his photo ops and probably pretty mediocre speaking appearances for FRC Action.) I suspect he thinks it's all his god's doing, and that he was entitled to his status, but he sure didn't earn it himself.

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I think the car lot especially after it expanded was not profitable to support a large family. If Josh had stayed at the first small lot and ran it himself with Anna's part time help, it would have been fine. Not millionaires but enough to pay the bills. I think Jim Bob wanted a bigger lot and with that came hiring staff, not family to run the lot on an everyday basis. When they traveled for Santorum's campaign Josh was rarely present at the lot. With the low margin inventory there was no way they could afford to keep the 5-6 people paid, workers comp., insurance etc. Also if the car lot was doing fine when Josh left for DC, JB would have either kept it himself or had another son assigned to it. JB wouldn't give up or sell a a positive cash flow business.

As for homeschool, I hope Anna has met some other homeschooling moms and is introduced to new programs and materials. If she hasn't I fear she will revert to the only system she knows which is ATI. I see visions of her and Priscilla teaching those wisdom booklets.

Anna has posted pictures on Instagram of Mac and Michael using Math-u-see. I'm not sure if it's a decent program or not though.

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