Muslim Leader:God Commanded Family Planning

[roddma]

The main purpose of Quiverfull is out breed Muslims. What if they started slowing things down?

http://kuow.org/post/god-commanded-fami ... ged-malawi

[IronicallyMaeve]

Wow, it sounds like they support child brides and young mothers so they can continue to get an education. That's very Godly of them.

[Hane]

OT: I was raised Catholic. Back in the early '70s, when my next door neighbor and I were 19, she got engaged and was going to premarital counseling with her fiance. She showed me the book her (Methodist) minister had given her. It said flat-out that the church taught that it was immoral to have children before you were financially and emotionally ready for them. It was the first time I'd seen family planning presented not as a slightly dodgy lifestyle option, but as a moral imperative.

And I don't thing ANYTHING is going to slow down people of any faith who have a quiverful mindset. God told them to do exactly what they want to do, so anything else is immaterial.

[Idolatry]

I'm reasonably sure the Arkansas Muslim birthrate has always been slower than the Duggars'.

[doggie]

I'm reasonably sure the Arkansas Muslim birthrate has always been slower than the Duggars'.

so are rabbits

[Jana814]

I'm reasonably sure the Arkansas Muslim birthrate has always been slower than the Duggars'.

I'm sure your right!

[Jana814]

And I don't thing ANYTHING is going to slow down people of any faith who have a quiverful mindset. God told them to do exactly what they want to do, so anything else is immaterial.

I'm sure you r right!

[GiGi_41]

So my LO's first father is apparently Muslim. At least that is what the first mother said.

The first mother said that the father and her didn't believe in birth control because of his religion.

When I pointed out that actually yes Muslims did believe in birth control and that fathers should be responsible for their children, I was met with a OHH...and the religion idea and the LO not eating pork was dropped!

We still didn't give her pork until the adoption was final but it certainly was amusing.

ETA.

[Mama Mia]

So my LO's first father is apparently Muslim. At least that is what the first mother said.

The first mother said that the father and her didn't believe in birth control because of his religion.

When I pointed out that actually yes Muslims did believe in birth control and that fathers should be responsible for their children, I was met with a OHH...and the religion idea and the LO not eating pork was dropped!

We still didn't give her pork until the adoption was final but it certainly was amusing.

ETA.

On - topic --I would assume a blanket statement regarding Muslim beliefs regarding birth control would be about exactly as valid as a similar blanket statement regarding Christians and birth control.

Off--topic --Please tell me I misunderstood your post. You didn't really laugh off any religious requests the first parent made as soon as the adoption was final, did you?

[ADoyle90815]

so are rabbits

LOL! I guess the Duggars wanted to outbreed rabbits since they couldn't hunt enough to keep the population in check. ;)

[GiGi_41]

On - topic --I would assume a blanket statement regarding Muslim beliefs regarding birth control would be about exactly as valid as a similar blanket statement regarding Christians and birth control.

Off--topic --Please tell me I misunderstood your post. You didn't really laugh off any religious requests the first parent made as soon as the adoption was final, did you?

I just want to make this clear...if my LO's was from a different country or was enmeshed in a culture I wouldn't laugh off her nationality or culture. She came to live with us on the day she was born. We were never asked to bring her to Mosque or involve her in Muslim culture (I would have done so if asked). I even asked if I needed to purchase halal foods and was told no. If her first family were even somewhat practicing Muslims I would feel different about this situation I promise you.

We followed the mothers request until the adoption was final. Just like we observed her wish for the LO's hair not to be cut. Am I supposed to observe her never getting her hair cut also?

Her first mother is NOT Muslim. The first mother is someone that is related to my partner and we have seen her eat ham, pork and bacon before, during, and since. I think that is probably the most amusing part about it. It was a way to assert some power in a situation in which she had no control.

We now have a second child (My LO's half-sister) there are no restrictions on her diet nor any mention of her being Muslim. If she requested the same restrictions we would follow them, because as foster parents that is what we are supposed to do.

Once my LO was adopted her spirituality (or lack of) fell on my shoulders. We are liberal Quakers and hold that EVERYONE has the light within them. Her previous food restrictions are no longer valid. If she decides when she is older that she wants to pursue her first father's religion she may.

[DGayle]

On - topic --I would assume a blanket statement regarding Muslim beliefs regarding birth control would be about exactly as valid as a similar blanket statement regarding Christians and birth control.

Off--topic --Please tell me I misunderstood your post. You didn't really laugh off any religious requests the first parent made as soon as the adoption was final, did you?

Why should a birth parent be allowed to dictate the permanent path of the child's post-adoption life? Especially when the birth parent who's part of the process chose a family of a different religion? You can't seriously expect a non-Muslim family to raise a child as a Muslim, or any other religion. If I, an atheist, adopted my kids to a Christian, I'd be foolish to expect them to raise the kids as atheists. Once the adoption is final, the legal parents are the parents, and with that is the right to decide religious matters. Good ones will help a child remain connected to any culture they were a part of, but if a child wasn't participating in any religion, then why shouldn't that be up to the legal parents?

Imagine how many fewer adoptions there would be if kids came with a rule sheet attached, even from birth.

Gigi waited until she was the full legal mother before making religious decisions.

[Mama Mia]

Why should a birth parent be allowed to dictate the permanent path of the child's post-adoption life? Especially when the birth parent who's part of the process chose a family of a different religion? You can't seriously expect a non-Muslim family to raise a child as a Muslim, or any other religion. If I, an atheist, adopted my kids to a Christian, I'd be foolish to expect them to raise the kids as atheists. Once the adoption is final, the legal parents are the parents, and with that is the right to decide religious matters. Good ones will help a child remain connected to any culture they were a part of, but if a child wasn't participating in any religion, then why shouldn't that be up to the legal parents?

Imagine how many fewer adoptions there would be if kids came with a rule sheet attached, even from birth.

Gigi waited until she was the full legal mother before making religious decisions.

The way the original post was worded I took it to mean that the adoptive parent agreed to follow the first parents religious requests as part of the first parent agreeing to the adoption. Yes, if I was putting up a child for adoption, and it was important to me that they followed a particular guideline, and they AGREED to it -- I would absolute expect them to follow it.

If they didn't intend to follow it they have options - they could a) explain to me why that wasn't feasible and hopefully I would agree b) I could choose someone else as an adoptive parent or c) they could just adapt and follow the request.

The point is that it's unethical for a potential adoptive parent to make false promises to the first parents. Sure, life happens and all agreements might not end up being carried out - but that's very different from knowingly agreeing to a parenting request with no intention of following through.

From the follow up post by Gi Gi, it sounds like that wasn't what happened, that she never said she'd permanently restrict pork, so my apologies.

[Howl]

To bring things back into focus, this man is filled with an amazing amount of intelligence, wisdom and compassion. I'd really like to know more about his religious educational background/influences and cultural Islam in that area. I'd like to know who introduced family planning into their community and how they did it.

Mosa says the struggles the villagers face today take precedence over any cultural or religious resistance to family planning. Even so, as a religious leader, he sees little conflict with Islam.

He notes the Koran says women should breastfeed for two years to encourage child spacing. So modern contraceptive methods, he argues, are "really in line with what God commanded us to do."

Mosa’s village has been leading the family planning push in this part of Malawi. It formed a mother’s support group that spreads the message of modern contraception and smaller family sizes through words and song. The group also rescues girls from child marriage and teenage pregnancy, ensuring they stay in school — all without a penny of outside financial support.

They’re doing this not because someone is telling them to, or paying them to, but because, as Mosa says, their future depends on it.

[Aurora rising]

Most moslems believe in birth control - as far as I know everything with is reversible (is there such a word?) is allowed, e.g. NFP, condoms, even the pill. Sterilisation is not allowed, but everything else.

[eri]

There is a huge emphasis on reproduction in the various Muslim faiths. It is not uncommon for women to have about ten kids each, or for a single person to have 70-90 first cousins.

The fundie Christians are lagging behind. But if 19KAC taught me anything, it is that there are a lot more families like the Duggars than I thought.

IMO "out-breeding" another religion because you see it as competition is really petty and sad.

[Pretzel]

There is a huge emphasis on reproduction in the various Muslim faiths. It is not uncommon for women to have about ten kids each, or for a single person to have 70-90 first cousins.

The fundie Christians are lagging behind. But if 19KAC taught me anything, it is that there are a lot more families like the Duggars than I thought.

IMO "out-breeding" another religion because you see it as competition is really petty and sad.

That's a bland and pointless statement. Neither is it uncommon for haredi Jews to have 10 kids +, neither is it uncommon for various strict Christians to have a bunch of kids.

Christianity, Judaism, Islam. Three words for the most colorful and versatile subcultures with astonishingly differing believes among their followers.

[Imagine20]

I don't know any Muslims families with more than 4 kids. I know younger couples who use natural family planning and don't plan to have as many kids as possible.