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Duggars Vs. Bates


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singsingsing

People love to speculate about a competition between the Duggars and the Bateses. I tend not to believe that they actually feel like they're in a competition with each other, but it got me thinking: what if it actually were a competition? Who would be winning? And then I made a spreadsheet. Because I'm home sick and I'm insane.

 

This is how I calculate it:

 

-Lose one point for each child 18+ who is single.

-Lose 5 points for each child 25+ who is single.

-Lose 15 points for each child 30+ who is single.

-Lose 50 points if any immediate family member has a scandal (immediate family = the parents and children, grandchildren and sons/daughters-in-law and scandal = anything majorlike adultery, divorce, leaving fundamentalism completely and obviously, that would be a scandal to fundies not necessarily to us, and that isn't criminal - wearing pants or kissing before marriage doesn't cut it).

-Lose 100 points if any immediate family member does something criminal (and gets caught, obviously).

 

-Gain one point for each child.

-Gain 5 points for each set of twins.

-If Michelle or Kelly ever manage to produce #20 that's an automatic 100 points.

-Gain 1 point for each child courting.

-Gain 5 points for each child engaged.

-Gain 10 points for each married daughter.

-Gain 15 points for each married son (because they carry on the name).

-Gain 1 point for each maternal grandchild (i.e. the child of a daughter)

-Gain 2 points for each paternal grandchild (i.e. the child of a son, because they bear the family name)

-Gain 5 points for each set of grandtwins.

 

The results so far: the Duggars are winning by a small margin. The Duggars and the Bateses each have three single children over 18 (but under 25). The Duggars have 2 single children 25+. Each family has 19 kids apiece, but the Duggars have two sets of twins whereas the Bateses have none. The Duggars and the Bateses each have one married son and two married daughters, however the Bateses also have one daughter courting. The Bateses have one grandchild (paternal) to the Duggars' 3 (also paternal).

 

Total points for the Duggars: 57

Total points for the Bateses: 54

 

Jill and Alyssa's upcoming babies won't make a difference because they will both be maternal grandchildren, thus taking each family to 58 points and 55 points respectively. It's Anna's baby that will make a difference, pushing the Duggars a little further ahead. But if Michael gets married this year and no other Duggar does, the Bateses will probably take the lead.

 

It's based almost purely on childbirth and marriage, because those are the main things they're evaluated on by themselves and others. I decided not to give points for pregnancy because it's too iffy and the added points for children who have been born, or the lack of points for fewer children make up for it.

 

This actually took me only a few minutes to put together and is going to consume very little time to keep updated, so I plan to continue the game indefinitely. :)

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I'm sorry but, no. If he objected to the cover-up of sexual abuse and rape, as a grown ass man, he could have spoken out! By keeping his mouth shut, he's complicit in the cover-up. 

Well, they do offer us a last name that is the same as Norman Bates... So if a drama series was made based on them, with Norman as the 20th kid, and his mom in place of Kelly Bates, I'd totally watch

Reminds me of a line from The Addams Family, when Wednesday didn't dress for Halloween. She said "I'm a homocidal maniac. We look like everybody else."

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browncoatslytherin

this is interesting! i love :D i wonder how other fundies with similar beliefs and ideologies would measure up, too. they'd be so far behind the bates and duggars it wouldn't really be a contest, but it would be interesting to see families like the kellers and the paines, and even the arndts and maxwells.

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singsingsing

Yeah, the Duggars and Bateses are really easy to do this with because they each have an equal number of kids, their ages line up almost perfectly, and they're both in the spotlight so I'll always know when someone starts courting, gets married, or has a baby. I guess I could add some of the other families we follow and see who winds up in third place, fourth place, etc. but I just don't have enough time to do it! So the Duggars vs. the Bateses it is. :)

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browncoatslytherin

oh i know! keeping up with even half of who we talk about would be daunting lol

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anjulibai

I think you should add something for number of pregnancies. That would change things, because Kelly has been pregnant 23 times (19 successful pregnancies and 4 miscarriages) and Michelle has been pregnant 19 times (17 successful pregnancies and 2 miscarriages) .

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anjulibai

BTW I think I will add this to my spreadsheet, LOL! Thanks!! :D

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I think you should add something for number of pregnancies. That would change things, because Kelly has been pregnant 23 times (19 successful pregnancies and 4 miscarriages) and Michelle has been pregnant 19 times (7 successful pregnancies and 2 miscarriages) .

Would successful pregnancies get more points than miscarriages?

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It would be hilarious to see how the Arndts match up!

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browncoatslytherin
It would be hilarious to see how the Arndts match up!

the maxwells would be losing BAD

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anjulibai

Would successful pregnancies get more points than miscarriages?

Up to singsingsing, but I don't think so.

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singsingsing

I really seriously considered adding total number of pregnancies, but ultimately I decided against it because I felt like it was too wonky. Too many variables. I guess what I've done essentially is just given any pregnancy a neutral value until the outcome is known. To be honest I would also feel somewhat callous adding or subtracting points for miscarriages or (God-forbid) still-births - so yeah, I guess pregnancy = 0 (neutral), live birth = +1, because despite all their talk of 'life-begins-at-conception' and Michelle's oath that she would always say from now on that she has 20 kids (no, wait, 21), they don't seem to count their miscarriages toward their total. There's also the issue of the possibility that some of them will have miscarriages and not choose to share that with the world, so the points could end up pretty skewed. The other stuff (births, marriages) is basically impossible to hide.

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nelliebelle1197

I think you should lose points for twins, but not for grandtwins. Having more pregnancies end successfully outweighs twins. Because more = more and twins could be seen as cheating. Grandtwins are just more numbers.

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singsingsing

It's not just about numbers, it's about prestige, and twins = more prestige. I don't know what I'd do with triplets - probably double the points.

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nelliebelle1197
It's not just about numbers, it's about prestige, and twins = more prestige. I don't know what I'd do with triplets - probably double the points.

I would posit that more successful pregnancies has more prestige than twins. After all, Kelly has NINETEEN pregnancies compared to the Milk Dud's SEVENTEEN. :nenner: :nenner: :nenner:

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I think there should be points lost for married kids still living on parental property, points gained for employed sons, employed daughters are neutral, and points gained for sons who's supplied their own homes (Josh gets a point for his DC home, and do any of the Bates boys own their own homes that weren't given by Gil?).

I love all of this game.

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the maxwells would be losing BAD

The Maxwell score is 22. I haven't done the Arndts, but I'm guessing their score would be -5

I wanted to find another family with 8 kids to compete with the Maxwells. The only family I could think of are the Sanders.

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singsingsing

You all have awesome ideas - unfortunately I already have a full time job, so I'm going for the simple and the obvious - the in-your-face things that are the usual yardsticks we use to compare them. ;) So I'm sticking with the marriage-and-babies war, but if someone were truly ambitious they could go into a lot more detail and pit several families against each other.

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Toothfairy

Can there be extra points on who they marry? The Bates daughter is married to a senators son and moved all the way to a different state. While the Duggar daughters are staying local with homes provided by daddy. Josh married fundie. Jill got a college educated dude. While Jessa got an asshole. Don't know if the Bates kids married fundie

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Can there be extra points on who they marry? The Bates daughter is married to a senators son and moved all the way to a different state. While the Duggar daughters are staying local with homes provided by daddy. Josh married fundie. Jill got a college educated dude. While Jessa got an asshole. Don't know if the Bates kids married fundie

I don't see how that would be easy to calculate. I mean does Anna count for additional points because she's fundie/ATI or Derrick since he's college educated?

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singsingsing

Yeah, it's just too subjective. We might think Jill got a better deal because Derick's university educated, but maybe the Bateses think she got a worse deal because he's so 'worldly'. We might think the Duggars should lose points based on how many married children live in Jim Bob funded housing, but for all we know they view that as a great success for the family.

I'm going off what they're generally compared with against each other (# of kids, # of grandkids, # married and so on) - tangible things that are basically indisputable facts. If they're courting, they're courting. If they have a baby, they have a baby. And into the spreadsheet it goes!

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nelliebelle1197
Can there be extra points on who they marry? The Bates daughter is married to a senators son and moved all the way to a different state. While the Duggar daughters are staying local with homes provided by daddy. Josh married fundie. Jill got a college educated dude. While Jessa got an asshole. Don't know if the Bates kids married fundie

Yes, the Bates girls married fundie. In fact, all three married/are marrying ATI royalty. None of the Duggars have caught the ATI chiropractor and Congressman's sons, I am thinking that the Bates win that one. Jessa and Jill married outside ATI.

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youthfulclearly

The Maxwell score is 22. I haven't done the Arndts, but I'm guessing their score would be -5

I wanted to find another family with 8 kids to compete with the Maxwells. The only family I could think of are the Sanders.

The Staddons have 8 kids. They have only married off 1 kid so far, and like the Maxwells, all their kids are adults. Their oldest is 35, and their youngest is 18, which is pretty close to the Maxwells age range.

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Geechee Girl

How do broken courtships and/or engagements factor in? Does Zach Bates lose points for the family? Since this is the Fundie Games, I think bonus points should be awarded for teenage marriage and childbearing.

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