Joseph Duggar starts College

[Ralar]

I used to see a doctor who was partnered with another GP. The other doctor ended up taking me as his patient.

Now they have apparently split up. Last time I went, there was a huge notice in their lobby that they were no longer taking Medicare, they would only take certain insurance plans, and the rest were paying cash. Now.. you can pay cash and then file a claim with your insurance on your own. Normally the dr office will file on your behalf and you pay the co-pay up fromt, something like $25 although the last year I was there it had jumped up to $45.

Ok so I have not been back, I don't care for that second doctor. A few months ago I got a letter from him. He is moving to a new office. He is no longer taking insurance but he is taking applications for new patients. He has developed some kind of system where the patient pays either a hefty annual fee or an even more expensive monthly fee, no matter how often or how little you see the dr.

If you are accepted into his office, in exchange for this fee you get nearly instant access to him, he might even come to your home or office. That is unheard of.

I have no idea how this is working out for him. This is a new way of doctoring but I can just about guarantee you his patients are now limited to people with enough DI to pay his annual fee. No idea how test or anything work but I was really blown away at the exclusivity of his program.

Have to go. work.

That new medical practice model is called Concierge Medicine.

[BrownieMomma]

That new medical practice model is called Concierge Medicine.

yep, it sure looks like my former dr is practicing concierge medicine, interesting stuff.

My kids are on the state insurance that working parents can get - make too much for medicaid and can't afford employer-provided insurance. I literally cannot get them into a doctor in my town, I called every physician in the phone book, googled and provided by the state ins website. No one will take them because either the dr does not accept chip or not accepting new patients.

So this concierge stuff really scares me because the medical personnel available to me distance themselves from the govt program. I can see why do it, from all that I've read.

Still, I just want to take my kid to the dr and preferably someone they can have a relationship with. As of now, they can only go to the local community clinic, where you will never see an actual MD but a PA.

[SportsgalAnnie]

Or Mars Hill.

(PS -- I'm from around the Tri-Cities. PM me if you want a meetup.)

I forgot that was a religious one too

[LadyCrow1313]

I've always felt that "Duggar time" was more on Jim Bob and Michelle than the kids. I have never really known a child who did not respond to the parental wake up time. What those kids never had, as most kids in the world have had their entire lives, is a schedule, because the PARENTS never had a schedule. Michelle never had to get up and make her headship breakfast because JimBob never went anywhere.

I'm sure that all the boys who went to ALERT responded well to the schedule and were on time because they were expected to do that. College shouldn't be any different, especially since it sounds as if there will be "consequences" if he is late or does not attend some classes.

The girls, well, Jill, get up on time to take their darlings to work.... so it CAN be done, attending to a schedule. Even if you're a Duggar.

This is something that's always bugged me about them. Get yer asses up & at 'em, Duggarlings! :angry-banghead:

[DuggarsTheEndIsNear]

This is something that's always bugged me about them. Get yer asses up & at 'em, Duggarlings! :angry-banghead:

I don't think its that the Duggar kids can't get up. I think it's just that their parents give them a lot of slack because their parenrs became reliant on making excuses.

That said, I have a hard time getting up in the morning/getting out the door and I've gone to real schoools and I've had real jobs for the past decade. It's just harder for some people to conform to societies need to start early. If life started after 10 am, I would be golden. Lol

So I can't fault any reluctant Duggars too much cause that would be hypocritical.

[Cleopatra7]

Although I was surprised by the news that Joseph Duggar will be attending college, I'm not very hopeful that this will help him expand his horizons. These unaccredited "bible colleges" exist as a sort of fundie finishing school, where young adults are shipped off with the intention of making them more compliant to the whims of the religion in question. It's not unlike the world of haredi Judaism, where boys are sent to yeshiva and girls are sent to a "seminary" (preferably in Israel) to reinforce their commitment to the Torah world. While Joseph will ostensibly learning a trade at Clown College, I would be surprised if it's a legit program that teaches real skills that can be transferred to the outside world and not something more sketchy in the for-pay college line where you hand over a lot of money and don't learn the trade. I say this, because I have read many accounts on "Stuff Fundies Like" and other sites where people who went to these "Bible colleges" found themselves unable to have the outside world recognize their degrees or their credits, due to the lack of accreditation and the hit and miss nature of the classes. I think this is intentional, because if the fundie world is the only place where your "Bible college" degree is worth anything, then that gives you less of a reason to leave. :disgust:

[louisa05]

Of course it's HE because women folk shouldn't be able to work :doh:

The women can work. However, for no stated reason, they are not allowed to work at a mall food court or fast food restaurant. And no dorm students, male or female, are allowed to work at a hotel or motel or to house-sit. And students have to have a pass that allows them to work and get permission to quit a job.

A few rules that stood out to me as especially draconian:

Students are not allowed to get up prior to 5 a.m. and must get up by 7:30 a.m.

They are supposed to only leave campus in groups of two or more (but, obviously, that group is not a mixed gender group). And then, they can't go more than 50 miles from campus without parental permission.

They are not allowed to go home except for scheduled breaks unless they can document an emergency. And they have to have permission to go anywhere but home on those breaks. It is odd to me that these really controlling, homeschooling, never-let-go-of-their-kids sort of parents would be comfortable with that rule.

[SassyPants]

The women can work. However, for no stated reason, they are not allowed to work at a mall food court or fast food restaurant. And no dorm students, male or female, are allowed to work at a hotel or motel or to house-sit. And students have to have a pass that allows them to work and get permission to quit a job.

A few rules that stood out to me as especially draconian:

Students are not allowed to get up prior to 5 a.m. and must get up by 7:30 a.m.

They are supposed to only leave campus in groups of two or more (but, obviously, that group is not a mixed gender group). And then, they can't go more than 50 miles from campus without parental permission.

They are not allowed to go home except for scheduled breaks unless they can document an emergency. And they have to have permission to go anywhere but home on those breaks. It is odd to me that these really controlling, homeschooling, never-let-go-of-their-kids sort of parents would be comfortable with that rule.

The up by 0730 might be a stretch for a Duggar.

"If God had wanted me to see the sun rise, he wouldn't have made it so early in the morning" said Jessa.

[LittleOleMe]

I've always felt that "Duggar time" was more on Jim Bob and Michelle than the kids. I have never really known a child who did not respond to the parental wake up time. What those kids never had, as most kids in the world have had their entire lives, is a schedule, because the PARENTS never had a schedule. Michelle never had to get up and make her headship breakfast because JimBob never went anywhere.

I'm sure that all the boys who went to ALERT responded well to the schedule and were on time because they were expected to do that. College shouldn't be any different, especially since it sounds as if there will be "consequences" if he is late or does not attend some classes.

The girls, well, Jill, get up on time to take their darlings to work.... so it CAN be done, attending to a schedule. Even if you're a Duggar.

I completely agree. It's the parents - and thus the smaller children. Whenever they go on trips and are packing, the older kids are always ready to go and are pretty much waiting around for JB and J'chelle to get their asses in gear. I seem to remember the girls making comments about it, in a very "my parents are so fucking lazy but we're ready on time all the time" kind of way.

[shedemei]

Oh, there's a whole bunch of crazy in there. I was just surprised at how egalitarian it was in being draconian. For example, check out the dress code section.

Having wake and bedtimes seems totally inappropriate for people who are living away from home for the first time and learning how to be adults.

[LittleOleMe]

Actually, female students ARE permitted to work. They may be using "he" because they don't believe in singular "they".

All students are held to a bunch of restrictions including needing to get permission, a work pass, and not being allowed to work overnight or on Sundays. There are a few additional rules for women who live on campus, but one of them actually appears to be a leniency that men don't have.

* Dormitory ladies may not work a job during the Wednesday evening church service without administrative approval.

* Dormitory ladies may not work at a mall or fast-food restaurant. Some exceptions may be made by the administration on a case-by-case basis.

* Arrangements for dormitory students traveling to and from work must be indicated on the work pass and approved by the Director of Student Employment. Ladies may be permitted to travel alone to work if necessary.

It sounds like it's run more like a boarding school for jr high students than a private college for ADULTS

[SquirrelySquirrel]

I completely agree. It's the parents - and thus the smaller children. Whenever they go on trips and are packing, the older kids are always ready to go and are pretty much waiting around for JB and J'chelle to get their asses in gear. I seem to remember the girls making comments about it, in a very "my parents are so fucking lazy but we're ready on time all the time" kind of way.

Yep, remember when Boob took the oldest girls to that father-daughter retreat? They were all waiting in the vehicle while he was just getting around to packing.

I'm another who would be golden if everything started after 10am. I'm an insomniac, and I've never been a morning person. But I am a stickler for getting my ass to places ON TIME. Always being late is a huge sign of being selfish and self-centered. Every time they joke about Dugger Time with their smug little smirks I just want to reach through the tv and slap them.

[LittleOleMe]

Yep, remember when Boob took the oldest girls to that father-daughter retreat? They were all waiting in the vehicle while he was just getting around to packing.

I'm another who would be golden if everything started after 10am. I'm an insomniac, and I've never been a morning person. But I am a stickler for getting my ass to places ON TIME. Always being late is a huge sign of being selfish and self-centered. Every time they joke about Dugger Time with their smug little smirks I just want to reach through the tv and slap them.

Ditto to everything you said!! It's incredibly selfish and I, too, want to rip them through the tv and just shake them. It's incredibly rude.

I, too, do not sleep at night. It sucks. I try to schedule things later in the day but sometimes I can't and I'm forced to get up early. But even when I'm exhausted because I didn't sleep, I still get up and get done what needs to get done. Because that's what being a responsible person means. Unfortunately Ma and Pa Duggar are anything but.

[SassyPants]

Agree with all of you ladies. Lateness= disrespect of others' time.

They use those kids as an excuse, but I'd venture to say that JB and M have always been part of the late crowd.

My mom is one of those people and as a child it drove me crazy.

[bluebird]

I looked up info about that college last night but didn't delve into it. I wanted to see what the academic admission criteria is...never found it. Guess it is just a big check? The site I was poking around on made it perfectly clear that hours/credits earned may not be transferable...they made it very,very clear..Does the college have a minimal ACT/SAT Score requirement? From what I am reading here it sounds like a modern day internment camp for young fundie adults. What happens when a student screws up and doesn't follow a rule? Are they locked up and isolated for awhile? Do they get a beating, public humiliation? This is a cracker jack college from the sounds of it and frankly those rule scare me.

[DuggarsTheEndIsNear]

Although I was surprised by the news that Joseph Duggar will be attending college, I'm not very hopeful that this will help him expand his horizons. These unaccredited "bible colleges" exist as a sort of fundie finishing school, where young adults are shipped off with the intention of making them more compliant to the whims of the religion in question. It's not unlike the world of haredi Judaism, where boys are sent to yeshiva and girls are sent to a "seminary" (preferably in Israel) to reinforce their commitment to the Torah world. While Joseph will ostensibly learning a trade at Clown College, I would be surprised if it's a legit program that teaches real skills that can be transferred to the outside world and not something more sketchy in the for-pay college line where you hand over a lot of money and don't learn the trade. I say this, because I have read many accounts on "Stuff Fundies Like" and other sites where people who went to these "Bible colleges" found themselves unable to have the outside world recognize their degrees or their credits, due to the lack of accreditation and the hit and miss nature of the classes. I think this is intentional, because if the fundie world is the only place where your "Bible college" degree is worth anything, then that gives you less of a reason to leave. :disgust:

Coming from my own experiences, I think Christian schools have one of two outcomes: either you're religious after leaving, or you're not. I went to an all girls Catholic school. Upon entering the school, 90% of the students were confirmed or about to be confirmed (some of the student body was not catholic and accepted on a purely academic basis). By the end of my time there, about 40% of the girls were still practicing the faith while everyone else wasn't. 5 years out, I would estimate (I can't speak for all the girls because a lot of them fell off the face of the earth when we left high school) 25-30% were still identifying as christian. Our school wasn't even that religious (compared to other Catholic schools in the area, we were pretty liberal; and those schools were also pretty liberal) or strict in the dress/behavior code (we had rules like: no logos on your shirts that were more than 1"x1" unless they were the school name/crest; your hair had to be more than 1" long and couldn't be a color that doesn't naturally occur; skirts had to go below your fingertips (not strictly enforced unless there was a uniform check); if you were going to wear the sweats instead of a skirt, you could only wear a specific shirt and sweatshirt with it; socks had to be visible above your shoes when wearing a skirt; you had to wear underwear under your skirt (there was actually a need for this rule. I remember sitting across from a girl once and she had her legs open but nothing under her skirt... so awkward...)).

Long story short, I would say it's too early for us to tell which direction Joseph is going to come out of this. HOWEVER, if he really loves alert (and disciplining boys) so much, I really doubt that he's going to be one of those ones who bothers questioning his faith, ever. I think of all the kids in the family, he's probably the one who will most likely push for more kids than his parents had.

[DuggarsTheEndIsNear]

Oh, there's a whole bunch of crazy in there. I was just surprised at how egalitarian it was in being draconian. For example, check out the dress code section.

Having wake and bedtimes seems totally inappropriate for people who are living away from home for the first time and learning how to be adults.

But if kids (er adults) are awake before their dorm parents (or whatever they're calling them, I'm calling them parents), then they could sneak out and do the hanky panky!

[calimojo]

I am appalled by these rules for adults. But I guess when you consider how supremely sheltered most of these kids have been their whole lives, it would probably be a recipe for disaster to turn them loose on a real college campus. The culture shock would be so overwhelming.

What they really need to have is some sort of gradual college that starts out strict, and then gradually over the 4 years allows more and more freedoms. Kind of like a treatment program, baby steps to help these poor young adults actually be able to survive

[Sundaymorning]

If you read those rules, you'd think that they are talking about a bunch of 10 year old kids.

Seriously, it's so ridiculous, I don't even know where to start.

[bluebird]

I spent some time and read through the student handbook..wtf?!? Joseph's horizons look pretty narrow and bleak to me. Their rules extend far beyond college/campus life..how are some of those rules even legal? I believe I read in order to resign from a job you have to obtain counsel or permission beforehand. How a student spends their time on holiday or semester breaks is prescribed, girls cannot work in fast food positions and it sounds like they can't even throw an apple in their backpacks from the cafeteria. Getting a speeding ticket on a specific road was grounds for discipline? Traffic safety is important and should be reinforced but come on! Getting married without permission was grounds for serious discipline..did I read that right? While I was going through the handbook I was beginning to feel emotionally paralyzed,lol..Those students have to gut out a brainwash camp for 4 yrs for a degree from a college that lacks accreditation and is probably a b.s. educational experience to boot. What i$ the point? ETA..There is an illuminate feel to it all...Shower time for me to remove all of the yuck

[DuggarsTheEndIsNear]

I am appalled by these rules for adults. But I guess when you consider how supremely sheltered most of these kids have been their whole lives, it would probably be a recipe for disaster to turn them loose on a real college campus. The culture shock would be so overwhelming.

I know a lot of people who were a LOT less sheltered/controlled by their parents who went ape shit crazy when they were first on their own at college. A couple of them ended up with alcohol poisoning our first night in the dorms, others ended up knocked up by the end of the first semester, some never made it to classes because they were too busy having fun. I couldn't imagine what it would be like for someone who had absolutely no freedoms and then was given that much freedom...

[Sundaymorning]

I know a lot of people who were a LOT less sheltered/controlled by their parents who went ape shit crazy when they were first on their own at college. A couple of them ended up with alcohol poisoning our first night in the dorms, others ended up knocked up by the end of the first semester, some never made it to classes because they were too busy having fun. I couldn't imagine what it would be like for someone who had absolutely no freedoms and then was given that much freedom...

I concur. When I went to college, there were some really sheltered kids too, who, for the first time in their life, really had freedom. Our university didn't have any stupid rules, so they could basically do whatever they wanted. Their parents were not fundies, some of them were Evangelicals and others were just really sheltering them (no alcohol, no parties, no smoking!).

And well, some of the kids were ok with their parents rules, and they never really tried alcohol and parties, since they didn't feel the need to. And that's ok, everyone should live the way they want to.

But there were a lot of kids who were forced onto their parents rules, and well, once they were out on their own, hell broke loose. From alcohol poisonings to having sex with a new guy or girl every week to abusing drugs, you name it. And I'm not judging them either, they were adults and it was their choice to live the way they lived, they had to suffer the consequences (many of them did not pass their first year due to incessant partying).

What I'm saying is that extreme sheltering and unrealistic rules often lead to the opposite of what was intended.

[Mela99]

I wonder why he picked this place instead of College of the Ozarks... wouldn't that be closer to home and focus more on saving money?

[TeaELSee]

My husband works at a non secular STEM (science, technology, engineering & math) boarding high school. The rules are MUCH more relaxed than that school. There are rules and a level of trust.

[FloraDoraDolly]

Pensacola Christian College (the home of the A Beka homeschooling empire) also has extremely strict rules. They even have a goon squad that goes through everybody's stuff to make sure there are no forbidden books/music/magazines/electronics.