6 Yr Old Minnesota Girl Committs Suicide

[roddma]

This is almost to heartbreaking to post. How can a 6 yr old shave any concept of suicide?

http://www.usnews.com/news/articles/201 ... r-accident

[Burris]

This was not suicide; it was murder - a murder commited by an entire system of teachers, counselors, foster parents (who knew about her ideation and even found evidence on her neck from practice attempts), and bio family.

When a prisoner threatens suicide, he is put on watch. When a six-year-old does it, her guardians leave her alone in a room with a fucking rope.

I hope I see them all in hell.

[Coco]

She wrote her "i'm sorry" note in purple marker.

i hope this is a wake up call for the people who failed her. My heart is breaking for all the little kids she knew, and everyone going through grief. Her teacher must be in so much trauma because of not acting on what she drew to step up and protect her from whatever was hurting so bad.

[formergothardite]

OMG. This is just too awful. :cry: That poor child. There were healed marks on her neck, so it seems like this is not the first time she tried this.

[Grimalkin]

I can't syop thinking about a 6 year old feeling so unloved.

[crazyforkate]

This is why you always take this stuff seriously, no matter how preposterous it seems. It is way, way better to overemphasize it than to ignore it and wind up with this kind of tragedy. That poor kid.

[bluebird]

I agree with you Burris! Why was that child not in a therapeutic clinical setting where her safety could be monitored and where she would also receive intensive treatment? So preventable..All of the evidence that suicide was a likely outcome were there and ignored. This is heartbreaking. It does not surprise me at all that a 6 year old would turn to suicide..could she appreciate the finality of it all? My guess is noooo. Who knows what she had been exposed to, heard, saw..through her home life and through the foster care system itself. She may have been knowledgeable about suicide at age 6. She fell through the cracks, it is a damn crime.

[Burris]

This is why you always take this stuff seriously, no matter how preposterous it seems. It is way, way better to overemphasize it than to ignore it and wind up with this kind of tragedy. That poor kid.

But it isn't preposterous; it's merely rare at that age - which makes this all the more disturbing.

* The child was in state care because her parents' home had been deemed unsafe - which means she may well have suffered abuse.

* She spoke to her therapist about suicide; she showed suicidal ideation. This would not have been ignored in a teenager or in an adult.

* She was drawing pictures of a hanging child.

* She had ligature - practice - marks around her neck, demonstrating that she may have made an attempt in earnest and panicked or simply that she was preparing.

* She expressed deep feelings of isolation to at least one caregiver.

* She wrote two separate notes expressing regret, with one being fairly explicit.

* Instead of being put on a suicide watch, she was left alone in a room that contained a rope by which she could do the deed. She was there, alone, long enough to successfully complete the act.

Her mother, whatever else she may be, is correct: This was not suicide - at least not in the usual sense. The girl may very well have used that rope herself, but a shoddy and uncaring system drove her to it. She was not responsible for her actions in any meaningful way.

And frankly, considering the staggering level of negligence that went on in this case at every level, I hope someone with the authority to do so pushes for her cause of death to be listed not as accident or suicide but as homicide.

There are some people in this situation who owe a debt for their negligence - a debt they can never repay because the victim of their callous unconcern is now dead.

I hope this case is used is an example by which new protocols are drawn up for how to deal with young children who express suicidal thoughts.

I agree with you Burris! Why was that child not in a therapeutic clinical setting where her safety could be monitored and where she would also receive intensive treatment? So preventable..All of the evidence that suicide was a likely outcome were there and ignored. This is heartbreaking. It does not surprise me at all that a 6 year old would turn to suicide..could she appreciate the finality of it all? My guess is noooo. Who knows what she had been exposed to, heard, saw..through her home life and through the foster care system itself. She may have been knowledgeable about suicide at age 6. She fell through the cracks, it is a damn crime.

Considering the practice marks and the note of apology, I think she did understand the finality of death on at least a basic level. There is no talk in the article of her believing some better life awaited her after death. She saw it in the same way as many adults see it: 'No matter what awaits, even if that is nothing, it must be better than this.'

Most child psychology things I've seen say kids don't understand the finality of death until around nine or ten, but I've known more than my share who were introduced to the concept far younger and were brought quickly to the realization that dead people do not come back to life again. If this child had been exposed at a younger age to the death of a family member, and had this explained to her, then she may very well have known her acts were final.

And that is one of the most disturbing aspects of this case: A six-year-old girl felt such despair that she chose an option she may very well have believed led to non-existence over continuing with the life she had.

That should trouble everyone here - everyone who had a hand in her care - everyone who dealt with her corpse - everyone who had to deal with the legal matters surrounding her death - everyone who read that article.

Everyone.

[Maggie Mae]

I agree with you Burris! Why was that child not in a therapeutic clinical setting where her safety could be monitored and where she would also receive intensive treatment? So preventable..All of the evidence that suicide was a likely outcome were there and ignored. This is heartbreaking. It does not surprise me at all that a 6 year old would turn to suicide..could she appreciate the finality of it all? My guess is noooo. Who knows what she had been exposed to, heard, saw..through her home life and through the foster care system itself. She may have been knowledgeable about suicide at age 6. She fell through the cracks, it is a damn crime.

Who has the responsibility of paying for that? Not everyone has comprehensive health insurance that covers dependents and their mental health. Intensive treatment is expensive and completely outside of normal six year old needs that the state kid care plan probably doesn't have much covered. It really irritates me sometimes on this board and in Real Life in general (not trying to single you out, it's a lot of different posts in different places about different topics) when people fail to realize that it's not as simple as "the mom should have done x, y, and z." Also I'm annoyed right now. Again, not trying to take it out on you specifically.

I guess my point is that the US should have a better system for health care, including mental illness. Its horrible to think about 6 year olds who are that depressed. :(

[KittenMitten]

I don't know what to say. I spent all day thinking about this and wish I had wise words to say, but there are none. I can only say poor baby. I just have no words.

[DGayle]

Who has the responsibility of paying for that? Not everyone has comprehensive health insurance that covers dependents and their mental health. Intensive treatment is expensive and completely outside of normal six year old needs that the state kid care plan probably doesn't have much covered. It really irritates me sometimes on this board and in Real Life in general (not trying to single you out, it's a lot of different posts in different places about different topics) when people fail to realize that it's not as simple as "the mom should have done x, y, and z." Also I'm annoyed right now. Again, not trying to take it out on you specifically.

I guess my point is that the US should have a better system for health care, including mental illness. Its horrible to think about 6 year olds who are that depressed. :(

The child was in foster care, not with her family, and had ben FOR A YEAR. Who should pay? It doesn't fucking matter. The system had her in their care. "Who will pay" shouldn't cross anyone's minds. It's not like the system can't send the bill to the taxpayers. They do it all the goddamned time for piddly shit.

So yes, she should have been in a therapeutic setting that met her needs. By taking her from her family, the state accepted the obligation to provide proper care REGARDLESS of cost since they have access to taxpayer money. There is no excuse for THIS PARTICULAR CHILD to not have had the care she needed.

[snarkykitty]

This is almost to heartbreaking to post. How can a 6 yr old shave any concept of suicide?

http://www.usnews.com/news/articles/201 ... r-accident

Think about it from the perspective of a 6 year old.

You may be feeling any combination of feelings like being sad, lonely, physically or mentally hurt, bullied, chronically ill, have few friends, disinterested family members, "parents" or parental figures who you feel do not love you or care if you were here or not...

Then think about your possible gut feelings while swamped by these emotions?

"I don't want to be here". "Everyone hates me." "I'm a loser." "I'm ugly." "I'm dumb." "Maybe I should run away." "Maybe I should be dead."

Common enough that you probably know of someone who, as a child, felt this way. :cry:

[roddma]

I think about all the kids I know/knew including myself and great nephew by marriage is 6 going on 7. There is no way he would have any comprehension of suicide unless someone told him even if he was distraught or depressed. Im not saying it is an impossibility, but really disturbed a 6 yr old would know anything about it.

[ViolaSebastian]

The child was in foster care, not with her family, and had ben FOR A YEAR. Who should pay? It doesn't fucking matter. The system had her in their care. "Who will pay" shouldn't cross anyone's minds. It's not like the system can't send the bill to the taxpayers. They do it all the goddamned time for piddly shit.

So yes, she should have been in a therapeutic setting that met her needs. By taking her from her family, the state accepted the obligation to provide proper care REGARDLESS of cost since they have access to taxpayer money. There is no excuse for THIS PARTICULAR CHILD to not have had the care she needed.

Dang straight. If the taxpayers can spend $172 million on penis pumps, they can sure as hell dig into their pockets to pay for the therapy to save a suicidal six year old.

[Burris]

I did a bit of looking around and, while I have found some links that touch the subject, I'm disturbed by how few of them deal with the subject in a rigorous way.

My first search term, "Dealing with children who talk about suicide" was not specific enough and brought up a lot of hits on how to explain the concept of grief and death to children. It did, however, lead to the disturbing link below.

This link, for example, seems comprised mostly of parents at a loss as to how to handle suicidal or homicidal talk in their young children.

My second search term, "Suicidal ideation in preteens" was more fruitful - and yet less accessible to the average parent.

What I discovered in a paper, "Suicidal Behavior in Children Younger than

Twelve: A Diagnostic Challenge for Emergency Department Personnel" was disturbing. The very first sentence in the abstract reads as follows:

Suicide is one of the leading causes of death in children younger than 12 years and is the fourth leading cause of death in 12 year olds. Increasing numbers of young children now present to the emergency department (ED) with mental health issues, and ED personnel must determine the most appropriate disposition options for these children, sometimes without the assistance of specialty mental health services. Much of the present body of literature describing suicidality fails to separate children from adolescents for analysisand discussion.

Our progeny, our hope, our future - and they're killing themselves. We, as a people, have a duty to find out not only why this is happening bot how to stop it.

WebMD provides a list of warning signs that children and adolescents - but more likely these indicators are truer for older kids - in hope of saving lives.

I will reproduce some of the pertinent parts of that article:

Common warning signs for suicide include:

•Making suicidal statements. [The girl did this on multiple occasions.]

•Being preoccupied with death in conversation, writing, or drawing. [The girl drew pictures of a hanged child.]

•Giving away belongings.

•Withdrawing from friends and family. [The girl expressed the belief no one liked her.]

•Having aggressive or hostile behavior. [I find it likely that if she were having trouble forming friendships, either she was shy or angry and unlearned in how to form healthy attachments.]

It is extremely important that you take all threats of suicide seriously and seek immediate treatment for your child or teenager. If you are a child or teen and have these feelings, talk with your parents, an adult friend, or your doctor right away to get some help.

Other warning signs can include...Neglecting personal appearance.

Depression

Signs of depression, which can lead to suicidal behavior, include:

•Feeling sad, empty, or tearful nearly every day.

•Loss of interest in activities that were enjoyed in the past.

•Changes in eating and sleeping habits.

•Difficulty thinking and concentrating.

•Complaints of continued boredom.

•Complaints of headaches, stomachaches, or fatigue with no actual physical problems.

•Expressions of guilt and/or not allowing anyone to give him or her praise or rewards.

From he "Suicide Risk in Children" article at education.com, we learn the following:

"Very little is known about childhood suicide."

"Until recently, it was believed that children never committed suicide."

"Suicide in children is on the rise. In a 20-year period between 1970 and 1990, suicide rates tripled among children ages 5-14 years. Suicide rates among this group are relatively low, accounting for about 1% of all completed suicides. Nevertheless, although children kill themselves at lower rates than the rest of the population, suicide is the third leading killer among children ages 10-14 years (behind accidents and cancer). "

"One study found that 33% of a group of 39 outpatient psychiatric children (ages 6-12 years) had contemplated, attempted, or threatened suicide (Pfeffer, 1984). Even children with no psychiatric history appear to have suicidal thoughts; about 12% of elementary school children admit to suicidal ideas, threats, or attempts (Pfeffer, Zuckerman, Plutchik, & Mizruchi, 1984)."

So here it is; the hard truth: Children - sometimes young children who know what they're doing and why - are killing themselves. And very few people are aware of this situation.

phys.org produced an article: "Are young children prone to suicide? Signs to watch for"

The message is clear:

"It isn't out of the blue that they decide to kill themselves," Dr. Fritz said. "If a parent sees their child withdrawing or being unhappy a lot of the time, being depressed, changing the way they act with friends, they should be concerned about that.

"Now, every kid will be moody, sad, mad at the world," he said. "But usually those feelings are more transient. If it lasts for several weeks, that's much worse than being mad for the day."

None of those signs necessarily point to suicide. But parents should consult a professional if the moods persist, the doctors said.

And if a child mentions suicide, take it seriously.

"I don't think most kids talk about suicide," Dr. Fritz said. "They don't say, 'I wish I was dead,' or 'I want to die' at any age. But if parents hear something like that, they should be worried.

"No parent wants to admit that a child is so unhappy that they mention suicide," he said. "They'll say, 'Oh, you don't mean that.'

"Well, they might."

[bolding and emphasis mine]

Underneath the spoiler tag I am placing random words related to this topic in hope this page will rank highly in the search engines.

Preteen suicide child-suicide depression six-year-old self-harm mental illness

This should not have happened. Not this time. Not all the other times it has occurred. Not again.

[Maggie Mae]

My point was that you can't just admit anyone to an intensive mental health facility. The first question is always "where is your insurance." The foster family should have taken her in for more evaluation or whatever, but it's not like people of all ages don't let medical stuff, especially mentally illness related conditions, slide because of cost.

[bluebird]

For a suicidal 6 yr. Old in foster care there is always a way to get them the treatment they need. No one pursued it or pursued it properly. There is a system out there that could have saved that child's life but the system she was in failed her, she fell through the cracks.

[Burris]

My point was that you can't just admit anyone to an intensive mental health facility. The first question is always "where is your insurance." The foster family should have taken her in for more evaluation or whatever, but it's not like people of all ages don't let medical stuff, especially mentally illness related conditions, slide because of cost.

Doesn't matter. Yes, many places would ask for insurance but I cannot imagine they couldn't have found a competent child psychiatrist who would take on this situation either at a reduced fee or free of charge.

ETA: And as for her falling through the cracks - in that system, there are more cracks than there is any solid ground at all. It seems like somehow damned near everyone manages to fall through the cracks.

[Burris]

"Heartbreaking: 6-Year-Old Found Hungry, Wandering in Pittsburgh Neighborhood"

[Coco]

Doesn't matter. Yes, many places would ask for insurance but I cannot imagine they couldn't have found a competent child psychiatrist who would take on this situation either at a reduced fee or free of charge.

ETA: And as for her falling through the cracks - in that system, there are more cracks than there is any solid ground at all. It seems like somehow damned near everyone manages to fall through the cracks.

I wonder if she had a CASA advocate.

Surely she was on medicaid. My children have been on medicaid in the past, and it is very easy to use. It's just a card you show. There are no copays and very little waiting time. I've done doctors' visits, a dentist appointment, and one ER trip using medicaid cards and it was super easy. Someone could have helped this baby. The system would have paid for it.

I hope this story causes thousands of concerned caring people to sign up to foster. It's the most difficult but most important thing there is to do.

[Deist woman]

I accept that children as young as this may commit suicide. But this explanation should be reached only after exhaustive investigation, and a complete autopsy. I would guess that there are more murders made to look like suicide, than actual suicide, at this age. Again, suicide is not impossible, but the burden of proof should be very high.

[Burris]

I accept that children as young as this may commit suicide. But this explanation should be reached only after exhaustive investigation, and a complete autopsy. I would guess that there are more murders made to look like suicide, than actual suicide, at this age. Again, suicide is not impossible, but the burden of proof should be very high.

Coroner said not foul play - unless callous stupidity counts.

[Coco]

Coroner said not foul play - unless callous stupidity counts.

It should, imho. People need to know that they can be held accountable for the children in their care. Neglect is neglect.

[DGayle]

My point was that you can't just admit anyone to an intensive mental health facility. The first question is always "where is your insurance." The foster family should have taken her in for more evaluation or whatever, but it's not like people of all ages don't let medical stuff, especially mentally illness related conditions, slide because of cost.

If a patient is a social worker, THE STATE IS THE INSURANCE. Kids in foster care have access to EVERYTHING, if only the social worker and/or foster parents are willing to bring it up. When it's a child in foster care, insurance coverage is literally a blank check. EVERYTHING MUST be covered without regard to cost. Have you EVER heard of a foster care denied health care from a legitimate facility because of not having private insurance? Absolutely not. Foster kids are guaranteed payment. Facilities like guaranteed payments.

She had access to help, but the adults in charge of her fucked up BIG time, and should be thrown in the stand, then in jail.

[DGayle]

It should, imho. People need to know that they can be held accountable for the children in their care. Neglect is neglect.

Homicide with the method being neglect until the victim kills themselves is still suicide, and it's even worse because of what pushed the victim into it. So even if someone else didn't wrap the rope around her neck, the adults killed her. The hands that did it just happened to be hers.