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How many kids are too many?


rodgerdodger

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I have two and that is enough for us financially. I would love to have had one more but couldn't afford to.

My hubby has a cousin who has seven (22 oldest to 8 youngest). Number 5, 6 and 7 were all birth control failures. She ended up begging to have her tubes tied at 32. She loves them all, knows and pays attention to them all, but they live in an very unsafe area to be able to afford it. Her kids cannot go outside and play, even in the yard, and were quite surprised one time they visited us and my daughter suggested the younger ones and her go out to play.

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We have two, I came from two and my husband had 4 siblings. Two was always enough for us, financially and able to give them each appropriate attention. Even if people have plenty of money it takes more than that to raise children properly. Both of our kids have three children and they feel the squeeze but wouldn't have it any other way. It is up to each couple to decide but I feel like the Duggars are insane confusing over fertility with God's blessing. I just wish the offspring would think for themselves and not copy this lifestyle. It reminds me of cats breeding, it starts with two then there is a hundred, just not a good idea.

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I worry a lot about population growth, and the maximum number I feel comfortable having for myself is one, and even that one sometimes feels like too many, when there are so many children already birthed, in need of loving parents and care.

I wonder how many kids most people would have if for every child a couple gave birth to, they were then responsible for one child who needed a home. I suspect there would be a huge number of only children.

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1 is too many for me personally. I don't have any, but kids seem like they suck. I will give myself plenty of me time by never having one. I don't get what they add to one's life besides annoyance. I'm being serious and not snarky. All I ever hear is you don't sleep, forget date nights, you'll die just to have a shower, marriages fall apart, your house will be a mess, etc. Sounds awful. *shrugs*

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When you can't afford them and have to have your own children raise them. My grandma had 22 kids, but that was wayyyy back then when woman couldn't go to school or work. So she married the first man she saw to get out of the house. Now I can't imagine people having that many kids since everything is expensive. Unless you have a really good job and income. I know couples with large families but most of their kids are from foster care. There was a gay couple at church who adopted 12 kids from foster care and both husbands have degrees and make good income. I personally wouldn't want a whole bunch of kids knowing that they would have to suffer for my actions. I am a foster parent and adopted two and foster around 14. I also have kids of my own, but I'm willing to foster and adopt more since I do have the room but it's better not to bite off more than I can chew

Now who does that remind me of? :lol:

I have to admit, I'm a bit shocked and amazed by some of the numbers in this thread :shock:

22 children, holy fuck. But to an only child like me, even 8 or 6 or 4 sounds like sooo much work. I know four families with 3 children each, and that's it. I don't think having many children is common here in Germany at all. What's funny is that I have also noticed that with pets. Where an American says he has 4 dogs and 3 cats, I feel here people mostly have only one or two of each.

Really? I'm surprised. I'm one of four and, while my family's always been on the larger side of average, quite a few of my peers (both in Canada and in the UK) come from families with three, four, even five kids. Then again, I'm in my mid-twenties now, so I suppose I'm approaching the generation that are having kids rather than the generation that *are* the kids, so we'll see what my peers are doing when they start childbearing.

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1 is too many for me personally. I don't have any, but kids seem like they suck. I will give myself plenty of me time by never having one. I don't get what they add to one's life besides annoyance. I'm being serious and not snarky. All I ever hear is you don't sleep, forget date nights, you'll die just to have a shower, marriages fall apart, your house will be a mess, etc. Sounds awful. *shrugs*

I love the two i have, they are my whole world right now, i wish i could be strong enough to have more, but i have to agree that kids are really difficult. :D It is WAY more work and struggle than any blogs or commercials or even most parents will have you believe. Plus add in the possibility of postpartum depression or other struggles like behavior needs or dietary issues on the kid side... whew. Sometimes it's the most amazing, beautiful, wonderful thing, but usually it's just drudgery. At least, the early years. We're still at the 'crayon marks on all the furniture' stage. (no matter how hard you try to hide the damn crayons after coloring time is over, they will FIND THEM; broken crayons multiply) and I haven't gotten into the preteen or teen years yet.

i think they should make a toy doll set for little girls with backache simulator, dark undereye circle make up, an alarm that goes off at random times with a complicated shutoff, and a cd with 12 kinds of crying to decipher (and a packet of warm fuzzies and sweet baby smell lotion). :lol: That would not be flying off the toy store shelves but it's kind of real.

post-10046-1445199971142_thumb.jpg

and then they waddle up and give you a sweet hug, start saying whole sentences in baby gibberish or you get to see them do something amazing and it's worth it all. But jeez it's a high price. I'm sad my kids won't have more siblings to fight with and all that, but at least they'll have time for friends to make up for it, and a happier mommy.

justsomething.co/23-hilarious-struggles-only-parents-will-understand/

i'm just glad my hubby isn't forcing us to stay in a cult where kids are just a number, and other moms like me with a really low stress tolerance have to live in turmoil: going through pregnancies without much recovery time, and trying to raise more kids than they can manage.

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Really? I'm surprised. I'm one of four and, while my family's always been on the larger side of average, quite a few of my peers (both in Canada and in the UK) come from families with three, four, even five kids. Then again, I'm in my mid-twenties now, so I suppose I'm approaching the generation that are having kids rather than the generation that *are* the kids, so we'll see what my peers are doing when they start childbearing.

I agree with nellautumngirl. I'm also from Germany, and have generally made the same experiences. Growing up, I was friends with a girl and a boy from a family with five kids, but that was SO weird. They really were the odd ones out. My parents were also friends with a couple with four kids, but they always felt the need to explain that they didn't plan to have four. Three was their maximum (the last two are twins).

Apart from these two exceptions, three is the absolute maximum of what I know here in Germany, and two is definitely the standard. There are also way more families with an only child than with three. Come to think of it, one child is probably closer to the standard these days. Yes, our birth rate is THAT low. Definitely nobody talking about overpopulation in these parts!! :lol:

I would attribute it to a pretty high rate of secularization pretty early on. Definitely almost no fundamentalists. I don't even know any Catholics who oppose birth control. And also, we just don't have as much space, so I think it was obvious quite early on that limiting family size is a good idea. There really isn't anywhere here where you can just buy a huge plot of land for spare change and build a house for your family.

So yeah. These days, the government is really busy trying to get Germans to have more kids. :popcorn2:

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When I was a kid of about 7, my friend was the fourth child of five and I thought that was on par with how I see the Duggars today. I just had one sister. Then when I was a teenager, my mom went on to have loads more in fairly quick succession (seven kids in total, but the 7th was stillborn) and suddenly her family seemed small. I thought it was so cool having a large family and telling everyone that I had so many siblings, and secretly hoped we would reach 11 (amount of the biggest family in my home town) or maybe even the Duggars....or more! I had a thing for large families and all of the characters in stories I wrote would have insane amounts of kids (ranging from a fairly normal sized large family of 6-8 kids, to one with 40 kids under 18, including loads of triplets and quadruplets).

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I agree with nellautumngirl. I'm also from Germany, and have generally made the same experiences. Growing up, I was friends with a girl and a boy from a family with five kids, but that was SO weird. They really were the odd ones out. My parents were also friends with a couple with four kids, but they always felt the need to explain that they didn't plan to have four. Three was their maximum (the last two are twins).

Apart from these two exceptions, three is the absolute maximum of what I know here in Germany, and two is definitely the standard. There are also way more families with an only child than with three. Come to think of it, one child is probably closer to the standard these days. Yes, our birth rate is THAT low. Definitely nobody talking about overpopulation in these parts!! :lol:

I would attribute it to a pretty high rate of secularization pretty early on. Definitely almost no fundamentalists. I don't even know any Catholics who oppose birth control. And also, we just don't have as much space, so I think it was obvious quite early on that limiting family size is a good idea. There really isn't anywhere here where you can just buy a huge plot of land for spare change and build a house for your family.

So yeah. These days, the government is really busy trying to get Germans to have more kids. :popcorn2:

Funny how it's so different here in the UK (Canada obviously doesn't have the same space issues :P). Then again, both the leader of UKIP and the PM like to harp on about free movement within the EU because "We're a small island", yet both men have four kids each, so there seems to be a bit of cognitive dissonance (or racism) going on.

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If you don't want children, please don't have them. Having unwanted children is so unfair to them. I got plenty of sleep, date night, me time and enough money to live our lives, so no hardship for us. I now have two adult "children" that are my really good friends and could not be any happier about it.You don't have to raise them forever. Do your own thing and celebrate the fact that you can make that choice.

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Obviously it depends on the individuals/parents, but for a typical middle-class family, any number over 6 is too many. If you need to buy a special vehicle to fit the whole family, you've gone too far. You could reasonably fit 8 people into a 4 bedroom house, but beyond that you're pushing it.

The kids as a whole will miss a lot of opportunities if there are so many of them. Unless the grandparents are really involved, there's no way two parents can send 6 kids to college or keep track of 6 kids' sports teams and activities. And I really think beyond 6 there is too much pressure on the older ones to set a good example and help out, when they should be enjoying their own childhood.

I remember watching an episode where Michelle announced she was pregnant again (can't remember which kid, maybe Jordyn) and the look on Jana's face said it all - she actually looked surprised like wtf another one?!

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Also voting "it depends on the family".

I'm the middle of three; each parent is oldest of three; my sister has three. I'm not interested in having children at all, ever, so for me, one kid would be too many. And I know a woman who had ten and now has 20+ grandkids and a few great-grandkids, and she has been able to parent/granny each of them effectively.

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My grandparents had seven children. My grandfather was a dentist who made some good investments in the stock market and they lived very comfortably. Although their house was only four bedrooms they were large bedrooms. They also didn't ever have seven children all at home or at least not for long because the youngest was born 18 years after the first one. All their children attended college along with Catholic school. However most of their children were born in the 1950s so things were a little different then today. While I know my youngest uncle played Football in high school I doubt they dealt with the number of extracurricular activities that are considered commonplace for elementary school age children. Plus they could afford for a nanny to help out when my grandmother had so many little ones. The first four children were born in that many years. My grandmother also LOVED children. She watched me while my parents worked and refused to accept anything in exchange for doing it. Still my aunt mentioned that at one point that my grandmother said she wished that she hadn't had quite so many children so she could have given them more individualized attention.

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As others have said, it depends on the family and their situation. There was four kids in my family, my parents struggled in their early years. I'm the youngest and there is an age gap between me and my three older siblings. By the time I was 10, they were out of the house and at college or starting their careers. My parents' incomes allowed them to help out us out a bit with college tuition and cars after high school graduation. If my parents had more kids, things would have been different.

I have a childhood friend who grew up in a family of 7 kids. Both of his parents worked and the house they lived in was in inheritance from a grandparent. His parents stopped in part because the mom was having health problems during the pregnancy of the youngest kid.

With large families both fundie and non fundie, there a lot of things to take into account today. I have seen some families that really can't afford to have that many kids and others that can afford it. With some large Mormon families, I've seen some bloggers whose husbands make a lot of money and they can afford to live on one income. Then I've seen some Mormon bloggers who struggle quite a bit because their husbands don't make a lot of money. It is the same with Protestant and Catholic fundie families, there are some that can afford it and others that can't.

Other things need to be taken into account like cost of living in different areas. I have friends and relatives that live in expensive areas and they have limited their family size to 1 or 2 kids.

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I think you should have as many kids as you want/can afford/ can maintain sanity around/ can give a decent life. The human race would die out if each couple only had 2 kids each, so I commend those who venture into the territory of 3 or more.

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If you don't want children, please don't have them. Having unwanted children is so unfair to them. I got plenty of sleep, date night, me time and enough money to live our lives, so no hardship for us. I now have two adult "children" that are my really good friends and could not be any happier about it.You don't have to raise them forever. Do your own thing and celebrate the fact that you can make that choice.

I so agree. I'm sick and tired of seeing kids abused and neglected because their parents never wanted to be parents in the first place. I would rather people know they don't want to parent not have kids or abort than to have kids and their kids have to suffer

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If you don't want children, please don't have them. Having unwanted children is so unfair to them. I got plenty of sleep, date night, me time and enough money to live our lives, so no hardship for us. I now have two adult "children" that are my really good friends and could not be any happier about it.You don't have to raise them forever. Do your own thing and celebrate the fact that you can make that choice.

This is why it bugs me when people tell me I'm selfish for not having kids, as though it would somehow be less selfish to bring a dependent infant into the world that I'm not emotionally equipped to care for by virtue of not wanting it.

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For me one kid is too many. I am not mommy material.

Me neither, I mother my three cats. Less expensive and less mouthy.

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I so agree. I'm sick and tired of seeing kids abused and neglected because their parents never wanted to be parents in the first place. I would rather people know they don't want to parent not have kids or abort than to have kids and their kids have to suffer

I do completely wholeheartedly agree that if someone doesn't want children, they should not have them. They should not be made to feel apologetic or 'less than."

I don't agree too much that children are abused or neglected because their parents never wanted them. If we are going to say that all spanking is abuse, then there are loads of abusive parents who do want their children, they just think spanking is an acceptable form of parental discipline.

People who don't want their children and never wanted to have children would be likely candidates for abuse and neglect, I feel that is obvious. But if it is being said that all abused and neglected children are because the parents didn't want them, that's the part I don't agree with.

I think wanted children are probably abused more than unwanted children, and one reason is that birth control is widely available and abortion is legal.

I saw Freakonomics back in Oct. I'm not gonna be quick to believe the crime rate is down because abortion became legal... the reasoning being that unwanted children are being aborted rather than birthed and then abused/neglected which pushes them to criminal behavior.

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I thought I saw, on the show, JB say it was always up to Michelle if they had more kids.

It has always been my impression, perhaps erroneously, that Michelle was the real ATI instigator.

I am thinking the bolded is true more and more. I think Michelle has a nasty case of baby rabies, and he just left it up to her to decide how many children they had. Jim bob's fault lies mainly in the fact that he let her carry on like this without thinking how it would affect Michelle's mental and physical health over time.

There's also an article I found where Michelle is the one to insist that, although her girls are "real go-getters" who could support themselves, her plans for them include becoming wives and mothers.

Interestingly, Jim Bob says in the comment right before Michelle's that he actually wants his daughters to be able to work and support themselves if they ever had to. Michelle states that her daughters are hard working and COULD support themselves if they had to, but insists that they would rather be wives and mothers instead. Kind of like how Jinger doesn't want to move to the city at all, she just wants to be closer to a Wal-Mart. :roll:

If there's any truth to this article and it's not a fabrication, then for me, it really puts the issue to bed about whether or not Michelle is the one pushing for the ATI lifestyle. Seems to me that Jim Bob wouldn't care if his daughters moved out and supported themselves as long as they lived with other conservative Christians and didn't fool around with guys or dressed immodestly.

www.popsugar.com/moms/Interview-Michell ... II-2727153

Remember everyone, it's Michelle's world - we all just live in it.

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Part of my answer won't be popular. I don't care.

Are you already able to support the ones you have? Or do you have to rely on a bunch of social services to feed the ones you have? I do not believe it is responsible to intentionally conceive more when you already have so little that you qualify for aid. The shitty pay of so many jobs is a different topic (I support raising the minimum), but he effect is the same. If you're in poverty, it's selfish to expect the children you do have to share what little they get with another mouth.

.

Yeah, as long as you don't find it remotely classist, elitist or racist that about a quarter of families wouldn't be able to have children, at all, because their perfectly respectable jobs - that YOU rely on- don't pay enough for them to get by without things like Medicaid or WIC or Section 8 :roll: of course, not having children will allow them more time to pick that fruit and shuffle that paper and ring up your purchases and watch Your kids-so it's all good. Right?

Anyway. I think it's really hard for most people to know in advance how many kids they can handle. If you are feeling stretched to your limit, but managing, with 2, you'll probably know not to have another. But if you are managing well with two but having baby cravings -- you might not know that 3 is what will put you over the brink. Or babies one and two might be easy, adaptable children -- while 3 is a terror, and you discover you don't cope quite as well with a terror as you did with the first two angels. Or even that 1 and 2 are loud, raucous, sporty, high-energy, competitive, ambitious extroverts who completely match your family personality and lifestyle -- but number 3 is a quiet, shy, clumsy, introverted bookworm who won't get off the couch and go outside to save their life. Or vice versa. And it could be child number 2 or 3 or 6 or 10 that tips you over the edge.

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I am in the concern with over population of the planet so my short answer is replace your self only.

The longer is more like no family should exceed the number of children for which they have adequate time, love, room and resources to rear and educate.

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Me neither, I mother my three cats. Less expensive and less mouthy.

I have one kitten and she's enough for now. I'll probably adopt another cat (once I finish grad school and move; my roommate would be okay with this, but HIS cat would lose his kitty mind if ANOTHER cat showed up in HIS house). And maybe a dog. That appeals to me MUCH more than human children.

Besides, the two big things I'm trying to keep Tessie (the kitten) from doing are bothering the plants and biting (me, mostly). She was spayed before I brought her home, and her foster mom made sure she was litter trained and sociable. And right now she's chasing her tail, because she's a loon.

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In past generations, when larger families were more common, I think parenting styles were different. Parents of today, have a strong belief that children need a lot more attention than parents in the past would have felt. Kids were not chauffeured around to a million different activities, or enrolled in Mommy and me, Gymboree, Kindermusic classes. The entire schedule of the family Did Not revolve around the kids.

Kids would walk to and from school, Play outside, do chores, do their homework etc. If the family watched TV, the shows were what Mom and Dad wanted to watch, not the Disney Channel or Nickelodeon. Kids TV was usually reserved for Saturday morning Cartoons, but other than that the grown-ups controlled the TV.

Kids might be in a sport, but usually that sport was through the school. Kids were not started in football, basketball etc when they were about 5 years old, in hopes of turning out the next Tom Brady, etc. They went to school, joined the school team and did a reasonable amount of practicing and went home, still did their chores and their homework.

In today's world, most family's schedules are based on their kid's schedules. Families are much more child-centered than in the past.

For families with lots of kids, I think most parents felt good about their parenting, if the kids were safe, warm, well-fed, educated, and socialized enough to be work together, get along, and work out differences. I just don't think parents of the past generations, sat around and stewed if their children had all of their emotional needs met at every moment of the day.

I am not making a value judgment on which style is best, and in truth, probably a balance between the two styles is a good goal to aim for.

I pretty much believe in reproductive freedom for women. While I don't personally like the idea of abortion, I support a woman's right to choose. I support access to and education about birth control and family planning, and I strongly believe as country, that we need to have laws and programs that work to improve our educational system, that prevent child hunger and homelessness, that end child abuse, etc.

As a supporter of reproductive freedom, then in principle, I don't feel like we need to be prescriptive about how many children individual families should have. I do feel, however, that education on family planning, Not just the birth control portions, but also caring, growing, paying for and understanding the impact of large on the environment, etc should be available. Having a very large family has some repercussions outside of just the family. People should also be given realistic information on the amount of work and money it takes to raise children in today's world. It can be absolutely the best experience in the world, but it isn't easy.

My oldest was an easy kid, she slept through the night, breast-fed like a champ, would sit quietly for hours with just a book or crayons to occupy her, rarely had tantrums, etc, and there were some really tough days. My youngest was definitely a handful, and I was exhausted by him, but there were so many moments of absolute Joy and intense love mingled into the chaos, that always outweighed the hard parts. But as I was over 30 when I started having kids, and I had cancer in between my 2, my husband and I were never in doubt that 2 was enough. Once in awhile, I would have a desire for one more baby, but I never had the desire for one more 2 year old, or one more kid to potty train ( both my kids were really tough for this) or one more kid to have to go to parent-teacher conferences for, etc.

And once my kids progressed from one stage to the next, I never really looked back and wished to repeat it. I had friends who were traumatized when their youngest went to kindergarten, or entered high school. I always was so excited for the next phase that saying goodbye to the previous one was not a problem for me.

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