Laura Munck is pregnant with twins

[freethemall]

I thought at first this was a post about the daughter, Amanda. Then I saw about Susanna wearing the big sister shirt....ugh I thought she was done with filling her quiver!

[Lemchop]

Though I definitely don't think it's responsible of them to keep having kids, I don't feel the same rage that I feel when I think about most other fundies bringing more children into the world. She not only loves her kids, but she seems to genuinely enjoy spending time with them, and she appreciates them as individuals (as much as parents with so many children can). The fact that she writes posts for Down's Syndrome awareness month without an obvious pro-life agenda... I don't know, there's just something about the Muncks that makes me say "you do you."

[Arete]

Elizabeth is the teacher for her brother with Down's Syndrome. They don't send him to a public school which has the resources to maximize his education. They assigned one of their home school educated older daughters the responsibility of educating her special needs brother. Sorry, these people are not fundie lite. They are full on fundies who will deny their son the best education possible and dump his future on his older sister's shoulders in order to "shelter" him. Because fear of worldly contamination trumps their son's best interests.

[16strong]

The Muncks are weird. They appear "normal"-ish on the outside, and the crazy doesn't really shine through with them, but I have to wonder how much of that is because they know how to hide it better than other fundie families?

They don't really affiliate themselves with any large group (at least not anymore) like ATI, so it makes it harder to connect them to a specific set of cult beliefs.

However, the daughters rarely wear pants, none of the kids have gone to college, they live out in the boonies, and they don't let the adult kids move out until marriage. To my knowledge, Mama Munck has never addressed these things. Convenient, huh?

And then all you're left with is the images of Disney birthday parties, Christmas trees, and the occasional pants-clad little girl. I'm not sure any of these things mean much to me. Call me when their posts use detail rather than obfuscation to describe the way they live.

It seems to me they are fundie as fundie has ever been, just without a cult to fill us in on the full scope of their beliefs.

[Marianne]

I always think that working with dogs make them no-spanking fundies. I mean, if they see that you don't need to hit to train your dog, why not the same for children ?

[WonderingInWA]

I'm a little surprised she's pregnant again, too. I mean, she's about to become a grandma! And she changed the name of her blog awhile ago to reflect their new lifestyle (or so I thought) and removed the word "Quiverfull" from the title. I just hope she has a healthy pregnancy -- no Zsu drama, please! Her kids are all cute, especially the girls. Good thing Liz is still around to help.

[Pretzel]

Some people have a soft spot for the Muncks- something I can't quite share. They're still fundies. Yes, they're not as emotionally stunted as most other fundies and they have a regard for their kids' feelings and know how to spell the word fun. But just looking at Mama Munck's terrible writing makes me cringe. Thinking that she homeschools all those kids makes me shudder. I am not a native speaker, nor do I live in an English speaking country and I deem my writing to be better than Mother Munck's. :think: They have a special needs child, one who is probably much more special needs than Josie Duggar, and they only have him assigned to his older sister as a special needs caregiver. Just like Jchelle did with Josie and Jana, yet nobody does cut her any slack. :cray-cray:

Hope she has a safe pregnancy, though.

[daisyjane1234]

Elizabeth is the teacher for her brother with Down's Syndrome. They don't send him to a public school which has the resources to maximize his education. They assigned one of their home school educated older daughters the responsibility of educating her special needs brother. Sorry, these people are not fundie lite. They are full on fundies who will deny their son the best education possible and dump his future on his older sister's shoulders in order to "shelter" him. Because fear of worldly contamination trumps their son's best interests.

Coming out of my mostly lurking state to jump in here.

I have some difficulty with this post. I am the parent of a child with significant disabilities, including a fairly severe developmental disability. My son is in a special needs class with several children with Down Syndrome. Perhaps it is different in the States, but in many parts of Canada special ed classes tend to continue to be a public form of warehousing people with disabilities. On several occasions we have considered pulling my son from school and homeschooling (and we are not homeschoolers) simply because I believe that my son might better reach his potential in an environment other than the public spec classroom where they fold pizza boxes and play Uno all day. We have kept him in school primarily because it meets his social needs, not his educational needs. And social needs are important. The upshot, I am sure there are wonderfully stimulating classes for kids with special needs with phenomenal teachers. But it is still very common for spec ed classes to be a public form of warehousing people with disabilities.

I don't know the Munck family well at all. But for all their fundiness - and I agree, they're likeable, but fundy - they do seem like a loving, happy, busy home and their son's social needs may be largely met at home - bearing in mind that this family does not want their children "socialized" in the way we do. While I am not a fan of the SOTDRT I do think that, in this case, his potential is likely being supported and nurtured at home as well as it might be in a spec ed. class.

edited because I can't type

[Arete]

Coming out of my mostly lurking state to jump in here.

I have some difficulty with this post. I am the parent of a child with significant disabilities, including a fairly severe developmental disability. My son is in a special needs class with several children with Down Syndrome. Perhaps it is different in the States, but in many parts of Canada special ed classes tend to continue to be a public form of warehousing people with disabilities. On several occasions we have considered pulling my son from school and homeschooling (and we are not homeschoolers) simply because I believe that my son might better reach his potential in an environment other than the public spec classroom where they fold pizza boxes and play Uno all day. We have kept him in school primarily because it meets his social needs, not his educational needs. And social needs are important. The upshot, I am sure there are wonderfully stimulating classes for kids with special needs with phenomenal teachers. But it is still very common for spec ed classes to be a public form of warehousing people with disabilities.

I don't know the Munck family well at all. But for all their fundiness - and I agree, they're likeable, but fundy - they do seem like a loving, happy, busy home and their son's social needs may be largely met at home - bearing in mind that this family does not want their children "socialized" in the way we do. While I am not a fan of the SOTDRT I do think that, in this case, his potential is likely being supported and nurtured at home as well as it might be in a spec ed. class.

edited because I can't type

She cannot meet his educational needs at home. As a previous poster indicated, her writing is atrocious, and she is still "homeschooling". I doubt Liz has much of an education from her mother, yet she is expected to educate her special needs brother. Only interacting with your siblings does not meet your social needs either. It is a big reason the Maxwells are so stunted. She can't meet his educational needs (or the educational needs of any of her children), and whether she is meeting his social needs is also in question. All because keeping all their children sheltered is more important than providing them tools to grow.

[browncoatslytherin]

Coming out of my mostly lurking state to jump in here.

I have some difficulty with this post. I am the parent of a child with significant disabilities, including a fairly severe developmental disability. My son is in a special needs class with several children with Down Syndrome. Perhaps it is different in the States, but in many parts of Canada special ed classes tend to continue to be a public form of warehousing people with disabilities. On several occasions we have considered pulling my son from school and homeschooling (and we are not homeschoolers) simply because I believe that my son might better reach his potential in an environment other than the public spec classroom where they fold pizza boxes and play Uno all day. We have kept him in school primarily because it meets his social needs, not his educational needs. And social needs are important. The upshot, I am sure there are wonderfully stimulating classes for kids with special needs with phenomenal teachers. But it is still very common for spec ed classes to be a public form of warehousing people with disabilities.

I don't know the Munck family well at all. But for all their fundiness - and I agree, they're likeable, but fundy - they do seem like a loving, happy, busy home and their son's social needs may be largely met at home - bearing in mind that this family does not want their children "socialized" in the way we do. While I am not a fan of the SOTDRT I do think that, in this case, his potential is likely being supported and nurtured at home as well as it might be in a spec ed. class.

edited because I can't type

as far as special education in the states...it depends on the district you're in. if you're in a good district, they may have excellent resources that will really help your child reach their full potential. honestly, though, even a decent district with a specific special ed teacher would likely be better than one of the older girls homeschooling him as they are trained how to interact best with those with special needs and how to teach them and help them learn. it's not just playing uno or folding pizza boxes all day, any kind of "play" activity is built into learning to assist them.

they could have even gotten him started early with an early childhood special education program, many programs of which are available not only through districts but through community programs, making them more accessible to families outside of specific districts.

[Arete]

Having older siblings teach younger siblings is educational neglect, period. It doesn't matter whether the family doing it is named Duggar or Munck.

[16strong]

Some people have a soft spot for the Muncks- something I can't quite share. They're still fundies. Yes, they're not as emotionally stunted as most other fundies and they have a regard for their kids' feelings and know how to spell the word fun. But just looking at Mama Munck's terrible writing makes me cringe. Thinking that she homeschools all those kids makes me shudder. I am not a native speaker, nor do I live in an English speaking country and I deem my writing to be better than Mother Munck's. :think: They have a special needs child, one who is probably much more special needs than Josie Duggar, and they only have him assigned to his older sister as a special needs caregiver. Just like Jchelle did with Josie and Jana, yet nobody does cut her any slack. :cray-cray:

Hope she has a safe pregnancy, though.

For confirmation, your writing is indeed better than Mama Munck's (which is atrocious. She has NO BUSINESS homeschooling, and most certainly not a child with special needs).

[lilwriter85]

Elizabeth being Jonathan's teacher is only thing I dislike about the Muncks. I give Laura credit for writing posts regarding DS awareness. I might have missed it, but it seems that Jonathan isn't involved in any type of activity or organization for DS or people with disabilities. As previous posters have said, Elizabeth shouldn't be homeschooling Jonathan. Nowm there are some bad school districts in the U.S., but many special education teachers are trained to deal with various special needs. Also, many school districts have therapists come in to assist when needed. The therapists assist or consult special ed teachers on specific issues. My boyfriend's mom is a retired occupational therapist. She mostly worked with adults with physical disabilities. But she did take on some pro-bono consulting assignments with special needs children at schools and at non-profit organizations like Special Olympics and Easter Seals.

Now,, it could be possible that the Muncks could tap into resources from public schools for Jonathan. I haven't found anything on the Munch blog to suggest that they do that. So far, the postings that I've seen about Jonathan's early life, do not mention anything about early childhood education intervention. Maybe there were therapists and others assisting the Muncks in the early years, but the Muncks want to keep quiet about that. I follow the below blog, which is an Ohio woman's blog about her son who has DS. She is Catholic and pro-life. But, she is pretty open and honest about the difficulties and she talks a lot about the therapists and teachers involved with her son.

wilsway.blogspot.com/

[lilwriter85]

The Muncks are weird. They appear "normal"-ish on the outside, and the crazy doesn't really shine through with them, but I have to wonder how much of that is because they know how to hide it better than other fundie families?

They don't really affiliate themselves with any large group (at least not anymore) like ATI, so it makes it harder to connect them to a specific set of cult beliefs.

However, the daughters rarely wear pants, none of the kids have gone to college, they live out in the boonies, and they don't let the adult kids move out until marriage. To my knowledge, Mama Munck has never addressed these things. Convenient, huh?

And then all you're left with is the images of Disney birthday parties, Christmas trees, and the occasional pants-clad little girl. I'm not sure any of these things mean much to me. Call me when their posts use detail rather than obfuscation to describe the way they live.

It seems to me they are fundie as fundie has ever been, just without a cult to fill us in on the full scope of their beliefs.

They did affliate with VF for awhile. Arthur, Laura, and one of the younger girls went to VF conference a few years back. They meet Michelle Duggar at the conference. After the shit that went down with Doug, they are probably done with VF and ATI type organizations.

[singsingsing]

I don't actually like the Muncks that much. I don't necessarily dislike them, but there are plenty of things they do/believe that I disagree with, I don't think Laura is particularly bright and her kids would probably do better in an actual school with teachers who can spell, I don't have warm, fuzzy feelings about them. But they're all right. I'd much rather see twins born to Laura Munck than to Esther Schrader, or any of the Maxwells, or the Pearls, or - etc. etc.

[JemimaPuddle-Duck]

Can anyone direct me to a post/posts that show Elizabeth is SOLELY responsible for Johnathan's education? I've only seen it discussed here.

I, too, wonder whether he receives any kind of therapy/intervention. I know he has a lot of medical needs, but has Laura ever mentioned to what extent his other disabilities reach? Do we really know how much their family is sheltered,or are we assuming based on the lack of blog-sharing?

Laura's writing IS truly awful; I actually cringe when I read her posts. That's not a good enough reason to condemn her homeschooling. Some people never properly learn writing skills. There are so many resources available that the children should have no problem getting that skill from their curriculum. I'd be willing to bet she knows she isn't a great writer. I took advanced English classes and I'm still a terrible writer. Partly because I don't get enough practice, partly because I just can't seem to put my thoughts to paper in a way that sounds good. As I know I'm lacking in this department, I'm striving to make sure my children will be better than I am. I think it's more important that she speaks well, but who knows? Maybe she makes up for her poor writing by being a math whiz? ;-)

[lilwriter85]

I don't actually like the Muncks that much. I don't necessarily dislike them, but there are plenty of things they do/believe that I disagree with, I don't think Laura is particularly bright and her kids would probably do better in an actual school with teachers who can spell, I don't have warm, fuzzy feelings about them. But they're all right. I'd much rather see twins born to Laura Munck than to Esther Schrader, or any of the Maxwells, or the Pearls, or - etc. etc.

I agree with this.

[lilwriter85]

Can anyone direct me to a post/posts that show Elizabeth is SOLELY responsible for Johnathan's education? I've only seen it discussed here.

I, too, wonder whether he receives any kind of therapy/intervention. I know he has a lot of medical needs, but has Laura ever mentioned to what extent his other disabilities reach? Do we really know how much their family is sheltered,or are we assuming based on the lack of blog-sharing?

Laura's writing IS truly awful; I actually cringe when I read her posts. That's not a good enough reason to condemn her homeschooling. Some people never properly learn writing skills. There are so many resources available that the children should have no problem getting that skill from their curriculum. I'd be willing to bet she knows she isn't a great writer. I took advanced English classes and I'm still a terrible writer. Partly because I don't get enough practice, partly because I just can't seem to put my thoughts to paper in a way that sounds good. As I know I'm lacking in this department, I'm striving to make sure my children will be better than I am. I think it's more important that she speaks well, but who knows? Maybe she makes up for her poor writing by being a math whiz? ;-)

I'll try to find the posts that mention Elizabeth being Jonathan's teacher. It was brought up early on, when FJ was discussing the Elizabeth/Joseph Maxwell engagement. Laura, like you mentioned, has talked about the physical problems related to Jonathan's disability. There have been the posts about talking him to specialized doctors and his issues that require a CPAP. As I mentioned before, there is no mention of therapists or counselors on the blog. I still think that is possible they are keeping quiet on the blog about certain things. I do get the feeling that Muncks keep their children a bit sheltered. But I don't think they are as bad as the Maxwells.

I also agree, with what you said regarding Laura's writing skills. There are many people that are bad at writing, but they are very good at other subjects.

[Georgiana]

I'll try to find the posts about that mention Elizabeth being Jonathan's teacher. It was brought up early on, when FJ was discussing the Elizabeth/Joseph Maxwell engagement. Laura, like you mentioned, has talked about the physical problems related to Jonathan's disability. There have been the posts about talking him to specialized doctors and his issues that require a CPAP. As I mentioned before, there is no mention of therapists or counselors on the blog. I still think that is possible they are keeping quiet on the blog about certain things. I do get the feeling that Muncks keep their children a bit sheltered. But I don't think they are as bad as the Maxwells.

I also agree, with what you said regarding Laura's writing skills. There are many people that are bad at writing, but they are very good at other subjects.

Yes, but those people don't usually teach writing or have jobs where writing is important.

Even if she's good at 90% of the subjects, if she's not qualified to teach one and she insists on teaching it anyway, then she does her kids a disservice in their education.

[Eponine]

Yes, but those people don't usually teach writing or have jobs where writing is important.

Even if she's good at 90% of the subjects, if she's not qualified to teach one and she insists on teaching it anyway, then she does her kids a disservice in their education.

+1

Mama Munck has absolutely no business teaching English/writing, regardless of how good she might be at other subjects. Homeschooling parents have a responsibility to make sure they have adequate methods of teaching subjects they themselves are not good at; if they are terrible writers they should bring in someone else (not another child) to help out or make sure to improve their skills and understanding before teaching it. Her competency in other subjects is irrelevant to how well Mama Munck can teach writing and English.

[Jana814]

I agree with this.

Me Too!

[SassyPants]

Twins!

Announced on their new blog.

[SassyPants]

Are expecting twins! Just announced on their new blog

[Hane]

I'm more concerned that a woman who can barely write a grammatically correct sentence is homeschooling all her kids.

(You can't kill us old English teachers--no matter how hard you try.)

[Idolatry]

42 and twins makes me think fertility drugs right off the bat. But maybe she's just super fertile and super blessed.