The wedding ties

[CorruptionInc.]

I wondered if she knew that knits should be sewn with a double or twin needle. She may not have known to even look on Pinterest for a tutorial on how to do that.

Does Jana have Pinterest? Or is she not allowed to have it until she's engaged?

[FreeHannie!]

yeah, it was really depressing when Anna said, "so like, has this been your life for the last two months...?" poor Jana. I think the producers were trying to make a point.

Yeah. At risk of being accused of Anna being one of my 'pet fundies', I actually believe she would have picked up a needle and helped.

I thought it was telling how at first Anna was like 'it's so nice to just arrive and have my dress ready' and then after a bit of chatting, she realised exactly what poor Jana had been doing for weeks and her reaction quickly changed to being horrified.

[grandmadugger]

Does Jana have Pinterest? Or is she not allowed to have it until she's engaged?

I thought someone had posted her pinterest. I think this is supposed to be her http://www.pinterest.com/jannynal/

Edit to add: The last sewing pin was how to make a tie. :cry:

[Coffee Addict]

I thought there was an instagram picture or something of Jana in DC this summer with the family friend Jennifer. Maybe this was Anna's way of trying to help Jana out after the wedding. Get her out of the TTH for a bit.

Am I mistaken?

[Coco]

I thought someone had posted her pinterest. I think this is supposed to be her http://www.pinterest.com/jannynal/

Edit to add: The last sewing pin was how to make a tie. :cry:

She also pinned one on sewing tips for knits. :D But does she have a serger? seems like that would have been the easiest method... all around sucks though, poor Jana.

[circularlogic]

this is off topic but i just perused janas' pinterest and her quotes board is very telling. its worth a look for a glimpse into her mind. since we all speculate so much, i just had to take a peek.

[RosyDaisy]

My bridesmaids dresses were on sale for $20 and didn't need alterations.

[uber frau]

Yes, but you didn't have a gig on national television based on the premise being a super special Christian snowflake in the big,bad, heathen world.

[CorruptionInc.]

That pinteresting name.... :?

[Rescinded and Mended]

I think Anna would've also been upset with the girls for not helping Jana. When Anna said she would've helped if she lived closer, I bet she would have too.

Some fabrics are just crap to sew, even for the most advanced seamstress (i.e. my friend); there are just some fabrics that don't work! Also would've she known to have the right needles, tension, thread etc?

You bring up an interesting point. My theory has always been that Jana got landed with the crap job of making the dresses and ties because they wanted fodder for the show and because Jim Bob didn't want to spend more on them, but what about Jana's budget for the alterations? Did she have the budget she needed to go out and buy the right types of needles, bindings, maybe some fusible interfacing? I wonder just how closely Jim Bob was watching the dollars involved with financing the alterations. :think:

It's also true that many of the seams don't looks so great up close, which makes me wonder about how much time Jana actually had to work on the dresses. If she has a household to run and siblings to raise and homeschool, in addition to visiting with Josh and Anna and attending however many public appearances her parents wanted her there for, maybe she simply didn't have the time to make the stitching look better.

I can sew, and do it well, but most of my work isn't going to be done in a hurry - not if anyone wants it to look good. It might be the same with Jana. If she only had an hour a night to work for two months because her days were so full, that wouldn't be enough time to finish the dresses and ties - not by herself.

*cool life hack: if you're stitching a knit fabric hemline, and you don't have the right needles or interfacing hem tape, just layer scotch clear tape along the hemline. Stitch, then gently pull up.

[Ellimenopy]

this is off topic but i just perused janas' pinterest and her quotes board is very telling. its worth a look for a glimpse into her mind. since we all speculate so much, i just had to take a peek.

Dear Lord - if that is really her board, it is ultra sad. Somebody needs to rescue Jana before she kills herself.

[EmmieJ]

Jim Bob is incerdibly cheap - If having Jana make all those alterations and ties cost him even $50 less than buying the dresses and ties completed online, he'd have absolutely no problem enslaving Jana for the task.

This was the man who couldn't be bothered to shell out for proper wedding reception decorations and table coverings, and who was content to have everyone else make food and serve it at the wedding. :(

His biggest contribution was probably the damn powdered lemonade mix he sent his sons out to buy at Sam's. :roll:

And Michelle doesn't give a damn. I know a guy who is also incredibly cheap. In his instance, I think it may stem from the fact that his dad died when he was in high school, and he and his mom and younger sibling had some very lean times as his mom went back to college to finish her degree. Or maybe it's just a genetic component. But what saves him from cheaping out every time is his wife, who will push for the more costly, better version of something if she really wants it. He'll listen to her.

If Michelle were to push on behalf of even slightly more expensive better dresses for the bridesmaids, or nicer decorations for the reception, or for a caterer, JimBob would probably give in to make her happy. But since she doesn't care, she just lets him cheap out.

[SassyPants]

And Michelle doesn't give a damn. I know a guy who is also incredibly cheap. In his instance, I think it may stem from the fact that his dad died when he was in high school, and he and his mom and younger sibling had some very lean times as his mom went back to college to finish her degree. Or maybe it's just a genetic component. But what saves him from cheaping out every time is his wife, who will push for the more costly, better version of something if she really wants it. He'll listen to her.

If Michelle were to push on behalf of even slightly more expensive better dresses for the bridesmaids, or nicer decorations for the reception, or for a caterer, JimBob would probably give in to make her happy. But since she doesn't care, she just lets him cheap out.

What bothers me the most is that all of the money is JBs- theoretically, Jill, who has been working the family job for 10 years, should have some of her own money to spend. JB is cheap and greedy. He has filled his pocketbook off the work of his children. Without those kids, his bank acct is not quite so full....and he'd still be working HIS ass off to survive.

[EmmieJ]

... Either way, Jill was thoughtless and unbearably selfish.

The thought I can't get out of my head, though, is that I can't help but wonder if the whole thing was meant to teach Jana a lesson of some sort. To send a message to her. Something about contentment maybe? To reassert to her her place in the family, according to JB and Michelle. I wonder if Jana said or did some very small thing and was being punished. Of course they wouldn't call it punishment. They'd call it life lessons and Jana would be told to consider it "helping" her.

Re bolded part - yes she was.

I was thinking that CinderJana is being clearly shown her value as an unmarried, non-courting woman in Gothard society. It's extremely low because she's neither producing children, nor on the immediate path to producing children.

Jill feeling completely free to toss that crapload of work on her and expect Jana to feel honored, mirrors that viewpoint, which is why I have found Jill so unbearable this season.

[EmmieJ]

What bothers me the most is that all of the money is JBs- theoretically, Jill, who has been working the family job for 10 years, should have some of her own money to spend. JB is cheap and greedy. He has filled his pocketbook off the work of his children. Without those kids, his bank acct is not quite so full....and he'd still be working HIS ass off to survive.

Yes, this makes me grind my teeth. From the start, equal portions of the TLC money should have been set aside into a trust account for each kid, for their sole use when they reached a certain age. If not 18, then 21.

But if this wasn't done, at the very least once they turned 18, they should have their own TLC money for each show they film. It should not be given in a lump sum to JB, who doles it out if and when he sees fit.

If nothing else, I'd like to see some laws enacted that require that once a minor on a reality tv show turns 18, contracts have to be re-written and money funneled directly to that adult child. It's archaic that JB still gets paid all that money and none directly to even the adult children (except Josh and Anna).

[eh02]

Was Jana up in DC right after the wedding? Anna seemed pretty horrified that Jana was doing all of that work on her own. Like...to the point where it seemed like Anna had some things on her mind that she wouldn't say in front of the camera LOL. I wonder if she felt so bad for her that she tried to give her an escape trip to relax for a bit? Granted, living with 3 small kids under 5 wouldn't be a vacation for most, but it'd probably be one for Jana.

I don't know if I'm totally buying that Jill just dumped all the work on Jana and didn't give her a choice - Jill and Jana seem super close. But I can see all 4 older girls making a list of jobs and then everything magically just ending up on Jana's list of duties because Jinger and Jessa seem kind of incompetent compared to Jana and Jill.

Whatever is going on, there's some seriously weird energy in that family surrounding Jana. I hope she is OK.

[VelociRapture]

I'm going to play Devil's Advocate for a moment (mostly because it's fun, but also because I am genuinely curious about your opinions):

We already know that TLC and the Duggars make up story lines and move events around in the time line to suit their needs. It's already been pointed out by some that the dresses are the exact dresses sold at Sears and that the hangars used on the show didn't match the ones at the salon that they supposedly bought them from. It has also been pointed out that there was something odd about the sewing setup Jana had going on in that scene.

Taking all that into consideration, I want to know: how do we know for sure that Jana really did do all that sewing on her own in such a short period of time?

Isn't is possible that either:

A) Jana had help that wasn't filmed and/or

B) The alterations started to be done long before TLC and the Duggars make it seem.

I'm not trying to diminish what Jana has had to deal with her entire life or anything. I do feel sympathy for her. . . however, as a newcomer to this site (long time lurker), I do find it interesting that people question the show constantly about other things yet anything to do with Jana (or Jenny or Josiah) being treated poorly is taken at face value. Isn't is possible that TLC and Boob agreed to have this particular storyline in order to generate more interest?

There are only so many times a wedding can be the main focus of a season before even the biggest leghumper gets sick of it. What better way to generate media interest in the show than by singling out a daughter as a Cinderella figure? That way, when Jana does eventually start courting and marries, people are genuinely excited to see a "fairy tale" ending for her. . . and more people cheering for her means higher ratings and more money.

I could be completely and totally wrong, but I was curious about other people's opinions about this. Any thoughts?

(Side note: I was going to suggest that they had the dresses professionally altered, but many people who are far better sewers than I am have pointed out why that probably isn't the case).

[fabkiwi06]

Typically that's how it's done. Technically, underage minors can't legally enter in contracts.

The Coogan Law was enacted back in 30's to deal with this very issue. It's been reworked over the years and essentially does what you described. If you are a minor and filming you are protected. Now... I'm not sure how the Arkansas jurisdiction changes the percentage... but there is money put aside JUST for those kids. That's why you don't see a ton of footage of the Howlers and Lost Girls outside of the occasional talking heads (All filmed in one day - $100 per kid at most socked away). Full info on the law is here: http://www.sagaftra.org/content/coogan-law

The older ones would have to negotiate and sign their own contracts. I don't think they can directly funnel all the money in to Jim Bob's account. The kids would have to consciously sign it over.

The exception to this is IF they are just featured "extras" (which is what I think JD is doing since he's not regularly on). Then they just cut them a check per appearance - and it's at standard minimum wage hourly pay for the state. Having no info on how the Duggars have worked their legal options, I'm guessing JB and Michelle are contracts. The older girls and significant others are covered on contracts; Josh & Anna are on contracts, and the rest of the kids, Amy, and Gma Duggar are "extras".

We deal with this stuff a lot at my job. There are lots of ways to go around it, but it's 10 times more complicated for the production company to do all of them and they don't want to jump through that many hoops... so chances are the kids get their money, but it's probably not very much.

[CorruptionInc.]

Another strange chain of thought here...

MAYBE Boob, Mullet and TLC want Jana to be portrayed that way; hoping that the public would see that Jana is a valuable asset (because her parents can't parent) and that they should leave them alone about not having her court.

You never know?

[browncoatslytherin]

Another strange chain of thought here...

MAYBE Boob, Mullet and TLC want Jana to be portrayed that way; hoping that the public would see that Jana is a valuable asset (because her parents can't parent) and that they should leave them alone about not having her court.

You never know?

or perhaps they're showcasing her abilities so as to advertize her to potential suitors, in a way?

gods that sounds so horrible.

[Rescinded and Mended]

I'm going to play Devil's Advocate for a moment (mostly because it's fun, but also because I am genuinely curious about your opinions):

We already know that TLC and the Duggars make up story lines and move events around in the time line to suit their needs. It's already been pointed out by some that the dresses are the exact dresses sold at Sears and that the hangars used on the show didn't match the ones at the salon that they supposedly bought them from. It has also been pointed out that there was something odd about the sewing setup Jana had going on in that scene.

Taking all that into consideration, I want to know: how do we know for sure that Jana really did do all that sewing on her own in such a short period of time?

Isn't is possible that either:

A) Jana had help that wasn't filmed and/or

B) The alterations started to be done long before TLC and the Duggars make it seem.

I'm not trying to diminish what Jana has had to deal with her entire life or anything. I do feel sympathy for her. . . however, as a newcomer to this site (long time lurker), I do find it interesting that people question the show constantly about other things yet anything to do with Jana (or Jenny or Josiah) being treated poorly is taken at face value. Isn't is possible that TLC and Boob agreed to have this particular storyline in order to generate more interest?

There are only so many times a wedding can be the main focus of a season before even the biggest leghumper gets sick of it. What better way to generate media interest in the show than by singling out a daughter as a Cinderella figure? That way, when Jana does eventually start courting and marries, people are genuinely excited to see a "fairy tale" ending for her. . . and more people cheering for her means higher ratings and more money.

I could be completely and totally wrong, but I was curious about other people's opinions about this. Any thoughts?

(Side note: I was going to suggest that they had the dresses professionally altered, but many people who are far better sewers than I am have pointed out why that probably isn't the case).

VelociRapture, I think your logic is sound. The more I see of this show, the more I feel like so much of it is just ridiculously staged. Whenever I try to search for the facts in all things Duggar, I try to do two things: 1) I look for behaviors the occur repeatedly with certain family members on the show, and 2) I try to find outside media where they are quoted directly, such as in interviews.

I think that, in any other circumstances, I would agree that a lot of that was staged to make it look like Jana did all the work on the dresses, and that people could have easily helped finish them off-camera. But two things bother me. The first is that Jana actually complained multiple times about having to do the sewing, and I can't remember the last time Jana actually complained about anything on the show. She did once say she was having problems with certain members of the family in a brief interview, and that she needed to work on that. The other thing that bothers me is that by making Jana look like Cinderella, no one else in her family looks good by comparison. Not Jana's mother and grandmother, who could have helped with the sewing or influenced Jim Bob to get the alterations professionally done and paid for. Not any of her sisters (or brothers!), including Jill, who all could have helped in different ways with the alterations, whether in sewing or by prepping the work ahead of time. And certainly not Jim Bob, who could have paid for the alterations and taken some of the stress and burden of the dresses off of everyone's backs by being less cheap and more considerate.

So even if we assume that the Duggars are turning Jana into CinderJana as a plot point for the show, why on earth would they do something that makes the rest of them look so bad? Michelle was happy to claim that she and some of the oldest daughters handled the homeschooling until Heidi Query was caught instructing the kids - then they had to admit they weren't doing all the homeschooling on their own. The Duggars are nothing if not concerned about their images (even if they are sloppy in how they handle it at times).

It certainly is an interesting question. :think:

[OneFifthQuiverFull]

I think the CinderJana story line is on point because she isn't even trying to HIDE the fact that she is being mistreated - there is no "keeping sweet" in her THs. Also I think the inclusion of Anna's sympathy was on purpose by the crew.

I think in Ma and Pa Duggar's warped self-absorbed POV they think they are portraying Jana as a sweet helper, and showcasing how the sisters help each other (and underlining the importance of marriage and breeding). I think they thought we and the leghumpers would take away from that story line what a wonderful state of sacrificial love goes on in that house and that it would be one more way we'd see their superiority. The more-worldly film crew and editors saw the juicy potential, and played it up.

[VelociRapture]

VelociRapture, I think your logic is sound. The more I see of this show, the more I feel like so much of it is just ridiculously staged. Whenever I try to search for the facts in all things Duggar, I try to do two things: 1) I look for behaviors the occur repeatedly with certain family members on the show, and 2) I try to find outside media where they are quoted directly, such as in interviews.

I think that, in any other circumstances, I would agree that a lot of that was staged to make it look like Jana did all the work on the dresses, and that people could have easily helped finish them off-camera. But two things bother me. The first is that Jana actually complained multiple times about having to do the sewing, and I can't remember the last time Jana actually complained about anything on the show. She did once say she was having problems with certain members of the family in a brief interview, and that she needed to work on that. The other thing that bothers me is that by making Jana look like Cinderella, no one else in her family looks good by comparison. Not Jana's mother and grandmother, who could have helped with the sewing or influenced Jim Bob to get the alterations professionally done and paid for. Not any of her sisters (or brothers!), including Jill, who all could have helped in different ways with the alterations, whether in sewing or by prepping the work ahead of time. And certainly not Jim Bob, who could have paid for the alterations and taken some of the stress and burden of the dresses off of everyone's backs by being less cheap and more considerate.

So even if we assume that the Duggars are turning Jana into CinderJana as a plot point for the show, why on earth would they do something that makes the rest of them look so bad? Michelle was happy to claim that she and some of the oldest daughters handled the homeschooling until Heidi Query was caught instructing the kids - then they had to admit they weren't doing all the homeschooling on their own. The Duggars are nothing if not concerned about their images (even if they are sloppy in how they handle it at times).

It certainly is an interesting question. :think:

The only explanation for that I can think of is that they honestly don't think they will be viewed in a negative light. They might think that all the "Servant's heart" and "helping others" stuff is enough to explain why Jana is the one doing the alterations alone on camera - that people would honestly think that Jana had volunteered off camera to do all the work herself and they didn't realize that she was upset until later.

I do think you raised a pretty good point about that though. The Duggars do seem to be rather careful about their image most of the time. There are times when they've messed up - like Benessa's Abortion comments or Moochelle's robocall - but their core base of fans don't seem to be too bothered by that.

It's possible that the actual scene was staged, but that Jana was seriously upset about being asked to do the alterations in her TH (I'd be upset too).

[VelociRapture]

I think the CinderJana story line is on point because she isn't even trying to HIDE the fact that she is being mistreated - there is no "keeping sweet" in her THs. Also I think the inclusion of Anna's sympathy was on purpose by the crew.

I think in Ma and Pa Duggar's warped self-absorbed POV they think they are portraying Jana as a sweet helper, and showcasing how the sisters help each other (and underlining the importance of marriage and breeding). I think they thought we and the leghumpers would take away from that story line what a wonderful state of sacrificial love goes on in that house and that it would be one more way we'd see their superiority. The more-worldly film crew and editors saw the juicy potential, and played it up.

That's a good point. I haven't watched any full episodes (just bits and pieces), but if Jana isn't keeping sweet in her THs recently than maybe the editors did decide to pounce on it as a story line. My only question is whether or not family members are present during the THs? I thought I saw it mentioned somewhere that various family members are present off camera (for accountability I suppose) - wouldn't Jana be less likely to say something that shows she was upset if her family were present? And would her parents allow that portion of the TH to be aired if they knew about it before hand or would they see it as a way to "prove" that the kids do have emotions other than ridiculously happy?

[Four is Enough]

I think the CinderJana story line is on point because she isn't even trying to HIDE the fact that she is being mistreated - there is no "keeping sweet" in her THs. Also I think the inclusion of Anna's sympathy was on purpose by the crew.

I think in Ma and Pa Duggar's warped self-absorbed POV they think they are portraying Jana as a sweet helper, and showcasing how the sisters help each other (and underlining the importance of marriage and breeding). I think they thought we and the leghumpers would take away from that story line what a wonderful state of sacrificial love goes on in that house and that it would be one more way we'd see their superiority. The more-worldly film crew and editors saw the juicy potential, and played it up.

This rings very true for me.. :D