Real Marriage, By Mark Drizz-Cull

[Trynn]

Well, I seriously know a woman in her late 30s who calls her parents every night to tell them she got home safely from work.

That was the context I had in mind.

[jerkit]

Mr. Jerkit and I do not have separate finances because I detest dealing with and thinking about money. And I'm bad at it.

[Trynn]

We are the same. In five years, we've had maybe three true fights. We don't always agree, but we let it go or compromise like grown ups. I find it odd that all the evangelicals and fundies I know talk about constantly fighting. They are also the people I know who talk about marriage being "hard" and so much "work" and how it is supposed to "test you" and "make you better". There is definitely some notion within certain brands of Christianity that marriage is just downright unpleasant and something to be endured.

In terms of finances, we have separate checking accounts and separate credit cards. We were both over 30 when we got married with established finances and didn't really merge them. We have one shared credit card and a shared savings account. The rest is separate. And a few helpful evangelical friends have informed me that this will ruin my marriage. Five years later, we're just fine, thank you.

Trynn, your mother may have her name on some bills for the sake of her personal credit rating.

That's probably it. I was 12 when she explained it, and all I cared about at that age was when we were gonna move again. And I was probably more interested in the ice cream she was buying for me anyway.

[louisa05]

Depends. Is this replacing conversation with her husband? I talk to my mother-in-law almost every day while my husband's at work. It doesn't replace talking to him, and is really just a bonus to my days. Talking to her adds something and doesn't replace or take away from anything else.

Sadly, it sounds like Grace talked to her mom so much because she needed the support.

It depends on circumstances as well. I talk to my parents almost daily now due to their health issues. Prior to that, I talked to them maybe twice a week.

Not to say that talking to your parents excessively can't be a sign that something is not right. I have a cousin, age 43 and married with 2 children, who calls his mommy approximately every 20 minutes and texts her in-between. Not sure how that is healthy for anyone.

[Trynn]

This next section is on forgiveness. It's not terrible, but there are some WTF moments.

Mark talks about how you need to forgive your spouse, because Jesus forgave you. After all, no one has been sinned against more than God, and we've hurt him more than anyone else. God could be a very bitter person, and isntead he sent Jesus to die for us.

If Mark doesn't think God is bitter, he must never have read the Old Testament. Juuuuust sayin'.

More talk about God forgiving us. He repeats himself a lot using different words.

Lists! Because we like lists in this chapter:

What forgivness is not:

1. denying, approving, or diminishing the sin that is comitted against us.

We can't say, “it's fine, no big deal†when it really ISN'T fine and it IS a big deal.

2. Naivety.

Naive people ignore sin rather than forigving it, because they don't really see the sinfulness of sin.

3. enabling sin

Don't be complicit in the sinner's actions

4. Waiting for someone to apologize

We need to forgive because God does, not whether or not the person who sinned against us repents

5. forgetting about sin committed against us

It's impossible to forget such things. But we need to not constantly bring it up to people.

6. Dying emotionally and no longer feeling the pain of the transgression.

We still feel the pain, but choose not to be paralyzed by it.

7. A one time event

Those who have been sinned against may feel fresh waves of anger, and need to continually forgive.

8. Reconciliation

9. Neglecting justice

If someone has committed a crime, you're free to forgive the person AND call the police. Also, by not seeking vengeance, we are trusting God to punish him in the end.

So, now that we've gotten a long list of what forgiveness ISN'T, what does Drizcoll say it isâ€

Forgiveness is loving despite sin. Just as God forgives undeserving sinners, we must too.

Forgiveness is loving despite sin.

The next subsection of the Chapter is entitled bitterness. Because in Christian Land, this is one of The Big Sins.

Mark starts the section with a story about how, when he was a little boy, he saw a tree in his yard he didn't like, so he took his father's handsaw and cut it down. He thought he'd taken care of the problem (there's no mention at all as to whether or not his parents were pissed) btu the tree just grew back the next spring! This is because the tree had roots.

Bitterness also has roots.

[Trynn]

Chapter 5 Part two. The subsection is titled “How to have a good fight.â€

Excuse any errors I may overlook, my H key ates me. I'm not going for a bad French accent, I promise. Wat appened to it is a long story, so moving on.

Mark's definition of fighting sounds closer to a respectful discussion mature people have from time to time, but whatever. He's a manly man, so it's FIGHTING, ok?

They key to having a good fight that ends in reconciliation instead of bitterness is to fight as friends, not enemies, and fight for the glory of god and the good of your marriage.

I've actually been told by some people (even conservatives) that couples should fight naked. This has to do with being vulnerable with each other. If mark were to say it, That would be amusing, but it's not actually in Marky Boy's checklist of tings to do when you fight.

1. First, decide if your spouse has committed a sin. If so, is this the right time to deal with it?

I...honestly don't know how to respond to that so... do Christian couples randomly have fights about whether or not one of them sinned?

2. decide how you want to deal with the conflict. Usually we respond with flight, fight, or fright. These are not usually the healthiest responses in marital conflict.

I agree with Driscoll, these are not healthy, and why would we even have such a response if it weren't built into us by evolution? Why would God give us that if he created us for a perfect world.... sorry, wrong rant. Moving along.

3. don't fight when one of you has been hitting the booze, smoking a joint, or snorting heroin. (Those aren't his exact words, I'm embellishing.)

This is probably supposed to be common sense, but actually, I am WAY less likely to explode with anger if you give me booze first. In fact, if you just give me booze, you can probably avoid having the fight in the first place.

I guess it's good advice for those of you who won't be needing a liver transplant by 35.

4. Before you fight, pray.

Oh dear Lord I can see this being used passive aggressively... "And please Lord help Irene to see that I, Walter the almighty, am right and she is wrong..."

5. Don't use fighting as a way to relieve stress

I'm nodding along, common sense, good advice

6. Sometimes a couple can't agree on an issue. This affects their oneness and unity. In these cases, “humble servants†need to ask themselves if the issue is really that big a deal, if they could just give in. If they think the issue isn't resolvable by doing this, they need to seek outside authority like a biblical counselor or a pastor. The mediator is then supposed to make the decision and the spouse in the “wrong†will submit to it.

Oh wow. Cristian counselors and pastors must be suuuuuper busy if this is how married couples handle big disagreements when one of them is stubborn. It sounds to me like a colossal waste of time for the pastors who could be doing REAL work, plus it just seems like...

To be semi fair, Mark DOES say this should be a rare occurrence, but...I feel like.... what if you have a REALLY stubborn spouse and you can't agree on a lot of things? Two stubborn people? I feel like in practice it probably wouldn't be? I feel like this is a way for the couple to not really deal with the problem. I could also see it building up resentment on the part of the “wrong†spouse.

“See honey, the counselor picked MY idea, I was right the whole time. Don't you want to repent now?â€

I'm not saying couples should never see a counselor, but I feel like it should be for bigger issues than... whatever Marky Boy is thinking... you know he's not really clear exactly when this sort of thing is called for. Should you go to a counselor to decide the color of the living room rug because one spouse is firmly set on having bright orange carpeting and the other is just as stubborn about wanting pink polka dots?

Or should they save it for when one spouse is dead set on moving to Alaska and the other rather likes it in Florida where they've been happily residing?

I feel like if Mark is going to bring this up he should get a bit more detailed.

And that's pretty much the end of the chapter. There's a poem on the next page but it's really long and I've never been a fan of poetry anyway.

And... we're done with part 1. Part 2 is labeled.... SEX! That's right folks, Marky Boy and Gracie is gonna tell us all about the ebul sehks! A few chapters from now, he'll be going into graphic detail about which sexual activity is permissible.

Sorry about the inconsistency of these posts. I have been.... ill.

[louisa05]

Oh, the "B" word.

Evangelicals love the "B" word. If you have a problem with the church, pastor, theology, abusive behaviors of someone, whatever. The problem is not a problem. You are the problem because you are bitter.

Nice to know Driscoll found a way to drag that one into marriages, too.

What a healthy culture they have.

[jerkit]

Spoiler alert

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The day I read Mark giving his readers permission to do it in the butt was the best day ever. I can't wait for the recap.

[Trynn]

Chapter 6

Sex:God, Gross, or Gift?

In this chapter, Marky Boy tells us how to have a healthy attitude about sex.

My opinion on the whole thing is that it's rather gross and disgusting and can't we all just procreate by test tubes? I know, not all asexuals feel this way, but, I do. I don't mean that nobody should have sex ever, just that I REALLY don't want to hear about. And yes, certain people in my life think that I DO want to hear about it, and that I'm just being a prude by remaining a virgin.

Anyway, I will try to stay off this tangent throughout the recap.

Mark begins by telling us that Eve was born and married in the same day, which I always thought was rather unfair. She had no choice but to be with Adam. What if she'd wanted to be single for a while? It's horrible to be forced to marry anyone.

In any case, God established a pattern for marriage supported by both Jesus and Paul (citation needed). Here are the things that need to happen before one can marry:

1. A guy needs to grow up by moving out of his parents' house, paying his own bills, worshiping his god (it doesn't say just any God, it says, "worshiping HIS God"), and generally taking care of himself.

2. A man is then able to pursue a woman

3. Man and wife become one flesh.

Yes, these steps are all initiated by the man. It doesn't say anything about how a woman needs to live by herself for a while and become self supporting, or anything about her pursuing the man. I mean, if all that was needed to become one flesh is for a man to pursue a woman, rape would be considered an acceptable way of going about this. I don't know why but the idea of "pursuing" a woman just leads me to think of a guy chasing her and then jumping her. Instead, they should discuss it together as a couple and come together, rather than having a man run after the woman.

The bible says sex is very good, so this is true. The first few pages of the bible tell us 7 things about sex. Really? Because, I've read that thing cover to cover many times over, and Genesis doesn't say much about sex except for implying that it makes babies. The latter parts of Genesis contain rape scenes (I think? Or was the story of Lot in another book?) but I don't think the first few chapters really tell us much except that "knowing your wife" results in pregnancy. And I don't think anyone needed the bible to tell them THAT.

Anyway, here's what Genesis supposedly teaches about sex:

1. God created male and female. They are different but complete in each other

2. love is more like a song than a math equation. People who are "stuck in their heads" get frustrated by this.

No, he doesn't tell us what he means by that and I don't have a clue.

3. Marriage is for one man and one woman. This is supported by Jesus himself

(Translation of what he really means brought to you by Trynn: GAYS ARE BAAAAAAAAADDDDDDD!!!!!!!!!)

4. God created sex. In fact, he created our bodies for sex.

(Translation of what he really means brought to you by Trynn: Asexuals don't exist, mmkay?)

5. Outside of marriage, sex is a sin. Here is an exact list of sexual sins:

a. Homosexuality

b. Erotica

c. Bestiality

d. bisexuality

e. fornication

f. friends iwth benefits

g. adultery

h. pornography

i. pedophilia

I notice that at least 2 of those items are synonyms, and yes, Homosexuality is first on the list, and pedophilia is last. I'll let you make of that what you will.

I can only find 3 of those that I personally think are sins, and they are:

1. Pedophilia (shudder)

2. Bestiality (animals can't give consent)

2. Adultery

Looks like I actually missed a few on the list.... my eyes skipped over the fact that Driscoll put rape in the middle of the list of sexual sins. He does admit that rape is wrong, but that should honestly be #2, right underneath pedophilia.

For married people, the following things are sinful to do with someone other than one's spouse:

a. masturbating someone else

b. oral sex

c. anal sex

d. heavy petting

e. dry humping

f. cybersex

g. phone sex

Seriously, does anybody actually NEED a book to tell them that these things are not ok if they're with someone besides your spouse? (Disclaimer: if you've already established with your partner that you don't care if he or she has sex with someone else, that is a different situation, but Marky boy doesn't think that exists, so)

6. Sex is to be done in such a way that there is no shame.

Sometimes shame is ok, because that is a response to our sexual sin. Sometimes we are ashamed when others sexually sin against us, and other times we feel shame about sex because we have the wrong feelings about sex in general.

Sorry, but, I believe that the way asexuals feel toward sex (and the attitude varies a lot) is not wrong, Just because I believe that sex is not something I want to participate in ever in my entire life doesn't mean I have the "wrong" attitude.

Also, I know rape victims tend to feel shame, and I don't think Mark is implying here that they SHOULD, just that they do, but I feel like I want to say this anyway: RAPE VICTIMS HAVE NOTHING TO BE ASHAMED OF. This is a public service announcement reminding victims of sexual harassment/assault/insert proper term here have nothing to be ashamed of. It is not your fault, you did nothing to cause it, and anyone who says otherwise should be tied to a chair while being forced to listen to Hannah Montana doing a duet with Justin Beiber while being forced to solve math problems in their heads while getting electric shocks to their primary sexual characteristics if they get an answer wrong. So there.

Mark goes on.

7. your standard of beauty is your spouse. God made Adam and Eve, and didn't ask them what they wanted in a spouse, he just said, here you are, you're married, enjoy! God did not permit Adam and Eve to develop a standard of beauty. Instead, he gave them each a spouse AS a standard of beauty.

Whoa, holy non consent batman. That is just.... so fucked up in so many ways I don't even.... :angry-banghead: :angry-banghead: :angry-banghead: :angry-banghead:

Having a "standard of beauty" is not holy or helpful. This is a lie of popular culture. God doesn't give us a standard of beauty, he gives us spouses.

Unlike other standards of beauty, a spouse changes over time. So if your partner is tall, your standard of beauty is tall. If he is fat, your standard of beauty is fat....

I could kinda see if Mark was trying to say that the person you marry is very likely to fit your standard of beauty... but I'm sorry, I don't believe that's what he's saying, and I'm having a lot of trouble coming up with a coherent response to why this not ok.

If he was saying to love your spouse despite the fact that you don't see them as beautiful... because I'm sorry, but if I were to get married to someone who, for example, got really sick, and as a result of this sickness, became pale and emaciated, my standard of beauty would not evolve to prefer emaciated people. I would still love my spouse, and I'd definitely still see beauty in them, but I would not be able to adjust to preferring people who were so skinny I cold wrap my small hands around their waists.

In fact, I think this whole "your spouse must be your standard of beauty" thing is very harmful.

Marky Boy then talks about how Adam sinned by sitting by and watching his wife sin, as many men do today... what? Do other Cristian traditions... see, Seventh Day Adventist tradition says that Eve was able to be decieved because she got separated from Adam. In SDA tradition, Adam wasn't there when Eve sinned. Do other Christian traditions support this, or is it just Adventists? Because I have yet to hear a Christian tell me Adam was THERE and letting Eve sin. Urgh.

We've got more sections to go through, but I'm done for now, largely because this book requires too much alcohol, and I'm getting drunk.