The Ken Alexander School of Statistical Analysis

[Firiel]

I did it so you didn't have to.

 

Originally, this was going to document his posts here, his comments on Sheila's blog, and his comments on Lori's blog. But I decided I still needed a job by the end of the week. So I just had to stick to his posts here. Before you ask... yes, I did look at and skim each and every one of his almost 400 posts here. Unfortunately, that exercise may have caused me to miss several written out numbers like hundreds, thousands, or millions. Don't worry. There are enough. Stats from different parts of the same post are separated by just a line break. Different posts are separated by two line breaks. My commentary is bold and in parentheses.

 

I can't believe I did all of this. I have a problem.

 

Quotes are from earliest to latest.

 

KEN ALEXANDER'S EXPLORATION OF NUMEROLOGY, PART 1

 

 

Quote

Even during those years Lori still did all the heavy lifting in raising the kids, and the nanny had about 6 hours a day of babysitting duties, no cooking or cleaning and mainly the two youngest kids.

 

No abuse at all in this family.... and we are not monsters. Writing it a thousand times like 8 years olds might do will not change the reality that we have a very loving, gracious, forgiving and highly successful family.

 

I cannot remember spanking one of my kids past age 4. Pretty sure this number changes some…

 

Someone asked how do I make it in the dental world with 80% women! I will tell you how i make it. I treat them very much like I treat my wife, with care, concern, honor, respect, and believe them to be my equals in every way.

 

I am 1000% committed to personal, professional and marriage growth. (TEN TIMES more than is possible.)

 

A wife and mother and career are 2/3 full time jobs if done well, yet feminism wants to have all women shoot for the moon when it comes to careers without stopping to think and wonder would I be better off postponing my career for something far more important, raising my children. (Translations for this one?)

 

Use the strap we use and apply a light force you can do it so lightly that it does not even hurt. A little harder and it hurts a little but the red mark lasts 10 seconds. You are so wrong. There is zero abuse, or anything except for the sensationalism that you all give to it. (Guys, this is just the first of SO MANY statistics about how to spank without abuse)

 

My guess is that Lori would have zero issues engaging with a few of you more reasonable ones, but you will not like her answers (Proved by Lori daily on her blog!)

 

1 1/2 to 2" wide, 1/8th inch thick and maybe 10 inches long. It stings, but leaves no bruises and the ed mark will be gone in 30-90 seconds.

 

A spanking is no where near any of these things. So weird for people to even think that a swat for child discipline is brutality!!! when spankings have been practiced for 4000+ years. (He’s a historian now, too)

 

Where has morality gone when many here on this site can murder a child in the womb, yet get so emotional about a child having a stinging bottom for 10-15 seconds?

 

Alyssa had dreams and goals which we were willing to support financially and Lori drove her to ballet class 15 minutes away, and then back every day sometimes 6 days a week, not to mention performances all over.

 

There are millions if not billions living out the Christian life taking the Bible literally at what it says. (The first appearance of BILLIONS.)

 

Moving to a new house, moving to a new area, having a brother or sister stay with you for along period of time, the list is long as to what we could disagree upon and 99% of the time I ended up giving in, and apologizing to keep the peace.

 

I would be very interested to see if SSM is into any DD or BDSM... or f this is just one more thing your group concocted by adding 2+2 and coming up with 7 like you have with me and many other things. (The irony of Ken accusing us of sucking with numbers is insane).

 

Lori's message is quite unique even if it is a massage that is over 2000 years old as it was abandoned by the church when feminism began to rule our society. So you all want to eradicate the message everywhere... even if it appears in the Bible more than 8-10 times... Right? (Remember this number!)

 

I see women like you daily and work with hundreds of them. You all amaze me. (Ken works with SO many people!)

 

I do not like the skinny look myself, and Alyssa looked good, but a couple of times probably added an extra 5 lbs on top of the 5 she normally carried more than most ballerinas.

But yo are a parent, so tell me how you plan on handling it when your daughter is now 10 lbs overweight? No time to panic, but is it not time to talk to her to help see where you can be a help in getting her the right foods and habits? What kind of parent let's a child go to 12-15 lbs overweight and never says a word to discuss it with them. No blame, no condemnation.. actually I shared with Alyssa my struggles with keeping weight off... it is a life long battle for most of us. How about 20 lbs is that when you step in... and kick yourself for not loving your child enough to step in earlier?

 

Now how about you... you know for a fact your kids are going to hell.. hypothetically of course... are you sure you want them born? For sure they are with weeping and gnashing of teeth for ETERNITY! Are you sure? (ETERNITY may be the biggest number Ken uses, but just wait for the smallest!)

 

Yes, I hunt and peck about 60 words a minute with lots of typos and then I have to go back a reread and try to make corrections

 

Travel half the time for only a few years, then 10 days a month since… I am a 24 hour a day stay at home Dad the other 20 days of each month :0. Got to many of te kids games and ballet… I have a great job where I have no one to blame for my success or failure but me… and there are lots of hours after 5 p.m. and before 8 a.m. to work. (Translation?)

Remember, we were all confused as to what Lori was going through because she was misdiagnosed by 28 different doctors in five years.

 

Hey, do you al not know that 50% of marriages end in divorce? (Notice how many time this statistic comes up…)

 

I do not know if this is 1% here or 20%, but you all do exactly what you accuse Lori of doing, putting dangerous words out on the Internet where someone may take it and do harm. I see you all as a forum as far more dangerous than Lori’s words. (1%, 20% or 100%-- so similar!)

 

Your case is the exception (including this because it was directed at me—I’m an exception, a super speshul divorcee!)

 

Lori has a near 100% track record of turning the marriages of the women she personally mentors around by training the wife to be Biblical.

 

Little male animal finally after a billion years evolves a little wee wee AND has to not just urinate through it he has to make some sperm and ejaculate it. (Ken explains evolution!)

 

I can name hundreds of men who will die for their wives, and I am one. I think you may confuse people who call themselves Christians and those who ARE Christians. It is two different groups that intersect maybe at 50%?(Correct me if I’m wrong, but if the two different groups intersect, does that mean that people who don’t call themselves Christians could be Christians?)

 

Also, Lori works directly with women from 2-3 different churches all with different levels of belief on submission.

 

You say I have more posts per day, but I am answering many more people each day who are asking me specific questions. If you ask 3 and 7 other ask 1-2, would you prefer one long post to address all when you said this approach was confusing?

 

The submission passages in the NY and the passages explaining headship and leadership are many, maybe 12-15? (More submission voices magically appear!)

 

In today's world a mom with an 8th grade education and a knowledge as to how to use Goggle and the Internet can be more knowledgeable than most college professors 20 years ago. Goggle.

 

For those keeping track it has been a 4-5 hour evening with FJ tonight.

 

Until this past year I did not get a single client from the Internet and I may get 1-2 a year, but even then, 99% is word of mouth referrals.

 

Do I need to go back and see how many of you asked the bullying comments to stop? 1%? (We are the 99%!)

 

I have a professional relationship with well over 4000 women, most between the ages of 20-40 years old. How many do you know? Many of them confide in me because I am the consultant to their offices and they trust me. (Four THOUSAND women confide in Ken.)

 

Funny all you all here had perfect marriages when so many others are hurting and 50% end p in divorce. Common stat again…

 

You want to arm chair quarterback how every relationship is supposed to be dealt with with less than 1/20th of the facts and you will not even accept the facts as stated.

I have 30 years of working with women. If they open up to me at times, it is because I am a nonthreatening person with significant graduate training in psychology and human relations.

 

stop trying to discount what Lori teaches because it is hugely successful if applied correctly, which it appears hundreds of women have figured out on their own without seeing and domination or abuse by their husbands... NONE. (Hundreds of women figure it out without Lori’s help?)

 

Also remember, she often has posts schedule up to 60 days out,

 

Our lives, family, my work and Lori's blog are all full and running over with blessings. Hundreds and maybe thousands of lives changes and improved for the better and as of yet, not one that we know of who has been harmed by our lives or ministry. Only a few hard core feminist women and some people already bruised or pained by the church take offense at Lori's blog. Only a few hardcore feminists… and, you know, those pesky women who teach sane submission like Sheila.)

 

Those people you are concerned about may exist, but in 3-4 years of blogging Lori has never heard from one of them, yet she has heard from many, including three today thanking her for her ministry in their lives and marriage. Pick any topic on the Internet and I can tell you how someone, somewhere might abuse it. Should Amazon shut down because a child could be killed by 99% of the products they sell if used by the wrong person in an uncaring and dangerous manner.

 

I diligently studied the Bible in the original languages, formulated conclusions concerning textual criticism and hermeneutics, and concluded that the Bible may not be 100% accurate because of how it was handed down over time, but that it is indeed 99.8% accurate and 100% accurate on all major points of theology necessary fir life and godliness.

 

I am not saying a small % are abused, but what is the ea; probability that Lori's blog will ever negatively affect an abused women?

 

I worked hard on trying to solve our marriage issues for 5-7 years before Lori found "Created to Be His Help Meet" and the light bulb went off.

 

As far as the 25% number I would like to know what that drops to if the infrequent and lesser psychological abuse in marriages is removed from the number.

Certainly if she feels abused she should seek wise counsel, but all the 25% statistics of Christian marriages have experienced some type of abuse shows is that abuse is now a loose term

But her work often helps lessen or eliminate the psychological abuse, and we cannot be advocating that we throw another 25% of Christian marriages into the divorce category. (This is some sort of logical fallacy—I know that much.)

 

I may have to start picking and choosing what I respond to as I cannot take 3-4 hours a day on this, but instead need to take a longer more protracted look at your concerns as I try to show you that apart from a few issues of spanking, wifely submission, etc. (I feel your pain, Ken! I hope I still have a job by next week!)

 

Half the time I got spanked it never hurt, and half it hurt some, but not enough to last more than a minute. But I am sure that if I needed a 5 minute spanking Dad would have given it to me and I would now appreciate it if it saved me from smoking or doing something really stupid with my life.

 

Spanking is 95% effective, but when it is not, or not as effective as we would like, switch things up.

No spankings for 6 weeks then spank again and see if it is far more effective.

 

has the world moved that fast and far in 30 years that can call us Chalarans when we teach exactly what Americans believed and practiced 30-400 years ago. No, what is happening in this world is that loud voices like yours al cry foul on something you want to change. You get your liberal academics and other liberals to all scream at the top of your voice how spanking is so wrong even as you know that 75% of parents still practice it in some form. (Ken, enlighten us—what exactly did Americans teach in 1614? I’m guessing it was ebil pagan beliefs because, you know, Native Americans lived here then.)

 

There are hundreds and thousands of reasons my Bible is true and the biggest reason is that Jesus Christ rose from the dead and was seen by over 5000 people. (There are 783,137 words in the Bible—that’s, like, a reason every 2-3 words!)

 

30 year career as a life and systems coach to offices. Average new clients is 20 a year. Average number of female staff 7. 30 x 20 x 7 = 4,200 women. And many of these offices I have visited multiple times, sometimes over many years. They cross off two days from their schedule just to talk to me in groups and in private, and many become my friends.

I have women telling me all about how women act and think for 30 years now and you all do not think very highly of yourselves at times. Give me 6 women in an office and one man and the man is almost never the problem. (Ken does math and brags about the ladies)

 

[Firiel]

PART TWO:

How about a 33 year Christian marriage? How about 100+ marriage and family books read and digested. In today’s world experience can be better than any collage degree, but Lori dies have a University degree and a graduate degree. How about married to a husband who has 4 ½ years of graduate study in theology, psychology and human relations? You cannot tell me we are not fully qualified. In a church of 5,000+ who do you think they give the most women to be mentored to, and the toughest? Yes, Lori. And they also give us the toughest pre-marital couples because what Lori teaches works, and is 100% Biblical. If you have a problem it is with God and the Bible, not Lori.

I personally think spankings should be over by 7 years old.

Our daughters and one son got parasites along with Lori 24 years ago and 28 doctors and four years later they were finally given a definitive diagnosis.

I do not wish to downplay my daughter's views of food and body issues, but they have lots of company on these issues. Can you tell me that a majority of young women do not at some point struggle with these issues and how about 90% of all ballerina's?

Lori has well over 1000 posts so finding your ammunition should not be hard to make your points.

Sacrificial love would have said no basketball ever for you so long as your wife is ill for 25 years. Look back and you will see it thrown at me many times, when the full story is sooooo far from the reality of things. That is just one of over 50 illustrations I could give you and if you look at many accusations I already have given to you.

I would say up to the age of 18 we may have mentioned or talked about weight 3-4 times and all related to her feelings.

Yes Polecat, Lori received and receives many comments and nasty statements, many of which came from this Forum according to Goggle.

75% of parents still spank, and for a reason. It is a very effective and proven tool for raising great kids when done right. (GOGGLE!)

You put too much "what if" in her answers and pay the 1% card that someone might be damaged by the advice. (That’s 1 in 100!)

I like the words "pleasing each other" which captures 98% of what submission means. Both can do that. The last 2% is allowing him to lead when you have spoken your mind once o twice, he gets it, but disagrees. (This stat is pretty steady—submission is 2% of a marriage, but for some reason Lori discusses it about 90% of the time.)

I refer you to this article and a million others on a husband's role in a Christian marriage and it lists Leader as the first part of the role. (A MILLION!)

Just Google and find the stats ... They are pretty consistent between 70-80% of parents have spanked their kids.

I cannot recall spanking any one of my children more than twice, but I am sure it may have been 3-4 times for a couple of the stronger willed ones.

You do not have the time or energy to sit at the top of the stairs putting the kid back in bed every 15 minutes when a swat would solve the whole ordeal.

That there are billions of Christians in the world, and some are true believers, and some are not.

A Biblical marriage is superior to an "equal" marriage because as I love and make may wife more important than myself, and she chooses to submit, the goal is to give each other 100% of ourselves, not 50-50%. My marriage has gone from 25 miles and hour to over 80 an hour with getting out of our equal marriage and moving to a more Biblical model.

What do you say to the hundreds of readers each year who say their marriage was radically changed when they began practicing what Lori writes about? I will guess that most have finally achieved a 50-50% marriage and they are loving have peace in the way they deal with each other.

So I Goggled this ... husband's role in christian marriage

Results in .40 seconds 5,720,000.

Now out of those 5,720,000 I am sure that Google got some wrong, and some duplicates, but there is no pastor in any church who goes longer than a year before teaching this lesson, especially on Father's Day where they tend to blister the men for not doing their role properly and leading with love. Tough to tell how many really at this point in time, but I am sticking with $1,000.000 and will include the bad ones to get my count up

I did not put two and two together... and you are right... I have to stop jumping on here as my work is suffering greatly. (Mine too, Ken… mine too.)

My thinking included all who claim to be Bible Believers which appears to be about 550 - 700,000,000.

This structural approach leads the WCD to claim that there are 706 Evangelical denominations worldwide with a total of around 300 million adherents in mid-2010. The formula used for the broader term “evangelical†produces a total of approximately 700 million Great Commission Christians worldwide in mid-2010. A parallel assessment of Pentecostals and Charismatics results in about 600 million for the same year.

Nonetheless, it can likely be generally agreed that there are approximately 500 million Evangelicals in the world today. (???)

Although I admire your marriage relationship and how ideal it is, I think you must have your head in the sand if you do not know that 50% of marriages end in divorce, and probably a large % of those which do not also have significant marriage disagreements. I live in the real world where 60% of those I help manage are divorced or running from one guy to another because they cannot get along.

The stats are so far against your ideal thinking. I do not claim that doing things God's way with husband leadership and submission is a panacea. I only claim it is Biblical, and the model for Christian marriages to strive towards. It creates a structure that allows for the resolution of issues with the wife usually getting 95% of what she wants and husband 5% because love trumps submission when it comes to conceding decisions.

First I am thrilled to be corrected on the 50% divorce rate. I have always fought against that stat (WHERE KEN? ALL I SEE IS THAT STAT THROWN AROUND.)as I did not see how it could be true, but even 30% end in divorce proves my original point that a huge number of marriages need a structure to problem solve when they reach impasses.

Third, here is how the 95% works in my marriage. I try rarely to object to anything my wife wants to do or buy. When she wants to buy something big, or do something out of the ordinary she talks to me about it, and 95% of the time either I do not care if she does what she wants, or I decide I would prefer she not do it, but because I love her I am not standing in her way and I joyfully go along with her desires.

I know, I am probably spoiling your fun. It is usually that way when there is one adult in the room. (One adult… guess who it is?)

Submission is within an important 2% part of the CPU of a Biblical marriage. The CPU controls all in a computer.

There are times when it seems there is not choice ... live with the problem or hope that the SSRI will help and deal with usually modest side affects. What I was saying is a small % maybe 1-2% do not tolerate them like the rest.

Pain does not have to bruise and by hurt I meant something far more than a 10 second sting. I was spanked with a belt by my Dad and the pain lasted the time of the spanking and maybe 10-20 seconds longer. (Specific spanking guidelines continue)

Our parenting was o easy compared to our friends after age 7. Three of the five closest friends who are all Christians had rebellious teens, and now rifts in relationships as adults ad they tried your approach with no spanking.

Pain is not the end of the world, especially when it lasts 10-20 seconds and teaches obedience and discipline.

I know it is hard to grasp, but a brief spanking discipline lasts less than 1-2 minutes most times, but yelling can go on and on with the battle of the wills.

It is important to keep I mind that the concept of submission is a vital 2% issue in a Biblical marriage. If both spouses are first Christians, then they will act like this towards each other first, before submission comes into play. The fruit of the Spirit is love, joy peace, patience, goodness, meekness, gentleness… and these things must be the 98% part of a Biblical marriage.

It is in the 2% of a marriage that specific Biblical instructions are given for a wife to respect her husband and be submissive, which can be seen as “let him lead.â€

You ask where the wife is guaranteed she gets 95% of what she wants, and what I am explaining is how a Biblical marriage should work. Many Christian marriages do not work this way and that is why Lori is teaching what she teaches to women o help get them back on track.

Part of a Biblical marriage and the 2%, is that if her husband is not being obedient to follow what God has called him to be as a husband, she is called to “win him over†by her loving, kind, gentle, respectful, submissive†behavior.

Long term counseling is out of the question but for the top 20-30% in the world. What do you say to the other 70%? Screw it all ... lose your wife and let her consider the consequences of her sins? (Ken coincidentally develops an awareness that he is rich when it suits him)

I still want to know what this group wants to tell the husbands of the 70% of the world without adequate professional help?

I do not see this as black and white as Lori, but I like her challenging young ladies to think hard about what God is really calling them to and not just run with the crowd in our new society of 50% professionals soon to be women. (Like their new daughter-in-law?)

A hug for 10-20 seconds is not abusive, nor is finding a wife in the hall and pinning her hands for 10-20 seconds to gain her attention so you can talk frankly, but kindly to her, BUT one must know their spouse well in order to do this

A submissive marriage should look very much like an egalitarian marriage and it does have much compromise in it. I have said previously that my sense is that Lori gets 98% of whatever she wants, mainly because I trust her in many areas.

We have a deep and abiding love for each other. (Lori has neither confirmed nor denied this!)

You like the sensationalism as the .00000000000000000001 chance that some might spank a child too hard, or a wife might submit to an abusive man while following Lori's blog you believe gives you license to even make these wild irresponsible speculations. (That’s about one in 1,000,000,000,000,000,000,000—with odds like that, it’s likely no one in the WHOLE WORLD is being abused.)

I will bet that half the married women on this Forum do not even know that their husbands have many significant unmet wants and desires that will continue to go unmet because of what you call compromise. Men often cave in to their wives because we want to keep the peace and keep the wife happy.

Would that be enough to get you and FJ off her back? It has nothing to do with her stated purpose, but everything to do with your purpose, but who knows, maybe a post on the subject is warranted to help alleviate your fears of the .000001 chance that her blog will be any part of continuing the abuse. (1 in 100,000,000—abuse has gone down, it turns out!)

Your premise of someone being harmed by Lori's is too far fetched and unrealistic, especially given that submission is already prevalent in many parts of the world with or without Lori's teaching. She can stand up under the .0000000001 risk that you and your group are in hysterics over, just like she will in her car and drive tomorrow, assuming she will not get into an accident.

Curious, my issue is not with you, but with those who somehow believe that if information is already public, hidden in some small comment in one of 1200 posts, that it should be showed to the whole world.

How about Koala searching through 1200 blog posts and another 400o pages of comments to come up with 2-3 pages of highly personal things that she can parade around your Forum like a cat with a dead rat in its mouth. "Look what I found buried in some back comment from a post a year ago that can help make my wife look bad. This is highly unethical behavior, yet no one in your FJ audience calls her on it and tells her to stop the bad behavior.

Yes, this is a personal blog, and my wife is willing to share many details about real life, but to cull out a few pages of perceived negatives out of 5200 pages of information WITHOUT recognizing all of the great things my wife has posted, and the lives she has helped change for the better, is horrible behavior.

Our problems with each other have gone from 20% to .001%. It is rare that we have any upset whatsoever. We finally the last 14 years have what you may have had all along in your marriage.

I do not want you to change if you are happy, BUT Loeri is often dealing in the realm of unhappy marriages. It is such a cop out to say you have a great marriage and ignore the 30% of marriages that do not.

Very few posts, all written by me, in with Lori, cover anything you might even think as manipulative or power. Show me ONE comment written by Lori that implies manipulation or power by a spouse. Just one. Then try to find 2-3... impossible to find in 5400 pages of posts and comments, yet you write this as if you have any facts whatsoever?

We believe that a swat or swats should hard enough to actually work in training a child's obedience. The swat should also sting for only 5-20, and should not leave a bruise, although a small bruise is the risk worth taking to gain training in discipline.

[Firiel]

FINAL PART OF THE TRILOGY:

But why must we fit into other people's boxes? Isn't the world of ideas big enough to have varying pints of view without making it seem that our ideas are so horrible, when just 20-40 years ago the majority of America would have agreed with us? (But not 400 years ago? Ok, I suspect that first one was a typo…)

The more nasty women become she may equate this with how they treat their husbands. No more lady like behavior, and this site is a prime example of the radial change in women in the last 50 years. Hence her desire to try and get women back to a point of submission and decency.

Women who are submissive and taken advantage of by dominating husbands need your protection, but others who you disagree with you welcome to throw to the wolves. You have two different standards for your life as to how you desire to protect people from the .00001% chance that they be harmed. And you actively participate in the harm and splash it all over many people without concern for all who may have my same name. A bunch of blooming hypocrites you are. Sad.

I am in no way concerned about ANYTHING I have written that will reach even a .0000001% chance of being considered libelous or defamation of character. My posting here, is to precisely to see if I can reason with reasonable people and get them to remove the defamation of character that they PURPOSEFULLY participated in moving up the Google Search Engine to be just under my wife's name, and blog, when typing in her name. (While I was completing this exercise, I would just feel gleeful whenever I saw one of his remarkably tiny numbers—it was like Christmas.)

Biblical Submission looks a lot like a healthy Egalitarian marriage, but that comment gets whacked too because FJ does not want to look at the 98% we have in common on the concept of a healthy marriage, but the 2% we disagree upon.

I am a bit amazed at your view of some women, considering them so inferior to you in their ability to process information, digest it and accept or reject it. That somehow because it was written on the Internet women everywhere are gullible and are taking what Lori writes without careful reflection, even not knowing her in person. WHY? Because she publishes a blog along with a million other women Lori's authority and control is just so much more powerful?

Herein has been one of my biggest issues with you and salex in that you press fr changes in Lori's blog because of a .0000001 chance someone may be harmed, without a modicum of proof that such a thing has, or ever will happen. The bottom line is you do not like her teaching and you want to shut it up or tame it for your purposes.

How many times do I have to say that 100% of the responsibility for the rape is the man's? You just don;t like anyone to give advice to not walk down an dark alley, or do not get skunk drunk and expect that n consequences come for that form of behavior. (A man is 100% responsible for raping a woman. The woman is just facing the consequences of her behavior. What.)

You must know that there are many forms of "christians" in this world, and I would challenge you explain your interpretation of the 5-6 submission passages (The number shrinks again!)

They go to church where many pastors skirt the issue of submission because the church is made up of 60% women, many of whom will call him up angrily if he dared teach what the Bible actually says on the subject.

I can list a 30-40 far more important Christian tenets than submission. It is small potatoes compared to serving, kindness, generosity, love for others, etc. ( :lol: )

As a matter of fact the two could have made great doctors as they both had almost perfect scores in all years of schooling, and are so smart they are not falling for the lies perpetuated on millions of women that they can have it all with both a career and family.

Our church is not as Fundie as Lori is, but they always send the most difficult cases to her to mentor because they respect her results... almost 100% success in getting marriages healed.

The elders are aware of Lori's teaching and have made only one small request of her. They have no problem with what she teaches as it is a personal blog, and the leaders of the mentors group sends the toughest cases to Lori to mentor because of her almost 100% success rate in healing marriages.

"What do you do??" "I am a SAHM." "OH" is the general response implying inferiority or misplaced values. If 60% of women are working and 33-50% wish they were home more with the children what makes yo think feminism and the women can do all a man does attitude is not to blame?

75% of new Mom's wish they could stay home, so maybe it is not feminism, maybe materialism that creates the problem.

Maybe Lori's 100% sample is just plain blind luck, or maybe it is God's Word that a wife can "win her husband without a word." When you have the success rate that Lori has and every week hear 1-2 more success stories, it is hard to move away from what is working to some FJ agenda based on limited experience. We are all accountable for the truth we know.

Not statistics, but the origin of “Google tactics†:lol:

It pains me to no end that you all make fun of, castigate, spew profanity at, and try to harm with your Google tactics a woman, yes, one of you, who has lived with chronic illnesses and and two brain tumor operations. A human being who has been through such pain and misery in life, you want to destroy further. Is there no shame anymore?

Here you go 75%... I thought I pasted the link: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... rd-to.html

I am sorry ... another survey says only 47%. About half of all working young mothers wish they could be home with their children, but feminism has gifted them with the ability to fend for themselves, and many men are more than willing to let women suffer the consequences.

I have spent hours answering your specific questions with specific responses.

It takes 10 minutes to please most men... adding an extra 10 minutes once, twice three times a week to ones schedule seems like an easy thing to do, but for many it is a chore. I

For the record, my understanding is that most healthy couples enjoy sex 2-3 times a week in their 20's and this drops to 1-2 times a week in later years. This is probably mainly full love making. BUT for men who feel they need more frequency than their wife enjoys, she can usually please him alone with 10 minutes, requiring only him to need lube.

No Lori's point is that extra sex that a spouse desires an be accomplished in 10 minutes.

For the record, your lie about us spanking our babies for for hours is very offensive. We NEVER spanked a child until they were much older and NEVER spanked for not sleeping and NEVER spanked more than 5-10 seconds at a time. And no in four hours the child might have been spanked a total of 60 seconds and this might have happened once in their lifetime anything more than the modest 5-10 seconds of swats.

I am sorry that your child has a sleeping disorder, but I can promise you that allowing your baby to cry themselves to sleep a few nights between the age of 6-12 weeks would not cause a sleeping disorder. If we had had any issue with our children sleeping through the night we might have rethought allowing them to continue to cry, but crying for 30 minutes or less then off to sleep over 2-3 nights help make our children into great sleepers very early in life... every one of them.

We might have done just as you have in that case, but certainly we would have first tried the easy way until it proves itself wrong after 2-5 nights of trying to let the baby cry back to sleep when they wake up in the middle of the night.

I have traveled the world working with thousands of people of different faiths, belief systems, modern and traditional values, and have friends of all walks of life including some terrific women and gay friends, but I have never seen a group that not only refuses to show at times any reasonableness in many discussions.

After 2-3 weeks on the FreeJinger Forum I was hoping to have come to some different conclusions. As of now my image of what is going on with this Forum is that it is not a healthy place, especially for any real disagreement. (At least five weeks at this point)

The average spanking lasts 8-10 seconds, most are 1-3 swats.

The times we insisted that a child not be defiant happened once for three of our children, and zero times for another that I can recall. The child was swatted 2-3 times then asked to comply again. sent to time out, sent to their room, put back to where they were to comply. This went on for some time with maybe 5-6 such 8-10 second spankings over the course of the defiance. Total 60 seconds. You take the 60 seconds of swats separated by 15-20 minutes and come up with 1800-2400? That is either very creative math or an appeal for sensationalising to create a lie. Maybe 18 swats in 4 hours proving a 100% exaggeration with your math and logic. (Translation?)

And I do not have time to go back and show you the myriad of lies and mischaracterizations I have exposed in 2 weeks. Hundreds... a few more today. Are you and others so blind?

Koala, until your can differentiate between pre-2001 and after 2001 you will continue to mischarchaterize my wife. Lori is completely different person now. Not controlling or manipulative, but loving, caring and generous. (not really statistics, but :lol: had to add this one)

If she can change, so can all people. AND no matter how bad she says shew as, I saw 95% really good stuff in this woman and still loved her for the good in her as great Mom and person, even as she had things to change about herself, thrust upon her by others and childhood circumstances.

We can accept 10-15% miss communications that come from our comments, but the post that are written are very clear.

But you know as well as anyone that what Koala is doing is taking a massive amount of comments over a four year period, and trying to find fault. If you can find fault with 3% of what we say because it is unclear fine... we are not perfect... The real issues here come down to just a few things.

I can think of only spanking each child 1-3 times each ion their childhood, and my wife probably spanked more, but by age 4 it was a very rare occurrence.

Our model of parenting works. It is proven effective, and our children claim to have zero negative effects from it emotionally or psychologically.

If it were not for you bringing this up we would think nothing of it, just and 99.9% of her readers think nothing of it, but appreciate her candor. (Deleted comments not taken into account!)

If you have seen rampant abuse caused by submission, my 40 years as a Christian has seen little or none. So the 1% you are speaking of or 5%, does not disqualify true Christianity.

The average child received probably 8-10 spankings in their childhood (2-3 a year).

We believe as do millions of others that if one is to spank, the swat needs to sting enough to cause discomfort.

You pull out quotes to sensationalize things that happened over a period of 4 x 6 = 24 child years. Yes, we spanked our children just as millions of other parents did back then and continue to do today.

I cannot recall spanking a child after the age of 5, but it is possible we spanked until 6 or 7. Once we got compliance at an early age, our children were generally obedient and we spanked very little after 4-5 years old. (MILLIONS)

out for a few days probably... if any really cares... (came back next day!)

I get thrown 2000+ comments but get criticized for giving a fraction of the responses. There is no way I can understand or hear what you are trying to say when it is filtered through all the manure. (numbers here may be accurate!)

First, statistically if you were correct with your assessment, then domestic abuse would be higher in the church than it is outside the church. Remember, a disproportionate 75% of abusive men are hiding behind the church in your illustration, yet the same % of abuse takes place with church couples and non0-churched couples. Wouldn't your 75% mean even a 300% increase in church couple abuse? Which it is clearly not according to formergothardite's articles.

Yes it should be less, and I am trying to find independent and verifiable statistics of abuse within the church. All I read is 1 of 4, and that is the same 25% as outside. So now hat is your point that goes with your spew of profanity unbecoming a Christian? False or at least without any substantive data or proof... speculation and mischaracterization of the true church and how it operates. (Ken not understanding statistics—someone posted that abusive men are 75% more likely to seek out a place that gives them opportunity to abuse, and Ken decided that meant that abuse would be 3x higher in the church.)

One of the main purposes for coming here was to do as I teach which is to seek out criticism, evaluate it, and even if it is 98% wrong, there are still some nuggets of truth that are worth changing in one's life, especially if we are followers of Jesus.

It is not any one individual that is oppressive, but to have 50-100 angry women trying to make you look bad and flounce is not a healthy situation. (I don’t think there were that many regular posters in the threads… I had long since peaced out.)

[jerkit]

All hail Firiel!

I lurve you.

[Firiel]

All hail Firiel!

I lurve you.

I expect my official FJ medal within the week. :P

[polecat]

You are a brave, brave woman. Bravo.

I had to stop reading when I got to Ken with his sex ed/evolution speech. *shudder*

[Firiel]

In light of recent discussion, I wanted to highlight this one:

We have a deep and abiding love for each other.

Lori has neither confirmed nor denied this!

[jerkit]

In light of recent discussion, I wanted to highlight this one:

Lori has neither confirmed nor denied this!

Lori thinks she hasn't responded, but she has loud and frickin' clear.

[FundieWatcher]

My favorite is that Lori knows "thousands of married couples". And she knows there is no abuse in any of the marriages.

She must spend her entire day getting to know couples intimately.

[formergothardite]

I had forgotten how insufferable he was. I bet Lori has gotten emails saying that her advice caused harm, she responded by hitting the delete/block buttons.

[browncoatslytherin]

this is hysterical. it's amazing how many figures he just pulls right out of his ass. it's like his ass is a storage are for a plethora of numbers.

[kpmom]

Ken. He's a student of theology, a confidante of over 4000 women, has completed substantial graduate work in psychology and human relations, and a statistician to boot.

He is the most interesting man in the world.

[salex]

All hail Firiel!

I lurve you.

I second this emotion.

However, I couldn't get through the first post. I had forgotten what a douchecanoe this man is and what an ass he makes of himself.

Firiel, you must have an iron constitution to wade through all this.

As bizarre as Lori is, Ken, in large doses, is hard for me to take. Imagine the misery of listening to Ken babble on during say, a driving trip. If he's like this in real life, no wonder Lori has headaches.

I also quickly agreed with whomever it was who said before that they thought Ken might have been drinking while answering posts on FJ. Reading his posts certainly makes me want to drink!

[Loveday]

Ermagerd. This is unbelievable. Firiel, I bow down to you. :worship:

I had no idea Lori has a graduate degree. Or did Ken pull this out of his arse as well as all the statistics?

[Firiel]

Ermagerd. This is unbelievable. Firiel, I bow down to you. :worship:

I had no idea Lori has a graduate degree. Or did Ken pull this out of his arse as well as all the statistics?

I believe it's Ken's graduate degree. He was defending his credentials, I think.

EDIT: Nope, I'm wrong. He says she has one. I'm very curious about that now!

[dairyfreelife]

Thanks for taking the time to find all that again. He really does pull a bunch of random numbers out of his ass. It doesn't make him sound smarter, if that's what he thought.

Ftr, only 30 percent of the world identifies as Christian. Another 70 percent do not or are unknown. This follows Muslims, Those without a religion, Hindus, and Buddhists.

He's right about the billions, but only slightly, because he does not know the real amount or percent. It's a little over 2 billion people who claim the same religion as he and Lori. Another 1.6 billion are Muslim, which makes about 3.6 billion who follow an Abrahamic religion.

Another estimated one billion claim to not have any religious affiliation. Almost 900 million are Hindus and another roughly 350 million or so are Buddhist.

And those statistics were not pulled out of my ass.

[thoughtful]

Firiel, I am 100% grateful to you for putting all of Ken's numerical assholery in one place.

100%, I tell you!

[thoughtful]

Ken should have worked for Procter and Gamble -- his made-up statistics always make me think of the many years of "99 and 44/100 percent pure" Ivory soap ads:

[Firiel]

And those statistics were not pulled out of my ass.

dairyfreelife, I regret to inform you that you clearly have not grasped the basic tenets that Ken teaches and have thus failed Ken's statistical analysis course. ;)

[jerkit]

I think my favorite part of this whole thing is where Ken says that we shouldn’t make Lori’s comments more public than they already are.

[Firiel]

This is definitely my favorite (and others like it):

You like the sensationalism as the .00000000000000000001 chance that some might spank a child too hard, or a wife might submit to an abusive man while following Lori's blog you believe gives you license to even make these wild irresponsible speculations.

SO MANY ZEROS. It's like a one in a quintillion chance, according to Ken. There probably haven't even been that many people in the world EVER.

[salex]

Regarding lori's degrees. I believe but am not 100 percent sure that in the years she was teaching, California teachers first got Bachelors degrees in the subject the were planning to teach then master's in education. With planning this might be done in 5 years total --back then. Again any California teachers, please cprrect me if I have it wrong. Hub's cousin taught in California but she was somewhat older than lori so who knows. Not to mention my memory may be off on this?

[docmom]

This is definitely my favorite (and others like it):

SO MANY ZEROS. It's like a one in a quintillion chance, according to Ken. There probably haven't even been that many people in the world EVER.

There probably haven't been that many complex life forms in the world ever. Math is really not Ken's strong suit is it?

[Firiel]

There probably haven't been that many complex life forms in the world ever. Math is really not Ken's strong suit is it?

There definitely haven't been that many people reading Lori's blog ever!

And we know that at least one of them spanked a child too hard... wasn't there one woman who was afraid she broke her child's arm?

[Gerialc]

Regarding lori's degrees. I believe but am not 100 percent sure that in the years she was teaching, California teachers first got Bachelors degrees in the subject the were planning to teach then master's in education. With planning this might be done in 5 years total --back then. Again any California teachers, please correct me if I have it wrong. Hub's cousin taught in California but she was somewhat older than lori so who knows. Not to mention my memory may be off on this?

To teach in California, you need a Bachelor's (in any subject) and to complete a credential program, which usually takes a year. I know at my school, receiving your Master's takes another 12 units after your initial credential.