Our Little Haven Blog

[nelliebelle1197]

Does anyone ever read Nikki from Our Little Haven? She is the mom of 10, homeschools despite a limited education and what looks to be poverty in small town Vermont. Her blog is not terribly controversial or insightful on the surface, but unlike bright shiny Maxwells, the glamorous Vision Forumers and hate-agenda driven Zsu, Nikki is more of what we think of as a typical fundie - too many kids, limited opportunity, living on Jesus in a run down house on bargain food and charity shop/rummage sale finds. She posts a lot of pictures, often on her garage sale loot and of things people have given her.

I kind of find her fascinating despite the fact that not much happens on her blog other near daily posts of tons of pictures. Her kids all have super Old Testament names. Even Salinn the oldest is really

named Sarah. Oh, look, there's Obediah, too!

Her homeschool philosophy

ourlittlehaven.blogspot.com/2011/09/another-school-day.html

I am pretty sure I found her here. Does anyone know anything about her?

[salex]

Wow, that makes 3 in the last week (The Kleins, the urine in the eye woman and this group) who basically say the Bible is the main textbook and they don't worry about learning things other than things needed by the family.

[BiblebeltCath]

When I was on a fundie listserv for married women, I saw that this is much more of the reality of fundiedom. For every shiny, happy super-family, there are probably at least a hundred barely scraping by, striving to follow all the restrictive rules and shooting themselves in the foot.

I remember they had a series of house tours on the listserv and it was one tiny trailer or very old rural shack after another. They also were all into natural cures because their husband's jobs didn't have insurance and they had no money for the doctor.

[JemimaPuddle-Duck]

I wonder if it varies by location. Where I live all of my friends (fundies mostly) are fairly well-off. We are just run-of-the-mill middle-class, but we're fine. Everybody else is doing pretty well too. I'd say there are two families at our church, and at least two others in a neighboring town who are what I would consider really wealthy for this area, which is well into six figures.

[ViolaSebastian]

One of her daughter's middle names is Taxes. Lydia Ruth Taxes. I must have missed the book of Taxes in the Bible.

[formergothardite]

The regular non-quiverfull fundies I know are less likely to be very poor. There are so many stories I know and have heard from people who grew up in poverty and hated when they heard their mother was pregnant again because they knew it meant less food. I don't think it is that uncommon. I am one of nine children and we weren't rich but compared to many other people we knew who had large families, we seemed rich. I read an article a couple of months ago from a former quiverfull, fundie mother and at one point she only weighed 90 something pounds because they just didn't have enough food, she had been told not to work and that whole "God will provide" idea wasn't working.

Lori needs to go live the lives of these people for a couple of months and see what the lifestyle she advocates is really like.

[docmom]

The regular non-quiverfull fundies I know are less likely to be very poor. There are so many stories I know and have heard from people who grew up in poverty and hated when they heard their mother was pregnant again because they knew it meant less food. I don't think it is that uncommon. I am one of nine children and we weren't rich but compared to many other people we knew who had large families, we seemed rich. I read an article a couple of months ago from a former quiverfull, fundie mother and at one point she only weighed 90 something pounds because they just didn't have enough food, she had been told not to work and that whole "God will provide" idea wasn't working.

Lori needs to go live the lives of these people for a couple of months and see what the lifestyle she advocates is really like.

Lori,as she has amply demonstrated time and again, has absolutely no imagination. She simply cannot comprehend that people out there live lives drastically different from her own. Her answer would be "submit more".

[formergothardite]

I would love to see Lori try to "submit more" when she has 5 kids ages five and under, no car, no health insurance, no nanny, has to teach them all herself, has to cook all the food herself, has to clean the house herself, has to go hungry because there isn't enough food and on top of that she has to have happy sex every time the husband says so. Lori would be singing a whole different tune if she was forced to practice what she preaches.

I feel sad for the Little Haven children. She said that even though she barely teaches things like who past presidents are, there are a couple of her children who voluntarily memorized them. There is so much potential there that is being crushed because she either can't or won't educate her children.

[AllisonWndrland]

I feel like this blog has popped up here before. I remember thinking everyone needed a bath, STAT, then immediately felt like a jerk for judging a woman who appears to be incredibly busy with her children (even though their education is woefully lacking and that just pisses me off). This mother also seems to care about her children, unlike a ton of the other bloggers discussed here. Or maybe I'm confusing this blog with a similar one. I still think they all need a bath, though.

Lori's head would explode if she actually had to do even part of the work this woman appears to do. Reading to the little ones and taking out the trash are on the more recent posts. Lori's recent posts? More of the same drivel about women needing to stay home and shut up. Her act is tired.

[Coco]

scroll through the photos really fast and it's like a stop motion movie! :D i haven't seen that many photos of the same kid same pose except on Facebook.

This is the reality of quiverfull for so many of the families - too many kids, farm animals in squalor conditions (that would be so difficult to keep up with so i understand), tons of plaid. I don't judge them because i'd be doing much worse in those conditions. At least they can afford the internet.

[ILoveJellybeans]

Real life is less like the Duggars but more like the Shraders.

People see the faces of the Quiverfull movement, like the Duggars, Doug and Beall Phillips before the fall, Botkins, Maxwells etc. and see their big broods of happy looking children, all well dressed, healthy looking and living in a nice house with space for everyone. Sure, they may talk about the whole buy used save the difference thing and pretend to be frugal, but they are well off from all the times they speak in front of churches and at fundie events, the successful fundie businesses they run and the books they write.

All of the mommy blogs make large families look so nice as well, with the house looking tidy, children neat and well behaved, posed photos....but I bet they clean the house before every tour of their tiny house and how organised and efficient it is, and crop out dirty laundry or the stain on the carpet where the marker pen the baby found didn't wash out when taking photos, and in reality it looks like every other home that has loads of kids-toys on the floor and unmentionable horrors between the sofa cushions (other than Erika Shupe, you get the feeling that if you moved a piece of furniture an inch to the left or left a fingerprint on a surface that she might kill you). They don't show you how exhausting it is when all five children under five are screaming at the same time, or how tired they are after the baby screamed all night, and only tell stories of misbehaviour when it is minor and cute, or in a post about discipline strategies.

In reality there are way more families where they all go to bed hungry because the father's income doesn't stretch far enough to feed their 10 kids, where the kids have to go without medical care or dentist visits unless it is a serious life threatening emergency because they don't have insurance and cant afford it, where the whole family is crammed into a tiny trailer because they cant afford a bigger house, where the mother actually dreads becoming pregnant again because they are desperate for money, but cant do anything about it because she believes birth control is a sin, and that she must be available sexually for her husband (even if she is heavily pregnant and got 4 hours sleep last night), domestic violence and child abuse are rampant, miserable couples as they didn't know eachother long enough during courtship and actually aren't compatible, but only stay together as divorce is a sin.

Its harder than fundie royalty makes it look, and there is way more poor families than rich ones

[nelliebelle1197]

Real life is less like the Duggars but more like the Shraders.

People see the faces of the Quiverfull movement, like the Duggars, Doug and Beall Phillips before the fall, Botkins, Maxwells etc. and see their big broods of happy looking children, all well dressed, healthy looking and living in a nice house with space for everyone. Sure, they may talk about the whole buy used save the difference thing and pretend to be frugal, but they are well off from all the times they speak in front of churches and at fundie events, the successful fundie businesses they run and the books they write.

All of the mommy blogs make large families look so nice as well, with the house looking tidy, children neat and well behaved, posed photos....but I bet they clean the house before every tour of their tiny house and how organised and efficient it is, and crop out dirty laundry or the stain on the carpet where the marker pen the baby found didn't wash out when taking photos, and in reality it looks like every other home that has loads of kids-toys on the floor and unmentionable horrors between the sofa cushions (other than Erika Shupe, you get the feeling that if you moved a piece of furniture an inch to the left or left a fingerprint on a surface that she might kill you). They don't show you how exhausting it is when all five children under five are screaming at the same time, or how tired they are after the baby screamed all night, and only tell stories of misbehaviour when it is minor and cute, or in a post about discipline strategies.

In reality there are way more families where they all go to bed hungry because the father's income doesn't stretch far enough to feed their 10 kids, where the kids have to go without medical care or dentist visits unless it is a serious life threatening emergency because they don't have insurance and cant afford it, where the whole family is crammed into a tiny trailer because they cant afford a bigger house, where the mother actually dreads becoming pregnant again because they are desperate for money, but cant do anything about it because she believes birth control is a sin, and that she must be available sexually for her husband (even if she is heavily pregnant and got 4 hours sleep last night), domestic violence and child abuse are rampant, miserable couples as they didn't know eachother long enough during courtship and actually aren't compatible, but only stay together as divorce is a sin.

Its harder than fundie royalty makes it look, and there is way more poor families than rich ones

This is exactly why I wanted to give this blog its own thread and didn't even bother being cutesy in the thread title. There are so many issues that come to mind when looking over this blog- so many of the issues we discuss about the realities of quiverfull are right there in those pages. We have proof in print that too many kids too soon leads to unintentional neglect (two of Nikki's under 5s have recently had infected baby teeth and one had to have a ROOT CANAL!), poor education, nutrition, standard of living (for a developed country) and hygiene.

Speaking from my favorite spot in the Bitch Corner with my Bestie Viola Sebastian, I keep trying to believe the house is just old and tired, but I have to face reality that the house is just ... dirty. I'd love to lock Erika Shupe in there for a couple days with no access to cleaning supplies, just to watch her languish in her own personal hell on earth!

[Odd1Out]

Do you think any of these Bible only for homeschool families simply can't afford curriculum/software/supplies and would never admit that?

[ViolaSebastian]

Don't miss her recipe for buttermik squirrel pie...mmm-mmm... :?

Or her post on her youngest crawling up the stairs and falling because the rail was missing a spindle...good Lord, they were worried she had broken her neck because she couldn't move her feet. And lady, that's not 'in and out of sleepiness', that's in and out of freakin' consciousness. It looks like they couldn't afford a baby gate.

ourlittlehaven.blogspot.com/2012/10/mercys-13-month-baby-post.html

Off topic, but I will never in my life understand people (this goes for fundies and non) who think that a horrible accident is a great time to take photos to post on one's blog/facebook/instagram. Thank Jeebus my parents were busy comforting me and talking with the doctors during my childhood mishaps and not busy snapping blog content...

ETA: They had to call 911 a second time after she started choking on a quarter. ourlittlehaven.blogspot.com/2014/01/she-did-it-again.html

[Jana814]

Do you think any of these Bible only for homeschool families simply can't afford curriculum/software/supplies and would never admit that?

In this families case that could be it. I think that feel if they teach only from the Bible the kids will not want to go away from the fold.

[thoughtful]

One of her daughter's middle names is Taxes. Lydia Ruth Taxes. I must have missed the book of Taxes in the Bible.

:::in Rodney Dangerfield's voice:::

Hey, little Taxes, what a cute kid! I guess they're hoping her future husband won't cheat on her!

Do they have a kid name "Death?"

Maybe they're planning to render her unto Caesar!

[fun2beme]

Don't miss her recipe for buttermik squirrel pie...mmm-mmm... :?

I was just laughing with my dad about how so many high-end restaurants in my area are adding rabbit to their menus. My dad grew up dirt poor in the 30s-40s, and they used to hunt rabbits for food. Now all of a sudden, their dish of desperation is becoming a gourmet dish.

But yeah, not sure I could go for the whole squirrel pie thing... plus how many do you need for a pie?

[lawfulevil]

Small game recipes typically call for "a brace", so two squirrels. Preferably young fat ones, stringy ones really ought to find a home in a slow cooker. I was the front end manager for a Big Lots in Oklahoma. Yes, I found it weird, but meat's meat. Especially if you've a huge family to feed and no income increase in sight. I think two squirrels roughly equals one rabbit once they're cleaned. Depends on the squirrels and the rabbit, I'm sure.

[anniebgood]

Do you think any of these Bible only for homeschool families simply can't afford curriculum/software/supplies and would never admit that?

My SIL was homeschooling her 7 kids and one year they literally were too poor to afford new materials so the kids didn't get schooled. They were living in OK then and there was little to no supervision.

Her husband who was a lazy no good fool said public schools were tools of the devil. She was a licensed Vet Tech who didn't work because the same asshole husband didn't want her away from him.

She finally got fed up, put the kids in school and they had a better life. He got a VA disability and that didn't take care of 9 people. He passed away 2 years ago, she got a great job as a traveling technician for a vet specialty computer co, her kids are all out of school or almost and one of the older ones lives at home and takes care of them when she travels.

So yes, families don't always have money to buy new materials.

[antwan]

When I was on a fundie listserv for married women, I saw that this is much more of the reality of fundiedom. For every shiny, happy super-family, there are probably at least a hundred barely scraping by, striving to follow all the restrictive rules and shooting themselves in the foot.

I remember they had a series of house tours on the listserv and it was one tiny trailer or very old rural shack after another. They also were all into natural cures because their husband's jobs didn't have insurance and they had no money for the doctor.

Yes, ditto the natural cures due to lack of insurance (though they'd never admit that; the natural remedies are "preferred.")

[antwan]

I want to adopt Silas. He's soooo cute.

[Mama Mia]

If they can afford the Internet and have a computer they can get materials for free. And since they have blogs they obviously have both those things.

They could put together their own curriculum, or in some states. they can be provided with a computer for every kid and a complete on-line grade appropriate curriculum provided free by the stat.

[antwan]

If they can afford the Internet and have a computer they can get materials for free. And since they have blogs they obviously have both those things.

They could put together their own curriculum, or in some states. they can be provided with a computer for every kid and a complete on-line grade appropriate curriculum provided free by the stat.

True about the free curriculum (Amleside online is one.)

But they would never want the free "public school at home" curriculum offered by the state.

[Coco]

There's the library too, if they couldn't afford a computer or web access as a way to learn for free. But even if they were out in the country with no spare fuel for trips to the library, there's always Goodwill books that could be bought on one trip to town. Goodwill usually has whole sets of encyclopedias that can be bought for almost nothing. Outdated, sure but it would cover the basics. Honestly their lives don't have to be so bleak. But some fundies seem to chose the bleakest road on principle. And of course if they truly wanted the best for their kids they'd have fewer kids that they could actually afford to feed well and raise well, or put them in school where they would have more opportunities from teachers and mentors... and access to programs for kids in need.

[Coco]

Don't miss her recipe for buttermik squirrel pie...mmm-mmm... :?

Or her post on her youngest crawling up the stairs and falling because the rail was missing a spindle...good Lord, they were worried she had broken her neck because she couldn't move her feet. And lady, that's not 'in and out of sleepiness', that's in and out of freakin' consciousness. It looks like they couldn't afford a baby gate.

ourlittlehaven.blogspot.com/2012/10/mercys-13-month-baby-post.html

Off topic, but I will never in my life understand people (this goes for fundies and non) who think that a horrible accident is a great time to take photos to post on one's blog/facebook/instagram. Thank Jeebus my parents were busy comforting me and talking with the doctors during my childhood mishaps and not busy snapping blog content...

ETA: They had to call 911 a second time after she started choking on a quarter. ourlittlehaven.blogspot.com/2014/01/she-did-it-again.html

everyone has cardboard and i'm guessing this family might have duct tape.

i made cardboard/duct tape/fabric railings for our staircase in a rent house because my hubby didn't have time and it was the best i could manage. The railing was originally made of two wagon wheels with a huge open space between them, halfway way up the staircase. At the top it was also open except for the top rail. It was not at all intended for children. I just duct taped a couple layers of moving boxes together to make it as strong as possible. It only took a few hours and we actually left it that way when we moved out and no one complained. :D

If their daughter fell because of one missing spindle that's the parents' fault. i hope she didn't get punished for just being a curious toddler exploring.

eta: found a better photo