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Shraders in Zambia - Welcome to Poisonwood, Stephen- Part 3


happy atheist

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It seems like they limited their Muslim conversion attempts to a single underage girl, and John was content to leave those efforts to Esther for the most part. John was even getting help and advice from his FB followers...a couple of them posted videos about how Jesus is found in the Quran, etc. I'm sure that's mostly some insulting conversion material (a la "Jews for Jesus"), but at least they thought he should make the effort.

John also put out the August newsletter. I can't copy it right now, but if anyone else is on his mailing list they may be able to post it.

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So John has managed to convert a man from one version of Christianity to another. :lol: Wonder how long the conversion will last?

In John's view it doesn't really matter how long it lasts. They believe that "once saved, always saved." So as long as you recite the "Sinners' Prayer" (which isn't mentioned in the Bible anywhere) and get full immersion baptized, they can wipe their hands of you and claim success!

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"Converting one man from Christianity to Christianity." Muchas thankyous for the lulz, Slickcat79!

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Esther is due this month. I keep wondering if anything has happened every time I see this blog bumped to the top.

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He lost substantial support? That means a lot of churches start saying that they won't send the funds they pledged. I've not seen a church do this during my IFB days unless a missionary did something they really didn't approve of. At least when I was IFB missionaries would come, give a presentation and then the church would agree to an amount of money they would send each month. If membership dropped and tithes were low they would still struggle to send the amount they agreed on just because they knew the missionaries were depending on it. John must have really fucked up if churches dropped him after only being there a such short time.

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Part 2 ( file was to big)

Why am I not surprised that John is liberal with the use of the condescending and unnecessary quotation mark?

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It is still true that more people die of AIDS and malaria in a single day in sub-Saharan Africa than have ever died of Ebola.

According to my calculations: 564,300 deaths of malaria annually in sub-Saharan Africa (according to Nothing But Nets) + 1,160,000 deaths of AIDS (according to WHO) = 1,732,300; divided by 365 = 4,736 deaths per day of these two big killers.

Ebola hasn't killed that many people, total, since it was first discovered in 1976. To date this outbreak, by far the worst ever, has killed 1900. The media is right to report this as an unfolding disaster, but they tend to distort.

I'm not saying this to downplay the seriousness of Ebola to those who are actually affected by it, who live in villages and neighborhoods that are quarantined and guarded by soldiers with guns, or who see their loved ones carried off to hospitals never to return. This is a terrible, terrible thing.

But the distance from Senegal, the newly infected country, to Zambia is about 3500 miles as the crow flies. Senegal's closer to Norway than to Zambia. So that's not exactly a clear and present danger to this particular family of silly Americans.

Pneumonia is a big killer of children in Zambia, as is diarrhea. And, as someone mentioned, there's been a severe measles outbreak. These are statistically much bigger threats.

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He is seriously taking money from a "newly planted" missionary church in CHINA? As if these people don't have enough to do among their own local populations. Even if all they wanted to do was convert people to Christianity, they have a much more uphill battle than Shrader. China is a much bigger and more diverse country where Christians make up <10% of the population.

That whole newsletter is one of his more blatant money grubbing attempts. Our house needs work! We're having a new baby! Our belongings were destroyed, including *specific brand* of piano worth at least a few hundred. God bless those who SACRIFICIALLY give!

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Still no mention of the plane. I bet it is not flyable and is trying to figure out how to explain away wasting that much money on an airplane and flight lessons.

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Dear Fool Brother John,

Here's how to up your stats--I saw this work in Malawi in 1990. Wait till the food is nearly gone for the season, then offer food for Baptism or a enough local currency for a beer and you'll be baptising plenty.

Sad but true.

Oh and I sincerely hope your wife won't need blood. I doubt that local midwife has access to a blood supply. I've no doubt she's at least as competent as any Gothard trained midwife (Jill Duggar) and probably has more experience than many, but with that many kids--a Seventh Day Adventist hospital can usually be relied upon to do a decent job. Of course, they expect a muzungu to PAY......

You see John, the 3rd World is not as underdeveloped as you imagine. They understand a concept foreign to you: "Child Spacing" (i.e. Family Planning). And another: Vaccinations that keep their kids from being crippled with polio and other diseases we think of as "erradicated." They also understand that Americans have MONEY and expect them to use it for services rendered. They have relatives who have "been to" the US or UK (that's England to you John, not the University of Kentucky). They have relatives who have more education that you do and who have more common sense.

Get a clue please. You are adding squandering the Goodwill generated by REAL missionaries who care about the PEOPLE first, then the soul.

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He lost substantial support? That means a lot of churches start saying that they won't send the funds they pledged. I've not seen a church do this during my IFB days unless a missionary did something they really didn't approve of. At least when I was IFB missionaries would come, give a presentation and then the church would agree to an amount of money they would send each month. If membership dropped and tithes were low they would still struggle to send the amount they agreed on just because they knew the missionaries were depending on it. John must have really fucked up if churches dropped him after only being there a such short time.

So what happens if something bad happens and they have to leave? Who will give them enough money to purchase 11 plane tickets? Maybe they are counting on crying to Anna who will cry to Boob? It's getting worse by the minute....

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He is seriously taking money from a "newly planted" missionary church in CHINA? As if these people don't have enough to do among their own local populations. Even if all they wanted to do was convert people to Christianity, they have a much more uphill battle than Shrader. China is a much bigger and more diverse country where Christians make up <10% of the population.

That whole newsletter is one of his more blatant money grubbing attempts. Our house needs work! We're having a new baby! Our belongings were destroyed, including *specific brand* of piano worth at least a few hundred. God bless those who SACRIFICIALLY give!

It is astounding that he doesn't see how his taking money from a fledgling church in China proves how this trip is more about his ego than actually saving souls. I am sure a church, however small, in country with a very small Christian population would do more "soul winning" with a little extra money each month than John will just cavorting around Christian-majority Zambia without a plan or any infrastructure for his particular denomination. I would think anyone with any reasoning skills who truly believes souls needs to be "won" for Christ would see this and wonder why John isn't either in China working with that church or else working hard in the US to send money over.

So now not only is the Shraders' little jaunt not winning any new converts, it's actually slowing down the spread of his church worldwide. As someone who despises his brand of Christianity, I guess I should be happy!

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So what happens if something bad happens and they have to leave? Who will give them enough money to purchase 11 plane tickets? Maybe they are counting on crying to Anna who will cry to Boob? It's getting worse by the minute....

Wow. It didn't take John long to annoy his sponsors if he's lost substantial support within 3 months. If the grasping, grifting, bullshitting prayer letter above is representative though, I'm not surprised. Perhaps the sponsoring churches are realizing that he is all talk and very little action. He has done sod all in 3 months, unless you count spending money and possibly converting one person.

Re. the bolded: If something awful happens (arrest, death or emergency) then the U.S. Embassy and Consulate will step in. Well, to an extent. The Consulate will not be pleased at all if John hasn't got proper medical/evacuation insurance and hasn't registered with them yet.

Consulates do have some emergency and discretionary funds but do want to be reimbursed. If I read the paperwork correctly, John's visa depends on the sending Church (Valley Baptist) committing to pay all Shrader expenses in Zambia even if the sponsoring churches drop away. The Consulate will bill Valley Baptist for anything expended for the Shraders.

John is going to have to contact the U.S. Embassy and Consulate to register the the latest little Shrader as a US citizen if he hasn't done so yet. I'd love to be a fly on the wall for that conversation. The Shraders will be pressured to register in case of emergencies.

Regarding medical expenses, it's OK to pay out of pocket for a midwife, but John and family may not qualify for care at many Zambian hospitals without insurance.

Surely John's sending church sent the Shraders to Zambia with basic insurance, even if John thinks it's just optional? If not, are most IFB sending churches that criminally irresponsible? Anyone?

ETA: A belated thanks for changing the thread title. :D

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I would honestly be surprised if he was sent with any sort of insurance. I would love to know what exactly caused a substantial amount of his funds to be cut. Was it the obvious lack of planning when it came to having the visas? His lack of planning when it came to housing? Him practically refusing to try and convert the Muslims he was living next to? Or is it something else that John has managed to hide from the rest of us. For him to lose so much support so fast is just shocking to me. I would think that the churches would buy the idea of him getting settled and having a baby as an excuse for the lack of soul winning. I was expecting it to take a year or so before churches started questing him.

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It is astounding that he doesn't see how his taking money from a fledgling church in China proves how this trip is more about his ego than actually saving souls. I am sure a church, however small, in country with a very small Christian population would do more "soul winning" with a little extra money each month than John will just cavorting around Christian-majority Zambia without a plan or any infrastructure for his particular denomination. I would think anyone with any reasoning skills who truly believes souls needs to be "won" for Christ would see this and wonder why John isn't either in China working with that church or else working hard in the US to send money over.

So now not only is the Shraders' little jaunt not winning any new converts, it's actually slowing down the spread of his church worldwide. As someone who despises his brand of Christianity, I guess I should be happy!

I'm not sure that John is such an egotist. I don't think he's actually thinking "A new church in China should give me money instead of using it itself to save even more souls, because I am John and I am more important!" What I think is more likely is that he is mentally stuck somewhere like an early teenager, where he just doesn't think of other people. So it's not that he sees himself and the China church and thinks he's more important, he just doesn't see the China church as its own entity outside of what it can do for John. We have seen a few times John "repent" for his sins, and I think it is genuine, and that is the emotion he has when he understands that he did something wrong.

I think maybe SOTDRT education is partly responsible for this because they drum in so hard "it's wrong to steal!" "it's wrong to cuss!" and they teach you a huge list of what is wrong to do and they don't have any tolerance. So then something that takes more advanced thinking like "taking a gift from someone who needs it more than I do" just doesn't seem wrong because it's not "stealing" or any of the other bad things.

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You know, if it were anyone but John Shrader, I'd think it pretty awful for a sponsoring church to dump a monetary commitment to a missionary so fast. It does take time to adjust to a new country, and things are always hard to predict in Africa. Unless the missionary had clearly gone off the rails or was doing something definitely against church beliefs then I'd expect at least 6 months latitude and probably more.

Of course, I'd say that John was never on the rails in the first place, and we at FJ have certainly been criticizing the fuzziness and unreality of his plans for months. OTOH, the sponsoring churches had the same info that we did and agreed to fund him any way -- so why are they backing out so quickly. It's been obvious that John hasn't got a clue for ages.

However, we only John's word that he has lost "substantial support." To him that may just be that he hasn't been able to get money for everything he wanted, or individuals are criticizing him for his slow conversion rate and/or unwillingness to go all out and convert Muslims, or perhaps that donations are just slowing down. But " Satan's continually fighting" John. He's such a drama queen!

The Mickey Mouse 501©3 that John channels his donations through strongly advises insurance for missionaries but doesn't require it. If Valley Baptist hasn't insured the Shraders and are left to pay massive bills then I have no sympathy at all. I hold the pastors of that church directly responsible for enabling this irresponsible dimwit.

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I thought she did have some kind of complications with the last baby. Was it just that she was in labor for several days? Can't that end up being dangerous?

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You know, if it were anyone but John Shrader, I'd think it pretty awful for a sponsoring church to dump a monetary commitment to a missionary so fast. It does take time to adjust to a new country, and things are always hard to predict in Africa. Unless the missionary had clearly gone off the rails or was doing something definitely against church beliefs then I'd expect at least 6 months latitude and probably more.

Of course, I'd say that John was never on the rails in the first place, and we at FJ have certainly been criticizing the fuzziness and unreality of his plans for months. OTOH, the sponsoring churches had the same info that we did and agreed to fund him any way -- so why are they backing out so quickly. It's been obvious that John hasn't got a clue for ages.

However, we only John's word that he has lost "substantial support." To him that may just be that he hasn't been able to get money for everything he wanted, or individuals are criticizing him for his slow conversion rate and/or unwillingness to go all out and convert Muslims, or perhaps that donations are just slowing down. But " Satan's continually fighting" John. He's such a drama queen!

The Mickey Mouse 501©3 that John channels his donations through strongly advises insurance for missionaries but doesn't require it. If Valley Baptist hasn't insured the Shraders and are left to pay massive bills then I have no sympathy at all. I hold the pastors of that church directly responsible for enabling this irresponsible dimwit.

That's what makes me think that if it is true he has had a lot of churches back out of their pledges he must have done something else, something we don't know about. John has spent several years being careless with his children and finances, so that should not have been a shock. He had to have done something else to piss off churches.

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I thought she did have some kind of complications with the last baby. Was it just that she was in labor for several days? Can't that end up being dangerous?

Yes, but that was just due to electrolytes coming over from the Japan tsunami. As long as there are no more Japanese tsunamis, her birth will go smoothly. :?

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There has got to be more to the story. I'm sure these churches realize they are not just pulling John's support, the are pulling support to 8.5 small children as well. I can't see any church taking this decision lightly. Maybe the Ebola issue/ fear scared them into telling John to come home....

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IF (because I don't believe half of what John claims and he twists the facts) John has really lost substantial support and churches are pulling out then I want to know why.

What happened to that Shraderfriend guy? I want the real inside dirt. :popcorn2: :popcorn2: :popcorn2:

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