Happy Birthday to Stevie Maxwell (and a BIG newsflash)

[16strong]

He sounds like a pimp. And i hate thinking about this but what if Steve was abusing his daughters with that type of control. He views them as his property something no one else can have but him.

:lol: :lol: :lol:

[Justme]

What's saddest about his daughters never being allowed to marry, is they have been raised their whole lives that the only "role" for a woman is to be a wife and mother. They were not given a good education or skills to support themselves. If Steve and Teri would die in an accident, these girl/women would have a really hard life. Steve said he would leave them the house, but they still need money for taxes, maintenance, utilities, FOOD, etc.

I wonder if any of the reversal boys will marry. They have so little contact with people, unless they go out "caveman style" and grab one.... ;)

[nelliebelle1197]

He sounds like a pimp. And i hate thinking about this but what if Steve was abusing his daughters with that type of control. He views them as his property something no one else can have but him.

I really doubt Steve abuses his daughters in any sort of physical way. He is sick, but nothing indicates he is that sort of sick. I am not sure why you think he sounds like a "pimp". He is not trying to sell his daughters, which is what a pimp would do. He is prideful and their perfection is part of his pride. His daughters have never gotten married because they are wrapped in bubble wrap and no one is good enough to open the package.

I also don't get why other posters think even hinting at sexual abuse it funny.

[Jana814]

I wonder if any of the reversal boys will marry. They have so little contact with people, unless they go out "caveman style" and grab one.... ;)

I think the reversal boys will marry. I mean Joseph almost did. But I still wonder about the girls.

[freejugar]

did we really need eleventy posts about what happened at the fair?

[johnhugh]

did we really need eleventy posts about what happened at the fair?

Off the prayer closet :naughty: - we did as Stevie needed to show us that as well as making penis balloons, Anna could also pump up crazy hat balloons!! :wink-penguin:

Hi Stevie

[Handmaiden of Dog]

I really doubt Steve abuses his daughters in any sort of physical way. He is sick, but nothing indicates he is that sort of sick. I am not sure why you think he sounds like a "pimp". He is not trying to sell his daughters, which is what a pimp would do. He is prideful and their perfection is part of his pride. His daughters have never gotten married because they are wrapped in bubble wrap and no one is good enough to open the package.

I also don't get why other posters think even hinting at sexual abuse it funny.

I don't think posters are hinting at sexual abuse. In this case Toothfairy is using "pimp" as a person with complete control over a a grown woman's life: where she can go, what she can do, who she can see . In our culture there just isn't any good terms to describe that sort of relationship. Slave owner? Prison guard? There is no title or descriptor that is quite right which tells you how sick and unnatural Steve's relationship to his daughters is.

I'm sure deep down in his sick, black, deformed heart Steve justifies his throttle hold by saying if he didn't control every aspect of their lives his daughters might end up going to hell. For some reason he has never understood that you raise your children right so that they have the freedom to make their own choices. That is what life is. It appalls me that there is no legal way to stop him. It appalls me that Teri just stands around like a dummy and lets it happen. It is not sexual abuse but it IS abuse.

[IReallyAmHopewell]

What's saddest about his daughters never being allowed to marry, is they have been raised their whole lives that the only "role" for a woman is to be a wife and mother. They were not given a good education or skills to support themselves. If Steve and Teri would die in an accident, these girl/women would have a really hard life. Steve said he would leave them the house, but they still need money for taxes, maintenance, utilities, FOOD, etc.

I wonder if any of the reversal boys will marry. They have so little contact with people, unless they go out "caveman style" and grab one.... ;)

NO, their brothers would support them and take them into THEIR families, where they would continue to be unpaid help.

[divadivine]

Dear Anna: Burn that outfit. Stop with the side ponytail.

Dear Sarah: Please stop using the word synergy. I realize you don't get off the compound often, but I think you must have a Stevhovah approved dictionary in the house. Take it out & learn some new words.

Dear Mary: Stop it with the crazy eyes.

[ILoveJellybeans]

Dear Anna: Burn that outfit. Stop with the side ponytail.

Dear Sarah: Please stop using the word synergy. I realize you don't get off the compound often, but I think you must have a Stevhovah approved dictionary in the house. Take it out & learn some new words.

Dear Mary: Stop it with the crazy eyes.

But dictionaries wouldn't be fundie approved, unless he goes through the whole thing and crosses out words like sex.

[nelliebelle1197]

I don't think posters are hinting at sexual abuse. In this case Toothfairy is using "pimp" as a person with complete control over a a grown woman's life: where she can go, what she can do, who she can see . In our culture there just isn't any good terms to describe that sort of relationship. Slave owner? Prison guard? There is no title or descriptor that is quite right which tells you how sick and unnatural Steve's relationship to his daughters is.

I'm sure deep down in his sick, black, deformed heart Steve justifies his throttle hold by saying if he didn't control every aspect of their lives his daughters might end up going to hell. For some reason he has never understood that you raise your children right so that they have the freedom to make their own choices. That is what life is. It appalls me that there is no legal way to stop him. It appalls me that Teri just stands around like a dummy and lets it happen. It is not sexual abuse but it IS abuse.

Yeah, we have all been in agreement that the Maxwells are emotionally abusive parents for years. Because it is obvious. Toothfairy does in fact seem to be hinting at sexual abuse when she says: And i hate thinking about this but what if Steve was abusing his daughters with that type of control. He views them as his property something no one else can have but him. We all know there is a lot speculating on here. But speculation about something like that with no evidence is a little much for me.

[Coco]

What's saddest about his daughters never being allowed to marry, is they have been raised their whole lives that the only "role" for a woman is to be a wife and mother. They were not given a good education or skills to support themselves. If Steve and Teri would die in an accident, these girl/women would have a really hard life. Steve said he would leave them the house, but they still need money for taxes, maintenance, utilities, FOOD, etc.

I wonder if any of the reversal boys will marry. They have so little contact with people, unless they go out "caveman style" and grab one.... ;)

This. We can say it a million times and it will still be worth saying again. Fundies have their daughters on a hamster wheel with no way out. They're trained for a life that they have no control over attaining. They can't ask a guy to marry them, and any relationship has to make it through the additional obstacle of their authorities' approval. So not only do they have to "win" the guy, they have to "win" the permission. This can lead to feeling trapped and having mental breakdowns. And compromising their own abilities and talents. Wasted potential for so many girls who don't fit the traditional stereotype.

It's just cruel to limit someone's options in life to a path that they have no power to get to on their own.

[nokidsmom]

This. We can say it a million times and it will still be worth saying again. Fundies have their daughters on a hamster wheel with no way out. They're trained for a life that they have no control over attaining. They can't ask a guy to marry them, and any relationship has to make it through the additional obstacle of their authorities' approval. So not only do they have to "win" the guy, they have to "win" the permission. This can lead to feeling trapped and having mental breakdowns. And compromising their own abilities and talents. Wasted potential for so many girls who don't fit the traditional stereotype.

It's just cruel to limit someone's options in life to a path that they have no power to get to on their own.

To the bolded in both posts above: this is what I find really tragic for a number of the SAHDs that get discussed here. They are raised for a specific type of life, no real education or at least nothing that's broad based enough for them to seek an alternative if plan A doesn't work out plus it's the luck of the draw that daddy isn't a completely controlling, "no one is good enough for my daughter" type who throw every possible obstacle out there.

This is where I feel sorry for the likes of Sarah Maxwell or even the Botkinettes as annoying as those two are. Both are trapped by a fruitcake of a Daddy. Both are trapped by their upbringing and no real education. And what complicates things even more, IMHO, is not only do they have to "win" the guy and the permission, if Daddy shows himself to be too much of an obstacle to suitors, there's lost opportunities to attain the life they have been raised to lead. Not only are these girls and the guys involved are disappointed, never mind the whole "giving away pieces of your heart" nonsense (I do think there's a lot more heartbreak out there in fundieland then what we hear about), but word will get around that Daddy's a problem and guys will steer clear. So eventually the daughters don't get any more chances to even "win" the guy. I wonder if that is where Sarah Maxwell is now.

[FloraKitty35]

:lol: :lol: :lol:

The thought of Stevehovah dressed like Willie the Pimp from the People of Walmart website brings a smile to my face.

[nokidsmom]

I don't think posters are hinting at sexual abuse. In this case Toothfairy is using "pimp" as a person with complete control over a a grown woman's life: where she can go, what she can do, who she can see . In our culture there just isn't any good terms to describe that sort of relationship. Slave owner? Prison guard? There is no title or descriptor that is quite right which tells you how sick and unnatural Steve's relationship to his daughters is.

I'm sure deep down in his sick, black, deformed heart Steve justifies his throttle hold by saying if he didn't control every aspect of their lives his daughters might end up going to hell. For some reason he has never understood that you raise your children right so that they have the freedom to make their own choices. That is what life is. It appalls me that there is no legal way to stop him. It appalls me that Teri just stands around like a dummy and lets it happen. It is not sexual abuse but it IS abuse.

I read Toothfairy's use of the word as someone who controls where, who, what. There is indeed no good word to describe this sort of complete control over an adult person in a non sexual context I suppose, though "prison guard" fits nicely in Steveovah's case.

And unfortunately there's no legal way to stop it as this is dealing with a child over the age of 18. In fact, I would argue that anyone aiming to control a legal adult to this extent that the method of emotional / mental control is what has to work because physically and legally, you can't restrain the person. The only way to exert / maintain the control is to prevent the person in whatever way possible from recognizing that they are free to walk out the door and / or hobble their means to do so. Steve has achieved this on both counts. Plus children who have been raised from day one to always obey parental authority and that to go against that authority is a really, really bad thing that merits punishment (disobey Daddy = going to hell in this case), are going to be perfectly primed for parental control in adulthood. It's a tough thing to shake off.

[Coco]

i wonder what catalyst would help his kids see they could just walk away.

maybe waking up one morning and realizing their dreams aren't going to come true unless they leave.

[salex]

i wonder what catalyst would help his kids see they could just walk away.

maybe waking up one morning and realizing their dreams aren't going to come true unless they leave.

I wonder-- do they have dreams? Or have any dreams beyond doing their duty to the family and going to heaven been stomped out to the point that they just are in the moment--and that moment is controlled by a chore chart and will be til they die and go to heaven?

The things that they might have to look forward to are repetitive--they vacation in colorado every year in the same place and do the same things. Their tours don't include sight seeing just the same thing over and over--maybe different church, but same gig, same sales pitch, interchangeable audiences and "fans".

Same foods, same people, same bible, no outside stimulation. Even when at the fair, they only show themselves preaching to others and handing out pamphlets, not walking through the animal barns or quilting exhibits, which should be benign enough for them to at least see.

I believe they part of the dulling down of life and keeping the adult offspring in a permanent childhood is to eliminate any excitement and anything to look forward to or dream of.

[nokidsmom]

i wonder what catalyst would help his kids see they could just walk away.

maybe waking up one morning and realizing their dreams aren't going to come true unless they leave.

I can tell you from personal experience that this realization is what did it for me. But it's also overcoming the fear of disobeying / displeasing controlling parents. In fact, the kids would have to decide that displeasing Daddy, hell and all, would be preferable to not having a life. Making obeying Daddy = not going to hell is pretty loaded.

[nokidsmom]

I wonder-- do they have dreams? Or have any dreams beyond doing their duty to the family and going to heaven been stomped out to the point that they just are in the moment--and that moment is controlled by a chore chart and will be til they die and go to heaven?

The things that they might have to look forward to are repetitive--they vacation in colorado every year in the same place and do the same things. Their tours don't include sight seeing just the same thing over and over--maybe different church, but same gig, same sales pitch, interchangeable audiences and "fans".

Same foods, same people, same bible, no outside stimulation. Even when at the fair, they only show themselves preaching to others and handing out pamphlets, not walking through the animal barns or quilting exhibits, which should be benign enough for them to at least see.

I believe they part of the dulling down of life and keeping the adult offspring in a permanent childhood is to eliminate any excitement and anything to look forward to or dream of.

Good points. Living lives that repeat over and over and experiencing nothing that's different, would there be anything to hope for or aspire to?

I suppose there could be one thing: girls were probably told at some point that they would be wives and mothers. The boys, they would have a wife, a family and home of their own. I guess the girls were told to clean the kitchen cabinets because "someday you will be a wife and keeper of your own home, so you need to know how to do this" and the boys were told to "learn how to do to this skill (carpentry, IT work, fixing Uriah) because someday you will have your own family to provide for". That's about the only "dream" I can think of that the kids would have been allowed to have

Chances are the kids were told about their "somedays" yet time marches on and that "someday" hasn't happened for the kids still at home. At least two of them, Sarah and Joseph, would have expected that "someday" to have passed already.

[NotALoserLikeYou]

I think hell is a big fear and there's something about it being drilled into you so young that it becomes an unquestionable belief. I struggle with that fear, even when I was being a "good Christian." I struggle with it when I'm going through total unbelief.

[Coco]

Good points. Living lives that repeat over and over and experiencing nothing that's different, would there be anything to hope for or aspire to?

I suppose there could be one thing: girls were probably told at some point that they would be wives and mothers. The boys, they would have a wife, a family and home of their own. I guess the girls were told to clean the kitchen cabinets because "someday you will be a wife and keeper of your own home, so you need to know how to do this" and the boys were told to "learn how to do to this skill (carpentry, IT work, fixing Uriah) because someday you will have your own family to provide for". That's about the only "dream" I can think of that the kids would have been allowed to have

Chances are the kids were told about their "somedays" yet time marches on and that "someday" hasn't happened for the kids still at home. At least two of them, Sarah and Joseph, would have expected that "someday" to have passed already.

ITA, surely they've been taught to have dreams of being a wife and mom or dad and spiritual leader... or even dreams of reaching people for God. Eventually they have to realize they're preaching to the choir. If they wanted to be missionaries they'd need to get training. If they think God only expects them to honor their dad as an extension of God on earth, earning rewards in heaven by doing every little chore as unto the Lord -- well that's not going to go on forever, they'll live longer. Surely that's crossed their minds.

[Coco]

I can tell you from personal experience that this realization is what did it for me. But it's also overcoming the fear of disobeying / displeasing controlling parents. In fact, the kids would have to decide that displeasing Daddy, hell and all, would be preferable to not having a life. Making obeying Daddy = not going to hell is pretty loaded.

For me it was just not wanting to die a virgin. :lol: I was all for being a fundie but there weren't any takers, and after two of my younger sisters got married i kind of gave up hope waiting for a guy to materialize. There just aren't many fish in a puddle. I guess that's what the annual Big Sandy thing and other ATI retreats are for - seeing the other marriage prospects out there. For my family when we were Mennonites it was Youth Bible School. They'd do all these weird things to try to get the guys and girls to mingle. Seating arrangements changed at every meal. It was a-w-k-w-a-r-d. :lol:

[Coco]

I think hell is a big fear and there's something about it being drilled into you so young that it becomes an unquestionable belief. I struggle with that fear, even when I was being a "good Christian." I struggle with it when I'm going through total unbelief.

me too. The years of being under that scary burden. :x It changed for me when one of my friends made a comment that Corrie ten Boom couldn't have been a true Christian because she wore jewelry. :cray-cray: And i read The Cross and the Switchblade. It just made me realize God has true believers everywhere -- it's so dumb we were taught that only people who followed these rules from our church in our country the way our preacher said to live, were godly. (down to things like not having little girls wear barrettes that matched their dresses). They got into that whole thing of "others may but you cannot" and "whoever knows something to be sin that thing is sin to him" Stupid, legalistic rules.

If God has Christians in every walk of life then obviously the definition of Christian is way broader than kids like me were taught to think. After that it just made more sense to live by love and quit trying to judge who was godly. Those verses, "what does God require of you but to do justice, love mercy and walk humbly", and the two commandments that Jesus talked about were loving God and loving other people. Not a bunch of stupid lifestyle rules. One of the leaders of the church i was part of, Denny Kenaston, passed away of a brain tumor a couple of years ago. It's very sad... but he was a very harsh preacher until close to the end. His preaching was super strident. It caused a lot of young people to really struggle with heavy burdens. Anyway, after he passed away i just kept thinking wow it must be amazing to him to see just who else is there, you know? There's even that verse about every tribe and nation being there.

sorry for the wall of text it's just with Robin Williams passing away this is all i can think about. i have to believe God cares about a person's heart being toward loving others more than about following rules. Anyway most of the rules in the Bible are based on not hurting others because we're supposed to love them more than ourselves...

[Haligh the Liar]

I saw this in front of my house the other day, and immediately freaked out.

Has Steve Maxwell moved to Maryland?!?!?!

[uber frau]

It's like that annoying take on the "no fear" sticker from the nineties. Except that with Steve it's "Know Jesus, no fun/no Jesus, know fun".