The Mallys at NEA Convention

[GeoBQn]

The Mallys went to the National Education Association Convention in Denver. While there, they set up a booth on creationism and tried to rope unsuspecting public school teachers into conversation.

tomorrowsforefathers.com/gracenotes/?p=13067

My dad was a public school history teacher and used to go to conventions like this about every other year. This makes me wonder whether he ever encountered yahoos like the Mallys there. They wouldn't have gotten very far with him--he's Jewish, and doesn't feel that he owes proselytizers any politeness or time.

[anniebgood]

Perhaps the NEA needed some comic relief...... :pink-shock:

[Miggy]

Speaking of the Mally's ... can anyone tell me about "Bright Lights"? I think it's a bible study course written by Sarah. When I went to the Bright Lights site there was information about meetings and conferences but I couldn't find info about the books that a home school mum would be using.

[artdecades]

I was at ALA a couple weeks ago and there were quite a few religious publishers there. Thankfully, ALA lumped them all in one section so the Jesus freaks were right next to the Scientologists, which made me laugh. Kinda wish the Mallys were there for laughs, cuz librarians would not have that at all.

Also, some SOTDRT greatness here

Dr. John is speaking here with an Native American young man.

[SoybeanQueen]

Ugh. If I were there for work, I can't imagine being pleased to have someone try to engage me in religious conversation. That's when I would have to avert my eyes and pretend I didn't even notice them there.

[Marian the Librarian]

I was at ALA a couple weeks ago and there were quite a few religious publishers there. Thankfully, ALA lumped them all in one section so the Jesus freaks were right next to the Scientologists, which made me laugh. Kinda wish the Mallys were there for laughs, cuz librarians would not have that at all.

Also, some SOTDRT greatness here

Oy - fundies hoping to convert attendees at an ALA conference, I can only imagine! Those who know anything about librarians know we provide information representing all sides, while striving to remain neutral.

On the rare occasion that this happens in my workplace, my standard response is, "As a city/county/state (take your pick) government employee, it's not appropriate for me to engage in this conversation with you." Lather, rinse, repeat; walk away as necessary.

[nelliebelle1197]

Speaking of the Mally's ... can anyone tell me about "Bright Lights"? I think it's a bible study course written by Sarah. When I went to the Bright Lights site there was information about meetings and conferences but I couldn't find info about the books that a home school mum would be using.

Isn't this thing (for want of a better word) more of a way to organize a youth group but not a youth group for the SAHD crowd? That was my understanding.

[lilah]

Bright Lights is a youth group type activity, it's mostly focused on being a virgin and loving Jesus. It's why I refer to Sarah Mally as a professional virgin because she seems to show no interest in getting married because she's have to give up her very profitable ministry.

The exchange with the athiest was so weird. I'd love to actually debate the Mally's about how it is possible to be moral without religion. (given that so many awful things are done in the name of religion)

[dairyfreelife]

Perhaps the NEA needed some comic relief...... :pink-shock:

Based off the supposed conversations, it sounds like they got it.

Not buying the chemistry teacher responses though.

Dr. John joined the conversation, sharing some things about chemistry (which were above my level!), and pointing out flaws in the evolution model.

The chemistry teacher said, “I agree with you, evolution is definitely an uphill battle…†and expressed that it was the harder route to believe.

“So why is it that you choose to believe Evolution?†I asked him.

“Yes, why do you believe the more unlikely option?†Dr. John added.

“It just feels right!†he said, “It feels good to me.â€

For some reason I can't buy that a he 'believed' in evolution because 'it feels right/good'. I hear that from many Christians that they get that answer, but every person in science I know has never said such a thing because they know the details and know how science theories actually work. Hell, I'm not in any science and I know how the difference in a theory in other disciplines versus a theory in science.

Good to know the Mallys know so little about it really. My small science education levels could bring their arguments down. That's sad because I got a C in chemistry in college. :? Don't mock, I suck at math calculations. That's what got me and why I had to drop physics. Advanced math is not my forte sadly.

Evolution arguments are the same. The missing link bullshit is a common one.

The biggest of all is that it's entirely based on an ancient book, so all their 'well, the Bible says...' answers to serious questions could be knocked down by any non-Christian fast...funny how so few, if any, evangelist bloggers ever discuss the conversations that tear their arguments down. It's always about them succeeding and see how dumb atheists/non-Christians in general are and how we tear them down so easy.

Their logic is flawed because they tend to go one way in their conversation that there's one alternative to any answer if the answer is not the one they want. I can say, no, I'm not Michelle Obama. Why not...well, I'm white and don't live in Washington D.C and don't have any Ivy League education. The logical conclusion would then be that I must be Britney Spears. She's white, doesn't live in D.C and doesn't have an Ivy League education. However, the logic is still false because I am not her either. Point is that logic doesn't work that if it's not one thing, it must be another. They say if evolution has a flaw, it must mean creationism is true and their idea of God is real. Except even if evolution turned out to suddenly not be true, it does not automatically mean that creationism is true. And that's where they fail and fall hard.

[Miggy]

The whole argument against evolution comes crashing down if you ditch your KJV and go back to the Greek bible and that key word "kairos". It has been translated as "day" which the fundies take to mean a twenty four hour period but it meaning is more a "period of time" or "at the right time". Once you have that the world is created in six periods of time and not 6 x 24 hours, then evolution fits really neatly into the bible.

This is why I get so annoyed with Christians who take the whole bible literally but refuse to look at more than one translation. I don't understand why they think those who translated KJV were perfect but those who did Good News, NIV or Contemporary English made mistakes.

... and Mr Miggy, a Christian who happens to be a chemistry lecturer, believes in evolution and hates fundies. If the Mally's approached him at an expo ...?

[shedemei]

The whole argument against evolution comes crashing down if you ditch your KJV and go back to the Greek bible and that key word "kairos". It has been translated as "day" which the fundies take to mean a twenty four hour period but it meaning is more a "period of time" or "at the right time". Once you have that the world is created in six periods of time and not 6 x 24 hours, then evolution fits really neatly into the bible.

If you mean the creation story, then I think you mean the original Hebrew and the word יןם. My understanding is that yom can be understood as a non-literal day as it's used in the creation story before then sun is created.

[Miggy]

I don't know Hebrew, only Greek, but I believe the two words have the same meaning. Either way, pre-KJV, there was never a suggestion of the 6 x 24 world creation. Reading Genesis without a time scale in mind, the order of creation matches the order of evolution. The bible doesn't say how God created each stage so therefore, it is possible that God used the Big Bang as a way to create the universe, God used evolution to create plants & animals, etc.

Edit to add: Mr Miggy & I are both doing history degrees for fun. As part of it, he is learning Hebrew & Latin and I am learning Greek and Russian. (We then help each other.) Neither of us are experts but, with what we've learnt, we have a very different perspective on many historical documents. I find it scary how many people think they can just get up and preach, reciting what they have been taught. I would love it if they would all go and study, read various translations of the bible, read non religious texts from the same time, listen to other opinions ... then, with an education, start preaching.

[lilah]

Really interesting stuff! I also know that "thall shalt not suffer a witch to live" is also a mistranslation where witch can also be female poisoner. Also the some translations say the messiah would be born of a maiden, not nesecarily a virgin.

I do think if the Mally's encounter someone who stumps they carefully edit those encounters out of the blog. Or just say that they prayed over that smart evolutionist's soul.

[Trynn]

Wasn't the word for young woman synonymous with virgin at that time? I wonder if, because of the rules about premarital sex, Virgin was synonymous with maiden? Or something like that.

[DifferentGurl]

I don't know Hebrew, only Greek, but I believe the two words have the same meaning. Either way, pre-KJV, there was never a suggestion of the 6 x 24 world creation. Reading Genesis without a time scale in mind, the order of creation matches the order of evolution. The bible doesn't say how God created each stage so therefore, it is possible that God used the Big Bang as a way to create the universe, God used evolution to create plants & animals, etc.

Edit to add: Mr Miggy & I are both doing history degrees for fun. As part of it, he is learning Hebrew & Latin and I am learning Greek and Russian. (We then help each other.) Neither of us are experts but, with what we've learnt, we have a very different perspective on many historical documents. I find it scary how many people think they can just get up and preach, reciting what they have been taught. I would love it if they would all go and study, read various translations of the bible, read non religious texts from the same time, listen to other opinions ... then, with an education, start preaching.

My family's got a similar philosophy about creation ( and we never even studied the book in Greek or Hebrew! ). 7 days could have meant 7 million years, etc. How do we know that God didn't use evolution to create things? It is all possible.

Then again, people that take the Bible literally don't even consider things like what the Bible was in Greek or Hebrew or the culture that the authors lived in, etc.

[naatashamaru]

Oy - fundies hoping to convert attendees at an ALA conference, I can only imagine! Those who know anything about librarians know we provide information representing all sides, while striving to remain neutral.

On the rare occasion that this happens in my workplace, my standard response is, "As a city/county/state (take your pick) government employee, it's not appropriate for me to engage in this conversation with you." Lather, rinse, repeat; walk away as necessary.