Homeschool blogger wants "No Happiness or Peace" for child

[littleSable]

A homeschool blogger (who I believe is affiliated with Pioneer Woman?) writes that she wants "no happiness or peace" for her 17 year old daughter, who ran off with her 21 year old boyfriend.

heathersanders.com/2014/05/28/beauty-for-ashes/

First time posting a thread, hopefully I do it right! Mods, feel free to move or fix if I did this wrong.

[chaotic life]

You did it right. I feel very stabby right now.

I'm so tired of religious fundamentalists and conservatives who cannot see that children are separate beings from their parents! First, there's a concept called UNCONDITIONAL LOVE. If you cannot wrap your pea-sized brain around it as a parent, then you don't deserve the children you call yourself parent to. Second, as much as every parent who has ever lived WANTS to spare our children from their mistakes and having to learn life's lessons the hard way, we simply cannot do so. Third, who cares if your child was living a double life. Care far, FAR more about the fact that she could not trust you to tell you who she really was in the first place. Your failure is not that she was someone independent of what you tried to make her become. Your failure is that you failed to see who she was and make your home a SAFE PLACE for her to be herself.

All that said, I would be extremely worried about my 17 year old having taken off with a 21 year old boyfriend. If TX does not have a Romeo and Juliet law, then that fully falls under statutory rape, and given she is not yet a legal adult, it also falls under a failure as her parent to keep her safe and in the home until she turned 18. There are no easy answers to these questions. You can go a legal route and report her as a runaway, which will drive a massive wedge in your relationship but will bring her home when she is picked up, at least until her 18th birthday. If you truly believe this boyfriend is dangerous, then that is the route you must take, even though it is extremely hard. Or, if you do not feel he is dangerous, and/or she is close to her 18th birthday, you can try the unconditional love route, to try in retrospect to give her a safe place to be loved and open about who she is and shelf your condemnation and moral righteousness for something you vent to your friends and never to your child.

I'm guessing blogging and heaping a curse of no happiness nor well-being upon her is probably the option 3 you should NOT take in this situation.

I have teeangers. It's HARD to parent them. It's even harder when they disagree with you on life choices. But, you must remember these are their choices to make and never yours. It's not personal that they want to learn how to step out into their own lives. It's part of the painful process of growing up. Histronics like these only make it more painful and reconciliation harder.

[salex]

17 in TX may be able to consent, not fall under statutory rape.

dallascriminaldefenselawyerblog.com/2008/05/texas-age-of-consent-law.html

A reader asked me what the age of consent is in Texas. Great question. Let me begin by stating there is no section of the Texas Penal Code that defines “age of consent.†Rather, you have to begin in the Sexual Assault Provisions of the TPC.

§ 22.011. SEXUAL ASSAULT.

(a) A person commits an offense if the person:

(2) intentionally or knowingly:

(A) causes the penetration of the anus or sexual organ of a child by any means;

(B) causes the penetration of the mouth of a child by the sexual organ of the actor;

© causes the sexual organ of a child to contact or penetrate the mouth, anus, or sexual organ of another person, including the actor;

(D) causes the anus of a child to contact the mouth, anus, or sexual organ of another person, including the actor; or

(E) causes the mouth of a child to contact the anus or sexual organ of another person, including the actor.

This begs the question- What is a child?

© In this section:

(1) “Child†means a person younger than 17 years of age

who is not the spouse of the actor.

Mom is effectively putting a curse on her own daughter? Nice.

I am not one who promotes unconditional love, but there is also a point where the kid is an adult and if you want a relationship in the future, you have to stand back and watch and hope things go better than you think they will.

[Marianne]

Plus, 17 and 21 years old is really not a big deal. Seriously. This people are crazy. there's nothing more normal that a teenager having a boyfriend.

[ILoveJellybeans]

Its sad that fundies don't have unconditional love for their children.

[NotALoserLikeYou]

Plus, 17 and 21 years old is really not a big deal. Seriously. This people are crazy. there's nothing more normal that a teenager having a boyfriend.

She acts like her child has died and she is grieving that loss. Her 17yo daughter has a boyfriend, it could be worse!

Also, I get a weird vibe from this woman, but maybe it's just the constant blogging. She just seems very obsessive about a lot of things.

[Coco]

Plus, 17 and 21 years old is really not a big deal. Seriously. This people are crazy. there's nothing more normal that a teenager having a boyfriend.

Right. If these bloggers are all about bringing back the pioneer days, well that's a ripe old age to get hitched. She should have a driver's license and maybe even a job by then. Time to let go, if the guy is a decent guy. Not an ideal situation, but close enough to adult to just back off.

[Letgo]

I read her blog and I'd be worried, too. It sounds as if the parents were not too thrilled about the guy. I have no idea what happened here, but as a general rule, family and friends ought to like the boyfriend or girlfriend, in my experience. If the people closest to you don't like him or her, find out why. They may have valid reasons. If this girl is 17 she is under age. I would not be comfortable for my 17 year old to date a 21 year old. A four year age difference is too much at those ages. (I also didn't like the idea of David Brown marrying...Monica?, I think. He was only 17 as I recall and she was 22 or 23? Maybe even worse since boys tend to mature later. But I digress.) Anyway, I can't fault the mom for being worried. This isn't an issue of too much parental control to me, but one of she is under age and left home to live with an older guy. Has she graduated from high school or home school? Does she have a job or is she dependent on him? Does he isolate her? There are a lot of possibilities here, and as a parent who did have a child date a controlling, abusive guy, this sets off alarm bells for me. Also, judging from the photos on the blog, the parents appear to let the kids have quite a bit of freedom. The mom says the daughter is an independent thinker. At least it doesn't sound like an ATI/VF type of parenting.

[NotALoserLikeYou]

The mom said the boyfriend was a "false prophet" - wolf is sheep's clothing. I wonder what she meant by that.

[FloraKitty35]

In the "good old days" (circa 1895) the age of consent for her daughter would have been 10 years old (in Delaware).

[Emme]

In the realm of "scary comments" on the post: "I have my own Emily, 15 years, who causes me much heartache as well. They are very alike in that they are both artsy, march-to-their-own-beat type girls. Depression, cutting, bulimia, extreme-in-your-face-defiance, refusal to do schoolwork to the point that she is almost two years behind – it’s enough to make this homeschool momma throw up her hands and give up. But God! That is all I can say. I so don’t get His ways but I have to learn to live with them. It seems very strange to pray that one’s own child suffer the consequences of her bad choices, but that is where I am at with her. I will pray for you and for your Emilie. I will pray that God protects your hearts and minds from the lies that Satan tries to bombard you with, and that Christ’s love would shine through the darkness and turn her heart back to Him and to you.

If your child is 15, depressed, cutting, and bulimic, you should NOT want her to suffer the consequences of her bad choices. You should be GETTING THEM HELP. It's not god teaching you anything. It's your child screaming out for help in every way possible.

[Coco]

In the "good old days" (circa 1895) the age of consent for her daughter would have been 10 years old (in Delaware).

:pull-hair: wow i had no idea it was that young. My grandma got married in the 1940's at 16 to a 32 year old and had 5 kids in less than 5 years. My grandma's sister got married at 13. (Both of them to WWII vets in a rural area). But 10 is so icky, esp. since in the 1800's didn't girls used to get to puberty later?

[Coco]

In the realm of "scary comments" on the post: "I have my own Emily, 15 years, who causes me much heartache as well. They are very alike in that they are both artsy, march-to-their-own-beat type girls. Depression, cutting, bulimia, extreme-in-your-face-defiance, refusal to do schoolwork to the point that she is almost two years behind – it’s enough to make this homeschool momma throw up her hands and give up. But God! That is all I can say. I so don’t get His ways but I have to learn to live with them. It seems very strange to pray that one’s own child suffer the consequences of her bad choices, but that is where I am at with her. I will pray for you and for your Emilie. I will pray that God protects your hearts and minds from the lies that Satan tries to bombard you with, and that Christ’s love would shine through the darkness and turn her heart back to Him and to you.

If your child is 15, depressed, cutting, and bulimic, you should NOT want her to suffer the consequences of her bad choices. You should be GETTING THEM HELP. It's not god teaching you anything. It's your child screaming out for help in every way possible.

[Mama Mia]

I would be shocked if the police would do anything about a 17 year old runaway, especially in a state where there is nothing illegal about her relationship.

I am really hoping the mother is just letting off steam. Unfortunately she's doing the kind of venting that should be kept to your closest friend or spouse or in a paper diary with a lock, or as an annonymous poster on a forum - NOT to the entire freaking world under your own name about a child who has grown up on your freaking blog! :angry-banghead:

17 was the absolute most frustrating age with all of my kids. I think what the mom was trying to say, although very badly, is that she hopes that her daughter discovers that life is going to be rough living with a guy who may have some bad traits, without a high school diploma or a job and that living with no rules isn't all it's cracked up to be so that she comes home quickly.

Like if your kid is partying or hanging out with gangbangers and you want them to realize that is a bad path before they get seriously hurt. So you hope that they don't just see the romance or glamour in the situation. Not that you want something bad to happen, you just want them to see the dangers - if that makes sense.

Personally I don't see a problem with the age difference, but I wouldn't want my kid moving out if they were still in high school. I would certainly rather the boyfriend was hanging out at my house, even if I disliked him, than having my daughter run off. And of course there is the old truism about forbidden fruit....

[Coco]

You did it right. I feel very stabby right now.

I'm so tired of religious fundamentalists and conservatives who cannot see that children are separate beings from their parents! First, there's a concept called UNCONDITIONAL LOVE. If you cannot wrap your pea-sized brain around it as a parent, then you don't deserve the children you call yourself parent to. Second, as much as every parent who has ever lived WANTS to spare our children from their mistakes and having to learn life's lessons the hard way, we simply cannot do so. Third, who cares if your child was living a double life. Care far, FAR more about the fact that she could not trust you to tell you who she really was in the first place. Your failure is not that she was someone independent of what you tried to make her become. Your failure is that you failed to see who she was and make your home a SAFE PLACE for her to be herself.

All that said, I would be extremely worried about my 17 year old having taken off with a 21 year old boyfriend. If TX does not have a Romeo and Juliet law, then that fully falls under statutory rape, and given she is not yet a legal adult, it also falls under a failure as her parent to keep her safe and in the home until she turned 18. There are no easy answers to these questions. You can go a legal route and report her as a runaway, which will drive a massive wedge in your relationship but will bring her home when she is picked up, at least until her 18th birthday. If you truly believe this boyfriend is dangerous, then that is the route you must take, even though it is extremely hard. Or, if you do not feel he is dangerous, and/or she is close to her 18th birthday, you can try the unconditional love route, to try in retrospect to give her a safe place to be loved and open about who she is and shelf your condemnation and moral righteousness for something you vent to your friends and never to your child.

I'm guessing blogging and heaping a curse of no happiness nor well-being upon her is probably the option 3 you should NOT take in this situation.

I have teeangers. It's HARD to parent them. It's even harder when they disagree with you on life choices. But, you must remember these are their choices to make and never yours. It's not personal that they want to learn how to step out into their own lives. It's part of the painful process of growing up. Histronics like these only make it more painful and reconciliation harder.

One of my best friends married a guy in our super-conservative youth group, and over time my friend and her hubby left the church to go to a less conservative church. It made his parents mad to the point that they actually MOVED to another state to "keep their other kids safe from his influence". And what my friend and her hubby were doing was just innocent stuff like modest jeans, Christian music, etc. It basically destroyed the relationship between the parents and their son. They even asked other parents' opinions on what they did wrong in raising their son, that he turned out to be such a "failure"!! (and he found out about them asking that) It was so bad that when they brought their other kids (his siblings) over for a visit around Christmas time and saw their Christmas tree, they turned around and walked out the door. All the drama only settled my friend and her hubby even more in their ways. If his parents wanted to really change him they would have treated him like an adult, and discussed their concerns. But they never established that level of trust, it was all obey or the highway. They're losing some of their other kids "to the world" too, which might not have happened if they'd just have admitted that becoming an adult means that you do sometimes make mistakes and you choose your own path. Respect goes a long way toward making kids want to believe like their parents.

[LittleOleMe]

These are comments are really telling. People are telling her she is wrong to post this stuff and she just brushes it off like it's no big deal, you just don't understand her, but her daughter does, so it's all good.

Lynn

This thought keeps coming back to me, over and over again. So I’m going to type it out. See what you think: If I were a teenager today, how would I feel with my photos, my decisions and rebellion plastered all over a blog so whoever/wherever/gets to read all about it? When I asked myself that, my answer is always “Enraged!!!†I know that we live in a very different world than it was when I was Emelie’s age…but do things like privacy really change? Food-for-thought.

Heather Sanders

Lynn – I think yours is a valuable question to ask. The kids have been active, willing parts of my blog for years. Since I am a homeschooling blogger by occupation, we have lived our lives with more transparency than most. While this particular post is about parenting, the other most recent posts were not. Emelie has read the posts and most of the comments; we discussed them briefly last weekend. I have protected her privacy with purposeful vagueness while at the same time attempting the level of transparency I need to continue writing about homeschooling with an obvious missing ingredient.

RE

Wrong. The level of transparency you needed was the following statement:

“Emelie has moved out of her own.â€

Then follow with whatever homeschooling post you were going to make regarding Meredith’s and Kenny’s educations.

What you have done is absolutely appalling parenting: trying to publicly shame your daughter on the internet. You know the internet is forever. Are you trying to ensure that she has the hardest time possible getting jobs and making her way in the future so she has to admit defeat and come back under your control no matter how old she is? This is evil.

Heather Sanders

RE – I appreciate your willingness to write what you have. I’ve thought about all you’ve written–even before you commented; in fact, way before I posted what I did. Defeat will not be part of Emelie’s future–her future is bright. She is wickedly creative, brilliantly brave and incredibly kind. Our response is not about control, despite what some may think. It is about love. I love her. We love her. We want the best for her NOW and in the future. She knows that.

[Geechee Girl]

I'm failing to understand the mom's use of the following verse:

http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Matthew+7%3A15-19&version=NIV

In my reading of the passage, it would also aptly describe her and her husband's parenting by producing bad fruit (daughter). I hope the girl is like, "deuces" to her parents for this public shaming.

[polecat]

Reading the posts here, I was ready to dig into this woman. Pretty much all I want for my kids is peace and happiness. But when I read the post -- and maybe I'm reading between the lines here -- I got a different picture. She says,

"Naturally, I am praying safety over her, but at the same time, asking that she find no happiness or peace in her current path, which can only lead to despair."

"In her current path" seems to be a pretty important part of that sentence. Now, I don't agree with THAT sentiment, either, necessarily, but at the same time, I understand it. If one of mine ran away with a partner at 17, I'd want them to come to their senses quickly, and that might require a little personal disquiet and unhappiness.

That said ...

I certainly would not have published a blog entry of that nature, which seems to me would only hurt and alienate the child further. I'd be more hurt and saddened that my child couldn't even trust me with the most important parts of his life. I'd feel horribly guilty. I wouldn't blog a huge entry about how my kid had betrayed me (as she does in multiple paragraphs!) because I think I'd feel as though I'd failed my kid.

Regardless, kids grow up. At some point, you've got to let them find their wings and make their own choices. This is absolutely not a choice I'd be happy with, but it's also not a choice I'd risk destroying my relationship with my child over. Not only is this path likely to be destructive, as the blogger says, but it's also likely to end in heartbreak and the need for soft, loving, nonjudgmental parents' arms.

[chaotic life]

As I said, if whatever the child has done truly involves something unsafe, then as the mother you must exercise your legal authority that she is not in fact a legal adult and call the authorities. Yes, the police WILL return her from an unsafe situation, even against her wishes, and charge her with a crime for running away if necessary.

If this is not about an unsafe situation, then it is something in which there is a personality conflict. At that point, there is not something you truly have the right to dictate to a near-adult child. Outside of something dangerous that you can still step in as the legal parent of a minor child, this is the point when you have to let children choose their path and make their own mistakes.

I am pleased to see that others are standing up to her. Frankly, that open and "transparent" oversharing of her daughter's life feels like a way to shame and bully the 17 year old to me.

[BravaAmica]

At no time does this blooger hint that her daughter might be in an unsafe situation. The post is all about "me, me, me, what will the neighbors say, me, me, me, my daughter is such a sinner, me, me, me, i hope she's not happy..." There is no unconditional love in that family. Just because they let their kids wear Converse lowtops and have different hair colors doesn't mean that the parents aren't people who value absolute obedience over anything else. It's so sad. At no time does this woman ask herself, "Why did my daughter feel so unsafe in our family that she could not be herself?" Nope. Not her. She asks herself, "Why is my daughter such a horrible sinner?" I mean, she stops short of calling her a slut or whore. I don't blame the daughter for leaving the first chance she gets.

[Coco]

At no time does this blooger hint that her daughter might be in an unsafe situation. The post is all about "me, me, me, what will the neighbors say, me, me, me, my daughter is such a sinner, me, me, me, i hope she's not happy..." There is no unconditional love in that family. Just because they let their kids wear Converse lowtops and have different hair colors doesn't mean that the parents aren't people who value absolute obedience over anything else. It's so sad. At no time does this woman ask herself, "Why did my daughter feel so unsafe in our family that she could not be herself?" Nope. Not her. She asks herself, "Why is my daughter such a horrible sinner?" I mean, she stops short of calling her a slut or whore. I don't blame the daughter for leaving the first chance she gets.

The mom has too much invested in the way she raised her kids to allow them to make mistakes... you're right, it's all about her.

Reading the posts here, I was ready to dig into this woman. Pretty much all I want for my kids is peace and happiness. But when I read the post -- and maybe I'm reading between the lines here -- I got a different picture. She says,

"Naturally, I am praying safety over her, but at the same time, asking that she find no happiness or peace in her current path, which can only lead to despair."

"In her current path" seems to be a pretty important part of that sentence. Now, I don't agree with THAT sentiment, either, necessarily, but at the same time, I understand it. If one of mine ran away with a partner at 17, I'd want them to come to their senses quickly, and that might require a little personal disquiet and unhappiness.

That said ...

I certainly would not have published a blog entry of that nature, which seems to me would only hurt and alienate the child further. I'd be more hurt and saddened that my child couldn't even trust me with the most important parts of his life. I'd feel horribly guilty. I wouldn't blog a huge entry about how my kid had betrayed me (as she does in multiple paragraphs!) because I think I'd feel as though I'd failed my kid.

Regardless, kids grow up. At some point, you've got to let them find their wings and make their own choices. This is absolutely not a choice I'd be happy with, but it's also not a choice I'd risk destroying my relationship with my child over. Not only is this path likely to be destructive, as the blogger says, but it's also likely to end in heartbreak and the need for soft, loving, nonjudgmental parents' arms.

:clap: :clap: :clap:

[feministxtian]

I saw this earlier and had to stick my 2 cents in..."mom of a few"....this bitch makes me a wee bit crazy (like wanting to confront her in person and let her have it crazy)

[LittleOleMe]

Not only that but she has posted THREE separate posts about this. THREE! She posted the one that was linked and then another full of pictures with random "I love you" "we love you" "come home" mixed in and then another where she doesn't directly come out and say it's about her daughter but it clearly is.

And you're right. She never says anything about WHY her daughter feels the way she does. My mother used to do this, too. "I know you hate me, but .." "I know you don't like me, but .." One day I finally said "You always say that but you never ask why" She was just dumbfounded. It never occurred to her to think of anyone but herself. That's exactly what this mom sounds like. She doesn't care about her daughter outside of how it makes her feel and look. That's not an easy situation to grow up in, and if this guy is giving her the proper attention and making her feel special, then I don't blame her for leaving. She may regret it later, but thanks to her mother publicly shaming and bullying her, she will probably never admit it, making her even more miserable and unhappy, essentially making her mother's predictions come true.

[LittleOleMe]

I saw this earlier and had to stick my 2 cents in..."mom of a few"....this bitch makes me a wee bit crazy (like wanting to confront her in person and let her have it crazy)

I read your's and Charlie's exchanges with her. She really does not get it, does she? She clearly did nothing wrong and she isn't to blame for this so everyone needs to understand that. I really hope Emelie finds peace and happiness away from her mother. That bitch is batshit crazy.

ETA: She has since closed comments on that post. Guess she didn't like you two asking the hard questions. I'm surprised she didn't delete them, but she's too full of herself to do that. She "proved you wrong" with her non-existant logic. :roll:

[feministxtian]

I did NOT appreciate her bullshit about "Mama of a few – We do not share the same world view or interpretation of God’s Word, which means we will not likely agree, in general, on parenting/life choices. I do want to clarify that we do not put any conditions on our love for Emelie or our other children. She knows, and they know–and all three would tell you–that we love them unconditionally.

We cannot condone certain behaviors, and believe there are consequences for them, but we absolutely love our children unconditionally."

Obviously SOMEONE has screwed up here...her kid split. She lacks the humility to admit that she's probably VERY wrong regarding her daughter. I hope that kid has a BLAST free from under mommy's thumb.