Harry Potter And The Forbidden Books

[Laurabelle]

My sister in law forbid my niece to read them, but she was allowed racy romance novels instead. :cray-cray:

Aunt J, is that you??

Seriously, though, my aunt bought me the first Harry Potter book when it first came out as a birthday present and my parents (albeit very politely) sent the book back to my aunt and explained that Harry Potter was evil because it promoted witchcraft and other bad things. They then sat me down and explained that they would have to send it back to her. Being the HUGE bookworm that I was, I was disappointed, but didn’t really bother me much. As I got older, my aunt and other relatives would talk about how my cousins loved the books and an argument would always ensue between my father and them about how the books were anti-Christian or whatever. My aunts always brought up the fact that my parents allowed us to read The Magic Treehouse books, Narnia, and LOTR, etc. But Harry Potter was WITCHCRAFT, you know. :?

I never read them until I was in my mid-twenties and a co-worker convinced me to try them because she was sure I’d love them. I did, and fell in love. I can’t believe I waited this long to read them. I got my youngest sister hooked on them (who still lives at home with my parents) and my father got wind of both of us reading them and got upset because they are ebil. So, we are currently in the process of explaining/convincing him that they are NOT what he forever thought they were. He’s stubborn and convinced he’s always right, so it will take a while, but we’re stubborn, too. :shhh:

It really doesn’t make sense why HP is bad but Narnia and LOTR are okay. The logic is so faulty and I’m sad that I believed that ignorance for so long! :(

[AnywhereButHere]

This. Anything they enjoyed as kids is okay, no matter how similar the content is to newer things they want to ban.

I wonder if the fact that Harry Potter is in a modern setting scares some of them. Since we don't have orcs or elves or talking robots running around, LoTR and Star Wars are obviously fantasy. Harry and his friends are otherwise ordinary teens in modern-day Britain doing magic. Any kid old enough to actually read the books isn't likely to think Harry Potter is real while Star Wars isn't. But fundies aren't known for their critical thinking skills.

I wonder what the people calling to ban HP on religious grounds would say if they actually read the last book.

Heresy! Sacrilege! How dare Rowling compare Harry to Jesus or say he's Jesus incarnate! With Harry Potter, nothing will make it's detractors look at it favorably.

A talking lion, however - no problem. :roll:

[OkToBeTakei]

I'm fairly certain JK whilst writing the first book ABSOLUTELY purposely thought, how can I really get this message about witchcraft across to this generation, to brainwash them and really stick one to those pesky nutty christians. I'm sure it was in her outline :roll:

Just as Shakespeare wrote EVERY SINGLE LINE with the absolute intention that it could be interpreted numerous ways with deep intent. He sat in the pub in Stratford planning how he could torture millions of British school children trying to pass their O and A levels :lol:

[Rachel333]

As I got older, my aunt and other relatives would talk about how my cousins loved the books and an argument would always ensue between my father and them about how the books were anti-Christian or whatever. My aunts always brought up the fact that my parents allowed us to read The Magic Treehouse books, Narnia, and LOTR, etc. But Harry Potter was WITCHCRAFT, you know. :?

Haha, that was my aunt as well. Her daughter, my cousin, loved Harry Potter but my parents wouldn't allow it and I remember arguments about that.

I wasn't allowed to read Magic Treehouse books either though, and I'm not entirely sure why. I think my mom didn't like the suggestion of "real world" magic, while Narnia, LotR, Oz, etc. are clearly set in a fantasy realm.

I loved Edward Eager and E. Nesbit, but now that I think of it I never told my mom that I was reading them because I was afraid she'd tell me I couldn't read those as well. I remember feeling particularly guilty for reading some Nesbit books in secret.

My parents are way more relaxed now and the Magic Treehouse books, which I never got to read, are my little sister's favorite series. It's hard not to feel a bit resentful sometimes; younger kids don't know how good they have it. :lol:

[OkToBeTakei]

Drama

Bold Girls by Rona Munro

Sailmaker by Alan Spence

Tally's Blood by Ann Marie di Mambro

The Cheviot, The Stag and The Black, Black Oil by John McGrath

Men Should Weep by Ena Lamont Stewart

The Slab Boys by John Byrne

Prose Prose

Short stories (a selection) by Iain Crichton Smith

Hieroglyphics and Other Stories (a selection) by Anne Donovan

The Testament of Gideon Mack by James Robertson

Kidnapped by Robert Louis Stevenson

Short stories (a selection) by Iain Crichton Smith

Short stories (a selection) by George Mackay Brown

Sunset Song by Lewis Grassic Gibbon

The Cone-Gatherers by Robin Jenkins

The Trick is to Keep Breathing by Janice Galloway

Poetry (a selection by)

Carol Ann Duffy

Edwin Morgan

Norman MacCaig

Jackie Kay

Carol Ann Duffy

Robert Burns

Don Paterson

Liz Lochhead

Sorley MacLean

Above are the set texts for the Scottish 2014 Standard grades. (start at age 12/13 culminating in exams at age 14-16.)

Wonder what the literary censors discussed would make of these :think:

The Testament of Gideon Mack

The main story of The Testament is set within a framing narrative which concerns a publisher who recollects the "strange disappearance" of the novel's main character, Gideon Mack, and the discovery of Mack's "last testament". The testament itself comprises the main narrative. It recounts the life of its author, a son of the manse (meaning the son of a minister of the Scottish Kirk), who has followed in his father’s steps, eventually becoming minister to the small town of Monimaskit. Since Gideon does not, however, believe in God as such, he becomes increasingly disillusioned with his existence, until an accident sends him tumbling into a local gorge. Believed to be dead, he emerges three days later, claiming to have met and conversed with the Devil, who has confirmed several of his doubts. After scandalising and alienating his friends, the parish, and the Kirk at large, Gideon once again disappears, leaving his written account for posterity.

The epilogue to the novel is presented as the report of the freelance journalist who first brought the manuscript to the publisher’s attention. He interviews several of the inhabitants of Monimaskit who were mentioned in Gideon’s testament.

[AnywhereButHere]

My last year of high school I had to fill up a space in my course schedule with an elective. It came down to a choice between an art class or a class on Shakespeare (reading and dissecting 6 plays over the term). There was no way in hell I was taking an art class (absolute certainty on a failing grade), so Shakespeare it was. It turned out we had to read two plays in our regular English class, so I had to read eight of these things that term. I thought my head was going to explode. I’m pretty sure that if Shakespeare had a plot to destroy school children, he was taking it global. :D

[OkToBeTakei]

My last year of high school I had to fill up a space in my course schedule with an elective. It came down to a choice between an art class or a class on Shakespeare (reading and dissecting 6 plays over the term). There was no way in hell I was taking an art class (absolute certainty on a failing grade), so Shakespeare it was. It turned out we had to read two plays in our regular English class, so I had to read eight of these things that term. I thought my head was going to explode. I’m pretty sure that if Shakespeare had a plot to destroy school children, he was taking it global. :D

:lol: :lol: :lol:

I got sent out of class once for losing the plot and opining. 'You know maybe he meant ABSOLUTELY nothing with that line, maybe it just bloody rhymed.'

[Geechee Girl]

In Miss GG's FB group for incoming college freshmen, there was discussion last week of what books to pack. The thread went on to stating how many times they each read the books. A few of the kids shared they weren't allowed to read HP as the series was forbidden. Miss GG has decided to adopt a fundie-lite girl, and share her own copies of the books.

[Firiel]

THIS OMG

i never understood why they celebrated Christmas in the books without commenting on how it was some muggle thing... because logically, the wizarding world would surely have stopped celebrating christmas and other religious traditions around the time they were being burned at the stake and beheaded. i really have a lot of thoughts on this topic.

Well, actually, turns out the Muggles doing the witch hunts were very bad at it. So they rarely captured real witches or wizards. On the off chance they did manage to capture one, the witch/wizard was able to perform a very simple spell and endure the burning at the stake while feeling a rather pleasant tingling sensation. (I honestly no longer remember which book this is from, but I'm sure it's canon.)

So I suspect that is why they were fine celebrating Christmas-- the Muggle assault on witchcraft had no real effect on them. Actually, I always found it a bit morbid to think of Muggles dying horrible deaths while witches and wizards laughed up their sleeves because the punishment was useless against their own group.

[Rescinded and Mended]

I always felt like holidays in the series were used purely as props for Harry's benefit. It was mainly so we could see that he was getting presents or invited to stay with friends, and that there were people who cared enough about him to send gifts and issue invitations. Ron and Hermione's birthdays almost never get mentioned, although I think Hermione's is in late August or early September, while Ron's is in February.

[louisa05]

YESSSSSS. I went to a Catholic elementary school, and it was mostly pretty normal, but I am positive that was what they said about banning Pokemon cards. (I think it was really because they were becoming a distraction in class, and also maybe they were worried about kids losing them at school and kids/parents getting upset, but probably wanted a fancy reason.)

Sadly, these days, a "fancy reason" is often necessary because too many (not all!) parents are convinced that their precious little darlings would never ever ever break a rule or use an item brought from home to distract themselves or others. Just calling something a nuisance item rarely works.

That said, I taught in a Catholic school later and not a word was ever said about trading cards. And given that the first principal ran the staff NCAA basketball pool personally, I'm not sure there was much worry about gambling of any sort.

[Hane]

I always felt like holidays in the series were used purely as props for Harry's benefit. It was mainly so we could see that he was getting presents or invited to stay with friends, and that there were people who cared enough about him to send gifts and issue invitations. Ron and Hermione's birthdays almost never get mentioned, although I think Hermione's is in late August or early September, while Ron's is in February.

True, and holidays like Christmas and Easter are considered far more social than religious in much of Europe nowadays. I don't think the "War on Christmas"nonsense ever hit England the way it did in the US.

[crazyforkate]

I'm fairly certain JK whilst writing the first book ABSOLUTELY purposely thought, how can I really get this message about witchcraft across to this generation, to brainwash them and really stick one to those pesky nutty christians. I'm sure it was in her outline :roll:

Just as Shakespeare wrote EVERY SINGLE LINE with the absolute intention that it could be interpreted numerous ways with deep intent. He sat in the pub in Stratford planning how he could torture millions of British school children trying to pass their O and A levels :lol:

Don't forget she was out to turn everyone gay. Gay like Dumbledore.

[Trynn]

I've actually heard Christians argue that the spells in Harry potter are real spells.

Funny, cuz they never worked when I tried them.

I was also told that in The Lion King Rafiki is doing real voo doo. Does anyone know if that's true?

[Marianne]

I've actually heard Christians argue that the spells in Harry potter are real spells.

Funny, cuz they never worked when I tried them.

It works with me ! My therapy dog have learn that when I say "Accio something", she have to take it and give me. She's the best wand you can dream

[Trynn]

It works with me ! My therapy dog have learn that when I say "Accio something", she have to take it and give me. She's the best wand you can dream

I stand corrected.

Do you think this would work on a cat?

[Marianne]

I stand corrected.

Do you think this would work on a cat?

Cat train you, you don't train cat ! :shifty-kitty:

[OkToBeTakei]

Cat train you, you don't train cat ! :shifty-kitty:

:lol:

I taught my child when in her buggy to use the 'FORCE' to open doors (automatic.) She used to hold her hand up and screw up her face...priceless :lol:

[Joan of Snarc]

I taught my child when in her buggy to use the 'FORCE' to open doors (automatic.) She used to hold her hand up and screw up her face...priceless :lol:

Like this Volkswagon commercial. So cute.

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[Jinger Jar]

Having watched the brouhaha over Harry Potter and the silence in fundie-land over the Rick Riordan books (demons, demigods, kids with one human parent and one parent from the Greek or Roman pantheon, the horror!), I'm pretty sure HP draws the condemnation at least partially because it was authored by an unmarried mother.

[JellyHope]

The Duggar girls, in their (ahem) book, say that ANY magic is bad.

[louisa05]

Having watched the brouhaha over Harry Potter and the silence in fundie-land over the Rick Riordan books (demons, demigods, kids with one human parent and one parent from the Greek or Roman pantheon, the horror!), I'm pretty sure HP draws the condemnation at least partially because it was authored by an unmarried mother.

I don't think so. When they first went crazy about it at the school I taught at right after the first two books became popular here in the U.S., they all thought she was a man--the J.K. thing worked.

There are segments of evangelicalism where divorce is politely ignored and pretty common. The last year I taught at that school, only 4 of the 22 kids in the senior class had parents married to each other.

I don't know if people who have never been completely inside that culture really grasp how much their suspicions are aroused by anything popular. There is a degree of "if the rest of the world likes it, it has to be wrong". Harry Potter, in part, fell victim to that with them. I suspect it is related to their obsession with the idea of "being set apart from the world". Rick Riordan never became a national phenomenon.

[mockingbird]

I don't think so. When they first went crazy about it at the school I taught at right after the first two books became popular here in the U.S., they all thought she was a man--the J.K. thing worked.

There are segments of evangelicalism where divorce is politely ignored and pretty common. The last year I taught at that school, only 4 of the 22 kids in the senior class had parents married to each other.

I don't know if people who have never been completely inside that culture really grasp how much their suspicions are aroused by anything popular. There is a degree of "if the rest of the world likes it, it has to be wrong". Harry Potter, in part, fell victim to that with them. I suspect it is related to their obsession with the idea of "being set apart from the world". Rick Riordan never became a national phenomenon.

Yep, I suspect it is the popularity thing. Even with people I have run into who hate Harry Potter for secular reasons, I find that most of the time it comes down to kind-of a hipster-like superiority: "it's popular, so it must be bad writing/uninspired, and not even worth my time to read - I like [insert obscure or classic children's fantasy series here] better." (I got into a years-long debate with one of my college English professors who had this attitude. He was the type of person who if you even mentioned up you read them on the way out of class, he'd start a debate with you about how bad they were, and then when I found out he hadn't even read them I thought it was hypocritical since literature analysis is supposed to be based on textual evidence. LOL By the time I graduated, he'd read one of them and admitted they were better-written than Twilight :lol: )

But back to religious attitudes. I think if something is popular, parents might be more likely to want to look into it when their kid brings that book home from the library, because they want to see if the hype or criticism is applicable. Maybe a kid would be more able to slip a less-popular fantasy book under their parents' noses, since they wouldn't have that heads-up from the media or their church to look out for the book. Also, it could come down to keeping up the family's reputation with the church - you'd probably have an easier time "getting away with" letting your kids read a less popular fantasy series than one everyone knows about if the child happened to let the title slip, and I'm sure the better-known "evil influences" make for better gossip anyway since people already know what they are.

[Toothfairy]

The Duggar girls, in their (ahem) book, say that ANY magic is bad.

But magic isn't real, so what's the problem that fundies have with it.

[louisa05]

But magic isn't real, so what's the problem that fundies have with it.

Can't speak for all of them, but the neo-Pentecostals/Charismatics, and most of the fundie-lite Evangelicals I worked with thought that magic is real and is a tool of Satan and demons.

I kind of had to concede that if the adults around them are too dumb to know the books are imaginary, it might sometimes be best that those particular kids don't read them.