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Seven Weeks Of Suffering Whooping Cough


debrand

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My brother contracted chicken pox as a newborn, many decades before the vaccine, either in the hospital or very shortly after he came home. He was covered in pustules, poor little guy.

When I was a kid we used to have pox parties, whereby one kid would get sick and parents would bring their kiddos over his house so that all of them were sick at the same time. I remember going to several of these shindigs, but for some reason I never got it. I did get a really bad case of shingles as an adult, though. I don't know if that is related.

If you got shingles then I believe you had chicken pox at some point. Perhaps a mild case that was not recognized as such.

I could not watch much of the video of that poor little girl coughing so hard. I hate having a cough. My last cold (or whatever it was) included a cough that lasted for three months. I was sure I had some other disease...TB, lung cancer, something. Nope, just a bug that didn't want to quit. It hit quite a few people in my area over the winter. I'd have happily been vaccinated to avoid it!

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Before this article, I had never heard of Sarah Pope before but you are correct, she is very smug and obnoxious.

From a link in the comments on her blog, I found someone even more extreme.

Apparently, she has written a book about the wonders of measles

She blames the death of her child from an unknown illness on vaccinations but the doctors apparently blame the death on a genetic disorder

naturematters.info/

Her kids have remained healthy unlike their vaccinated friends. :roll:

I will take your book Sarah Pope and raise you: No Measles, No Mumps for Me, one of my favorite picture books as a kid :lol:

Apparently there is a video if you don't want to read: http://www.dailymotion.com/video/xne4ew ... _lifestyle

I couldn't find the post about her kid, but if he or she died around the age when you are getting a lot of vaccines, I could see how someone might want to link that. Especially maybe if you felt guilty for passing on a genetic disease? But that doesn't make it true or make her anti-vax message any less harmful.

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When we went to enroll my stepdaughter in high school, we discovered that her immunization record was incomplete. I'm pretty sure it was a clerical error, and since she got her shots in Arkansas, I wasn't about to track down what she'd had and what she hadn't had. So I signed a waiver. One signature, and that was it. I couldn't believe how easy it was to get out of California's "requirement".

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Here is an interesting article published in the Journal of Autoimmunity about a possible link between vaccinations and autoimmune diseases. This particular article is not very data driven. I would be very curious to see a long term study (with a lot more numbers!) done on this issue:

Vaccines are one of the greatest achievements of modern medicine and are commonly and safely inoculated to human and animals worldwide. However, in rare occasions, similarly to infec- tious agents, vaccines can induce the appearances of autoantibodies, enigmatic inflammatory condition and overt autoimmune disease [9]. Of which, non-specific manifestations such as arthritis, neuronal damage, fatigue, encephalitis and vasculitis were frequently described [9,27]. These rare events were documented in case-reports, case series, studies as well as via the CDC vaccines adverse events reporting system, weeks and even months or years following vacci- nation [27,28].

Abstract:

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/20708902

Full article here:

http://freepdfhosting.com/962132b4b7.pdf

In general, I have a lot of sympathy towards parents who do not vaccinate or choose to go on an alternative vaccination schedules. The thinking of these parents is along the lines of "what is a mere 7 weeks of pertussis compared to a lifetime of chronic Something Disease?" Also, parents who already have sick kids are constantly trying to understand why their kid is unhealthy, especially because even the best medical treatment in the US is often insufficient or not ideal for handling long term chronic diseases. Sure, the concerns might be unfounded, but given that the rate of autoimmune diseases is supposedly rising in the US, I think it is worth a second look.

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That shocks me. In California parents have to show proof of current vaccinations before kids can be enrolled in school and have to provide proof they're up-to-date on their shots or else they'll be medically excluded from school later on.

I really don't get the anti-vaccers. To me it smacks of irrational and irresponsible parenting.

That's not actually true, although obviouslythey don't advertise the fact. All the parent has to do is sign a form saying vaccines are against their religion.

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Here is an interesting article published in the Journal of Autoimmunity about a possible link between vaccinations and autoimmune diseases. This particular article is not very data driven. I would be very curious to see a long term study (with a lot more numbers!) done on this issue:

Abstract:

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/20708902

Full article here:

http://freepdfhosting.com/962132b4b7.pdf

In general, I have a lot of sympathy towards parents who do not vaccinate or choose to go on an alternative vaccination schedules. The thinking of these parents is along the lines of "what is a mere 7 weeks of pertussis compared to a lifetime of chronic Something Disease?" Also, parents who already have sick kids are constantly trying to understand why their kid is unhealthy, especially because even the best medical treatment in the US is often insufficient or not ideal for handling long term chronic diseases. Sure, the concerns might be unfounded, but given that the rate of autoimmune diseases is supposedly rising in the US, I think it is worth a second look.

If this article's findings ended up being consistent, it doesn't really have anything to do with vaccines specifically. There is a theory that autoimmune diseases can be "triggered" by an infection - your immune system gears up for the infection and then just never is able to calm down again basically. If that is what vaccines are doing, it's because vaccines elicit an immune response - just like if you actually got the illness. So anything that triggers the immune system, whether it is a vaccine or the "real" illness, could have done it. These people would probably have an autoimmune disease eventually become "activated" if it wasn't by the vaccine, by an illness at a later point in their lives. I hope that makes sense? The article puts forth an interesting theory, but it is not anything you can use to argue against vaccines (because if the kid doesn't get vaccinated, but later gets the disease, that could also trigger the autoimmune disease... you're not avoiding all the triggers by avoiding the vaccines or really eliminating any really because now the child is vulnerable to the disease being vaccinated against), unless there was consistent proof that vaccines trigger autoimmune diseases MORE than regular infections.

I really have no tolerance for anti-vaxxers because a) the benefits of vaccines are clear, have been proven a thousand times over, b) reactions are RARE (this article even said that) while the diseases vaccines prevent were much more common, and c) (most important) you are putting other people in danger with the decision not to vax, therefore it is not a simple "personal choice" thing. (BTW, "anti-vax" does not include people who have legitimate medical exemptions from vaccines; it's people who choose not to vaccinate for other reasons.)

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One of the reasons people had such big families 100+ years ago was because many children died. What next, polio?

I just read an article (in a print magazine) about 24, I think it was, people (kids mostly IIRC) that have come down with a "polio-like" disease. The drs. are saying it's absolutely not polio, but it sounds scary and a lot like polio.

I'll see if I can find an article online about it.

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The junior JB who dated a young anti-vaxx mom for a while has become all hellz-naw! about vaccinations and we have agreed to exclude it from our list of discussable topics. Actually, it's the one thing we don't/can't/won't discuss.

He annoys the bejabbers out of me because he has the ramble down pat, and starts rattling off statistics and acronyms and initials and - God love him, he needs to watch this one - occasionally does that snide little, "Y'know what that is, right?" .....left-brained twerp!

It's meant nothing to him to see photos of young people in iron lungs, of people in my generation with withered limbs, or horrific pox scars. To him - smart though he might be - the presence of vaccinations and the absence of horrible diseases during his growing-up years have really nothing to do with each other.

Love the kid, but :pull-hair: !!!!!!

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I had a severe NotFlu back in September that left me with a cough so bad that I couldn't sleep through the night for weeks. Codeine-based cough medicine didn't do squat. The coughing destroyed my voice so badly that even as late as December people were telling me I "sounded better." Someone asked me if it could have been whooping cough, but I have had an adult booster. If that is what a run-of-the-mill illness can do, WHY would anybody roll the dice on whooping cough? "But it's more natural to let the kids get it the old fashioned way!" Natural isn't always good!

Like rabies! And tetanus!

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My sister hadn't vaccinated the boys. Not because she was philosophically opposed, but because she is a neglectful cow. At first I didn't worry about it too much, it was summer, we weren't around other kids, and I figured she was coming back. After they'd been here a few months, I decided to get them vaccinated. Now, the 10 year old has had everything but hpv and chicken pox. (They had chicken pox as toddlers) The 8 year old is missing hpv, chicken pox, and mmr, which he's getting next month. I did space them out a bit more with him, due to some minor health issues. (Mild cp, drug and alcohol exposure, moderate asthma, extremely underweight) The first one he got was tdap, because the last thing this kid needs is pertussis. I know I'll be resting easier once they're fully protected.

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If this article's findings ended up being consistent, it doesn't really have anything to do with vaccines specifically. There is a theory that autoimmune diseases can be "triggered" by an infection - your immune system gears up for the infection and then just never is able to calm down again basically. If that is what vaccines are doing, it's because vaccines elicit an immune response - just like if you actually got the illness. So anything that triggers the immune system, whether it is a vaccine or the "real" illness, could have done it. These people would probably have an autoimmune disease eventually become "activated" if it wasn't by the vaccine, by an illness at a later point in their lives. I hope that makes sense? The article puts forth an interesting theory, but it is not anything you can use to argue against vaccines (because if the kid doesn't get vaccinated, but later gets the disease, that could also trigger the autoimmune disease... you're not avoiding all the triggers by avoiding the vaccines or really eliminating any really because now the child is vulnerable to the disease being vaccinated against), unless there was consistent proof that vaccines trigger autoimmune diseases MORE than regular infections.

I really have no tolerance for anti-vaxxers because a) the benefits of vaccines are clear, have been proven a thousand times over, b) reactions are RARE (this article even said that) while the diseases vaccines prevent were much more common, and c) (most important) you are putting other people in danger with the decision not to vax, therefore it is not a simple "personal choice" thing. (BTW, "anti-vax" does not include people who have legitimate medical exemptions from vaccines; it's people who choose not to vaccinate for other reasons.)

There's actually been lots of study and research into the fact that our society's cleanliness is actually causing a lot of autoimmune disease triggers. Same with allergies. My boyfriend grew up in India and allergies are almost unheard of there. Of course, there are other serious sicknesses they have that we do not. It's just that in many cases, modern societies seem to maybe overdo it with tidiness and therefore our immunities are not being built-up as they would have in the past...of course, assuming you survive childhood and all. So, as the immune system is not tackling foreign bodies, it ends up attacking itself and as a result, normally harmless things like dust mites and peanut butter have become needless targets. Also, our own body threatening itself, hence autoimmunity.

Also, more children are being born and surviving and successive generations are being born. In the past, said children with certain health issues would have died. But modern technology has let them live and 'faulty' genes are being passed down in the process, which could include autoimmune problems, so the increase may have a little something to do with that as well.

I haven't seen as much to do with the latter theory as with the former, so I am throwing theory two out there just because I can.

There's a lot of unknowns with the increase in autism and autoimmune diseases, but certainly the increase in diagnoses seems to have great correlation to the increase in criteria for diagnostics, which means more people will get the diagnoses.

What is known is that vaccines save lives everyday across the globe and they have been around for a few centuries. Not one legitimate scientific study has been able to replicate Wakefield's and there is not any evidence that autism and vaccines have any correlation whatsoever.

What is also known is that smallpox does not exist anymore and it all points to vaccination as the sole reason.

What is also known is that Polio has been eliminated from North America and every single shred of evidence points to high vaccination rates as to the reason. Polio is not eradicated globally at this point, so not vaccinated means there's a real high chance that it could have a resurgence in the US. All it would take it for someone not vaccinated to pick it up in a country where it is prevalent and bring it back. If the non-vax rate kept growing, well, let's just say there will be a lot of very sick people...and sadly many crippled or dead people, mostly from those not vaccinated, but also in those unable to get the vaccine who are relying on herd immunity for protection.

As for the crazy lady who writes books about how awesome measles is...the doctor's told her that her son had Alexander's disease and I googled it. Based of the pics, he did appear to look like those who had it sadly, and even more sad is that it has no cure. I am not a doctor though, so not giving a professional opinion here. However, it sounds like her doctors and hospital were trying everything they could to diagnose him and in the end realized he had an incurable disease. I do feel very sad for her that she lost a child because I can't imagine and do not want to, but yet, she is risking the deaths of many other children, other babies, by her unprofessional writings and unscientific 'knowledge', scaring people into being no-vax.

Ftr, I was fully vaccinated and was rarely ever ill as a child. I barely had a cold and saw the doc really only twice a year at the most, but usually just once for a check-up. So, all the anti-vax people going on and on about how healthy their kids are compared to vaccinated ones is all asinine. Proof or I'm not buying it.

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If this article's findings ended up being consistent, it doesn't really have anything to do with vaccines specifically. There is a theory that autoimmune diseases can be "triggered" by an infection - your immune system gears up for the infection and then just never is able to calm down again basically. If that is what vaccines are doing, it's because vaccines elicit an immune response - just like if you actually got the illness. So anything that triggers the immune system, whether it is a vaccine or the "real" illness, could have done it. These people would probably have an autoimmune disease eventually become "activated" if it wasn't by the vaccine, by an illness at a later point in their lives. I hope that makes sense? The article puts forth an interesting theory, but it is not anything you can use to argue against vaccines (because if the kid doesn't get vaccinated, but later gets the disease, that could also trigger the autoimmune disease... you're not avoiding all the triggers by avoiding the vaccines or really eliminating any really because now the child is vulnerable to the disease being vaccinated against), unless there was consistent proof that vaccines trigger autoimmune diseases MORE than regular infections.

I really have no tolerance for anti-vaxxers because a) the benefits of vaccines are clear, have been proven a thousand times over, b) reactions are RARE (this article even said that) while the diseases vaccines prevent were much more common, and c) (most important) you are putting other people in danger with the decision not to vax, therefore it is not a simple "personal choice" thing. (BTW, "anti-vax" does not include people who have legitimate medical exemptions from vaccines; it's people who choose not to vaccinate for other reasons.)

Actually the article primarily deals with the possible role of vaccine adjuvants in triggering the development of autoimmune diseases, although the authors did mention the theory that infections could provoke autoimmune responses as well. E.g. the article discusses Gulf War Syndrome patients presenting antibodies to squalene, which was one of the adjuvants in the vaccines veterans were given at the time. This is relevant to the vaccine discussion because a lot of anti-vaccine parents believe that it is the adjuvants that are more damaging than the infectious antigen. Hence, the campaign against thimerosal and aluminum as vaccine adjuvants.

Regardless of what is causing the rise of autoimmune diseases, we as a society have an obligation to identify which individuals would possibly react negatively to vaccinations. There are long term financial consequences associated with chronic disease, and these are crushing our healthcare system. In addition, casually dismissing the possibility of a child developing lupus or arthritis due to vaccines "because they probably would get it anyway" is one of the reasons anti-vaccination parents don't trust the medical establishment when it comes to vaccines. I don't think that the issue is that parents don't care about their kids getting measles, or that they don't care about other people getting sick because their kid is a disease vector. The issue is that parents see vaccines as having negative consequences on their kid's long term quality of life. And for that, they are willing to ignore success stories like smallpox and polio.

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Most low-income kids and minority kids are fully into the vaccine program and all the requirements set by the CDC. Kids in foster care, medicaid, and free daycare are almost 100% vaccinated according to schedule. How many of those children are suffering from the issues given as reasons not to vaccinate? I don't have numbers, but just from observations it seems pretty low.

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Reading through the comments, I’m disappointed, especially at this one “the anti-vax movement is rooted in anti-intellectualismâ€. A few years ago, I might have agreed but now, I’m damn glad I don’t have to make the decision whether or not to vaccinate children.

Polio vaccine is harvested from monkey kidneys. Unfortunately, the doses I was given in the 60’s were contaminated with SV-40 or cancer causing “monkey virusâ€. Dr. Eddy (National Inst. Of Health) discovered this and was validated by Merck. The solution? Don’t tell anyone and we won’t have to waste the millions of dosages still on hand. The same “seed material†(kidneys) were used for four decades. Google Dr. Oschner who publically vaccinated two of his grandchildren, one died the other got polio but survived. The CDC finally made an admission but I’ve heard it’s since been removed from their website. They’ve been expecting a generation full of cancer.

Merck Researcher Admits: Gardasil Guards Against Almost Nothing http://www.pop.org/content/merck-resear ... othing-985

A widely popular HPV vaccine the federal government has recommended for girls and boys as young as 11 has caused thousands of adverse reactions, including seizures, paralysis, blindness, pancreatitis, speech problems, short-term memory loss, Guillain-Barré syndrome and even death. (MANY deaths by the way). http://www.thelibertybeacon.com/2013/11 ... ne-deaths/

Vaccine Court – how many people know about this? Have a problem with a vaccine? See you in “secret courtâ€. http://www.huffingtonpost.com/david-kir ... 68343.html

Why aren’t there any autistic Amish children?

I could go on all night -- I certainly hope anyone having to make vaccination decisions be “intellectual†and do your research. Some mothers I know have said their doctors recommend reducing the number of vaccines received and schedule them further apart.

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My brother-in-law is autistic and while he can get on my nerves at times, I find it rather offensive that people like you think having a child like him is worse than losing a child to polio or whooping cough.

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My brother-in-law is autistic and while he can get on my nerves at times, I find it rather offensive that people like you think having a child like him is worse than losing a child to polio or whooping cough.

When the Autism rates jump 30% in just 2 years, it should get everyone's attention. http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nati ... e/6957815/

Lucky for your BIL that he has a mild case and symptoms, unlike the children I know who have been diagnosed.

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Reading through the comments, I’m disappointed, especially at this one “the anti-vax movement is rooted in anti-intellectualismâ€. A few years ago, I might have agreed but now, I’m damn glad I don’t have to make the decision whether or not to vaccinate children.

Polio vaccine is harvested from monkey kidneys. Unfortunately, the doses I was given in the 60’s were contaminated with SV-40 or cancer causing “monkey virusâ€. Dr. Eddy (National Inst. Of Health) discovered this and was validated by Merck. The solution? Don’t tell anyone and we won’t have to waste the millions of dosages still on hand. The same “seed material†(kidneys) were used for four decades. Google Dr. Oschner who publically vaccinated two of his grandchildren, one died the other got polio but survived. The CDC finally made an admission but I’ve heard it’s since been removed from their website. They’ve been expecting a generation full of cancer.

Merck Researcher Admits: Gardasil Guards Against Almost Nothing http://www.pop.org/content/merck-resear ... othing-985

A widely popular HPV vaccine the federal government has recommended for girls and boys as young as 11 has caused thousands of adverse reactions, including seizures, paralysis, blindness, pancreatitis, speech problems, short-term memory loss, Guillain-Barré syndrome and even death. (MANY deaths by the way). http://www.thelibertybeacon.com/2013/11 ... ne-deaths/

Vaccine Court – how many people know about this? Have a problem with a vaccine? See you in “secret courtâ€. http://www.huffingtonpost.com/david-kir ... 68343.html

Why aren’t there any autistic Amish children?

I could go on all night -- I certainly hope anyone having to make vaccination decisions be “intellectual†and do your research. Some mothers I know have said their doctors recommend reducing the number of vaccines received and schedule them further apart.

I suggest you is use legitimate sites to back up those claims.

Also Amish children have autism too. That claim has been debunked and hpv vaccine does protect.

As for a court...it's known like all drugs vaccines carry risks. Those don't outweigh the benefits.

Also that the anti vaccine crowd thinks they know so much more than doctors who have years of scientific training and research astounds me.

I can also go on and on about this. Anti vaccine movements and vaccines and their safety were my research topic for school and grad school thesis. I came in on the fence and have researched and continually research this topic.

So "intellectual" scare quotes and saying we need to research sounds like you assumed we don't know what you are saying. We must not be as enlightened as you?

Or wait...I'm a big pharma shill perhaps? Don't know I'm being conned by big pharma? Heard it already if you come back claiming such things.

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Has the autism rate REALLY risen 30%, or is it just that the awareness rate is rising? We might not be seeing more autistics, we might just know more and have a better label for it now.

Also, people with mild cases might used to be able to fall through the cracks, but now we have better diagnostic systems?

I don't think autism is the worst thing that could happen to someone... But its not something i want for my (future) child either... I need to research the connection or lack thereof with vaccines and autism. ..

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A friend who has researched autism believes the rise is caused partly by chemicals in food such as preservatives. If it's true that being super-clean can cause allergies, maybe she was on to something. It makes sense, considering the rise in sugar drinks, orange chips, purple ketchup, yada yada all that crazy unnatural food. And have you guys seen the awful expose on mechanically separated meat???? HOLY SHIT youtu.be/T67DvoH2H3E

(McDonalds says they use all white meat but i bet there's a lot of weird going on there too.)

Anyway, i don't think vaccines are a problem unless there is a genetic predisposition. i do vaccinate but on the delayed schedule and after age 2.

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I remember when my first kid was born being so worried about whether to vaccinate or not vaccinate, and then I saw a documentary about polio and it decided it for me. They all are vaccinated, and I am very thankful for it.

But I do also resonate with the concerns over vaccines. I think the Gardasil vaccine is the most alarming recent one - some very serious side effects, limited human trials, and it was rushed into production. I don't think opting out of vaccines is the answer, but I wish there could be more research done to make vaccines better, safer, and more reliable. But I think there is very limited financial incentive to improve existing vaccines.

I remember reading that part of the recent whooping cough epidemics is that the vaccine might be ineffective against a certain strain : http://health.usnews.com/health-news/ne ... ng-vaccine

Also, a bit of a rabbit trail, but it drives me nuts when the media seems to blow these stories up. This past flu season the local news kept running headlines that deaths from flu had doubled since last year and you should go get vaccinated. Okay, except that the statewide deaths had gone from two to four people. Of course no one wants to die of flu, but it wasn't quite the epidemic they had indicated. Similarly, all the recent facebook sharing says the US has the highest rates of measles in 20 years. That sucks, but it's not like 1994 was pre-vaccination era. While I think regular vaccination is important, no vaccine can completely guarantee you will never contract the disease, and the sort of rhetoric that implies that drives me nuts. Flu shot ads are a huge pet peeve of mine. End rant.

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I read that the rise in autism was just because it is diagnosed more than before ?

(part of this message supressed because it's not usefull, but just saying that parents who don't vaccines make me think of parents from alive and well : http://www.aliveandwell.org/ )

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People on this site are smart, it's what drew me to it. I love that you guys dig deep for the info & clues, discuss and collectively come up with the most likely truth. Hope those skills don't just apply to reality TV stars.

Vaccinated children are protected, so they wouldn't need to be concerned with exposure, isn't that the point?

The country's leading autism experts are piecing together data to suggest that some children may be predisposed to autism, a disease that could very likely be set off by environmental factors. Researchers have linked pesticides, plastic chemicals in vinyl flooring, mercury in fish (it gets in the water and lead, among other things. http://www.rodalenews.com/research-feed/autism-rate

Thimerosal is a mercury-containing organic compound and is still used in most vaccines, particularly flu vaccines according to the FDA.

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People on this site are smart, it's what drew me to it. I love that you guys dig deep for the info & clues, discuss and collectively come up with the most likely truth. Hope those skills don't just apply to reality TV stars.

If there's anything that's going to get me to change my tune, it's an insult disguised as a compliment.

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