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Duggar Fertility Doctor Visit


MandyLaLa

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One of 3 things will come out of this:

1. Michelle will be told she's in menopause and we'll get A LONG SERIES of "seasons of life" quotes from her and possibly an announcement to the clan about how god opens and closes the womb

I don't think she's in menopause, during the promo tour in march she kept telling that they were hoping for more babies.

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I don't think she's in menopause, during the promo tour in march she kept telling that they were hoping for more babies.

Hoping doesn't have anything to do with reality :p

I mean there are lots of fundie girls who hope that their Prince Charming will find them even if they never leave the house or entertain anyone. And there are a lot of people who hope for world peace to just magically happen.

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IIRC, Kelly Bates sought "fertility treatments" so she could carry to term. I remember when they started being featured on the show, the pop-ups would say she was pregnant with number 18, but she was pregnant for like a year and never changed. She had two? miscarriages between 17 and 18. She saw a fertility doctor to get the proper hormone balance so she could carry to term and have a healthy baby. I can see Michelle checking her levels to see if she needs to do the same. They can't artificially create a pregnancy, but they can help keep it viable.

Also, I think they're okay with injectable fertility treatments, which surprises the hell out of me. The first Above Rubies issue I ever read featured a couple with seven or children. When they got married, she immediately went to a fertility doctor bc she couldn't have children. (She never discussed why this was so and I never understood it until I discovered that they seriously get these things checked out before marriage. Is this like a condition for marriage? I get the house inspected before I buy it so they get their potentials wives inspected before they marry them? Fucked. Up.) They used something and she conceived right away. And then a "miracle" happened and they didn't need fertility treatments anymore because Jesus. Anyway, my point is that Nancy Campbell seems okay with fertility treatments and Kelly Bates seems okay with fertility treatments (even if they're not as "severe" as using conception treatments) so why wouldn't Michelle be okay with fertility treatments.

This brings me back to an earlier comment in another thread about the triple date coming up. Michelle and Jessa and Jill could all be pregnant at the same time. Ew.

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Menopause means not having a period in over 1 year. She is probably in peri-menopause. Her periods may be irregular and she may not be producing eggs. A woman can go through this for many years before reaching menopause.

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"This brings me back to an earlier comment in another thread about the triple date coming up. Michelle and Jessa and Jill could all be pregnant at the same time. Ew."

Maybe this is why the girls haven't been in a big hurry to marry. Maybe they've been waiting till they feel Michelle won't be having more babies so that they won't be pregnant at the same time. I don't buy their 'my mom is my best friend' stuff they spout for the cameras.

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"This brings me back to an earlier comment in another thread about the triple date coming up. Michelle and Jessa and Jill could all be pregnant at the same time. Ew."

Maybe this is why the girls haven't been in a big hurry to marry. Maybe they've been waiting till they feel Michelle won't be having more babies so that they won't be pregnant at the same time. I don't buy their 'my mom is my best friend' stuff they spout for the cameras.

I just thought of something. If Michelle can get pregnant (and she very well may - stranger things have happened - and she could easily have an "oops" baby in a few years) then not only could Michelle and Jessa and Jill be pregnant together, but Anna as well, especially since she's been looking pregnant lately. Creeeeeeeepy.

I'm not sure why this has been flooding my mind lately, but it's kind of annoying. Even wine at 10:30am isn't helping :lol:

I agree with the the "my mom is my best friend" crap. That's just not true. They're much closer to their sisters than their mother. She doesn't even know them.

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I don't find it creepy, just sad. Sad because if Michelle gets pregnant again, the outcome almost certainly will not be good. She will be putting herself, her husband, and her children through more needless emotional turmoil, not to mention hurting her body and putting her life in danger. If she were actually really just 'leaving it up to God' it wouldn't be quite so bad, but she's not. As she seems determined to tell everyone, she is actively trying. I understand wanting to have faith in God, but being obsessed with getting pregnant again in your late 40s after 19 children, a brush with death (Josie) and a late miscarriage (Jubilee), makes it seem like you DON'T trust God with your life and your fertility. At all.

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I don't think what Kelly had (progesterone treatment) is a fertility treatment. It's a pregnancy treatment. It was something to maintain her pregnancies not create one. It also appeared to be provided by her regular OB. I know my OB provides it without seeing any further specialist.

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I still firmly believe this is just a filler plot. It's not like the show is particularly exciting. Plus, TLC still has a strong love of filming medical procedures.

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Dear Michelle: God is not just "closing" your womb, he's hammering "Do Not Enter" and "This Property Condemned" signs over its entrance.

This made me laugh. I had a hysterectomy when my kids were very little and later when my daughter asked if I was going to have any more children I told her "not only is the factory closed but it's been dismantled and sold for parts." :lol:

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I can actually see J'chelle going through with an 'embryo adoption.' It would further the Duggars' pro-life agenda, and garner a heck of a lot of media attention. I do hope not, though. And I will be watching on Tuesday, but only to put my mind at ease about her possibly being pregnant.

I don't think she would adopt an embryo. Unless it was from one of the J'slaves...

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I don't think she would adopt an embryo. Unless it was from one of the J'slaves...

Ew that would be gross. I mean I know it's fundamentally no different than adopting someone else's embryos. But it is.

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Ew that would be gross. I mean I know it's fundamentally no different than adopting someone else's embryos. But it is.

She has no problem with her daughters acting as mothers to her children now, so....

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I don't think what Kelly had (progesterone treatment) is a fertility treatment. It's a pregnancy treatment. It was something to maintain her pregnancies not create one. It also appeared to be provided by her regular OB. I know my OB provides it without seeing any further specialist.

Isn't that the same thing? Especially in the fundie world of "god opens and closes the womb". Kelly made a point to explain how they were using them to help keep the pregnancy viable, to help god in some strange way. That lead me to believe there really isn't a difference.

It's been awhile, but isn't Plan B basically just a progesterone pill? That's why it doesn't terminate pregnancy or even harm it if it's already occurred. So if what Kelly did was okay, then Plan B should be okay, too.

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To me it's different and I think to Kelly and Michelle it's different. One it to GET pregnant and the other is to STAY pregnant. One is treating a condition of pregnancy which they are fine with doing. The other is a possibly "artificial" (to them) way of conceiving.

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To me it's different and I think to Kelly and Michelle it's different. One it to GET pregnant and the other is to STAY pregnant. One is treating a condition of pregnancy which they are fine with doing. The other is a possibly "artificial" (to them) way of conceiving.

Personally I agree with you. I have a lot of mixed feelings on IVF (from friends experiences and personal ones) and while I don't think I would ever use it to get pregnant, I would to stay pregnant. But I'm thinking on a technical, medical basis. Wouldn't they both considered fertility treatments? They both are used in the means of a pregnancy and to produce healthy children. I suppose it doesn't really matter, especially not to the fundies.

And just a side note, Kelly has had three miscarriages correct? So she technically has more children than Michelle. Either way, she has no multiples so she has been pregnant more times. Which is insane. They have the same amount of (living) children, all roughly the same ages, but Kelly had to do it with 19 pregnancies while Michelle only needed 17.

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Wouldn't they both considered fertility treatments?

I'll try again. No, they are not both fertility treatments. Fertility treatments are those things like Clomid to release more eggs, surgery to correct problems, male medications to improve sperm count or mobility, IUI, IVF, etc. These are all treatments to improve the chances of conception.

After conception occurs, it isn't an issue of fertility. It's an issue of maintaining a pregnancy. It's two different things.

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I'll try again. No, they are not both fertility treatments. Fertility treatments are those things like Clomid to release more eggs, surgery to correct problems, male medications to improve sperm count or mobility, IUI, IVF, etc. These are all treatments to improve the chances of conception.

After conception occurs, it isn't an issue of fertility. It's an issue of maintaining a pregnancy. It's two different things.

This! completely!! Two separate things entirely.

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Whether it be tracking your monthly cycle, fertility treatments to become pregnant, or taking medications to maintain a pregnancy, none of those are "leaving it up to God". Leaving it up to God means husband and wife having sex and letting nature taking it's course without any intervention of any kind. So, quiverfullers can take all that rhetoric and shove it up their asses.

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I never, ever, ever, ever will get this "leaving it up to God" thing. They believe that god is omnipotent, right? (Depends on what leg they're shortening in theodicy, I guess.) If you believe in omnipotence, wouldn't you be "leaving it up to God" even if you were on birth control and using condoms and who else knows what? Michelle got pregnant on birth control and seems to feel that it was because God wanted her to be pregnant, right?

Embryo adoption might suffice for Michelle's pregnancy addiction/all her babies have to come from HER vagina but it probably wouldn't satisfy JB's need to let people know how often he sticks it in his wife.

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My like button is gone too :(

And these people are so full of sh*t when it comes to "leaving it to God". There are multiple times she would have died had she just left it to God. Same thing goes for Kelly Bates. It's just like how they pick and choose things out of the Bible they agree with and just glaze over the parts they don't.

:clap: I swear these fundies really do irk my nerves. They only throw out bible quotes when it's convenient for them.

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Neither option (IVF or medications after conception) is leaving it totally to God, in my opinion. Lucky for me I believe that God put these technologies and medications in our reach so we could USE them.

I can see why some people would think IVF was dicey and taking meds after conception wasn't, though. IVF is literally removing the required ingredients from the adults, putting them together in the lab, and then transferring them back into a uterus. It's night and day different from simply taking a medication. For me, personally, I don't have a moral problem with any of it, but I did not want to go beyond just medications when we dealt with infertility. IVF was too invasive, expensive, and likely to fail for me to feel comfortable.

Again, I don't think there's anything wrong with IVF, but I definitely understand why some couples would be OK with what Kelly Bates did to maintain pregnancy versus doing more invasive procedures to get pregnant.

Anyway, IVF and hormones post-conception are two very different things. Fertility treatments are only for, you know, fertility. Which is the getting pregnant part. Once you're pregnant, it's no longer a fertility treatment. <---- That was really my point. The rest was a rambly bonus.

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Admittedly I don't understand fundies or the whole leave it up to God to open and close the womb thing. Additionally I work in a fertility clinic and I am a doctor so I am biased. However I have a hard time telling the difference between IVF, medical supplementation to maintain a pregnancy, methotrexate to end an ectopic, Misoprositol post miscarriage, the morning after pill, the birth control pill, surgery (on the mother or fetus), chemotherapy , laser ablation of vascular anomalies in the placenta etc the list goes on and on and on. In every case people have decided to alter the natural course of things. Once people have decided to intervene then it is no longer in God's hands. It is one thing for someone to say that they personally would choose some interventions but not others and it is an entirely different thing for fundies to insist that the interventions they choose are Godly and good but the interventions other women choose are evil incarnate.

(To the other people here who would not choose IVF - I respect that choice and only wish Fundies would respect all women's choices.)

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As a product of IVF, I do get a little upset when I hear people saying they have a moral objection to IVF. It's like they are saying they have a moral objection to my existence. That's pretty hurtful.

My parents tried for 12 years to get pregnant. I am an only child. My mother was pregnant with triplets with me, and she lost the other two at 10 and 12 weeks. I am lucky to be here, and I am grateful for the technology that helped.

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amster, I don't have a moral objection to any woman's reproductive choices. I'm glad your parents were able to conceive you via IVF. My objection is directed at fundie women aren't practicing what they preach, but are still touting "leaving it up to God" when actually they aren't.

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