Why Jill First?

[artdecades]

In my opinion, I don't think Ben will finish college (and I hope I'm wrong). He's a freshman which means he's got 3 more years (if he is going FULL TIME) but I don't think he is. He's working part-time (I assume), going to school part time and spending his remaining time with Jessa. I think after Jill's wedding, the pressure will be on him to get married. I'm afraid he'll drop out and start working full time because he's got to secure a home for them prior to marriage. Jessa knows this and she's taking it slow. She knows Josh had a home for Anna, Chad had one for Erin, and Derick presumably has one for Jill. I wonder if she's asking Ben about this. I wonder what there plans are. Something tells me they'll get married in 2015 or 2016. Jim Bob should have allowed them to be friends but no courtship yet, but due to pressure from the show, he let it happen. She should have remained friends with him for the time being, if a better guy came along, she could have moved on (and she still can do this, but it will be harder due to the media and "official courtship" vs friendship).

I hope Jessa is aware of what kind of life that she'll have with Ben if they rush into marriage before they are ready. He really needs to establish himself and prove himself financially and he's got to gain more maturity, which might take a few years. She has to be patient.

IDKY but I assumed Ben was in a 2 year associates program. I guess because vocational training seems more valued in their circles

[Ursula]

Agree to all said here. Also, Jill is a few years older than Jessa...she just maybe more emotionally ready for marriage.

Jill is a mere 17 and a half months older than Jessa. It's Derick's seven years on Ben that makes the age difference that much more apparent.

Besides the age thing, haven't Jill and Derrick known each other a lot longer via phone, text, and skype? It might not have become official until she went to Nepal, but those two were very clearly courting long Jessa and Ben even met.

Based on the info released by the Duggar family it didn't sound like that much longer. DimBoob mentioned something about Derick to Jill when they first became prayer buddies two-ish years ago(?) but Jill didn't think much about it until sometime in the summer last year. I think it was stated they Skyped/e-mailed/texted for about five months before the trip to Nepal, so the "getting to know you" phase would have really begun for Derick and Jill in the summer but they didn't start officially dating (fuck the term "courting") until November, about two months after Ben and Jessa started dating.

Count me in among the people who believe we never would have heard a thing about Ben until engagement had he himself not blabbed about it on his Facebook profile. The family (other than Jordyn :D ) didn't announce a thing about Jill and Derick until after engagement had already taken place with "surprise - Jill's dating!" then "PSYCHE - SHE'S ACTUALLY ENGAGED" not two weeks later, with both happening after a ring had been put on it. Though I'm not sure if they would have been able to hide Ben's existence for THIS long. Seven months is a hell of a long time to date in fundie land. Or maybe Ben and Jessa really did get engaged at Krismas and they're waiting until he turns 19 next month to announce it. Just please, no double wedding!

[Rainytown]

I think Benessa happened solely to save the show. There, I said it. Plus, Jim Boob has quite a problem now, doesn't he? If Ben stays in school, there will be no wedding ratings bonanza for at least three years. Ben won't make enough repairing car windshields to keep Jessa in Tater Tot Casserole and frumpers, which also proves the lie to Jim Boob's bullshit about how many suitors he's rejected because they weren't "suitable". A seventeen-year-old boy doesn't have the emotional maturity or earning potential to take on the financial burden of a wife and at least one child in the first year of marriage.

There will be a very quiet breakup either during the hoopla surrounding Jill's wedding, or when Jessa meets someone a bit more financially realistic.

[Hisey]

I think the difference between Jill/Derrick and Jessa/Ben is very striking. Jill has some marketable skills, rudimentary Spanish, and a goal in life. Derrick has a job and a similar goal. I doubt that they are really "madly in love" because how can they be, having only met a few times in their lives? But they seem to care about each other. Seems fairly promising.

Jessa and Ben seem a sad couple with nothing going for them. Jessa has NO marketable skills that we know of. She's a 21 year old who will be entirely dependent on her husband. Worse than that, she has never expressed any goals or interests, and hasn't seemed to be working towards anything during the last few years. And she doesn't seem that interested in kids. Seems angry at them, actually, when they act like kids act. Ben is clearly far too young to be in a fundie relationship, with all it's requirements (husband earns the sole income, must be an entrepeneur, lots of kids, etc). Maybe that relationship could survive if they didn't have to follow the fundie rules, and Jessa could earn money or study for a career, and they could delay childbearing. But I don't think it has much hope as it is.

I notice one thing about Jessa and Ben. They keep talking about how "we're so in love that we don't notice anyone else" etc. The other young couples around them (Zach and Whitney, Erin/Chad) don't say those things. They just ACT in love.

I do wonder if Jill wanted to be a missionary and marriage was the only way. I could see this conversation happening:

Jill: Mom and Dad, I found three exciting missions I want to go on next year.

Jim Bob: Well, honey, we really can't spare John David that long, and Josiah is too young to escort you. . ."

Jill: Can't I go alone? I want to be a missionary!

Jim Bob: No, you need their protection. But when you get married, you can go wherever you (by that I mean your husband) want to go.

[ljohnson2006]

I think Jessa's courtship is more for TV. Just so we can stop snarking about how sheltered the girls are. I doubt she and Ben will marry. Jill seems to actually like Derrick.

[Evil Feminist]

What kind of degree is Ben getting? If he is going to get a bachelors, he should just start CollegeMinus! He should get free coaching since the Duggars and CollegeMinus are partners. Getting a BSBA in General Management or Entrepreneurship should take only about two years if he's already got a year done. Plus, maybe he could show the Duggar boys that it possible to actually get a degree instead messing around like they've been doing all these years. Oh, and then he can use his entrepreneurial skills to start his own windshield repair business! :wink-kitty:

[singsingsing]

I get the same impression about Jessa. What does she like? What does she want? Does she have any goals or aspirations or interests at all? She doesn't even seem enthusiastic at the prospect of being a wife and mother like, say, Anna. I remember watching that video where she demonstrated how she styled hair, and she seemed to really enjoy it. She was good at it. I couldn't help but wonder if she would have liked to be a hairstylist or a cosmetician or something of that nature had she been given the chance.

[nausicaa]

This is so true. Living on my own, having to find a job and pay my own bills, has really shown me how difficult it is. I'm 26 and I graduated university last year. I have no debt so I'm really lucky. I managed to find a really good job after about six months. I now make a lot more money than most of the people my age I know (but that's not saying much). Right now my goal is to save up enough money to be able to afford a car and to put a down payment down on a small, VERY reasonably priced condo. I'm still looking at being at least 30 before I can realistically achieve that, and I have no dependents. I don't know how these guys do it, plus have to support a wife who brings in zero income, plus have to support an ever-increasing brood of children.

Preach it sister. I'm a bit older than you, 29, and have a steady job. I was also lucky to not have student loans, but I am still a renter as I try to save for a down payment on a house, an emergency fund, a small furniture fund, while also putting money aside for retirement. I'm getting there, but it's been a loooong process, and I have zero dependents. I just don't know how these fundie guys are supposed to do it. I think the system will either fall apart or make concessions as the second generation comes up.

[marmalade]

I also agree is has to do w/ Jill being older. Ben might be ready to take the blung & Derrick is.

Jill is only 18 months older than Jessa. What she IS is more mature, with actual goals. Jessa and Jinger (and yes, aside from the JTTH business, even Jana) seem to be floundering a bit in finding themselves. Other than Jinger and her photography, these girls don't really have extra-familial interests. Jana was forced in her role as a doula to be Jill's accountability partner, but she never really seemed that into it. Jessa teaches the kids, and we've all seen how into it she is.

I can't link the pic for some reason, but Pickles and Hairspray posted a pic from the People magazine feature. The juxtoposition of the couples (one obviously in love, Jessa crossing her hands and looking away from Ben in the other) really illustrate where these couples really are in their relationships.

I think Jessa might just get rid of Ben while all of the attention is on Jill. Boob was desperate for a courtship, but this is not the right pairing. Now that they've got Jill's wedding to boost ratings, Jessa can quietly end things and like Zach Bates, find someone better suited to her standoffish nature (and someone who can stand up to that cretin, Boob).

[roddma]

Just from the pictures I have seen so far you can see that Jill is totally in love with this guy. Why should she wait and consider to being stucked in a courtship? They are adults and both seem to know what they want. Also Jessa and Ben don't seem close at all (compared to Jill & Derick). Did anyone notice that Jessa hardly looks into Ben's eyes?

We are talking about an inexperienced giddy young adult who grew up isolated. It is hard to tell if she is in love with Derick or in love with love. While they may seem to be a fit, I am concerned about Jill's lack of experience in telling love from infatuation. Looking back when I was Jill's age, I had little experience with men. I,too, was brought up with the purity thing, though not as extreme. It is a good thing I was not expected to marry the first one because it was just infatuation. I got older and wiser. It's a good thing I waited until 28 of marriage.

[Mela99]

I think it might be as simple as Derick asked first

[Dandruff]

I'm with those who are picking up chemistry between Jill and Derick and not Jessa and Ben. What are Jessa and Ben's common interests (not counting the bible) and how did an 18 year old who fixes windshields convince Jim Bob that he'd be a good provider? I suppose it's possible that Ben would move near the Duggars, maybe take over the car lot or some such, and live in one of the Duggar properties, but is this what Jessa wants to do with her life? I've assumed she'd want to get far enough away to not have to pack for a dozen siblings and participate in homeskool for same. Jill has been training in midwifery and is interested in missionary work. What are Jessa's goals?

[Rescinded and Mended]

I'm almost starting to feel sorry for Ben. I was watching a commercial earlier of the next episode where Ben leans in to side-hug Jessa, and she physically recoils from him. And then there's the fact that the only reason he seems to be there in front of the cameras is to follow the family around. When asked what he loves about Jessa, his answer was that he wanted someone who loves the lord as much as him, and who was HAWT. The best that Jessa could come up with was that he was a good guy.

Poor, dumb kid - this is an awful lot of trouble to go through just to have sex.

[LilyRose]

I get the same impression about Jessa. What does she like? What does she want? Does she have any goals or aspirations or interests at all? She doesn't even seem enthusiastic at the prospect of being a wife and mother like, say, Anna. I remember watching that video where she demonstrated how she styled hair, and she seemed to really enjoy it. She was good at it. I couldn't help but wonder if she would have liked to be a hairstylist or a cosmetician or something of that nature had she been given the chance.

On the Duggar family website, under each family members profile it says that Jessa wanted to be a beautician (or at least it did, not sure if it still does haven't been on there in quite a while).

I think she would have been good at it too, but I suspect that this aspiration was quashed because it would have necessitated her attending some sort of mainstream cosmetology class and from there, if she got a job, she could have wound up spending lots of time around normal ungodly folk.

[singsingsing]

On the Duggar family website, under each family members profile it says that Jessa wanted to be a beautician (or at least it did, not sure if it still does haven't been on there in quite a while).

I think she would have been good at it too, but I suspect that this aspiration was quashed because it would have necessitated her attending some sort of mainstream cosmetology class and from there, if she got a job, she could have wound up spending lots of time around normal ungodly folk.

Wow, I did not know that. Her interest and skill in that area really came across in the video, and I could totally picture her working in a salon. How depressing that so many doors are just slammed in these young women's faces...

[asmit4]

People kept asking about the time line for Jill and Derrick....it was noted on the show that they started skyping in August 2013....and I presume started courting in November? ....and got engaged at the end of March. With the wedding in June.

Comparing to the Bates family this seems like a 'normal' timeline. While Jill may be 'in infatuation'....it seems to me that Derrick is a good guy, with a good head on his shoulders and I think that Jill WILL grow out of infatuation and grow into real love.

[lascuba]

We are talking about an inexperienced giddy young adult who grew up isolated. It is hard to tell if she is in love with Derick or in love with love. While they may seem to be a fit, I am concerned about Jill's lack of experience in telling love from infatuation. Looking back when I was Jill's age, I had little experience with men. I,too, was brought up with the purity thing, though not as extreme. It is a good thing I was not expected to marry the first one because it was just infatuation. I got older and wiser. It's a good thing I waited until 28 of marriage.

Yes, that's what I think. I'm not a very romantic person at heart and I just don't do giddy, so Jill and Derrick getting engaged when they're still in the infatuated hearts and flowers stage would be worrying to me if I knew them IRL. I almost prefer Jessa's on-camera dry pragmatism, because it gives the impression that she's thinking about her future as opposed to being swept away by emotion. In a culture where divorce is not an option, it's especially important to be practical.

[August]

Maybe someone has an answer better than mine, but I think Jill is in luuuurrrvvveee and wants to get hitched as fast as possible, whereas Jessa is more reticent and wants to wait and see how it all works out with Ben. She doesn't strike me as the kind of person to jump in head first. She's led a bit more by logic than emotion.

Which is so completely and utterly different than the real world where we call it dating, not courtship. [/sarcasm]

[Ursula]

People kept asking about the time line for Jill and Derrick....it was noted on the show that they started skyping in August 2013....and I presume started courting in November? ....and got engaged at the end of March. With the wedding in June.

Comparing to the Bates family this seems like a 'normal' timeline. While Jill may be 'in infatuation'....it seems to me that Derrick is a good guy, with a good head on his shoulders and I think that Jill WILL grow out of infatuation and grow into real love.

Ehhh, I wouldn't say it's a normal time frame compared to the Bates family's relationships. The Bates family knew the Paine, Webster, and Klein(?) families IN PERSON before any of their children became romantically involved with each other, in most of those cases for at least a year. The only one who comes close to having such a speedy dating -> engagement -> marriage phase is Zach and I'll just flat out say my view on that now: Whitney is TOTALLY Zach's rebound from Sarah. Except in their world you can't rebound with a one night stand, you're pretty much forced to marry them. Don't get me wrong, Zach and Whitney look happy and in love but they are still just...so NEW to each other.

The same can be said of Jill and Derick. They went from hardly knowing the other even exists to marriage in 10 months. Why the rush? (No need to answer, we ALL know WHY the rush. Sigh)

[Fourcard5]

Ben is 18 and Derick is 25. Derick has a job, Ben works and is in school (iirc). Women in this cult rely entirely on their husbands for financial support, its what they are taught. It makes sense that Jessa wouldn't want to rush into marriage with someone who can't provide for her.

This is so true about Derick and Jill. But, I think Jessa would marriage Ben yesterday if she could and if he had a job. He can't get a job b/c he's always on that damn bus with the Duggars, maybe he gets paid to the drive the bus. who knows

[karen77]

Ehhh, I wouldn't say it's a normal time frame compared to the Bates family's relationships. The Bates family knew the Paine, Webster, and Klein(?) families IN PERSON before any of their children became romantically involved with each other, in most of those cases for at least a year. The only one who comes close to having such a speedy dating -> engagement -> marriage phase is Zach and I'll just flat out say my view on that now: Whitney is TOTALLY Zach's rebound from Sarah. Except in their world you can't rebound with a one night stand, you're pretty much forced to marry them. Don't get me wrong, Zach and Whitney look happy and in love but they are still just...so NEW to each other.

The same can be said of Jill and Derick. They went from hardly knowing the other even exists to marriage in 10 months. Why the rush? (No need to answer, we ALL know WHY the rush. Sigh)

Well, FTR, I met my DH on Nov 4 (talked via myspace for about two weeks prior) that was our first date. we were engaged by Jan 13th and we married Sept 15th of the following year, so basically 10 months. We've been married 6.5 yrs now.

Now, had HAD been in a long term relationship for 6 years prior and was 29 when we married, he was married before and was 31 when we married...so been around a bit :)

[Tangy Bee]

I think everyone is forgetting that Ben is probably getting paid by TLC. Bet it's WAY more money than he's earning with his wind shield repair business. Each time he steps in front of the camera it's, $$$$. That's money he is probably stashing for his "future" with Jessa. Didn't someone say he is transferring to Arkansas State, which is just 15 miles from the Duggars? I can't remember where I read that. Plus there have been recent instagram pics of them looking "fond" of each other at the moment. I just got a feeling he may love her more than she loves him.

[karismanic]

As for goals for Jessa, I could totally see her becoming a Certified Professional Organizer -- one of those people you call to organize your closets or come up with a pantry system. It would be a great home - based business, and what better credentials could one have than creating some sense out of Duggar chaos?

[boxerlover24]

Preach it sister. I'm a bit older than you, 29, and have a steady job. I was also lucky to not have student loans, but I am still a renter as I try to save for a down payment on a house, an emergency fund, a small furniture fund, while also putting money aside for retirement. I'm getting there, but it's been a loooong process, and I have zero dependents. I just don't know how these fundie guys are supposed to do it. I think the system will either fall apart or make concessions as the second generation comes up.

It has to, there is NO way these uneducated young inexperienced people can support a large family. I live actually right near the Gothard headquarters and the cost of living here in Chicago burbs is ridiculous- it will be very telling how much David and Priscilla toe the party line when it comes to the number of kids they have. I seriously doubt they will have more than 5. I just don't see how they could afford it.

I am nearly 26, my Fiance is almost 30 and together we bring in over 100K but it still doesn't feel like enough here. We have the mortgage on a modest house and I have a small amount of student loans (less than 15K) and the thought of having a baby right now makes me nervous. I couldn't imagine doing it on one income much less on the income of an inexperienced 18 year old.

The Gothard movement will not last- they are setting their children up for poverty.

[DGayle]

I suspect Ben's the one who's hesitant. He's barely legal. Thinking about providing a home and supporting a family on his own at 18 is nuts. There's a reason we don't encourage teen pregnancy in sane society. The cards are against you at that age. Now he's got a girlfriend who is used to being royalty.