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Doug Phillips is a Tool & Vision Forum is Dead - Part 7


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I don't give up easy. They're alternately all planning to ban me, ignore me or eat me, and are all in high dudgeon. I think it's kind of funny, actually. Because of the reaction, they're making me actually want to stick around a while. :lol:

Well, that's pretty much the definition of a troll. Wave that duck, baby, wave that duck.

Another bit of advice about debating -- if you don't use words like "all," "every," "they (with no specifics)," "always," you can't be accused of generalizing to the point where what you say is easily defeated because it can't possibly be true. You're welcome.

To address your generalization above, I am not in high dudgeon. But then, I was not raised in a damaging fundie atmosphere, was not beaten as a child, have never been sexually abused, etc. -- your opinions are not triggers for me. I can be calm and support those for whom they are.

And I do support them -- if there is anger in some posts, I think it is utterly justified anger. Your reaction of thinking it is fun to make someone angry seems rather childish to me.

I post for my own interest, and for lurkers -- drawing out someone with distasteful beliefs and an arrogant attitude, so they state their opinions and ideas, generally leads to their hoisting themselves by their own petard. The Internet is forever, and your inability to support your ideas will be here for anyone to read.

And, lest you are tempted to do an "I'm rubber, you're glue," I don't get any troll-y pleasure out of upsetting people - I find that practice really creepy. I don't want to anger you -- just let you show your true colors. Stay calm, stay strong, chuckle condescendingly at our opinions -- it all shows how you think.

Your response to the lawsuit against Doug (so victim-blaming and full of suspicion against the woman, and women in general, despite your claiming to disdain The New and Unimproved Doug), and the continuing answers about other things, are so predictable that I no longer want to make Bingo card jokes. Poe's Law comes to mind -- the reality is so extreme and predictable, it can't be differentiated from the parody.

And now I will be predictable, but these questions are hard to avoid, when talking to a Bible literalist. You seem to be having a problem that literalists often do -- sort of a "the entire Bible is the inerrant word of God to be taken literally except when I say so" issue.

But, since you use Proverbs to justify hitting kids, and say that, no matter who is supposed to have written or said something, it is the voice of God, it seems like you are OK with laws and advice that pre-date the New Testament.

Others have asked if you would stone your child to death or sell a daughter as a slave, and I don't remember you answering. I want to know if you have ever worn a fabric blend or eaten shrimp or a cheeseburger? Were Adam and Eve created at the same time, or was she made from his rib?

And I really should stop feeding him, I know. I don't wear nail polish, though. :lol:

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Hey guys, remember Ken? The one who was sure FJ manipulated Google and got so mad when we quoted his and Lori's words back to him? And remember Cabinet Man, the (almost) strongest man in the world, who swore doctors told him to abuse his wife and then pleaded with us not to come looking for him? Remember them?

*sigh* Those were the days.

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Hey guys, remember Ken? The one who was sure FJ manipulated Google and got so mad when we quoted his and Lori's words back to him? And remember Cabinet Man, the (almost) strongest man in the world, who swore doctors told him to abuse his wife and then pleaded with us not to come looking for him? Remember them?

*sigh* Those were the days.

And you knew where you were then! Girls were girls and men were men. Mister, we could us a man like Herbert Hoover again. Didn't need no welfare state, everybody pulled his weight. Gee, our ol' LaSalle ran great...

Sorry...

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And you knew where you were then! Girls were girls and men were men. Mister, we could us a man like Herbert Hoover again. Didn't need no welfare state, everybody pulled his weight. Gee, our ol' LaSalle ran great...

Sorry...

:clap: :clap: :clap: :clap:

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And I really should stop feeding him, I know. I don't wear nail polish, though. :lol:

I meant to mix up another batch of Skunk Remedy today but forgot. Perhaps you could do it in lieu of putting on nail polish? :wink-kitty:

Here's the recipe again:

1 quart of 3% Hydrogen Peroxide

1/4 cup of baking soda

1 to 2 teaspoons liquid soap

Use immediately and dispose of any excess in running water. Do not put in closed container or it will explode!

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I meant to mix up another batch of Skunk Remedy today but forgot. Perhaps you could do it in lieu of putting on nail polish? :wink-kitty:

Here's the recipe again:

1 quart of 3% Hydrogen Peroxide

1/4 cup of baking soda

1 to 2 teaspoons liquid soap

Use immediately and dispose of any excess in running water. Do not put in closed container or it will explode!

Oh, I saw that (and called in the guys in Hazmat suits shortly thereafter). But then I strayed, I strayed . . . (another reference to an All in the Family cast member, although the actual quote is from The Odd Couple).

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I think it's time for a musical interlude!!!

oavMtUWDBTM

I can't help be think that some how it was all part of the plan to break the Soviets. Hideous Style for Hideous Style, Bad Musical for Bad Musical... they were NEVER going to be able to keep up with the US and their economy would collapse... this is just more proof. Brilliant!

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Babycakes is the fundie who said she doesn't hand slap since she knows what this forum is about. Westchamp is the recent fundie who seems more upset about Christians cussing than Doug masturbating in a young woman's face.

I think many of the times fundies come here to try and argue about their beliefs they do so thinking that they really are intellectual and that they can easily defend themselves. Fundie beliefs are pretty impossible to defend using logic and reason, though, so the fundie will always lose. But most fundies haven't experienced this. I am reminded of Country Boy who declared that he would have no problem discussing his beliefs and then within a few posts discovered that he couldn't even defend his anti-gay rights belief.

Having been raised fundie I remember the feeling that I was the intellectual one and everyone else was wrong and that I had all the answers. So I don't doubt for one second that westchamps thinks he is intellectual, but the fundie system of belief prevents any sort of real questioning and digging for answers outside of the narrow fundie approved list of answers.

Yeah, westchamps. Sorry. And now it's too late to edit my original post. Apologies to Babycakes, I don't know why or how I messed that up. Actually, I do, earlier I saw someone refer to baby cakes and I thought that was a new nick for west champs.

So sorry for the confusion and being a dork.

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Babycakes is the fundie who said she doesn't hand slap since she knows what this forum is about. Westchamp is the recent fundie who seems more upset about Christians cussing than Doug masturbating in a young woman's face.

So sorry, Babycakes. My apologies for getting you confused. I've asked the mods-that-be to correct my post (as I'm out of the official editing period)

I think many of the times fundies come here to try and argue about their beliefs they do so thinking that they really are intellectual and that they can easily defend themselves. Fundie beliefs are pretty impossible to defend using logic and reason, though, so the fundie will always lose. But most fundies haven't experienced this. I am reminded of Country Boy who declared that he would have no problem discussing his beliefs and then within a few posts discovered that he couldn't even defend his anti-gay rights belief.

It's not just the logic, though. From what I've seen they cannot cope with anyone approaching things from a different set of first principles. To me, one of the defining bits of logic is that you can take first principles and work through to their obvious conclusion. And you can do that without actually believing those first principles are true. Yeah, I can fundy argue from the bible, but that doesn't mean I believe the bible is the inerrant word of God. Plus, I was raised Catholic, we don't put so much stock in bible literalism as some of the protestant / fun die religions.

Having been raised fundie I remember the feeling that I was the intellectual one and everyone else was wrong and that I had all the answers. So I don't doubt for one second that westchamps thinks he is intellectual, but the fundie system of belief prevents any sort of real questioning and digging for answers outside of the narrow fundie approved list of answers.

Yup. Then again, there are times I'm sure I have all the answers, too. But that doesn't stop me from discussing other people's wrongness with them :dance:

One of the defining moments in my life was when I could truly and honestly disengage from an argument without changing either mind. It was absolutely OK that the person I was arguing with didn't agree with me. He could continue to be wrong, and that was fine by me. I didn't have to have him admit he was wrong. I knew it, he knew it and it was all OK. :whistle:

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I meant to mix up another batch of Skunk Remedy today but forgot. Perhaps you could do it in lieu of putting on nail polish? :wink-kitty:

Here's the recipe again:

1 quart of 3% Hydrogen Peroxide

1/4 cup of baking soda

1 to 2 teaspoons liquid soap

Use immediately and dispose of any excess in running water. Do not put in closed container or it will explode!

Hey, this works for cat stink, too!

(I took care of my mom's hideously poorly socialized/ badly behaved/possibly traumatized cat after she died. Not an experience I wish to repeat, but glad I found something to take the horrible smell out!)

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Busted. I know very little about the history of feminism. Does this make me "anti-intellectual"? Strangely, I don't feel as though a big part of my life is missing because I don't know the history of feminism. I do know that wherever there is an aggrieved woman and a TV camera, Gloria Steinem isn't far away.

I think you mean Gloria Allred.

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But, since you use Proverbs to justify hitting kids, and say that, no matter who is supposed to have written or said something, it is the voice of God, it seems like you are OK with laws and advice that pre-date the New Testament.

Sorry to quote myself, but it's too late to edit that post. I meant something in the Bible, of course.

Just thinking ahead, due to Westchamp's tendency to only read a few words here and there . . . :D

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Westchamps: do you honestly think you will change anyone's opinions? Why so surprised at the tenor of this site ? It was clearly laid out on the intro page. You will never have the last word. This forum is for pointing out the mistakes and foibles of fundamentalists- you know, those who are holier than thou. When one of them royally fucks up as in this case, it will be commented on. A lot. Deal with it or naff off.

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I love how westchamps judged us for spending so much time here and now can't leave. Lol

Westchamps: Anyway, if she gets money from a lawsuit, then the money can go to professional help to heal from the teachings and abuse from Doug. I don't know why you didn't put that together....

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Most. Boring. Fundie. Ever. How can you guys stand it when there are more exciting things to do, such as seeing if the grass is currently growing?

Anyhoo, this is going around my FB today and made me think of westie's precious virgin ears.

http://www.buzzfeed.com/robinedds/how-sweary-are-you (not breaking 'cause it's buzzfeed)

I got a 36, which is apparently very fucking sweary. That’s the shit! You’re fucking brilliant, and everyone knows it. Well fucking done. :lol:

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As for Doug's teachings being "anti-childrens-best-interests"....for starters, the very idea of what is in a particular child's best interest is extremely subjective. A public school administrator would almost certainly have a different idea about what is in my child's best interest than I do. My kids routinely test out multiple grade levels ahead of their same age public school peers, so I think I win that argument. You may have a completely different idea about what is in your child's best interest than what I think for mine. It is really ironic that you are trying to make this point because I have never seen any group that is more felicitous for the best interests of their children than fundamentalist Christians, particularly those who go to the trouble of home educating their children. We home educate our children and we spend copious amounts of time trying to make sure that we do everything possible to further both their education and their character. If you think that Doug teaches or was teaching something that was not in the best interests of your child, then certainly you bear the final responsibility for raising that child, not Doug Phillips. The whole nature of Vision Forum when it was started was all about the best interests of the Christian family, including children. Doug has betrayed those principles in his own family with regards to this affair, obviously, but that doesn't mean the principles and teachings no longer apply.

Another fundie homeschooler with an opinion. Yawn.

And his children are much smarter than those in the satanic public school!!!! I'm shocked. Those public school administrators and

their fancy thinkin'...well, they are just no match for our clever SOTDRT fundie.

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Most. Boring. Fundie. Ever. How can you guys stand it when there are more exciting things to do, such as seeing if the grass is currently growing?

Anyhoo, this is going around my FB today and made me think of westie's precious virgin ears.

http://www.buzzfeed.com/robinedds/how-sweary-are-you (not breaking 'cause it's buzzfeed)

I got a 36, which is apparently very fucking sweary. That’s the shit! You’re fucking brilliant, and everyone knows it. Well fucking done. :lol:

I started lurking on this site when the scandal with Doug broke then finally made an account but I have gone back and read some old threads. I read 2 other debates between fundie men and fj people. Westchamps is getting his ass handed to him compared to those guys.

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Most. Boring. Fundie. Ever. How can you guys stand it when there are more exciting things to do, such as seeing if the grass is currently growing?

Anyhoo, this is going around my FB today and made me think of westie's precious virgin ears.

http://www.buzzfeed.com/robinedds/how-sweary-are-you (not breaking 'cause it's buzzfeed)

I got a 36, which is apparently very fucking sweary. That’s the shit! You’re fucking brilliant, and everyone knows it. Well fucking done. :lol:

I got a 34, but I learned some new words today. They say you learn something new every day, so my work for today is done. Thanks Squirrely!

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If you read the stories of people who were homeschooled in conservative, fundamental Christian homes, many times they did not feel like their parents wanted what was in their best interest. Just in my experience, my parents were rare in that they wanted what was best for us education wise and even then it was really what THEY felt was best, not what was many times actually best for us. Christian history and science text books are a load of shit, but no way we were learning the truth about evolution or any history that painted Christians in a bad light.

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I got a 34, but I learned some new words today. They say you learn something new every day, so my work for today is done. Thanks Squirrely!

I only got 8. :lol: Apparently I need to work on my swearing skills. I learned a whole lot of new words with that quiz.

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If you read the stories of people who were homeschooled in conservative, fundamental Christian homes, many times they did not feel like their parents wanted what was in their best interest. Just in my experience, my parents were rare in that they wanted what was best for us education wise and even then it was really what THEY felt was best, not what was many times actually best for us. Christian history and science text books are a load of shit, but no way we were learning the truth about evolution or any history that painted Christians in a bad light.

The crusades and the inquisition, those were just little tea parties or maybe those weren't the right kind of Christians so you didn't even learn about them :shifty-kitty:

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I only got 8. :lol: Apparently I need to work on my swearing skills. I learned a whole lot of new words with that quiz.

8? wow. In my defense, I've said words that were *not* on the list :shifty-kitty:

8... I think my chihuahua says more than 8 when her dinner is late :wink-penguin:

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