15 years of MOTH

[ILoveJellybeans]

What is this book really? The cover just makes it seems like a grid of the times of the day vs the family members, and everyone has a different color. Can't you do that in excel? Do you really need a $28 book telling you how to?

That's pretty much it. And it also comes with special things for making it, instead of just doing it on the computer or even sticking post it notes to the wall like I originally thought their followers used.

[Brightonbelle]

Has the Maxwell family ever explained how the became more & more religious. Someone on an thread talked about how it was interesting how people leave religious groups. I always wonder how people get more religious.

I can see how it happens, especially if you have an obsessive streak. If you're getting up at 4.15am to pray, why not make it 4am? It's only 15mins after all, and think of all that extra prayer! If you've decided you need to be modest, where do you stop? If you schedule in hour blocks, why not half hour blocks? Etc.

[Odd1Out]

Terie looks much better now than she did 15 years ago. Maybe since the kids are all grown she doesn't have as much pressure on her. She just looks more relaxed in more recent photos.

[gardenvarietycitizen]

What is this book really? The cover just makes it seems like a grid of the times of the day vs the family members, and everyone has a different color. Can't you do that in excel? Do you really need a $28 book telling you how to?

The Maxwell books are not mainly about the "how to" - that's certainly a part of the book, but the big draw is all the scriptural references they will put in that will reassure you that the lifestyle in the book (which you were presumably attracted to, and so bought it) is Godly, that it's a proper Christian way to live.

Most of their books have multiple Bible quotes on each page. The book makes some statement or recommendation, and then follows that immediately with the Bible verse for justification. So if you're someone wondering if you should follow this path, or if you're trying to convince your family that this is a good idea or whatever it is, the book will give you arguments.

As a secular heathen, I'd be thinking "just get on with it" and skipping the verses maybe, so the book would seem quite skimpy on info (and it's gotten reviews that way). But for their true audience, the verses are the main point, and that's not really available elsewhere.

It's a niche product.

[kpmom]

The comment from G in the UK mistypes Titus2 as 'Tits2'.

Hmmm, what's the odds that G is our own Mr. John Hugh? And what's the over/under on how long the comment stays up? (I'm in a betting mood today).

[NoneandDoneinCali]

I think part of the appeal is that 10/15 years ago, when this product was at its height of popularity, basic computer skills weren't as universal. We take for granted that everybody knows how to make a friggin' spreadsheet now, but back in the day, that wasn't the case, especially for these isolated, uneducated families where mothers in their 30's and 40's had never held a job or been exposed to much technology. I remember taking a (granted, one unit) class at a city college in 2001 on how to use Excel for bookkeeping, and I was 20 at the time. The Maxwells were in a unique position to reach these people, because they followed the same repressive line of thinking. Basically, the Maxwells found a need and exploited the fact that they had a captive audience through their church lectures. They're trying to do the same thing today, but blogging'/computer use is more common so it doesn't work anymore.

[Coconut Flan]

How does the fundie slide work? A friend and I were discussing that last night as over the last 19 years we've watched two used to be good friends of ours slide into religious fundie tea partiers. It began with being Baptist adhering political conservatives who could still think for themselves. Then they began listening to conservative talk radio and switched to more conservative churches. As the pastors and talk show hosts became more rabid and conservative, they followed them step by step. I think it begins with fundie leanings or "getting a message." Then it's a step by step process of getting more "righteous" or not thinking about the messages they're taking in. Both of the erstwhile friends used to be able to hear or read counter arguments to the supposed facts they had and go oh I was misled. Now it's fingers in the ears chanting you're wrong I heard it from our pastor/Faux News, etc and you're just wrong. Frogs in boiling water and they're both well cooked now.

I agree about the spreadsheets. It was a much sought after accomplishment at work in 2000 to be able to quickly and easily produce quality spreadsheets. Now it's expected from entry level assistants.

[SPHASH]

Christopher also looks much older than 20 in those pics too.

[YPestis]

I also witnessed a friend slide into right-wing nuttery once. In college, she was a left leaning Catholic (supported gay marriage, championed rape victims' rights etc). She was also family oriented: one of her most important goals was to have 2-3 kids and be able to stay home for several years. It was typical of a lot of middle-class and upper-middle class girls in our college.

Everything was going according to her plan. She met a Catholic boyfriend who was planning a medical career. He gave her a promise ring. They refrained from sex. She transferred to his school (against family and friend's wishes) since she felt they were going to be married anyway. Six years later, and still dating, they had a messy breakup. My friend picked herself up, found another guy and declared she has become a "conservative". I thought it was great she bounced back. However, as time went on, I realized she was drifting way into rightwing territory.

My friend started railing against "feminists" who were destroying society. She deplored the materialism of dual earners who "dumped" kids in daycare so they can "buy McMansions". She thought public welfare should be replaced by private charities because there's so much help out there! It was a litany of fundie beliefs. And the anti-thesis of everything she believed in.

I finally realized my friend's breakup led her to question her entire value system: her social beliefs, her religion, her political views. My friend thought she had done everything "right" and yet her life took a wrong turn. I think she decided her belief system must be wrong because why else could she have misjudged her boyfriend and made all those mistakes?

Strangely enough, it was her life turning another wrong turn that brought her back from the fringe. Shortly after giving birth, her husband lost his job and she found herself scrambling to support the family. She became the family breadwinner and is proudly still working to this day. However, my friend no longer believes the right-wing stuff. I trace that change to her family's financial struggles. It's hard to castigate working mothers when she is one, it's hard to rail against the welfare system when....well, she either came close or had to use it, and it's very hard to parse the right-wing language of "personal responsibility" when you fell onto hard times despite being educated and hard working.

I guess life is filled with unexpected turns. But it's those life experiences that forms our opinion. For some people, dramatic changes can cause one to do an 180 on their entire belief system. I think that's how mainstream, educated people turn into fundies. It's a reaction to something horrible in their lives. They feel they were wronged despite doing everything "right", and therefore reject the entire system believing this will protect them from another hurt.

However, I think if a person is smart and can think beyond their own sufferings, they will come out out stronger for it.

For our fundie families, many started out mainstream but decided they were "doing it wrong". Fundie society has rigid rules but also guarantees happiness and a rewarding afterlife if one adheres to those rules. Everyone comes out a winner! It's a guarantee few secular institutions can offer.

In some ways, turning towards fundie-dom is a way to close oneself off from the world. No family epitomizes this better than the Maxwells. They talk about "sheltering" but it's really just shutting out the world. It's like participating in a witch doctor ritual to cure your cancer so you can avoid chemo. Life is hard and the world is dangerous. It's a form of "magical thinking" that simple, if rigid, daily tasks can inoculate you against the frightening realities of life. And that is what many fundie families fall into.

[sparkles]

I'm pretty sure that Christopher came out of the womb as a middle aged clone of Steve. Even in pictures of him when he was young, he always looked like an uptight, rigid, humorless, self-righteous, get-off-my-lawn type, and it's even more apparent now that he's older. Of all of them, I think he'll be the one to take over after Steve kicks, overriding Nathan's first-born privilege.

[FloraDoraDolly]

How does the fundie slide work? A friend and I were discussing that last night as over the last 19 years we've watched two used to be good friends of ours slide into religious fundie tea partiers. It began with being Baptist adhering political conservatives who could still think for themselves. Then they began listening to conservative talk radio and switched to more conservative churches. As the pastors and talk show hosts became more rabid and conservative, they followed them step by step. I think it begins with fundie leanings or "getting a message." Then it's a step by step process of getting more "righteous" or not thinking about the messages they're taking in. Both of the erstwhile friends used to be able to hear or read counter arguments to the supposed facts they had and go oh I was misled. Now it's fingers in the ears chanting you're wrong I heard it from our pastor/Faux News, etc and you're just wrong. Frogs in boiling water and they're both well cooked now.

The Maxwells probably started out on a similar trajectory, but something happened that turned them into isolationists. Steve often mentions pastors who cheat on their wives, so I wonder if this is why the Maxwells stopped going to a real church? Even an uber-fundie church would keep Steve tethered to the outside world to some degree, but apparently he doesn't want that. And so the Maxwells become more and more isolated and drift farther and farther out to sea. There was also that time when Steve was having difficulty at work because he was expected to (gasp) interact with female collagues. I'm not sure if that's when he quit his job to work at home, or what. But again, it contributes to the family's isolation.

[Jana814]

I'm pretty sure that Christopher came out of the womb as a middle aged clone of Steve. Even in pictures of him when he was young, he always looked like an uptight, rigid, humorless, self-righteous, get-off-my-lawn type, and it's even more apparent now that he's older. Of all of them, I think he'll be the one to take over after Steve kicks, overriding Nathan's first-born privilege.

Good point. I bet he does! Espically since he was the one that had a boy 1st. I hope his poor son doesn't become a clone of his father & grandfather.

[skankbiscuit]

I imagine the women at church were defrauding to Steve. Most women don't wear frumpers, and even if the women were "modest" you could still see their figures. Steve has a problem with this, and that is why he forces Teri and his daughters to bring their clothing choices to him for approval. Don't buttons draw the eye to the chest, and Steve won't allow them? Steve has an issue with getting overly turned on by other women, me thinks, and that is why they don't associate with others. He has also mentioned that a woman bent over in his home during Bible study, and he caught an eyeful of her cleavage. Most guys would just look away and get on with their lives, but it made Steve CRY.

He is seriously, seriously messed up.

[johnhugh]

G says:

January 31, 2014 at 8:26 pm

Happy Birthday Tits2 !!

As a home schooling mummy in the UK, I could not have begun to know how to schedule without this book.

It’s allowed me to serve Him and my family.

THANK YOU Mrs Maxwell.

love G

>>>>>>>>>>>

Thank you.

:naughty: Stevie, when you over looked the spelling error :wink-penguin: when you passed 'G's' post, where you thinking about the breasts of the women that you leered at when she stooped down, then blamed her husband for the lustful thoughts that were put on your **** heart?

What fucks me off big time, is that the lady put 'Gaynor' as a Christian name not 'G' - again Stevie thinks he can even edit peoples names.

http://www.thinkbabynames.com/meaning/1/Gaynor

http://www.thinkbabynames.com/meaning/1/Gay

>>>>>>>>>>>

Oh Stevie, the beauty of turning of the power and getting a new ip address. :wink-penguin:

[kpmom]

:naughty: Stevie, when you over looked the spelling error :wink-penguin: when you passed 'G's' post, where you thinking about the breasts of the women that you leered at when she stooped down, then blamed her husband for the lustful thoughts that were put on your **** heart?

What fucks me off big time, is that the lady put 'Gaynor' as a Christian name not 'G' - again Stevie thinks he can even edit peoples names.

http://www.thinkbabynames.com/meaning/1/Gaynor

http://www.thinkbabynames.com/meaning/1/Gay

>>>>>>>>>>>

Oh Stevie, the beauty of turning of the power and getting a new ip address. :wink-penguin:

Ah ha! I had a strong feeling G was you John Hugh.

I'm sure Steve has some kind of filter that refuses to allow the word Gay to be posted even as part of a name. Interestingly tits is ok.

[Trynn]

Well, I hope he never receives any letters from the town of Gay, Michigan.

[Marian the Librarian]

Well, I hope he never receives any letters from the town of Gay, Michigan.

There's a Hell, Michigan too! Which is probably where Stevie thinks we FJ-ers are all going to go after we die... :lol:

[AuntCloud]

May I suggest the thread title be changed to "15 years a slave"?

[gardenvarietycitizen]

The censoring doesn't even have to be about gay, though. The Tit blog (yeah, I type "tit" and the rest autocompletes) edits all names so that you can't have any possibility of looking the poster up and having contact outside of the titblog. The MOTH forums do the same thing.

So they will turn one name, at least, into initials. They do this even for absolutely foreign names that can't have any shady meanings in English.

I've been to the Gay, Michigan that's in the UP.

[Jecca]

And I see the one comment that didn't get a reply was the one who didn't actually purchase the book, it was given to her.

Bloody rude, Stevus. Have you ever stopped to consider that a secondhand copy is the only way some people can afford a book, no matter how low the price?

[uber frau]

There's no need to buy second hand, those ppl just need to start on Steve's supa speshul savings plan. Put an envelope on the fridge and save 50 cents a week. Before they know it they'll have enough for MOTH. And if they're really blessed, they might manage to save enough for a OneTonRamp course as well. :roll:

[lizziesmom]

How does the fundie slide work? A friend and I were discussing that last night as over the last 19 years we've watched two used to be good friends of ours slide into religious fundie tea partiers. It began with being Baptist adhering political conservatives who could still think for themselves. Then they began listening to conservative talk radio and switched to more conservative churches. As the pastors and talk show hosts became more rabid and conservative, they followed them step by step. I think it begins with fundie leanings or "getting a message." Then it's a step by step process of getting more "righteous" or not thinking about the messages they're taking in. Both of the erstwhile friends used to be able to hear or read counter arguments to the supposed facts they had and go oh I was misled. Now it's fingers in the ears chanting you're wrong I heard it from our pastor/Faux News, etc and you're just wrong. Frogs in boiling water and they're both well cooked now.

I agree about the spreadsheets. It was a much sought after accomplishment at work in 2000 to be able to quickly and easily produce quality spreadsheets. Now it's expected from entry level assistants.

IMO the conservative talk radio and conservative tv (which has grown by leaps and bounds since the Fairness Doctrine was revoked during the Reagan administration) programs are pure propaganda. The more you listen, the deeper you become indoctrinated. There is no other side being presented, precious little factual information, and an agenda behind all of it. Those who listen to radio and watch tv programs 24/7 are going to to become well cooked frogs as you have correctly noted.

[JaChelle Sugar]

I wonder if for dessert tonight Steve will allow them each 15 animal crackers to celebrate the 15 year anniversary?

15? of course not. that many would be gluttony. sure gluttony isn't as sinful as f*n but its pretty bad.

[JaChelle Sugar]

IMO the conservative talk radio and conservative tv (which has grown by leaps and bounds since the Fairness Doctrine was revoked during the Reagan administration) programs are pure propaganda. The more you listen, the deeper you become indoctrinated. There is no other side being presented, precious little factual information, and an agenda behind all of it. Those who listen to radio and watch tv programs 24/7 are going to to become well cooked frogs as you have correctly noted.

UGH conservative talk radio. I know people who think that people like Sean Hannity are actual journalists instead of peddling talking points for ratings.

[WonderingInWA]

I'm shocked Stevie hasn't corrected the "Tits2" comment yet. That is hilarious!