Lay off Josh Duggar's Weight?

[ladypuglover]

Can you really not get it through your head that the OP has significantly edited the post at least five times? (she's even changed the title at least three times!) The post I responded to originally was one of the most judging, shaming, handslapping, pearl clutching posts I've ever read here. It rivaled Elle's "be nice to a rude bitch" thread.

ANYTIME someone posts with the aim of controlling anyone else's behavior, its gonna be an issue. OP didn't post HER opinions on fatphobic comments or on any of the issues raised in the ensuing discussion. She posted a one off bitch fit about how everyone should be nicer and then edited it down when everyone didn't fall all over her in praise.

I saw the OP's first post before edit and s/he intended this arguement to happen. S/he wanted to start a fight and s/he got it. The orignal post was very inflammatory which struck me odd as the post count of the OP at the time was under 10. So a noob gets to say how and what we say and we are supposed to take and ask for more? I don't think so. I don't use racist terms in writting or in life. It's ugly and I don't want that in my mouth. I also have never said anything on Smuggar's weight other than he could have a medical problem. Like a problem with his thyroid as he also has had some hair loss.

I'm sorry but I'm not going to allow a person that edits their posts 5 times and with less than 10 postings tell me what to do. I get a turn to drive the ISB just like everyone else. I have a pretty handbasket filled with cookies and I'm not giving that up either. If someone doesn't like that this board uses freedom of speech then they are free to click on the little x in the upper right hand corner. I fail to see why one person or a minority gets to say what happens on this board just because their feelings are hurt. I can control how I feel about things but I'm not going to be responsible for anyone else's feelings. They need to grow up and do that for themselves.

ETA, I think I have mixed up my posters as I don't think the OP of this thread was the one under 10 post counts. Still a very low number to come in with both guns blazing.

[Buzzard]

Hi all. I've been noticing that it seems like a lot of people like to make fun of Josh Duggar and his weight and I don't know, I just don't think that's really nice. Don't mind me, I really can't stand him either! But, I mean there's a lot of other people that have the same issue as him and no one says a word about their weight. Please don't take offence, I am just wondering if we should try to lighten up on making fun of his weight. Who knows what he is going through. He could be under a lot of stress or even have health issues and not be able to help it. You know what I mean? It's just my opinion to snark on other things about him like his arrogant attitude (Which I can't stand!) but it's only my opinion so it doesn't matter if you still want to or not. I just made this post because weight issues are sensitive and it's just something I've kept in mind I guess.

From what I can recall there was no line about not standing him either and most certainly nothing about considering the issues other on the board may have. The line about what he may or may not have been going through was there but nothing about his arrogant attitude snark being a ok. The health issues line seems to be the only original line left.

I recall a much more hand slapping "you're doing it wrong" tone that, honestly, rose to troll level.

[ladypuglover]

From what I can recall there was no line about not standing him either and most certainly nothing about considering the issues other on the board may have. The line about what he may or may not have been going through was there but nothing about his arrogant attitude snark being a ok. The health issues line seems to be the only original line left.

I recall a much more hand slapping "you're doing it wrong" tone that, honestly, rose to troll level.

I remember it that way too, Buzzard.

[keeperrox]

I didn't notice that the title went from:

"Lay off Josh Duggar?"

to "Lay off Josh Duggar a little?"

to "Lay off Josh Duggar's Weight?"

I'd LOVE to read the original post, now.

[daharyn]

I don't like that there are people here with legitimate arguments that are being reduced to "pearl clutchers" and "trolls" and being told "the fact of being fat should not be an insult to a fat person!" And you can't hide behind the argument that "this is a snark board!!1!" just because you don't have a good excuse for being closed minded. Yes, this is a snark board, but does that mean we're not open to any discussion or debate as to what is acceptable to be snarked on without someone being called "The PC police"? FTR, I don't even care either way how people talk about Josh Duggar. I think fat jokes are cheap shots, but hey, some people get their kicks from low-hanging fruit, so whatever. My problem is the way this argument, by the first response, was already a mudslinging match because someone expressed a difference of opinion.

This x1000.

I tried to bring in some medical data and got an I-won't-believe-it-so-it-doesn't-matter-what-the-science-says attitude. It's funny, how we all revert to fundamentalist behavior the minute someone has facts we don't like.

[forever ago]

On the subject of the pill, which I take for my endometriosis- it didn't cause weight gain for me, but it did give me epic zits. Apparently I'm in the like 2% of people whose acne didn't improve after going on it. Of course.

I went on BC originally for bad periods- painful cramps, irregularity, heavy flow, and just generally feeling shitty on my period- and an ovarian cyst. The pill didn't do shit other than make me nauseous 24/7 and regulate my periods. The patch gave me migraines and made me vomit each month right before my period, but made my periods more tolerable and definitely helped my poor appetite. The ring has improved my periods even more, though my appetite is about where I was. None of the three have really done anything for the cyst, but I stayed on it not just for my periods but in the hopes of gaining weight (I'm 100ish pounds, and am probably considerably lighter after this bout of stomach issues). I haven't gained a single pound on this shit.

FWIW, my acne was awful from age 9, but despite seeing two dermatologists, trying every OTC acne treatment available, and going on Accutane at 16, my acne didn't start clearing up until soon after I turned 18. It went away naturally. So BC hasn't done much, really, though I notice on the ring I break out just a little around my period. Better than what I had without BC, though...

[justlurking]

This x1000.

I tried to bring in some medical data and got an I-won't-believe-it-so-it-doesn't-matter-what-the-science-says attitude. It's funny, how we all revert to fundamentalist behavior the minute someone has facts we don't like.

Daharyn, I don't know who you're trying to fool. You didn't bring shit! You tried to validate someone else's claims by saying that you'd "try" to get some references and come back when you had the time (in the next few days) :roll:

I told you not to bother, cause you aren't gonna find anything. Even the people here that claim they "can't lose weight" have stated that they can lose pounds, but have difficulty maintaining the weight loss (for a variety of reasons). The whole premise behind my statements about people's ability to lose weight was to show that its not the same as being born with a disability that you won't ever be able to change.

Now, if you can find some "scientific evidence" which shows there are people who have never lost a single pound in their life, or have never experienced even a minor fluctuation in their weight I MIGHT be willing to read what you have to say. Until then, you can go sit down next to Jencendiary.

ETA: On second thought, don't both bother to provide any of your "medical data" which I definitely WON'T READ. As I told you in my last post, a person's inability to lose weight is irrelevant in terms of the discussion we were having about Josh Duggar whom I feel, the issue would probably not apply to.

[darareaksmey]

There seem to be an awful lot of people on this thread who are of the impression that if something doesn't bother them, it shouldn't bother anyone else. And not only should it not bother anybody else, but anybody who is bothered by it and expresses such discomfort deserves nothing but disdain.

Of course, I forgot that you're the only fat person in the world and only your reaction matters.

I just can't understand the apparent lack of sensitivity for anybody who doesn't share this perspective - they're bleeding hearts and pearl clutchers and insecure fatties. What made you people so bitter and callous?

***********************************************************************************************

Not just me, darling. Perhaps you've noticed others on this thread who've agreed with me?

No matter. I never, ever called Smuggar fat till this very thread; but if I were interested in continuing drama, I would call him fat fuck every chance I get till the cows come home. I'm a bleeding heart myself, but my heart doesn't bleed for a guy who condemns pretty much every one of us to hell. Here's my heart bleeding for the fat fuck: :violin:

Again, whatever. Everyone can now go back to being NotFat.

edited to clarify what's mine and what isn't; edited again to get the italics to work and if it didn't, I don't have time to edit more.

[Jencendiary]

Justlurking - Why is it so important that your fatphobic views be validated? Because at this point, you're trolling too.

[Avalondaughter]

I think there isn't much I can add to the discussion of why we feel it's okay to pick on Smuggar's weight. He's arrogant and demands perfection in a cult that demands perfection from women, but allows men to let themselves go.

The one thing I will add is just my observation that his weight gain is somewhat telling about how much food you get on your plate when you're one of 21 members of a household versus what you get when you're one of 2-4. How much TTC was on his plate growing up? Is it any wonder he might want more chickenetti?

[justlurking]

Justlurking - Why is it so important that your fatphobic views be validated? Because at this point, you're trolling too.

Jencendiary, you are pure USDA grade IDIOT. It's not my problem that you're so damn sensitive about your weight that you can't even comprehend when someone says "being overweight is not the same as being born disabled"--that's NOT being "fat phobic". You can continue trying to use inflammatory language to try to "validate" your pearl-clutching behavior, but it ain't gonna make what you say true.

Now, didn't I go tell you to go sit in a corner someplace...

While you're there :shhh:

[Jencendiary]

If I wanted someone to teach me how to suck eggs, I'd pick a better weasel than you.

[demgirl]

Jencendiary, you are pure USDA grade IDIOT. It's not my problem that you're so damn sensitive about your weight that you can't even comprehend when someone says "being overweight is not the same as being born disabled"--that's NOT being "fat phobic". You can continue trying to use inflammatory language to try to "validate" your pearl-clutching behavior, but it ain't gonna make what you say true.

Now, didn't I go tell you to go sit in a corner someplace...

While you're there :shhh:

Wow. Just... wow. Your level of vitriol, condescension, and dismissiveness on this thread is truly odd. I have stayed out of this conversation because I didn't think it was going anywhere positive for anyone involved. But, seriously, why is it necessary to tell another poster to "go sit in a corner" and tell them to be quiet? And it's not just after jecendiary came back at you ... that's pretty much what you've said from your first post on this thread. Telling someone to sit in their corner, or shut up, or yelling "Next!" after you 'decimate' their argument with a stated opinion isn't clever, it's not witty, and it's not convincing.

You absolutely have the right on this board to be a jerk to other posters. This board is all about free speech and saying what you will, no matter how controversial it is. But I needed to say something at this point -- not to tell you that you CAN'T say the things you are saying, but to say that I don't understand why you want to.

There's been a lot of attacking of each other lately on this board and it simply seems unnecessary. We are all so different and different things bother us. I don't think anyone's argument (except maybe the OP -- I didn't see the original post) was that it shouldn't be permitted to talk about Josh's weight. I think it was simply a conversation about whether you should talk about it, whether it's morally right to talk about it, and about whether it's even funny to talk about it. And I simply don't see why that conversation, which seems to me a perfectly valid conversation, has turned into, "Shut up. You're wrong because you don't agree with me. Don't bother trying to convince me -- I can't be bothered to care about your arguments, facts, statistics, or anything else. Now that I've taken care of you by saying that, shut up. You shouldn't talk anymore."

[justlurking]

If I wanted someone to teach me how to suck eggs, I'd pick a better weasel than you.

I'm truly devastated! :roll:

[justlurking]

Wow. Just... wow. Your level of vitriol, condescension, and dismissiveness on this thread is truly odd. I have stayed out of this conversation because I didn't think it was going anywhere positive for anyone involved. But, seriously, why is it necessary to tell another poster to "go sit in a corner" and tell them to be quiet? And it's not just after jecendiary came back at you ... that's pretty much what you've said from your first post on this thread. Telling someone to sit in their corner, or shut up, or yelling "Next!" after you 'decimate' their argument with a stated opinion isn't clever, it's not witty, and it's not convincing.

Demgirl, you should've followed your initial thoughts and just stayed out of things. Anyone who's even bothered to read the thread can clearly see that Jencendiary came at me FIRST, and out of nowhere, using inflammatory language to try to make it appear that I have issues with people who are overweight.

Yeah, I'm gonna be dismissive of someone who doesn't even take the time to READ what was stated and who then accuse me of being something I am not based on their lack of information---just like I'm about to be dismissive of you.

You too can go take a seat in the corner and STFU.

[pomology]

I'm not trying to hand slap anyone. I just stated that it hurts my feelings when the topic turns to certain things about weight--not just saying that someone's fat, but the attitude that always comes out on these kinds of threads that if fat people would just get off their fat ass and work out, and eat less, that would be problem solved. In theory, yes, I agree completely. In reality, it's not that simple. I desperately wish it was. There are psychological and emotional things that go along with weight gain.

In my family, there wasn't really enough food. I never realized this until about a year ago, actually, when I mentioned to my friends about how I ate growing up (I was very skinny), and they pointed out that I really didn't have much food. My mom didn't really keep anything "snacky" in the house, and once the meal was gone, it was gone. No seconds. I have IBS, and sometimes I would be sick before breakfast, but if I wasn't at the table, my brother would eat it, and my mother wouldn't stop him. Now I have MAJOR issues if someone eats something in the house that was supposed to be mine. I could see Josh having similar issues.

That said, I don't really care about Josh; I don't know the guy. I do think his upbringing is the reason he's Smuggar now. I don't care what anyone says about him, but I do wish people would consider other people when they generalize (yeah, I know--wishes, horses, beggars, etc.). I don't know what the original post said; I only saw it after it had been edited about 8 times. I don't know; I don't believe in censorship, so I'm not going to try to tell anyone what they should and shouldn't say. Snark away.

Signed,

Insecure, pearl-clutching fatass and puffin-lover.

Lainey,

I am incredibly sorry if what I said offended you. I truly did not mean to. My point about eating less and exercise is not about any individual person. It was more that I wish there was a societal overhaul where children grew up eating healthier food and being encouraged to exercise, because I think if you get into these habits as a child, they are much easier to maintain (for example, my parents have always served relatively healthy food and we pretty much never ate out in fast food restaurants and to this day I find most greasy, deep-fried food nauseating, but I love plain, boiled vegetables, which I think has everything to do with how I was fed growing up; as for exercising, I was not a particularly active child and even though I played some sports, I could not run more than short spurts and it is still a struggle to force myself to exercise).

Also, I do know several people (including myself) who have lost weight by exercising and eating better/less. I talked about my brother and I before, but I also had a Hebrew tutor (who must be in her fifties or so) who was always overweight and struggled for years with dieting, but about a year or two ago started going to the gym and get incredibly skinny and fit. So I know that for at least some segment of the population, putting your mind to it will yield results. I also understand that this segment of the population is generally younger and therefore in better shape physically and that mental conditions have a lot to do with it, too.

But I also know that it is hard and that some people, no matter how hard they try or how much willpower they have, it won't yield results. Particularly, as you say, when there are emotional issues involved. So, I feel bad for suggesting that you (and others like you) do not have willpower or whatever because they can't just eat better and exercise *abra kadabra* they're thin. That is not true and I should have chosen my words more carefully. I should have said that while I know that there are people out there who could stand to try eating better and exercising more, it's not at easy at it sounds and everybody has different bodies and different minds and therefore function differently.

By the way, I remember in one thread somebody commented about how even in blue (i.e. in your avatar) you are lovely and I have to agree. I know that you are working to lose weight and I wish you the best of luck in achieving your goals. But you are a lovely person both inside and (again, per your profile picture) outside.

My apologies once more for my insensitive wording,

pomology

[Lainey]

Awww, thanks, pomology. :) I wasn't referring to anything you said specifically. To be honest, there was another thread a few weeks ago where weight issues were brought up, and it was quite harsh. I must admit to some issues because I had lost a bunch of weight, then I got depressed and gained it all back plus 10 pounds. *sigh* And it seems like whatever mind frame I was in that enabled me to lose it in the first place, is gone. I want it back. Being fat sucks--it makes everything much harder, physically. Then you get people pointing it out to you, as if you don't know and need to be told. :roll: Some people treat you like you're stupid. I'm not stupid, and I hate being treated like I am. I am one of the people who really does know a lot about nutrition and weight loss (one learns when one has tried basically every weight loss system out there), but for some reason I have a LOT of trouble implementing it.

Anyway, I didn't want to make this thread all about me and my issues. Now are the rest of you going to quit fighting, or do I have to break out the puffins? :mrgreen:

:violence-axechase: :violence-duel: :violence-guntoting: :violence-hammer: :violence-instagib: :violence-rapidfire: :violence-rambo: :violence-smack: :violence-stickwhack:

[Guest Anonymous]

Jencendiary, you are pure USDA grade IDIOT. It's not my problem that you're so damn sensitive about your weight that you can't even comprehend when someone says "being overweight is not the same as being born disabled"--that's NOT being "fat phobic". You can continue trying to use inflammatory language to try to "validate" your pearl-clutching behavior, but it ain't gonna make what you say true.

Now, didn't I go tell you to go sit in a corner someplace...

While you're there :shhh:

Why do you have to be so aggressive and condescending about this? What is it about this discussion that has you feeling so insecure that you have to cut down anybody who disagrees with you?

Seems to me like you're the one with a major chip on your shoulder about weight.

[justlurking]

Why do you have to be so aggressive and condescending about this?

READ the thread. I'm not gonna keep going over this.

What is it about this discussion that has you feeling so insecure that you have to cut down anybody who disagrees with you?

What exactly are you disagreeing with?

Seems to me like you're the one with a major chip on your shoulder about weight.

Yeah, okay :roll: Weren't you the one calling people bitter and callous because they disagreed with you?

[PBrooke]

As an objective third-party observer, albeit the originator of the puffin: justlurking, you started out reasonable. You made some statements that while not trolling, were perhaps designed to elicit a reaction - I'm thinking of "Just ask Jennifer Hudson about losing weight" (yes, because talking to someone paid to look good is entirely the same as the average US chunk). In my opinion, by responding to someone who was offering to get research to back up their claims with a "Yawn," it was you who fired the first shot, bringing the conversation into flame war status. Just sayin.'

Full disclosure: I am a chunk, and it is entirely due to my own laziness and inability to put down the Oreos - and really, my poor self-control makes it all the more insulting to those with real metabolic problems, people who work far harder than I do, with less results.

Edited to add the word 'who'

[justlurking]

As an objective third-party observer, albeit the originator of the puffin: justlurking, you started out reasonable. You made some statements that while not trolling, were perhaps designed to elicit a reaction - I'm thinking of "Just ask Jennifer Hudson about losing weight" (yes, because talking to someone paid to look good is entirely the same as the average US chunk). In my opinion, by responding to someone who was offering to get research to back up their claims with a "Yawn," it was you who fired the first shot, bringing the conversation into flame war status. Just sayin.'

Full disclosure: I am a chunk, and it is entirely due to my own laziness and inability to put down the Oreos - and really, my poor self-control makes it all the more insulting to those with real metabolic problems, people who work far harder than I do, with less results.

Edited to add the word 'who'

PBrooke, it may have been your perception that my statement about Jennifer Hudson was designed to elicit a reaction, but that wasn't my intention. I have maintained throughout this entire thread that I didn't think being overweight was the same as being born disabled--because weight is something that can be changed whereas disabilities cannot. A poster named Rachel tried to claim that there are people who can't lose weight. My comment about Jennifer Hudson was used to illustrate that there are people, like her, who have felt that they can't lose weight due to years of struggling with their weight when, to be technical, it is in their ability to do so (in a way that disabled people cannot). The issue of weight maintenance is an entirely different issue.

For that matter, any "research" that someone would provide on such an issue would be irrelevant unless they provided information on people who had never lost a single pound in their entire life. My point has always been that weight isn't static, whereas a disability is.

It is your perception that a *yawn* can bring a conversation into flame war status, but it is my perception that using inflammatory statements such as "fat phobic" and "size discriminatory" when someone has said nothing of the sort does more to cause wars. I even pointed out in an earlier thread that I didn't think it was cool to harass people for being overweight or disabled, but that point was entirely missed because SOME people were just so intent on "going to war".

[Witsec1]

Oh for fuck's sake, go have a donut and chill out.

[EmmieJ]

I may be foolishly wading in where other, smarter people would not, but here's my two cents on the Josh Duggar/weight gain issue.

I don't post here often, but I do post on other forums about the Duggars, and yes, I do snark on Josh's weight gain, in conjunction with his general slothful lifestyle. I am overweight myself, and I don't believe in mocking a person based solely on their weight. My mocking of the Duggars, and in this instance, Josh, is based on a host of factors. The Duggars hold themselves up as being better than your average bear because they follow Gothard's rules. When I mock Josh, including his morphing into a 40'something balding, paunchy man while still in his young 20's, it's because it seems to invalidate their claim to being better than everyone else.

A young man in his prime of life (with no apparent disabilities - as our Joshie appears to me) should easily maintain a decent level of physical fitness without much effort. What demands does Josh have on his time? He sleeps in late, goes to work at his dad's car lot, then sluffs off home to eat dinner and watch tv. In between, he and Anna go along on TLC-funded trips to earn their easy living. Anna is the one doing the hard work - cleaning house, shopping, cooking meals, laundry, and hauling luggage. I wouldn't be surprised if she changes the oil on their cars too!

Josh is lazy, and he likes to eat. That's why he's packing on the pounds. I packed on the pounds while going through a postpartum depression after my son was born. I've been fighting those pounds ever since. But I don't put myself out there as a paragon of holy virtue, don't make a living scamming gullible viewers, and don't pretend to be any better than the next person. I deal with daily discrimination against overweight people by basically ignoring it and going about my life, accepting myself for who and what I am now, and always trying to do better.

Before he got married, Josh was a fairly attractive, slim young man. In the two years since, he and Prince William can compete for whose hair is falling out the fastest, his waistline has expanded greatly, his skin is pasty looking, and he looks at least 10 years older than his actual age. He can't help his hair loss -- but he could easily start taking a brisk 2-mile walk daily and push away the dinner plate after one serving. Many secular men do so.

[PBrooke]

This is neither here nor there, but why do people keep calling Josh "pasty"? Isn't it better than being some redneck leathered up by the sun? Why is being pale equated to sickly?

[forever ago]

This is neither here nor there, but why do people keep calling Josh "pasty"? Isn't it better than being some redneck leathered up by the sun? Why is being pale equated to sickly?

That's what I'm wondering. Josh doesn't look pasty to me, though apparently being "whiter than white" is a bad thing. I think it's modern culture's emphasis on tanning.