Alyssa Bates and John Webster are courting

[Joan of Snarc]

We encourage them to become close friends and get to know each other BEFORE entering courtship. By the time our kids are ready to court, they’re best friends and feel that they are moving forward to see if they should marry. During courtship, they’re obviously getting to know each other in a much different way, with the thought of marriage in mind. They are boyfriend and girlfriend at this point, not just friends. They do Bible study together, share beliefs, goals…It’s a time that they can be sparky and say, “I love you!†and go on dates, and buy gifts for one another, and express their feelings. Then engagement, for us, is a time of wedding planning. Every family is different in how they view the courtship process. There are many books and DVDs and MANY opinions. We have chosen what we feel is best to help us meet our goals, but others might pursue relationships in a different manner. Love, Kelly

:lol: I can hear my Mamaw telling me about when she was young, saying, "Young people would be sparkin', ya know...." Or, "Me and your Papaw were sparkin' back then...."

:lol: So funny. I haven't thought about that phrase in ages. I can't believe Kelly Bates actually used it, or a form of it.

[sunshine]

I wish they would but I doubt they do. It seems like their views on courting and dating are relatively liberal compared to the rest of their religious peers. I'm sure a book expressing their views would draw a lot of ire because they're allowing their kids to be "exposed to temptation" by not making them "guard their hearts" or some other hogwash.

Even still, the Duggar girl's book is expected to be release in March so people may compare the Bates' website to their book. It appears they are getting recognized through the creation of fan pages.

[RosyDaisy]

Dang, I was still in college when my sister got married. I managed to study and help her with wedding planning. I was also a SAHD (financial reasons, couldn't afford college housing). What's there excuse?

[RosyDaisy]

I assume Kelly doesn't know that "sparky" is a euphemism for sex. :shock:

[SamuraiKatz]

On her Pinterest description, Alyssa had "I 150% love my boyfriend" and as soon as it became more public, she changed it to "I 150% love coffee" - apparently they are ok with using that term

So coffee is code for boyfriend? Please! Just let them be honest about their feelings!

[sunshine]

Dang, I was still in college when my sister got married. I managed to study and help her with wedding planning. I was also a SAHD (financial reasons, couldn't afford college housing). What's there excuse?

I guess not everyone has strong multi-tasking skills.

[SamuraiKatz]

I would like to see what type of house the Webster's live in.

They do look lovely and happy.

What do we know about John other than who his papa is? Does he work, school, anything?

Is there some fundie rule about getting married off in order of age? In the non fundie world, how many people marry off by age. My husband had 4 younger brothers marry before him. My husband wanted to go to college, build a house and start his career before he even thought about marriage.

It is actually encouraging to me that these siblings are going out of order and picking when the time is right for them. It seems a bit more like a normal life, just a bit more.

Kelly has also said a few times when asked on her blog about if her kids wanted to kiss before marriage or leave the faith what she would do. She has said she would still love her kids no matter what choices they made (of course she said she hopes they choose wisely). I believe she would still love Zac if his future bride started wearing her jeans again or if Allysa had only 3 kids. In comparison every time Michelle is asked the same type of question we hear, that ALL of the kids want to wait to kiss and want lots of babies. We have never heard Michelle say she would love and accept her kids if they decided one day to wear jeans , date, and have no kids.

I believe Michelle said (in on of the early tv eps) that if the kids decided not to follow the Duggar faith (ATI), it would be their loss.

[sunshine]

I believe Michelle said (in on of the early tv eps) that if the kids decided not to follow the Duggar faith (ATI), it would be their loss.

So, it is safe to say the follow more of an organization than God.

The girls did say they want someone whose faith that does not waiver. I think Jill say it during the interview about courtship. I guess the person would want to continue the ATI, maybe because they have invested so much into the program. Thomas stated that he does not share the same views as the ATI.

[Odd1Out]

I just saw the courtship post. First of all, they are gorgeous and the photos are wonderful. I am jealous of the scenery!! But why so many pics for courtship? And really, once again the Bates parents or siblings are right there, intruding on every special ( and should be private) moment between the couple. It's a bit stalkerish. Can they not have a few minutes to themselves without a camera in their face and having to stop and pose.

[artdecades]

Alyssa's Pinterest is back to talking about her boyfriend. Is this new since the courtship?

I also noticed she pinned a picture of Kate Middleton in jeans on her style board. She may have just liked the other parts of the outfit, but I hope she is planning on ditching the skirts only.

[lilith]

The outfit Allyssa is wearing in the courtship pics is way more revealing than the average pair of jeans - it looks painted on (and she rocks it and looks great, just not at all modest).

[singsingsing]

Alyssa's Pinterest is back to talking about her boyfriend. Is this new since the courtship?

I also noticed she pinned a picture of Kate Middleton in jeans on her style board. She may have just liked the other parts of the outfit, but I hope she is planning on ditching the skirts only.

I hope she is. Not that it's wrong to wear skirts only, I just want some of these people to make their own choices for once. If she does marry John she'll probably move to Florida, so she'll have some freedom from her family at that point. She's already barely keeping the modesty standards, so who knows.

[anjulibai]

Alyssa's Pinterest is back to talking about her boyfriend. Is this new since the courtship?

I posted a quote from Kelly earlier (don't think anyone noticed) where she said that at courtship they were boyfriend and girlfriend - yes, Kelly used those words.

I'm guessing they didn't want Alyssa using the word boyfriend prior to an official courtship, though what's the point I don't know.

[Guest LilaFowler]

I like some of the nail art on Alyssa's Pinterest. I think I'll get mine done like this next time I go to the salon. http://www.pinterest.com/pin/483362972477519317/ It's so simple, just polka dots, but I can barely paint my nails at all, much less do decent polka dots. So I'll let the professionals do it. lol

[Hisey]

Erin and Alyssa and Jessa are all good looking young women at the height of their beauty, so yes, their courtships do make attractive stories. But what troubles me is how uneducated and inexperienced they are.

If their husbands are rude or unkind to them, they will be told to submit more. If their husbands cheat or are abusive, they will have no recourse at all, except perhaps to return to their aging parents.

Have these girls ever balanced a checkbook? Gone someplace in a car on their own? Jessa, in particular, seems to have no skills at all, other than cleaning house. Erin has her music--but what about Alyssa, with her interest in polka dotted fingernails? At just 19, she is going from one dependent position to another. Even worse, from a poor family to a rich one--it will be even harder for her to leave if she needs to, after having scored this "win."

So although the courtship and wedding pictures are pretty, I worry about these girls ten years down the line. I hate to see anyone put themselves in a trapped position with few ways out. It also irritates me to see Kelly milking these pretty stories while ignoring the fact that her girls haven't cracked a book in 2 years, and have no knowledge of higher level math or science or literature.

[sunshine]

I just saw the courtship post. First of all, they are gorgeous and the photos are wonderful. I am jealous of the scenery!! But why so many pics for courtship? And really, once again the Bates parents or siblings are right there, intruding on every special ( and should be private) moment between the couple. It's a bit stalkerish. Can they not have a few minutes to themselves without a camera in their face and having to stop and pose.

When we are in a love awww stage, people take a lot of pics. Look on face book, couples post pics of each other. They can also use these pics for their wedding to tell their story. :)

[sunshine]

Erin and Alyssa and Jessa are all good looking young women at the height of their beauty, so yes, their courtships do make attractive stories. But what troubles me is how uneducated and inexperienced they are.

If their husbands are rude or unkind to them, they will be told to submit more. If their husbands cheat or are abusive, they will have no recourse at all, except perhaps to return to their aging parents.

Have these girls ever balanced a checkbook? Gone someplace in a car on their own? Jessa, in particular, seems to have no skills at all, other than cleaning house. Erin has her music--but what about Alyssa, with her interest in polka dotted fingernails? At just 19, she is going from one dependent position to another. Even worse, from a poor family to a rich one--it will be even harder for her to leave if she needs to, after having scored this "win."

So although the courtship and wedding pictures are pretty, I worry about these girls ten years down the line. I hate to see anyone put themselves in a trapped position with few ways out. It also irritates me to see Kelly milking these pretty stories while ignoring the fact that her girls haven't cracked a book in 2 years, and have no knowledge of higher level math or science or literature.

Usually, a man who cheats or abuse in a marriage has done it in their single life. The woman or man make excuse for the person on why they act the way they do, when it is actually are warning signs that they person has an abuse issue or a cheating issue. They spent time together prior to their annoucement, a person can hide who they really are for so long....unless the person involves over looks the signs shown. :)

[singsingsing]

Exactly, and you don't generally get the chance to observe a person like that in the context of a courtship. That's why I think these types of relationships can be so dangerous. If you're never alone with the person, if you never see how they act when your parents or siblings aren't watching, how can you really know them? And a lot of abuse only starts after the honeymoon stage is over.

[gustava]

I just saw the courtship post. First of all, they are gorgeous and the photos are wonderful. I am jealous of the scenery!! But why so many pics for courtship? And really, once again the Bates parents or siblings are right there, intruding on every special ( and should be private) moment between the couple. It's a bit stalkerish. Can they not have a few minutes to themselves without a camera in their face and having to stop and pose.

I've wondered the same thing and have reached the conclusion that both before and after marriage, with the exception of the birth of the first baby, these womengirls don't have a life. They are under authority to first their fathers and then to their husbands. The interim between...courtship/engagement/marriage ceremony...are the only moments when they will be the center of attention. Otherwise, they are merely chattel.

[Hisey]

Usually, a man who cheats or abuse in a marriage has done it in their single life. The woman or man make excuse for the person on why they act the way they do, when it is actually are warning signs that they person has an abuse issue or a cheating issue. They spent time together prior to their annoucement, a person can hide who they really are for so long....unless the person involves over looks the signs shown. :)

I have to disagree. A lot of men hide their abusive nature--and they have every reason to do so, since being abusive before the wedding would hinder them from getting the woman they want. I know this from my own family. My mother would often say sadly how charming my father was while they were dating. He changed totally during the honeymoon. There were some minor warning that he had a cruel nature--but nothing a woman in her early twenties would pick up on.

Which is another point, these women are so young and so sheltered that there is no way they would notice those warning signs for what they are.

But a man can definitely hide his abusive nature till after the wedding--it happened in my own family , as I said.

[1004srs]

The night of my wedding - things changed drastically. I was tempted to leave the resort with my parents and get an annulment. Should have, but then I wouldn't have my daughter.

[3 ring circus]

The Alyssa and Erin have scored some good looking men. Jessa Duggar, well, not so much.

[sunshine]

I have to disagree. A lot of men hide their abusive nature--and they have every reason to do so, since being abusive before the wedding would hinder them from getting the woman they want. I know this from my own family. My mother would often say sadly how charming my father was while they were dating. He changed totally during the honeymoon. There were some minor warning that he had a cruel nature--but nothing a woman in her early twenties would pick up on.

Which is another point, these women are so young and so sheltered that there is no way they would notice those warning signs for what they are.

But a man can definitely hide his abusive nature till after the wedding--it happened in my own family , as I said.

I have seen the opposite. Young women are capable to taking note to warns, but they may ignore it because they are in love and want to be with them....which is their choice. It all depends on that family support provided, but it doesn't matter if you are sheltered or not, abuse happens in all cultures and there are parents who address it to their children.

[bucherwurm]

I guess when I look at them I see a happy young couple. I don't think of what the girls have been doing since finishing homeschool and before getting married. The lack of worldly experience. They don't need to have had a lot of boyfriends to have experiences. What about a big outing to a theme park just the oldest girls (they won't be alone, but also won't have parents hovering), or group dates with other young couples? Hopefully they do this. Just some time away from parents to have fun and find yourself.

I was married at 20, so I can't talk about not getting married young, but I went to college and had been working since I was 15. I wasn't brought up believing in purity before marriage, but even though we were left alone plenty of times, we waited until we were married.

I like the idea of accountability, but why can't these young people be trusted at all?

[pega127]

The Alyssa and Erin have scored some good looking men. Jessa Duggar, well, not so much.

Jessa really failed; too young, brings nothing to the table, not good looking. I'm hoping she sees the light and calls off the courtship!