Lori Alexander: Have Sex With Your Kids In the Room

[lilith]

I think it must also be partly cultural. In the U.S., most people grow up where the parents have their own bedroom, the children have at least a separate bedroom they share with siblings (or in more affluent homes, each child has their own bedroom). So we grow up with a certain level of privacy. In other cultures, or in families where the cost of living means that the entire family might share one large sleeping room, obviously the boundaries are different.

When my son was an infant, I preferred to have him sleeping in his bassinet in the same bedroom. No apologies - I was a worry wart and wanted to hear him breathing throughout the night. His father and I did have sex occasionally when he was asleep, but it was very quiet sex and I was mostly in a hurry for it to be over.

I don't think you and your husband are bad parents or horn dogs. You were in a long-term living situation that meant you shared a sleeping space with your two young children. You made the best of the arrangement. Lori's post is talking about when going away on vacation (presumably for no more than one to two weeks) and sharing a room with children. My thought is why can't the parents go without sex for that week? Would that be so terrible? Also, I think Lori's children are older than toddlerhood, but I'm not sure. I think the older your child, the less acceptable I would find having sex in the same room with them to be.

Lori's kids are adults, I'm assuming she's talking about the past or is just making up fantasies of being the perfect ever available sexpot wife.

[Hane]

I've heard that it's now a "thing" that, when your college roommate has a boyfriend/girlfriend in for an overnighter, you're "expected" to pretend you're asleep so they can go at it. Sorry, but I'd have had no trouble telling them to take their shag elsewhere.

That said, this thread is a little triggery for me. My ex and I used to travel to his home state so he could visit his kids and his parents. These visits stressed him out, and he used to want even more sex than usual. One time, we weren't able to get a separate room for my daughter, so he waited until she was asleep, and he talked me into doing the deed on the bathroom floor. I hate myself for not having had the guts to tell him it could wait till we got home.

[ark]

We were out of town this weekend and very discretely made love twice with our 4, 5, and 6 year old children asleep in the next bed. Had they woken up, they would only have seen mom and dad spooning under the covers. Nothing traumatic about that.

Sometimes this OMG, that's child abuse and no one should ever do that stuff just has me shaking my head.

[DarkAnts]

How can Lori go on vacations when she cant afford to pay her student loans back.

[J'ean Skirt]

(From the comments of the original post),

"And to be perfectly honest, I would have a MISERABLE vacation without sex. Grumpy, sad, and I can’t imagine being around all those other females, who are often skimply dressed without being with my wife and having any kind of victory with my thoughtlife."

This is so incredibly creepy!!!!

"Victory with my thoughtlife"

:wtf:

I don't even....

[Verin Sedai]

"Victory with my thoughtlife"

:wtf:

I don't even....

I'm sorry, but most of the fundie-lites I know would side-eye that (or I at least hope they would). Keeping "pure of thought" does not require regular service from your wife, else what are the unmarried men supposed to do? If my husband was claiming that he needed to have sex with me because of all the booty he'd been tempted by, I'd be questioning whether he was really into me or was just using my body as he fantasized. /gross

[OnceModestTwiceShy]

Am I a big weirdo because I'm not really all that grossed out by the thought of my parents having sex? I mean, OF COURSE I don't want to know details or be a witness in any way. BUT. My parents have a somewhat difficult relationship, and TBH, it actually made me happy when my mom told me recently that they still have sex, and have been having sex regularly all through their marriage. (Clearly I'm not the squeamish type with these things. I've seen many of my friends having sex...and that's all I'm going to say about that. ;) )

ETA: One of the things I study academically is the writings of the early Church Fathers (very congruous with the above, I know), and I would LOVE to hear what they would have to say about the idea that a Christian man couldn't have "victory over his thought life" because he couldn't have sex with his wife for a week.

[Curious]

I notice that Lori (and maybe some other fundies) keep saying "why should we put stress on our marriage by not having sex?

I'd suggest if abstaining from sex for a short period of time puts stress on your marriage, you don't have a very good marriage to begin with. There are a multitude of reasons to abstain and if your husband can't understand that and be respectful of them, why would you want him as a husband in the first place?

A few years ago, I was "out of commission" for many months, including an extended hospital stay. Not once did my husband say anything about sex during that entire time. Somehow, he managed to live and our marriage did not implode ;)

[PennySycamore]

I remember a syndicated columnist (Judy Somethingorother?) writing a column in the local paper saying that the could imagine her parents having sex exactly three times: on their wedding night and once each to conceive her brother and herself. I think she's right about that; we as kids are not supposed to think about our parents having sex.

I can't wrap my head around how Lori thinks that it's OK.

[J'ean Skirt]

I notice that Lori (and maybe some other fundies) keep saying "why should we put stress on our marriage by not having sex?

I'd suggest if abstaining from sex for a short period of time puts stress on your marriage, you don't have a very good marriage to begin with. There are a multitude of reasons to abstain and if your husband can't understand that and be respectful of them, why would you want him as a husband in the first place?

QFT

Mr. Bisky and I have had some stressful times over the last few months. It's just been the last few weeks we've moved to anything close to a normal-for-us sex life. As far as I can tell this is more common than uncommon.

[curlykate]

I just can't imagine having sex while my 3 year old sleeps in the next bed over. To me, it's just wrong on so many levels. When he was an infant or toddler, sure, it happened quite a few times because he was sleeping in the bassinet beside me. However, as another poster already mentioned, I spent most of the encounter just trying to speed things up and get it over with because it felt weird.

We haven't gone on vacation with our son in a few years, other than a few weekend long camping trips. Our old trailer was 2 separate rooms so we felt free to be intimate. However, we've since downsized and we all sleep in the same open space. We've managed to keep our hands to ourself out of respect for our child.

That's not to say we don't get all kinds of freaky when we're away without him. Just not when he's around.

Special circumstances aside (temporary living arrangements, etc) I don't see what the big deal is if you have to wait a few days to get your rocks off. If my hubby needed to get off that badly, I'd send him to the bathroom and tell him to choose a hand.

[Carla Bruni]

Okay, that's just disgusting. At my parents' place, I share a wall with them (a WALL!!!!), and I would never even consider bringing a guy home because EW, even though my parents are super liberal and my mom clearly understands I'm sexually active. To me, even a shared WALL is a big deal and a line I would never cross.

Why not get separate rooms?! That's so creepy. Eugh.

[louisa05]

I notice that Lori (and maybe some other fundies) keep saying "why should we put stress on our marriage by not having sex?

I'd suggest if abstaining from sex for a short period of time puts stress on your marriage, you don't have a very good marriage to begin with. There are a multitude of reasons to abstain and if your husband can't understand that and be respectful of them, why would you want him as a husband in the first place?

A few years ago, I was "out of commission" for many months, including an extended hospital stay. Not once did my husband say anything about sex during that entire time. Somehow, he managed to live and our marriage did not implode ;)

All of this. Did Lori's husband demand sex immediately after she gave birth? What if she had or in the future has surgery or a medical condition that means she cannot/should not have sex for a time? Can he not handle that? What if she just has the flu?

[RainbowSky]

As a pp said, a lot of people don't have separate rooms for kids and stuff. I don't think that many people are scarred by it. I wouldn't now on purpose in front of my older kids but there ARE some places where it would be hard not to. As babies, I would as long as they were asleep. I wasn't letting them watch at any age just cause....I've never been good with people watching, I don't care if its a baby and under covers. Nope! But again, that's my American head working. If I lived in a one room building with my entire family, I'm assuming I'd be used to it because the older people wouldn't be outside every time they wanted to do anything. I don't think?

[happy atheist]

All of this. Did Lori's husband demand sex immediately after she gave birth? What if she had or in the future has surgery or a medical condition that means she cannot/should not have sex for a time? Can he not handle that? What if she just has the flu?

She's had brain surgery twice. Ken seems to think its awesome that she "serves" him even when she's feeling crappy. I assume that goes for sex as well.

[hapamama]

There's a difference between having sex with a sleeping baby in the room, and having sex with a sleeping eight-year-old in the room. Big difference. An eight-year-old is capable of waking up and understanding what's going on and being upset by it. I would've been pretty pissed off as a kid if my parents had had sex while I was in the room. It's disrespectful to the other people, and yes, children are people.

When I was growing up, we lived in a motel room for 6 months.. my parents had sex, quietly, with 4 sleeping kids in the room. Didn't scar us in the least (we were 9, 8, 5 and 4). None of us were scarred by it. What I thought was icky was when I was a teenager and there was a shared wall between my bedroom and theirs. Yeah, sometimes I'd hear things I would have have not heard in the night...

Thankfully my kids sleep soundly, so some writhing around under a blanket hasn't woken them up if we happen to get it on while they're sleeping in the same room while we're travelling. We're pretty discreet about it.

[LadyBlue]

I agree with you 100% on this. If there are children in the room (and not infants and very young toddlers who don't have a clue what's going on), I'd consider it child abuse.

So long as you're aware that this is just an opinion, and an extremely rare one through the history of humankind. Having a separate space for everyone is a very recent occurrence, anthropologically speaking. The majority of cultures and time periods involved not just nuclear families, but extended families or even entire communities sharing one living area. Children were always "in the room" with relatives having sex.

It is still the norm in a large number of cultures and some of those people move to Western countries. If you're going to hurl loaded terms like "child abuse" around, it should really be for things that are actually abusive not just upsetting to your particular cultural sensitivities.

Lori doesn't have that excuse, but unless they were actually forcing the kids to watch or putting on a show, it is not abusive.

[Evilbad]

I think labeling it abusive is a bit over the top. Again, if we have done it with the kid in the room and if he had woken up, he would have seen nor heard anything overtly sexual. It is not abusive and if he had woken up, we would have stopped.

[latraviata]

Lori talks about a post on another blog in which the author says that parents should not have sex on family vacations if they are sleeping in the same room as their children.

tolovehonorandvacuum.com/2013/07/wifey-wednesday-sex-family-vacations/

Lori disagrees with this, and sides with male commenters who don't want anything to prevent them from having sex.

lorialexander.blogspot.com/2013/08/are-most-men-pigs-when-it-comes-to-sex.html#

I'm all for creativity and being discreet, but I imagine that when I have kids, I will draw the line at having sex when they are in the room--even if they are sleeping. Some of the suggestions other commenters give also seem really disrespectful to me. Family shower rooms at a campground? Sex wasn't allowed in the shared shower stalls in my college dorm. Why is it not ok for college students, but ok for married couples?

I don't think I am exaggerating when I say that the Netherlands is one of the most sexually enlightend countries. No sane Dutch parent will have sex in the presence of their children.

Fundies are obsessed with sex.

[OkToBeTakei]

If they are asleep and you're quiet, there's nothing wrong with it. I'm not talking about swinging from the chandeliers and hog tying each other, but some under the blanket action isn't really all that scandalous. A lot of people have the babies sleeping in the same room for at least a few months, and still manage to get it on.

Not feeling the hate on this one.

Agree with this. My kid slept in the room until she was three. We holiday about twice a year and she prefers to room with us as we her, due to safety abroad as we go to some 'interesting' places.

Can't say the urge is any more urgent on holiday than when not, but why does everybody assume it has to be swinging loud thumping forget your head sex. Some nice romantic gentle as the OP says under the blanket is quite nice at times. Save the gymnastics for home.

Whilst some may find it distracting I can tell the moment her breathing changes, also it really is dependent on your kid. Mine slept through the sounds of an airport departure lounge and on to a plane at age 8. I regularly hoover her room when she is sleeping. Just the way she is. If she was a light sleeper I totally think we would not consider it.

[treehugger]

Also, for what it's worth (and I have not studied anthropology or anything, so take it with a grain of salt), but I remember hearing from missionaries of a tribe in Indonesia, where the indigenous couples had their sexy times during the day, when most of the kids toddler age and above were running around outside, or with grandparents and relatives. Sex at night when the whole extended family was in the huts just didn't happen. Also, who said anything about having to have sex inside? I'm sure there are ways to be resourceful without having the whole family around.

Babies is obviously another story.

[GeoBQn]

Stop the presses, Ken has spoken!

Ken

I have traveled for 30 years and stayed in more than a few hotels where someone must be on vacation with all the noises coming through the adjoining doors. It can be a little annoying if it keeps me awake, but as long as it doesn't go on forever ... who cares. We are all adults and sex is a very natural and acceptable thing. If one is embarrassed and uncomfortable is it possible that their view of sex is a bit skewed? I just try to go to sleep and forget about it just as if crickets are chirping. It is all part of nature and no big deal what they do in their private room so long as they are courteous enough to be done by 11 p.m. :)

Ken

It looks like an exciting topic for the day, so I will add my two sense.

The Bible is clear on many things, and some things it leaves open under an admonition to seek sound reason and wisdom in all we do.

Sex should always be done with discretion and privately. The vacation issue of one room with the kids, or a tent with kids probably means that the couple should hold off until the kids are out of the room, or go someplace private.

Most important I think in these discussions is that each couple must decide how important it is to have sex during vacation, and plan appropriately. Wives who believe in husband leadership should make their thoughts clear on the subject, but be willing to defer to his judgment on the issue.

Lastly, for some who are so opposed to sex when kids are sleeping in the room, much of this depends on the kids ages, and no one is saying they are making noises or not under the covers. Under the covers quiet sex with kids up to 8 years old in the room is probably a non issue, but teenagers in the room it is probably not wise.

Remember, throughout most of history the whole family was in a tent or one or two bedroom homes with thin walls. Sex is not a bad thing, so teach your kids early that it is to be enjoyed in a marriage. No child is being defiled by hearing Mom and Dad having sex, but it can feel like being defiled if the child is not educated to know the difference between marriage sex and sex outside of marriage. For goodness sakes,.. this is how the child was made when Mom and Dad make love... a beautiful thing,

So be reasonable. There is no right on wrong here, but there are certain key ideas that should be followed: Men want and need sex on vacation to make vacation fun, and parents need to find a private time and place to make love.

[ShadowyOne]

Firstly, I don't know which way I come down on this, having not experienced it, yet. I would definitely think that the age of the child does matter, and also that discretion is the better part of valor. My impending blessing will be sleeping in a bassinet by my bed for the first bit of her life, and I'll probably say go for it while she is an infant. At what age the line should be drawn... hmm, we'll see.

However...

Ken

It looks like an exciting topic for the day, so I will add my two sense.

I definitely agree that Ken has two sense. Out of 100?

[medievalist1980]

So long as you're aware that this is just an opinion, and an extremely rare one through the history of humankind. Having a separate space for everyone is a very recent occurrence, anthropologically speaking. The majority of cultures and time periods involved not just nuclear families, but extended families or even entire communities sharing one living area. Children were always "in the room" with relatives having sex.

It is still the norm in a large number of cultures and some of those people move to Western countries. If you're going to hurl loaded terms like "child abuse" around, it should really be for things that are actually abusive not just upsetting to your particular cultural sensitivities.

Lori doesn't have that excuse, but unless they were actually forcing the kids to watch or putting on a show, it is not abusive.

Yes, it is only in recent, Western history that people have privacy - and I mean like the last 100 years. Pretty sure almost everyone on here had at the least great-grandparents who shared a room with their parents and siblings if not closer. And potentially animals if they were farmers.

[singsingsing]

Yes, it is only in recent, Western history that people have privacy - and I mean like the last 100 years. Pretty sure almost everyone on here had at the least great-grandparents who shared a room with their parents and siblings if not closer. And potentially animals if they were farmers.

Uh, no, not exactly. People have not only had privacy since 1913. I'm sure even poor people in the middle ages who all shared one room found creative ways to be discrete (although some probably cared more than others) - and the point is, that was normal for them. It's not normal for us in our society. People used to do a lot of things out of necessity or perceived necessity a long time ago - doesn't mean those things are okay to do now.