Think Overpopulation isn't a myth? You're a racist!

[alba]

I found an old 19KAC episode on YouTube (I was looking for the most recent one and got sidetracked; this one's from when Josie was a baby) and Dim Bulb was going on about how it's important to teach the kids to vote and make them conscientious citizens. Someone posted that if they really want to make their kids conscientious citizens they should teach them about overpopulation, and the reply was this gem:

 

 

Quote

and the people pushing the overpopulation bullshit are the same ones that were pushing the racist eugenics policy back in the 1920's! Yea they wanted to get rid of most of the population alright! All the black, brown ,Asian along with the non-white European! So from my chair you are a dumb jackass racist who either by ignorance supports racist depopulation policy or you out right know its nothing more than a racist policy and knowingly support it! Either way you are not to damn bright!

 

o_O

[tanksmom]

Sigh. When will some people start to realize that overpopulation is a problem not only because of the amount of space that a person needs to feel comfortable in but also the ability to supply the resources that said population will need to survive?

So yes, maybe you can fit the population of the world into one city/state/country but if you can't provide at least the most basic amount of water & food as well as other necessities no one will want to live there.

[ILoveJellybeans]

I found an old 19KAC episode on YouTube (I was looking for the most recent one and got sidetracked; this one's from when Josie was a baby) and Dim Bulb was going on about how it's important to teach the kids to vote and make them conscientious citizens. Someone posted that if they really want to make their kids conscientious citizens they should teach them about overpopulation, and the reply was this gem:

o_O

He wouldnt be saying that if one of his kids voted for Obama...he just means "We want to teach our kids how important my political beliefs are, and encourage them to all vote for the party I want to win. Its like gaining extra votes, but they all came out of my wife's vagina. Also, cute kids are a very important political tool, imagine seeing my adorable toddler holding an anti abortion sign"

It doesnt suprise me that the overpopulation deniers are also racist. Ignorance tends to all go together.

[alba]

He wouldnt be saying that if one of his kids voted for Obama...he just means "We want to teach our kids how important my political beliefs are, and encourage them to all vote for the party I want to win. Its like gaining extra votes, but they all came out of my wife's vagina. Also, cute kids are a very important political tool, imagine seeing my adorable toddler holding an anti abortion sign"

It doesnt suprise me that the overpopulation deniers are also racist. Ignorance tends to all go together.

Yeah, when he says it's important for his kids to vote, he means it's important for his kids to vote for the people he supports.

I think the person was actually saying that overpopulation believers (ie people who think it is a problem that we are facing) are the ones who are racists, which is why I find the comment so baffling.

[gezykah]

Yeah, my belief that if everybody raised their children to waste resources like the Duggars we'd be screwed since the planet can't successfully support billions of people living like them means at some point after I was born in 1979 I built a time machine and traveled back to 1920 to support eugenics since I hate swarthy brown people such as myself.

[debrand]

I found an old 19KAC episode on YouTube (I was looking for the most recent one and got sidetracked; this one's from when Josie was a baby) and Dim Bulb was going on about how it's important to teach the kids to vote and make them conscientious citizens. Someone posted that if they really want to make their kids conscientious citizens they should teach them about overpopulation, and the reply was this gem:

o_O

Well, I was born in the late sixties so I am not among the same people who pushed for eugenics. Also, I don't want to force anyone to limit or kill their offspring. I do want people to be educated on the issue. It would also be good if government provided some sort of tax break for parents who stop at either one or two kids. Another difference is that I don't think that such policies should be aimed at people on the basis of their race, religion, income level or physical/mental abilities. It is not my goal to raise up one race over another.

[alba]

Pretty much, debrand. There's a difference between trying to control other people's bodies and acknowledging that there's a problem that we all need to band together to deal with.

I'm white as they come and one of my (many) reasons for not having children is that I don't want to contribute to overpopulation. And I wasn't born till the nineties so where did my time machine go?!

Edit: It's like when people tell me I'm antisemitic because I'm a vegetarian, JUST LIKE HITLER! It's easier to throw accusations at people than actually engage with them, like Godwin's law.

[OnceModestTwiceShy]

Well, it is true that a lot of population control rhetoric is extremely racist and classist. It's all about "those people" overbreeding. Much of the real problem is the unequal distribution of resources. I'm not saying we don't need a worldwide movement for birth control, because we totally do, but there is no question in my mind that the way it is often framed is problematic at best.

[gardenvarietycitizen]

Education for girls, social safety nets (so your kids aren't your one chance at not starving to death as a old woman) and birth control made freely AVAILABLE. Plenty of people would be more than happy to voluntarily limit family size if they were actually able to do it and somewhat confident of the possibility of surviving as single women far off in the future.

Of course plenty of fundies would fight me on every one of those items.

[alba]

Well, it is true that a lot of population control rhetoric is extremely racist and classist. It's all about "those people" overbreeding. Much of the real problem is the unequal distribution of resources. I'm not saying we don't need a worldwide movement for birth control, because we totally do, but there is no question in my mind that the way it is often framed is problematic at best.

That's a fair point, and I guess I can see the similarities between that and eugenics. I hadn't really thought about that, so thanks for pointing it out.

It's a correllation/causation thing, though, I think. Some people who acknowledge the issue of overpopulation are racist about it, but saying the world population is fast outstripping its resources doesn't make one automatically racist.

gardenvarietycitizen: Pretty much, yup.

[gardenvarietycitizen]

Of course plenty of the "overpopulation is a myth!" people are plenty racist about it too, because their goal is "we need to have more [our race] babies! Our culture is in danger!"

[Anxious Girl]

Ah, JB shows his true colors. If he's so afraid of the minority becoming the majority and getting revenge on whites because of how white people treat LGBT, minorities and women as 2nd class citizens, then you'd think that he'd treat them equally instead of like they're 2nd class citizens. But that's being kind and using logic! Somebody should leak this out to the media. Since when have minorities been racist against white people in America? Raism = power + discrimination; not just discrimination.

But it's totally racism if a white person is bullied by a bunch of non-whites, because the history of white people has showed them being denied rights by non-whites in America; am I right? Then that means that there can be heterophobia too; because if a heterosexual grows up in a homosexual community and gets picked on by homosexuals all their lives; this proves that heterophobia exists because heterosexuals have been denied as a group by the homosexuals the rights to get married for centuries! :roll: /sarcasm.

[Flossie]

I found an old 19KAC episode on YouTube (I was looking for the most recent one and got sidetracked; this one's from when Josie was a baby) and Dim Bulb was going on about how it's important to teach the kids to vote and make them conscientious citizens. Someone posted that if they really want to make their kids conscientious citizens they should teach them about overpopulation, and the reply was this gem:

and the people pushing the overpopulation bullshit are the same ones that were pushing the racist eugenics policy back in the 1920's! Yea they wanted to get rid of most of the population alright! All the black, brown ,Asian along with the non-white European! So from my chair you are a dumb jackass racist who either by ignorance supports racist depopulation policy or you out right know its nothing more than a racist policy and knowingly support it! Either way you are not to damn bright!

Wait. Jim Bob posted this? Not one of his leghumpers? I thought JB graduated high school, this reply post sounds like it was written by a bitter loser who dropped out in grade school. I would have expected JB to have a bit more media savvy.

TLC = The Loser Channel

[alba]

No, no, no, it was a leghumper. Sorry, I wasn't clear in my first post. You're right, JB's more media savvy than that, though it wouldn't surprise me if he made similar claims in a less overt manner. After all, his family can't be racist because they went on that mission trip to El Salvador ;)

I can't seem to edit my original post to clarify, unfortunately.

[FlorenceHamilton]

Pretty much, debrand. There's a difference between trying to control other people's bodies and acknowledging that there's a problem that we all need to band together to deal with.

I'm white as they come and one of my (many) reasons for not having children is that I don't want to contribute to overpopulation. And I wasn't born till the nineties so where did my time machine go?!

Edit: It's like when people tell me I'm antisemitic because I'm a vegetarian, JUST LIKE HITLER! It's easier to throw accusations at people than actually engage with them, like Godwin's law.

Antisemetic because you are a vergetarian??? That's like asking if you walk to school or carry your lunch. It is a nonsense sentence.

[alba]

The line of "logic" goes something like this: I'm a vegetarian. Hitler was a vegetarian. Hitler was antisemitic. Therefore I am also antisemitic.

[RachelB]

The line of "logic" goes something like this: I'm a vegetarian. Hitler was a vegetarian. Hitler was antisemitic. Therefore I am also antisemitic.

FFS, do they go around telling painters that they must be anti-Semitic? Or people who are shorter than average?*

There's an easy test for identifying someone who is anti-Semitic: Does he or she say and do anti-Semitic things?

*I am shorter than average. I am also opposed to fascism and not interested in invading Poland.

[YPestis]

Well, it is true that a lot of population control rhetoric is extremely racist and classist. It's all about "those people" overbreeding. Much of the real problem is the unequal distribution of resources. I'm not saying we don't need a worldwide movement for birth control, because we totally do, but there is no question in my mind that the way it is often framed is problematic at best.

I would respectfully disagree that population control is framed in a racial context. In China, every single person I've spoken with agreed that the country has a population problem. In fact, the one-child policy is not as unpopular as Americans think. Most people I've spoken with agreed that the policy was needed, even as they wished for a second child. People didn't speak of "certain" people breeding, they believed that too many PEOPLE (in general) were breeding. The one-child policy applied only to the 95% of the Han population that dominated the country, ethnic minorities were immune from the policy. It's kind of the reverse of eugenics we've seen in recent history, I guess.

In the US, perhaps there is a slight racist tinge with the population debate, however I think that's a tiny minority. There is a legitimate problem of overpopulation and you are correct that it is linked to resource depletion but fundies (and many conservatives) don't understand this link. I have heard scattered talk of overbreeding of muslims/brown people/black people.....and yet, most discussions on population have pertained to resource depletion, economic growth and environmental sustainability.

As for classist and overpopulation....yeah, that one I've seen in more people than I'd like. However, the poor do suffer disproportionately in overpopulated areas so there is truth that the population issue is also linked to economic issues.

What we need to do is stop calling it "population control" and frame it as about resource availability. Even the most simple minded can understand that if there are more people than "things", people don't live as well. If we can frame it in terms wants and needs, perhaps more people would understand why birth control is a positive thing.