Lori: Preparing kids to be missionaries in public schools

[GeoBQn]

I sometimes also think there's a subtle racist component to choosing one of these generic "Christian" schools as they tend to be mostly white and keep kids of of public schools where "bad influence" tends to be code for "brown" or "black."

After Brown v. Board of Education, a lot of small private schools opened to function as whites-only schools. These were known as "segregation academies."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Segregation_academy

http://www.theatlantic.com/national/arc ... ng/266207/

[fakepigtails73]

Thanks GeoBQn for the "The Atlantic" article you linked. Very interesting!

The thing in that article that made me jump was when a Mississippi public hs student matter-of-factly mentionned of rowdy students being sent to the principal to be paddled. Holy crap! And here I thought that corporal punishment in schools was forbidden in the US; I'd expected it to be banned since the 80s, at the most. That article dates from 2012, so the interview would've been a few months earlier. Suffice to say that if I was a mother forced to send my teen at that school there would be more than hell to pay if I'd hear that the prinicipal paddled my child. I know that there are major, major discipline problems in schools, but I'd hope educators would seek solutions that go beyond "paddling the incorrigibles" and "zero tolerance on everything, we'll call the cops on you if you give the finger to your teachers" policies that are in vogue since Columbine.

I'll be damned!

Edited for typos and syntax

[lilah]

I think the difference is that no matter how abhorrent and insane Zsuzsanna's beliefs are, she is sincere and she lives them.

Lori, however, spouts the standard Titus2 party line, but only practices it when it suits her, the best example being that she espouses quiverfull but didn't fill her quiver and is full of justifications why the philosophy applies to everyone but her.

how many kids does she have and what is her justification for having only a few?

I went to a segregation academy so the Atlantic article struck a chord. Everything that was said in the article could apply to me. My school was "nondemonionational" but would sneak a lot of christianity into dialy life when it could.

One thing I want to call Lori out on is when she said "They have to be taught the ways of the culture they are going to and they need to be strong in their faith" do any missionaries we know in fundie circles do that? usually what cultural eudcation they recieve is about how the poor souls in other countires are poor, inferiror and probably worship the wrong god/gods

[lilwriter85]

Lori only had four kids and she said she didn't have more due to health problems and chronic pain because of a car accident. She has praised large families several times on her blog and she did some posting about people can afford large families. I don't think she realizes how her life would have been if she had more kids. I doubt her and her hubby would be going to Hawaii or doing other expensive things if they had a dozen kids. I also get the feeling that none of Lori's kids plan to have large families. I see them having 4 kids at most. The oldest daughter is 30 or so and she has been married two years now. The youngest daughter is 22 or 23 and still looking for a fundie lite husband. Her younger son is in orthodontic school and seems to have no girlfriend. Ryan the older son is expecting his second child in May. Lori's kids might not have the desire for larger families because they lived comfortably on one income and they know Ken's income might not worked well for a dozen kids.

[Jana814]

I live in Northern New Jersey. We have some of the best public & private schools in the state. Kids in my area who go to private school usually go, because of 1) religion (catholic or Jewish) or 2) they have a real learning issue & a private schools r usually smaller & they can get the 1-on-1 attaction they need. I went to public school, had a great experience & if I ever had kids u bet they will be going to a public school.

[dilannsmom]

I live in suburban upstate NY and we have one low cost IFB school (k-12) and a series of Catholic schools (k-12 on a variety of campuses) that are double the cost of the Baptist school. Both sets of schools are struggling financially. I would never even be tempted to send my daughter to either as they don't offer the upper level math and science courses that are favored by colleges. In addition they don't offer electives like instrumental band or chorus...again, those things that college admissions are looking for.

I teach at an International Baccalaureate school and will have my daughter attend there as the curriculum and instruction is top notch.

[GolightlyGrrl]

Would she agree with Muslim/Jewish/Hindu/Buddhists/Pagan/ect. parents prepping their kids to 'witness' their fellow classmates?

If a Muslim student talked about Ramadan or just wore the hijab to class or a if Jewish student talked about the wonderful Seder meal he had at his Bubbe's, Lori and her ilk would pitch a fit!

[lilwriter85]

If a Muslim student talked about Ramadan or just wore the hijab to class or a if Jewish student talked about the wonderful Seder meal he had at his Bubbe's, Lori and her ilk would pitch a fit!

I agree that would happen. I think Lori lives in a bubble in which only Christians matter. She ignores that other religions existed before Christianity and she ignores the fact that not every American is Christian. I bet she doesn't have one non-Christian friend and her kids probably only associate with Christians.

[gibbsgirls]

Are Lori's posts moderated? I posted a comment and I thought it appeared at the end of the thread, but now it's not there.

[GolightlyGrrl]

Are Lori's posts moderated? I posted a comment and I thought it appeared at the end of the thread, but now it's not there.

Yes, I left a very benign comment a while back and it never got published because I didn't agree 100% with Lori and my comment made a very pertinent point regarding socialized medicine.

[GiggleOfGirls]

The kids at my high school who acted like missionaries were ostracized and probably felt like little martyrs...

[tanksmom]

I send my kids to a private catholic school. My decision came about because the public school in my area routinely score in the bottom of the scale for learning throughout the state and both of mine need additional special education. In a public school they would get 20 mins a week of help, in private school they get 3 hours a week of help/tutoring with additional help available if needed.

Although I haven't set foot in church in about 7 months so who knows if I'm still entitled to the discount that you get from belonging to the parish. :?

Now when it comes to high school I probably will have to send them to public because I can't afford the high school tuition. However I would be quite miffed if my kids felt the need to be a missionary. We discuss religion at home and my kids know (in an age appropriate manner) why I won't go to church. They are raised and friends with people of all different religions and I would not be happy if they started the ZOMG your going to hell if you don't believe exactly as I do. It probably helps that in my area, even though it's a catholic school, most who attend are not.

[mockingbird]

As to the Seventh Day Adventist culture I was raised in... I went to SDA schools most of my life, and I can assure you that the same stuff goes on in the religious schools as does in the public schools. It is just more hidden, and even when things DO happen, the school administrators cover it up so they can look good.

I'm told by my best friend's brother that almost everyone in the boys dorm of the Adventist boarding academy I went to was into porn. My best guy friend said he was into porn, but he was smart about it, and only watched/looked at porn he'd borrow from his friends, and that was how he never got caught.

My aunt Beth, who went to Adventist schools as well (she's no longer Adventist) talks about all the things that happened in her school that the school covered up. Like the time someone put weed in the ventilation system, and nobody could figure out what that smell WAS.

In the Christian schools I went to there were drugs, sex, and porn. It was just more hidden, and even the administrators helped in hiding it, at least from the outside world.

What really made me angry, though, was seeing that children who went to public school were put down by other children. You were thought of as less if you went to public school. My cousins went to public school, but they also went to church. I was angry at seeing them mistreated.

My Catholic elementary school was similar especially with the "evil public school kids" thing. The day after public school religion classes, the teachers would tell us that if things were missing from our desks or moved around it was probably because the public school kids stole/messed with them. We were also told to take home any valuables the day before because you don't want the public school kids to steal them. When I switched to public school for middle school, I was kind-of surprised they weren't all evil. And then I had to go back for the evening classes so I could be confirmed, and nobody was messing around with the inside of the desks. Hmm.

I switched because they were hiring incompetent teachers - I think 6 people left after that year, the teaching level just went way down. We had one teacher who spent about a half-hour to an hour maybe twice a week lecturing us about really inane stuff instead of teaching. My parents also wanted me to go to the public high school, and discovered it was easier to get into certain classes in high school if you took the "prerequisites" in middle school, which my elementary school didn't have (for example, algebra, and then you could take honors math classes at the high school). My siblings didn't end up going to that school because it just became too hard to coordinate two totally different school calendars/schedules.

Apparently now it is even worse, there was a sexual abuse scandal with a student and he received very minimal punishment. They refused to do anything to protect the victim (like make sure they were never in the same classroom) and those who are in the ex-students/parents community think they just didn't want to do anything harsher because they need the kid's tuition money. I think he should have been expelled.

The quality of private schools can vary. In the case of my public school district the public high school has a lot more programs and advanced classes to offer compared to most of the Catholic schools. In the next town over the public high school pretty even with the Catholic schools so a lot more people choose the Catholic option. There are also some very nice secular private schools within about a 30/45 minute radius but I think they are significantly more expensive than most of the Catholic schools and again, at least in my district there is an excellent option available in the public school system so few people go to any type of private school in that community. I believe they are popular options for people who can afford them and live downtown though because the urban public schools are not as nice. (I wanted to go to one because it's a boarding school. My parents told me they would pay for boarding school or college, but not both, so I didn't get the chance. haha) I think those are the only options, I don't remember any other religious schools.

[Jana814]

The kids at my high school who acted like missionaries were ostracized and probably felt like little martyrs...

The same thing would happen when I was in high school. Although my school did not have kids that did that.

[Jana814]

I agree that would happen. I think Lori lives in a bubble in which only Christians matter. She ignores that other religions existed before Christianity and she ignores the fact that not every American is Christian. I bet she doesn't have one non-Christian friend and her kids probably only associate with Christians.

I think many of these Fundie people that we talk about on here also think that Christians matter. They don't want to believe that their can be people in this country that has a different view from them.

[RosyDaisy]

Lori, public schools do not need missionaries, at least not your kind. Do us all a favor and stay away. You chose to homeschool, now fuck off.

[Jana814]

Lori, public schools do not need missionaries, at least not your kind. Do us all a favor and stay away. You chose to homeschool, now fuck off.

Agree!! It's bothers me when people who homeschool think that it is the only way to learn & caside people who choose not to.

[lilwriter85]

I think many of these Fundie people that we talk about on here also think that Christians matter. They don't want to believe that their can be people in this country that has a different view from them.

I also think Lori and some of the other fundies are sheltered in a sense that they have little or no direct contact with non-Christians, in a way that also adds to "only Christians matter" attitude. I think Lori was raised in a type of household that was against non-Christians or non-believers. She has bragged about the neighborhood she lives in. Maybe all of her neighbors are Christian, but I doubt that all of them have her type of attitude. As I said before, her kids likely only associate with Christians. Those kids were raised by assholes like Lori and Ken and I see them continuing to have "I'm a special Christian" attitude. Sometime back, Lori did a brag post about how her oldest daughter was apart of Christian ballet company.

It would be hilarious if someone like Lori was sent to live in Dearborn, Michigan which has the largest Muslim population in the U.S. She would probably get her ass handed to her in different ways. I can see her being irritated by the sight of women in hijabs. But then again, I'm sure she gets annoyed in California whenever she occasionally sees a Muslim woman or an Orthodox Jew.

[Izzybee]

I have an acquaintance like this. Actually, it's the mom of one of my Girl Scouts (which she lets her daughter attend while telling us every week how really Boy Scouts is better because it's more godly, or something). She doesn't homeschool, so she posts all over Facebook what brave little God-warriors her children are, presumably to appease her friends who are horrified that she lets her children attend evil public schools. Every chance she gets, she puts the public school system down, but still praises her children, who have "servant hearts" (blech) and are apparently taking one for team Jesus.

The hilarious thing? Her kids are totally normal. They totally don't give a crap about their crazy mother. Unfortunately, I feel like as soon as Mom realizes this, her kids are going to get whisked out of real life pretty quick. I'm just doing my best as a Girl Scout leader to instill as much feminism and critical thinking skills in her kid as I can, as fast as I can.

[Avalondaughter]

I live in the NYC suburbs. There are two kinds of private schools here. There are several Catholic schools and some are quite expensive and prestigious and non-Catholic kids attend them. Some of them are pretty meh though. I friend of mine attended a Catholic school where the classes were almost twice the size of mine and I thought the quality of the teaching wasn't nearly as good as my public school. The kid's writing skills were atrocious.

The other type of private schools are traditional "prep" schools that are attended only by rich kids. The education is superior to the public schools, but it comes with a hefty price tag and it isn't religious.

We also have schools aimed at immigrant populations like a French school and a Japanese school.

Honestly I don't know where the nearest non-Catholic religious school is. I think there might be a Jewish school in the area. Where I live is heavily populated with Jews and Catholics and not much in the way of fundies. The closest thing we have to fundies is Orthodox Jews.

[OnceModestTwiceShy]

Thanks GeoBQn for the "The Atlantic" article you linked. Very interesting!

The thing in that article that made me jump was when a Mississippi public hs student matter-of-factly mentionned of rowdy students being sent to the principal to be paddled. Holy crap! And here I thought that corporal punishment in schools was forbidden in the US; I'd expected it to be banned since the 80s, at the most. That article dates from 2012, so the interview would've been a few months earlier. Suffice to say that if I was a mother forced to send my teen at that school there would be more than hell to pay if I'd hear that the prinicipal paddled my child. I know that there are major, major discipline problems in schools, but I'd hope educators would seek solutions that go beyond "paddling the incorrigibles" and "zero tolerance on everything, we'll call the cops on you if you give the finger to your teachers" policies that are in vogue since Columbine.

I'll be damned!

Edited for typos and syntax

It's disgusting, isn't it? It is actually one of the things I am embarrassed about as an American. How many other Western countries have institutionalized child abuse like this? :x

[VampireProtectYou]

I am a teacher and trust me, the religion of the students is our last concern...we worry about the education of the students.

[Jana814]

I live in the NYC suburbs. There are two kinds of private schools here. There are several Catholic schools and some are quite expensive and prestigious and non-Catholic kids attend them. Some of them are pretty meh though. I friend of mine attended a Catholic school where the classes were almost twice the size of mine and I thought the quality of the teaching wasn't nearly as good as my public school. The kid's writing skills were atrocious.

The other type of private schools are traditional "prep" schools that are attended only by rich kids. The education is superior to the public schools, but it comes with a hefty price tag and it isn't religious.

We also have schools aimed at immigrant populations like a French school and a Japanese school.

Honestly I don't know where the nearest non-Catholic religious school is. I think there might be a Jewish school in the area. Where I live is heavily populated with Jews and Catholics and not much in the way of fundies. The closest thing we have to fundies is Orthodox Jews.

I could have written your post. All the way from the suburbs of NYC to the type of schools in the area.

[Miggy]

The talk of porn in public schools took me back twenty years to high school ... My male friends regularly brought porn mags to school which they had stolen from either the newsagents or their dads. Magazines were read at school and swapped between all the boys until they disintegrated. I mentioned this to my Dad (who is pretty relaxed about most things) and he brought home a bundle of porn mags from his work for me to take to school. (He works for an international company where plenty of porn arrives from overseas, as well as the products that are suppose to arrive. It becomes their lunchtime reading.) He didn't mind any of us reading the magazines but he was really concerned about the boys stealing them!

I wonder what Lori would make of my Dad? :lol: :lol: :lol:

(My brother & I both managed to finish public school as Christians.)

[JesusFightClub]

Fakepigtails could have wrote my life there (except I was a bit too young to have sex)

I left state primary at 10, under a cloud, shall we say (being officially "a very disturbed child"). Went to private school for two years and left, er, under a cloud again. Went back to state education, struggled for a few years and then got mates and was happy. I look back on all of them with interest, they were intriguing times.

We were told exactly the same thing! "State school children steal." People were worried I would nick their stuff (I was the only kid who transferred to private school from state.) I also remember a very polite little girl saying "Please don't stand close to me. My Mummy says people like you have nits." :lol:

It was more bemusing than annoying. Being accused of stealing and having nits was just daft to me. At the age of 10 I wasn't wise in the ways of the five finger discount, and while I had had nits, that was when I was six. ;) Doesn't everyone have nits when they're six?

The only thing which got to me was when I had to leave. The mums were cooing "Well, it's better for you, really. You'll be back where you belong. It wasn't right for you, was it?" And the other kids were saying to me "Mummy and Daddy are sending ME to Gordonstoun/Fettes (etc). Shame about you, isn't it."

I also got told while I was there I needed elocution lessons because my accent was "common". It was a bit retro, that place. :lol: