What's with the term "unborn child"? RANT

[fundyfunland]

I searched through the old threads & couldn't find anything, so....

This has really frustrated me for some time - the use of the term "unborn child" or "unborn baby" to describe a fetus. It seems to me that it is a very politicized term, likely made up by the anti-choice movement, to give personhood and humanness to a fetus. I've also noticed that the term is being used by many pro-choice people now, likely out of habit from hearing it so many times.

I'm just wondering, when did the term "unborn" start to replace the regular use of fetus to describe what it actually is...a growing fetus? The first time I heard it was from my (pregnant) high school teacher who referred to her fetus as her "unborn child." I actually laughed because I thought she was joking when she used the term.

So, a) any idea when its use became widespread?

b) for those who claim to be pro-choice, why do you use the term?

This has been frustrating me for awhile now. Thanks for letting me rant! :evil:

[rock_girl]

Personally I prefer 'parasite' but it doesn't go over too well.

[YPestis]

I liken the term to "pre-owned" commonly used for used cars. I think it became popular in the 90's maybe? I remember some grumblers that it was not a real term and was purely political in its usage. It's now entered the vernacular and I've seen it used by people in normal conversation unrelated to abortion. I think we need to remember that abortion was not nearly the issue it became after the rise of the Christian Right. We saw the rise of a very organized, political force whose primary preoccupation is sexual morals (gays, abortion, contraception). Meanwhile, the prochoice side are not as galvanized about abortion, hence they've had to cede ground on the abortion debate. I see the popularity of "unborn" as the result of decades of activism by the prolife side.

[DarkAnts]

Personally I prefer 'parasite' but it doesn't go over too well.

Thats my preferred term too. It fits the scientific definition.

[rock_girl]

Thats my preferred term too. It fits the scientific definition.

Really? Score one for me!

[Coconut Flan]

I referred to all of my fetuses as parasites.

[JesusFightClub]

I am fairly pro-choice (not as much as my mum, who pretty much takes it the whole nine yards on these things :lol: ) but I was recently at a meeting where there were calls for abortion to be utterly decriminalised up until the moment of birth, and it to be purely on the mum's say-so, not on a doctors'. I agree with the principle there.

Still use "child" and "baby" to talk about the foetus. Not "unborn child" as it makes me think of that line from Radiohead's "Paranoid Android" about having unborn chicken voices in your head :D This is based on two other things as well. One, "unborn" is fairly pointless usage in a discussion about abortion rights anyway, Thom Yorke aside. Two,I don't think too much about the terminology of saying "child" or "baby" - we all know foetus is correct, but then it gives righties that special frisson when they can look horrified and say "It's a tiny pweshus BAYBEE and you're calling it a FOETUS to DEHUMANISE IT?"

I'd rather just say "Right, what the fuck. It's a fucking "baby", whatever. Can we get back to the actual issue in hand here, which is a woman's rights over her own body."

[NurseNell]

I've never heard a woman say I'm having a fetus. They say I'm having a baby. They don't say the fetus kicked me. They say the baby kicked me. If I'm talking clinically I use the term fetus but if I'm talking with friends I use unborn baby.

[SealFan1963]

When I was pregnant with my son we called him skeletor (from the old He-Man series) because that is what his ultrasound picture looked like, a skeleton (20 years ago, technology wasn't so great)

I'm pro-choice to a certain extent as I don't agree with abortion past when a baby (em, fetus) is viable outside the womb. When I was pregnant or a friend is pregnant I always refer to it as a baby.

[fundyfunland]

I'd rather just say "Right, what the fuck. It's a fucking "baby", whatever. Can we get back to the actual issue in hand here, which is a woman's rights over her own body."

See to me, I think, using the term baby or unborn baby or child, when it's actually a fetus, perpetuates their argument against abortion, as a baby is a human being, someone who should be protected and granted the privileges that come with personhood. Throwing around the term, "unborn baby" IMO, attaches my definition of baby to a fetus. If this is the case, then a woman's rights over her own body are the same as the "unborn baby's." That's just why I don't think the term should be used lightly. I think it adds fuel to the anti-choice arguments.

[lilith]

I've seen the term "unborn baby" used in 19th century legal transcripts, so it's not terribly recent.

[wtfrenchtoast]

I'm with JFC on this one. I think that people are going to call it whatever they want, regardless. If I'm arguing with someone about it, I'll let them say baby instead of fetus, because that doesn't change anything to me. A baby in the sense you're talking about has no more right to use its mother's body without her permission just because its outside the womb.

[Miggy]

I have heard it a lot in news articles recently, as in "The woman and her unborn child were both killed in the car crash." I have never really thought about it until now. You could just as easily say "Pregnant woman".

I described myself as pregnant not as having an unborn child. Never really thought about it as being a child until it was placed in my arms.

[lilith]

I have heard it a lot in news articles recently, as in "The woman and her unborn child were both killed in the car crash." I have never really thought about it until now. You could just as easily say "Pregnant woman".

I described myself as pregnant not as having an unborn child. Never really thought about it as being a child until it was placed in my arms.

In news pieces it can be used to clarify the situation. In a car accident, to use the example you cited, a pregnant woman could die but the baby still be delivered alive, either through an

emergency c section or spontaneous labor when the woman delivers before she dies. It may be that it's being used in news articles more as the chances of a foetus surviving the death of its mother increase.

[NurseNell]

I have heard it a lot in news articles recently, as in "The woman and her unborn child were both killed in the car crash." I have never really thought about it until now. You could just as easily say "Pregnant woman".

I described myself as pregnant not as having an unborn child. Never really thought about it as being a child until it was placed in my arms.

When you had an ultrasound, if you did, did you wonder if the fetus was male or female, or did you refer to it as a baby? Some women do announce pregnancy by saying I'm pregnant but just as many say I'm having a baby.

When a pregnant woman is killed the person responsible is often charged with two deaths, not one.

[Miggy]

When you had an ultrasound, if you did, did you wonder if the fetus was male or female, or did you refer to it as a baby? Some women do announce pregnancy by saying I'm pregnant but just as many say I'm having a baby.

When a pregnant woman is killed the person responsible is often charged with two deaths, not one.

I should have added "just my opinion" as I didn't mean to imply every woman would feel the same way. To answer your question; no, I didn't wonder about the baby, even during the ultrasound. Maybe I'm just weird.

[Guest Anonymous]

I think the nature of the pregnancy makes a difference. If a person has spent 12 years trying for a baby, has already picked out a name, and is painting the nursery, I understand why they would call their foetus a 'baby'. It's their future baby, the idea of it is already a part of their family.

If I had a positive pregnancy test result tomorrow, I would think of it as 'a pregnancy' (i.e. a medical condition, happening to my body), and I would have an abortion to remove the foetus.

In terms of intellectual exercise, and arguments about women's right to choose, I would always say foetus. But I am not going correct my friend when she coos about not being able to wait until 'the baby' is born.

[Guest Anonymous]

I've never heard anyone here in the UK refer to a wanted pregnancy as a foetus, outside a medical consultation. I don't know if that's a general cultural thing or just reflects the circles I run in. Most people I know are pro-choice and, at the same time that abortion is not taboo, it is also commonplace to speak of the baby kicking, or seeing the baby at the 12-week scan.

[SayNoToMullets]

When you had an ultrasound, if you did, did you wonder if the fetus was male or female, or did you refer to it as a baby? Some women do announce pregnancy by saying I'm pregnant but just as many say I'm having a baby.

When a pregnant woman is killed the person responsible is often charged with two deaths, not one.

There is a semantic difference in the bolded, though. "I'm pregnant" could be said by someone who has been trying to conceive, but it could just as easily be said by someone who has an unplanned pregnancy. "I'm having a baby" is used by someone who is planning to carry the pregnancy to term and raise the child. It is a more active voice, and the woman thinks of the fetus as a baby-to-be.

For that reason, I don't think of "unborn child" as being politicized when it's used by the pregnant woman herself, as this usage is informed by an individual woman wanting to have a child. It's the imposition of this usage onto a woman who might not use it herself that has political implications.

[Guest Anonymous]

There is a semantic difference in the bolded, though. "I'm pregnant" could be said by someone who has been trying to conceive, but it could just as easily be said by someone who has an unplanned pregnancy. "I'm having a baby" is used by someone who is planning to carry the pregnancy to term and raise the child. It is a more active voice, and the woman thinks of the fetus as a baby-to-be.

For that reason, I don't think of "unborn child" as being politicized when it's used by the pregnant woman herself, as this usage is informed by an individual woman wanting to have a child. It's the imposition of this usage onto a woman who might not use it herself that has political implications.

I'd agree with this. I'd also say it's fine to use 'having a baby' to refer to a woman who has herself indicated she is having a wanted baby.

"Unborn child" isn't a phrase I've often heard outside Christian circles or in legal cases, for example when a pregnant woman is attacked or injured and seeks justice for the loss of a wanted child.

[Tanaqui]

I've never heard anyone here in the UK refer to a wanted pregnancy as a foetus, outside a medical consultation. I don't know if that's a general cultural thing or just reflects the circles I run in. Most people I know are pro-choice and, at the same time that abortion is not taboo, it is also commonplace to speak of the baby kicking, or seeing the baby at the 12-week scan.

I guess I'm an oddball then because I've referred to my little parasite as "Fetus" throughout the pregnancy. "I know what sex Fetus is, but husband doesn't want to know" "Fetus, get your bloody foot out of my ribs", etc. I guess maybe part of it is due to the fact that there's no guarantee that he'll come out alive, so not calling him baby is kind of like knocking on wood?

[SayNoToMullets]

I guess I'm an oddball then because I've referred to my little parasite as "Fetus" throughout the pregnancy. "I know what sex Fetus is, but husband doesn't want to know" "Fetus, get your bloody foot out of my ribs", etc. I guess maybe part of it is due to the fact that there's no guarantee that he'll come out alive, so not calling him baby is kind of like knocking on wood?

That's kind of cute! Reminds me of when Phoebe sang to her fetus on Friends - "Are you in there little fetus, in nine months will you come greet us, I will buy you some Adidas . . ."

[ILoveJellybeans]

I think it depends on the situation.

I think if someone got pregnant but planned for it and was excited for it, then they can call it their unborn baby, cause thats what it is, its going to be their baby, but its not been born yet.

If someone got pregnant and it was unplanned and they didnt want to keep it, and planned to abort, then its just a fetus (or embryo, most abortions are done before it even resembles anything human), theyre pregnant, but for them it wont be their baby as the pregnancy will not be carried to term and it wont become a baby.

I think a fetus is what you make of it.

[alysee]

I think it depends on the situation.

I think if someone got pregnant but planned for it and was excited for it, then they can call it their unborn baby, cause thats what it is, its going to be their baby, but its not been born yet.

If someone got pregnant and it was unplanned and they didnt want to keep it, and planned to abort, then its just a fetus (or embryo, most abortions are done before it even resembles anything human), theyre pregnant, but for them it wont be their baby as the pregnancy will not be carried to term and it wont become a baby.

I think a fetus is what you make of it.

These are my feelings as well. Especially since I am pregnant and it's definitely a baby to me, even if it's scientifically just a bunch of cells with stumps.

[Conuly]

When it's anti choice advocates talking about baaaaaybeeeees and claiming that a two week old fetus is capable of thoughts and feelings, then I find it ridiculous.

However, when it is a couple talking about their wanted pregnancy, not so much. We want parents to love and bond with their children, and if talking about your baby or child instead of using a clinical term like fetus helps, so much the better. They could call it a spiffneffer if they liked and I wouldn't care. I think there is a big difference between talking about a specific pregnancy and talking about pregnancy in general.