And the happy holiday rants start...

[BelieveinScience]

Saw this on my fb feed-

this is what I believe. (I really couldnt care less if it does offend you) I am sick and tired of every year when CHRISTMAS comes around, there are people who want to take CHRIST out of CHRISTMAS because it might offend someone. Well, how about all of the CHRISTIANS? What about offending us because you are taking CHRIST out of CHRISTMAS!?!? CHRIST IS CHRISTMAS!!! If you aren't celebrating CHRIST then why are you celebrating? CHRISTMAS is about the birth of our SAVIOR! CHRISTMAS is one of a few holidays left that celebrate CHRIST! Leave my holiday alone!!! And tell everyone MERRY CHRISTMAS, not Happy Holidays!

ETA: do these people really not get there are other holidays at the same time. Have they not ever heard of I don't know Hanukkah?

[debrand]

Saw this on my fb feed-

this is what I believe. (I really couldnt care less if it does offend you) I am sick and tired of every year when CHRISTMAS comes around, there are people who want to take CHRIST out of CHRISTMAS because it might offend someone. Well, how about all of the CHRISTIANS? What about offending us because you are taking CHRIST out of CHRISTMAS!?!? CHRIST IS CHRISTMAS!!! If you aren't celebrating CHRIST then why are you celebrating? CHRISTMAS is about the birth of our SAVIOR! CHRISTMAS is one of a few holidays left that celebrate CHRIST! Leave my holiday alone!!! And tell everyone MERRY CHRISTMAS, not Happy Holidays!

ETA: do these people really not get there are other holidays at the same time. Have they not ever heard of I don't know Hanukkah?

Perhaps you could ask her for specific examples and a link to those examples. You could also point out that no one is telling her what she can't say, so why is she insisting that other people say Merry Christmas to her? Does she think that only she deserves free speech?

Yeah, I know that if you did that, you'd end up getting defriended. LOL

[CallmeChaCha]

You should ask this person if they participate in the Black Friday madness or if they buy presents for Christmas. If it's really about celebrating the birth of Jesus, then I'm sure the answer should be no.

[sippin0nsunshine]

Ugh Idiots. Happy Holidays applies when you don't know the religion and/or celebratory traditions of the person you're talking to, and also covers the new year as well.

I had an argument last year on fb about "Taking Christ out of Christmas." I quickly informed that person that X is just the Greek letter for Kh, and also represents the word "Khristos" which is the Greek word for CHRIST. So essentially, XMAS means "Christ-Mas", so fundies, stop bitching.

[mrs]

It really bothers me when those who do not let their children partcipate in "ebil" pagen Holloween, let them participate in Christmas, which is technically influenced from a pagen holiday?!

[ElphabaGalinda]

And of course she's acting like of COURSE everyone celebrates Christmas. I have never celebrated Christmas in my life, and Christmas has become such a commercialized secular holiday anyway. If she's giving presents or decorating a Christmas tree, she's celebrating the non religious part of Christmas too.

I hate how some people act like Hannukah is such a big deal though, just because it's around the same time as Christmas. It's an extremely minor holiday, and it was only made to be more important than it really is just to have some competition with Christmas and so that Jewish kids didn't feel bad about not getting presents. I don't even get hannukah presents anymore, because it's really so children don't feel left out. Does anyone know if there are particularly significant holidays of other religions around the same time as Christmas? Or were those exaggerated too to make it feel like a more inclusive "holiday" season? Hannukah isn't important at all in terms of religion, but no one had better take the Han out of Hannukah ;)

[Shasta ODonegal]

Winter Solstice, Yule, Festivus, Boxing Day, Kwanzaa, Hanukkah occur in December of this year.

[famof4]

Here is a link about other religious holidays around Christmas.

http://www.religioustolerance.org/xmas_other.htm

I am not sure if they are or are not major hoildays in there religions.

[emmiedahl]

Christ's birth did not happen in the winter. The celebration of his birth was moved there because that is when other religions celebrated their big holidays. Most of the accoutrements of Christmas are not Christian in nature, but rather leftovers from the festivals that it replaced.

Many Christians do not seem to understand that other people have the right to do as they please and that *not* celebrating a Christian holiday in the way that Christians demand is simply not religious persecution.

[gardenvarietycitizen]

And of course she's acting like of COURSE everyone celebrates Christmas. I have never celebrated Christmas in my life, and Christmas has become such a commercialized secular holiday anyway. If she's giving presents or decorating a Christmas tree, she's celebrating the non religious part of Christmas too.

I hate how some people act like Hannukah is such a big deal though, just because it's around the same time as Christmas. It's an extremely minor holiday, and it was only made to be more important than it really is just to have some competition with Christmas and so that Jewish kids didn't feel bad about not getting presents. I don't even get hannukah presents anymore, because it's really so children don't feel left out. Does anyone know if there are particularly significant holidays of other religions around the same time as Christmas? Or were those exaggerated too to make it feel like a more inclusive "holiday" season? Hannukah isn't important at all in terms of religion, but no one had better take the Han out of Hannukah ;)

I've long thought that if the schools (or whatever) wanted to make a big deal out of Jewish holiday so that they can be multicultural, they should pick Rosh Hashanah perhaps. It's an actual big deal holiday, and better yet, it's a holiday that happens at a time when the majority Christian kids do NOT have a big deal holiday, yet they do have their own sense of "new beginning" because it's the start of a new school year, so they can sorta get the idea while explicitly having it be a holiday that other kids have with special foods and all that that THEY don't have.

As for "holidays of other religions around Xmas" there's the interesting case of Ramadan and Eid-al-Fitr (hopefully spelled that right? The big holiday at the end of Ramadan with major feasting and family time). In 2001, 9/11 happened, and so all of a sudden it was a big deal to recognize Muslim holidays, to recognize that there are plenty of Muslim Americans, etc. Well, in 2001 Ramadan was in November and Eid in December and so you guessed it, it fell close enough to Xmas (THAT YEAR) to get the "oh, it's kinda like the Muslim Xmas" treatment.

...which is not too surprising, really. But the thing is of course the Muslim holidays circulate around the entire year since they don't do any leap-thing, so those holidays can be any time (this year it was in the summer, etc). Yet in some places the "oh, Eid after Ramadan is the Muslim Xmas" thing lives on so you can sometimes find cards for it or mentions of it on "look at us, we mention ALL the holidays!!" type sites, completely at the wrong time of year. Just one of those weird things.

In Japan the big holiday is New Year, which in modern times is celebrated January 1st on the usual "Western calendar" (it's the same holiday as "Chinese New Year" but it's been moved to January 1st in Japan). Japan does commercial Xmas now to some extent (far more now than previously) but it's mainly a "have dinner with your girlfriend" and "eat a cake at home" and "maybe give a small gift to a kid" thing - the big loot haul is New Year when kids get money which they can decide to blow on whatever they want when the stores open back up. New Year is also when everyone goes home to visit family and everything closes and you eat special food for a week and there's special shows on TV 24/7.

I'm surprised how much commercial Halloween is now a thing in Japan though. When I was a kid hardly anyone had even heard of it, now at least the decoration theming seems to be all over merchandise and toys for kids (though as far as I know actual trick-or-treating or dressing up still isn't a thing). I guess "commercial" seems to be the common theme in all this :D

[tanksmom]

Saw this on my fb feed-

this is what I believe. (I really couldnt care less if it does offend you) I am sick and tired of every year when CHRISTMAS comes around, there are people who want to take CHRIST out of CHRISTMAS because it might offend someone. Well, how about all of the CHRISTIANS? What about offending us because you are taking CHRIST out of CHRISTMAS!?!? CHRIST IS CHRISTMAS!!! If you aren't celebrating CHRIST then why are you celebrating? CHRISTMAS is about the birth of our SAVIOR! CHRISTMAS is one of a few holidays left that celebrate CHRIST! Leave my holiday alone!!! And tell everyone MERRY CHRISTMAS, not Happy Holidays!

ETA: do these people really not get there are other holidays at the same time. Have they not ever heard of I don't know Hanukkah?

I think that a lot of this has to do with Christians insisting that they are being OMG persecuted just like Jesus said would happen!!!11!! more so than the fact that they could care about what someone says to them. Unless I missed the meeting there isn't some mass plan to rid the world of Christmas. Unless it was covered in one of the gay agenda meetings??? I never seem to get my schedule for those :lol: Or my rainbow colored toaster :(

[keen23]

This year, my family will be celebrating Krismas. http://parentingbeyondbelief.com/blog/?p=170

I love the traditional, but commercial aspects of Christmas- the tree, the big holiday meal, the presents, the songs and the Christmas TV specials- but not the religious dogma. Krismas falls in completely with our family.

[gardenvarietycitizen]

This year, my family will be celebrating Krismas. http://parentingbeyondbelief.com/blog/?p=170

I love the traditional, but commercial aspects of Christmas- the tree, the big holiday meal, the presents, the songs and the Christmas TV specials- but not the religious dogma. Krismas falls in completely with our family.

Interesting to see it named as a concept. One fundie family I used to follow was of the opinion that "Christmas" was not actually in the Bible as one of the required holidays, and they were Reformed, so they took the usual "we don't celebrate Christmas in our household" line as far as religion goes, but they DID explicitly celebrate what they called "all the other parts of the American holiday" so they did Santa, red and green, the tree, lots of crafts, baking, presents, all the rest. Krismas would be perfect for them.

[emmiedahl]

Krismas is basically what we celebrate.

We used to be more interfaith than we currently are. We celebrated Hanukkah as a minor Jewish feast from my faith and then Christmas as a major religious holiday from my husband's faith. I went with the family to midnight mass. My husband is having issues with the Catholic church and so we do not do as much of the religious stuff.

It's not that we are engaging in some plot to remove Christianity from its own holidays, just that the holiday is very commercial and there is no escaping it in American culture. And it is fun! No harm in having fun with your children. If we moved to another country, we would celebrate their feasts and holidays just for fun. It is not a coordinated attack on Christianity or anything.

[valsa]

My reply to anyone bitching about the "War on Christmas"- Got over yourself. The world doesn't revolve around you and your pagan-origined, celebrating-at-the-wrong-time-of-the-damn-year holiday. There are other holidays that non-Christians celebrate at that time and there is another holiday that Christians celebrate as well.

[ElphabaGalinda]

I've long thought that if the schools (or whatever) wanted to make a big deal out of Jewish holiday so that they can be multicultural, they should pick Rosh Hashanah perhaps. It's an actual big deal holiday, and better yet, it's a holiday that happens at a time when the majority Christian kids do NOT have a big deal holiday, yet they do have their own sense of "new beginning" because it's the start of a new school year, so they can sorta get the idea while explicitly having it be a holiday that other kids have with special foods and all that that THEY don't have.

As for "holidays of other religions around Xmas" there's the interesting case of Ramadan and Eid-al-Fitr (hopefully spelled that right? The big holiday at the end of Ramadan with major feasting and family time). In 2001, 9/11 happened, and so all of a sudden it was a big deal to recognize Muslim holidays, to recognize that there are plenty of Muslim Americans, etc. Well, in 2001 Ramadan was in November and Eid in December and so you guessed it, it fell close enough to Xmas (THAT YEAR) to get the "oh, it's kinda like the Muslim Xmas" treatment.

...which is not too surprising, really. But the thing is of course the Muslim holidays circulate around the entire year since they don't do any leap-thing, so those holidays can be any time (this year it was in the summer, etc). Yet in some places the "oh, Eid after Ramadan is the Muslim Xmas" thing lives on so you can sometimes find cards for it or mentions of it on "look at us, we mention ALL the holidays!!" type sites, completely at the wrong time of year. Just one of those weird things.

In Japan the big holiday is New Year, which in modern times is celebrated January 1st on the usual "Western calendar" (it's the same holiday as "Chinese New Year" but it's been moved to January 1st in Japan). Japan does commercial Xmas now to some extent (far more now than previously) but it's mainly a "have dinner with your girlfriend" and "eat a cake at home" and "maybe give a small gift to a kid" thing - the big loot haul is New Year when kids get money which they can decide to blow on whatever they want when the stores open back up. New Year is also when everyone goes home to visit family and everything closes and you eat special food for a week and there's special shows on TV 24/7.

I'm surprised how much commercial Halloween is now a thing in Japan though. When I was a kid hardly anyone had even heard of it, now at least the decoration theming seems to be all over merchandise and toys for kids (though as far as I know actual trick-or-treating or dressing up still isn't a thing). I guess "commercial" seems to be the common theme in all this :D

I like that idea! I always hated how in school they mentioned Hannukah to be inclusive, but they never mentioned any actual important holidays that were a big deal. And since it's near the beginning of a school year, kids will think of it as a new year anyways. I knew about Ramadan and Eid as holidays, but I also know that they're at different times a year every year, so they're never were put together with Christmas in my mind. I have heard people call Hannukah the Jewish Christmas which is stupid, because it's insignificant compared to Christmas. You're allowed to work on that day, and you're not supposed to on major holidays, which is a big hint. No one would take off work for Hannukah unless they just don't particularly feel like working and have a boss who buys the excuse :lol: But even the least observant Jews at least try to take a day off on Rosh Hashanah. If anything was equivalent in importance to Christmas it would be Rosh Hashanah or Yom Kippur, and Passover is just as big too, but around the same time as Easter. The only reason December is called the "Holiday season" is because of Christmas.

I predict that Halloween in Japan will some day become just like in North America, since everything is getting commercialized everywhere. I guess that's the good part of Hannukah being made so commercial...none of the significant holidays had to get commercialized it its place. When I first noticed that adults don't really get Hannukah presents my mom actually told me we only gave presents so Jewish kids wouldn't feel left out at Christmas. I don't know if that's the real reason, but it makes the most sense.

ETA I celebrate Christmas by going out for Chinese food and going to the movies, which is a proud North American Jewish tradition :D But there's no escaping Christmas, it's ubiquitous, which is why there can't possibly be a war on it.

[Pudicitia]

Also, for many secular (and not so secular) people, new year is a big deal. In Scotland, it's called Hogmanay, and we get an extra day off compared to the rest of the UK. Works out brilliantly for me and Mr. Pudicitia for visiting our respective families: we see his English family for Christmas, go to church, etc, then trundle up to Scotland to spend hogmanay with my atheist Scottish family in the traditional manner (ie. lots of alcohol, raucous singing, and 'first footing').

*puts on classicist hat* Something...something... institutionalization of Christianity by the Roman state...blah, blah...Saturnalia...blah...

[BelieveinScience]

I like that idea! I always hated how in school they mentioned Hannukah to be inclusive, but they never mentioned any actual important holidays that were a big deal. And since it's near the beginning of a school year, kids will think of it as a new year anyways. I knew about Ramadan and Eid as holidays, but I also know that they're at different times a year every year, so they're never were put together with Christmas in my mind. I have heard people call Hannukah the Jewish Christmas which is stupid, because it's insignificant compared to Christmas. You're allowed to work on that day, and you're not supposed to on major holidays, which is a big hint. No one would take off work for Hannukah unless they just don't particularly feel like working and have a boss who buys the excuse :lol: But even the least observant Jews at least try to take a day off on Rosh Hashanah. If anything was equivalent in importance to Christmas it would be Rosh Hashanah or Yom Kippur, and Passover is just as big too, but around the same time as Easter. The only reason December is called the "Holiday season" is because of Christmas.

I predict that Halloween in Japan will some day become just like in North America, since everything is getting commercialized everywhere. I guess that's the good part of Hannukah being made so commercial...none of the significant holidays had to get commercialized it its place. When I first noticed that adults don't really get Hannukah presents my mom actually told me we only gave presents so Jewish kids wouldn't feel left out at Christmas. I don't know if that's the real reason, but it makes the most sense.

ETA I celebrate Christmas by going out for Chinese food and going to the movies, which is a proud North American Jewish tradition :D But there's no escaping Christmas, it's ubiquitous, which is why there can't possibly be a war on it.

I went public school in Florida for 2 years and we got Yom kippur off there.

[ElphabaGalinda]

I went public school in Florida for 2 years and we got Yom kippur off there.

That's awesome! But a rarity in a public school. No idea why a school would give off Yom Kippur without giving off Rosh Hashanah. Teacher's were always understanding, but I've never heard of a school that gave a day off for either. It's a very nice idea

[jaynie]

This year, my family will be celebrating Krismas. http://parentingbeyondbelief.com/blog/?p=170

I love the traditional, but commercial aspects of Christmas- the tree, the big holiday meal, the presents, the songs and the Christmas TV specials- but not the religious dogma. Krismas falls in completely with our family.

That's awesome. My father and I took to calling it "Colinmas" -- the celebration of all of the Colins that have ever been and ever will be (we know no Colins, but then, don't believe in Jesus, so it seemed just as irrelevant to celebrate their birthdays as the birth of christ. At least Colins are definitely real!). But I think Krismas has a more widespread appeal, and does perfectly sum up what so many of us are celebrating anyway.

As for other holidays, I do know quite a few pagans who make a big deal about Winter Solstice. I'm not sure if that's because it's inherently a Big Deal, though, or if it's a side effect of people coming to paganism via Christianity and needing a winter holiday to fill in the gaps. My assumption is that pre-christmas festivals occured in late December *because* of the solstice, but I'm not sure how well that translates to modern religion.

[GeoBQn]

That's awesome! But a rarity in a public school. No idea why a school would give off Yom Kippur without giving off Rosh Hashanah. Teacher's were always understanding, but I've never heard of a school that gave a day off for either. It's a very nice idea

My school district in the Chicago suburbs got off for Rosh Hashanah day 1 and Yom Kippur.

[Conuly]

Here in NYC we get Yom Kippur and Rosh Hashanah off every year, and spring break is carefully planned to encompass Passover, Good Friday, and Easter. But we have a very large Jewish population.

If you squint you can kinda add Diwali to the "holiday season", but that's really stretching it. It's more October or November, I just checked.

[ElphabaGalinda]

Here in NYC we get Yom Kippur and Rosh Hashanah off every year, and spring break is carefully planned to encompass Passover, Good Friday, and Easter. But we have a very large Jewish population.

If you squint you can kinda add Diwali to the "holiday season", but that's really stretching it. It's more October or November, I just checked.

I have heard some people count Diwali as part of the "holiday season", even though it actually next week, and often closer to Halloween. I'm actually used to wishing people a happy Diwali because of my university population, which is how I know when it is. At least that IS quite a big holiday, although not especially close in timing to Christmas.

We have a very large Jewish population in Toronto as well (proportionally), but we don't get Yom Kippur or Rosh Hashanah or Passover off. My school especially, half the school wouldn't show up on Jewish holidays, but there was still school. So there's definitely a large variation by region (and within regions). I just hate that Hannukah is the first place some people go to be inclusive while totally ignoring major holidays. Though I do prefer Happy Holidays as a greeting, I won't get offended if someone tells me Merry Christmas, it's good intentions. If someone knows full well that I don't celebrate Christmas and still says it, then that's a little weird and insensitive.

I'd say Bodhi day would count as part of the holiday season since it's in early december, but not everyone knows about that one. I only ever knew one person to celebrated it, and she said it was kind of important, but not the biggest of holidays. I think more religions have fairly big holidays in the spring time, though I often wonder why Easter was never secularized as much as Christmas. Probably because there's no presents :D

[gardenvarietycitizen]

I'm actually used to wishing people a happy Diwali because of my university population, which is how I know when it is.

There's a big Diwali celebration by me too, living in a university town...

[snarktastic]

I'd be very happy to celebrate Winterval with all the rest of the assorted heathens so that the CHRISTians could do CHRISTmas as an exclusively CHRISTian holiday. But one UK city tried the Winterval thing once, years ago, and now every year the press goes bonkers about how the Muslims are stopping the rest of us celebrating Christmas. Funny thing is though, if you go a largely Muslim area in December, you can hardly move for tinsel and Happy Christmas signs...