The "Thinking" House"wife" is so classy.

[Maggie Mae]

Today, she thinks that children are better suited for the DNC than their mothers.

http://www.thinkinghousewife.com/wp/201 ... t-mothers/

On the actual topic, I don't know how I feel about that. There are some places where small kids don't need to be (the opera, strip clubs, drug deals, $250/plate dinners). I just don't know that the under 6 crowd would get much out of the DNC.

However, "Laura's" reaction is just so over-the-top with anger and hatred of women that I have a hard time believing that she's not a parody site.

[grateful1230]

I was just reading this gem by the lousewife. My younger boys are turning 11 this month and next, and I would still not take them to the DNC. Unless, of course, they'll be allowed to make paper airplanes and fart noises at each other every few minutes. We do discuss politics (mostly because I've been so angry at the latest amendment passing) and my eldest has very strong opinions on the presidential race. Even so, I don't see taking him to the DNC. He'd rather go to the skate park.

[ILoveJellybeans]

I hate it when parents think their child has a right to be anywhere they are.

There are some places where a child should not be allowed, such as places where they are supposed to sit still, be quiet and listen for a long time or will be boring for them (as its not fair on the kid, who would be happier at home, and a bored child is more likely to misbehave and annoy others), and anywhere a child is likely to see something innapropriate (like a bar, adult party, horror movie, orgy) or do something dangerous (like a construction site).

This is not discriminating against children, its for the best as there are reasons some places are off limits for kids.

I was once at a party, at night, and someone had a kid of about three with them. The kid was completely unsupervised and decided I was her best friend ever, and bugged me for the entire night.

[snarkbillie]

I hate it when parents think their child has a right to be anywhere they are.

There are some places where a child should not be allowed, such as places where they are supposed to sit still, be quiet and listen for a long time or will be boring for them (as its not fair on the kid, who would be happier at home, and a bored child is more likely to misbehave and annoy others), and anywhere a child is likely to see something innapropriate (like a bar, adult party, horror movie, orgy) or do something dangerous (like a construction site).

This is not discriminating against children, its for the best as there are reasons some places are off limits for kids.

I was once at a party, at night, and someone had a kid of about three with them. The kid was completely unsupervised and decided I was her best friend ever, and bugged me for the entire night.

Define kid. Define inappropriate in a completely non-subjective way. What places specifically would children not "be allowed" and how would you police that?

[ILoveJellybeans]

It depends on the age of the child for a lot of things, like this political convention says that children under 6 cant go in, which sounds fair because a child under the age of 6 would find it really boring and would be better off at home, and they also might be more likely to act out from boredom. I think a child would be happier at home, with their other parent, a relative or a babysitter.

There are some things a child shouldnt see, like it would be innapropriate to take a child to see a movie which contains a lot of violence or sex scenes, as it could be scary for them. They have ratings for which age is able to see it, and I wouldnt let a child who is younger that that see it, unless they were only a few years short and mature enough to handle it, and I had seen it first.

I also think there are some places for adults only to have fun, like nightclubs and bars. I work in a daycare, and I was at this party on a Friday night, and it was annoying having kids running around as I had been around them all day and I just wanted to have fun without kids wanting my attention. A lot of other people agreed with me, even parents, who had paid for someone to watch their child for the night, and now had to listen to someone elses.

I dont mind kids in restaurants and stuff, as long as the parent makes an effort to keep the child behaving, like not letting them run around or be noisy.

Theres no real way to police it, other than staff asking someone with a disruptive child to leave, or someone selling tickets to a movie telling someone they cant take their child into a movie that is innapropriate for them to see. Sometimes its just manners, like if somewhere decides that children arent allowed, they should respect that, like someone gets an invitation somewhere that specifies no children, they dont bring the children.

[wtfrenchtoast]

Define kid. Define inappropriate in a completely non-subjective way. What places specifically would children not "be allowed" and how would you police that?

I don't see that inappropriate can be defined in a subjective way, but that doesn't make it less valid. There are just some places children don't belong and as a parent, I believe you have to make that sacrifice to be able to go anywhere whenever you want to. I think it should be within the rights of a private place, like a restaurant, to not allow children. If they are going to be disruptive to the atmosphere, or destructive, or loud in places where it's not appropriate, maybe they shouldn't be allowed. I understand that this makes things harder for parents sometimes, but you have to deal with it as a parent if someone doesn't want your kid on their property. Parents are free to not patronize these places.

Now, in regard to the DNC, I'm not sure it's fair to not allow children. It is a subjective matter.

[snarkbillie]

It depends on the age of the child for a lot of things, like this political convention says that children under 6 cant go in, which sounds fair because a child under the age of 6 would find it really boring and would be better off at home, and they also might be more likely to act out from boredom. I think a child would be happier at home, with their other parent, a relative or a babysitter.

There are some things a child shouldnt see, like it would be innapropriate to take a child to see a movie which contains a lot of violence or sex scenes, as it could be scary for them. They have ratings for which age is able to see it, and I wouldnt let a child who is younger that that see it, unless they were only a few years short and mature enough to handle it, and I had seen it first.

I also think there are some places for adults only to have fun, like nightclubs and bars. I work in a daycare, and I was at this party on a Friday night, and it was annoying having kids running around as I had been around them all day and I just wanted to have fun without kids wanting my attention. A lot of other people agreed with me, even parents, who had paid for someone to watch their child for the night, and now had to listen to someone elses.

I dont mind kids in restaurants and stuff, as long as the parent makes an effort to keep the child behaving, like not letting them run around or be noisy.

Theres no real way to police it, other than staff asking someone with a disruptive child to leave, or someone selling tickets to a movie telling someone they cant take their child into a movie that is innapropriate for them to see. Sometimes its just manners, like if somewhere decides that children arent allowed, they should respect that, like someone gets an invitation somewhere that specifies no children, they dont bring the children.

I don't really disagree with any of this. I think I get annoyed because I mis-define kids as "people under 18" and I forget that a 13 year old isn't what people have in mind when they say "kids shouldn't be allowed to go to the museum" or whatever. I think there's space for people to make decisions based on their specific child but agree that private places should be able to set guidelines. I don't want any kids showing up at the bar when I'm there either.

[patsymae]

There are some places where you have to bring children--on planes and trains, the ER (it was me, I was single, had the baby with me after a car crash, was told by the doctor he wouldn't look at me with the baby there--WTF?), the welfare office if you're applying for food stamps.

There are some places where you should never bring children--weddings that didn't specify kids on the invitation, adult parties that start after 7 p.m., bars and strip clubs, movies for adults (not just meaning "adult" movies which now means with sexual content, but any movie that doesn't involve dora, cars, disney characters, transformers, etc,

There are some places that are "iffy": i.e., museums, movies, some church services, any restaurant that doesn't have a theme character. This is when if you want you take your kid to see if it goes well, and if it doesn't, you LEAVE. Chalk the twenty-eight bucks up to a learning experience. Tell you kid that you have to leave and tell her the reason. If you want to have fun and do fun things you have to act in a certain way and respect the other people.

I was a single parent and had to take my kid with me if we went anywhere. If I got an invitation I would ask my family if someone could sit and if they couldn't, would tell the person I'd love to come but...(not meaning late-night event but, for example, a picnic where there would be no other children) and leave it up to them. Absolutely I never thought it was the other persons' problem to not accommodate my kid. But I went to a wedding recently and the other people that we were sharing the suite with showed up with a 4-year-old with a cold and asked (really more assumed we would)

When I once suggested to some parents (very non-fundie, Park Slope) that they shouldn't bring their kids to an adult dinner party, I got totally creamed.

Fundie and Park Slope helicopter parents agree on more than they thing.

[Glass Cowcatcher]

It goes both ways. There are of course (some) places that (some) kids should not go, but I also hate people who act like children should not be seen in public, ever.

[YPestis]

I don't have kids yet so I think my tolerance for misbehaving kids is much lower than war-weary parents. I hate it when I go to a "nice" restaurant and see noisy kids there. My SO is even worse and actively avoid sitting near tables with young children (which I think is unnecessary). My parents are much more tolerant of young children who cry and make nuances of themselves, which makes me wonder how I must have been as a young child. :~)

In general, it's up to the parents' best judgement to decide whether to take children certain places. Each child is different and every parent is different. I had a co-worker who had to bring in his kids to work when we were asked to come in on the weekend. He assured us his two young children (both under 10 yo) were "very mature" for their age and would not cause trouble. Some people looked skeptical but the boss didn't want to look like an ass and agreed. The two girls were lovely and behaved themselves very well. They brought some toys and a small comforter and slept for part of the morning and then played quietly without any issues. However, plenty of kids their age would have run around and caused a ruckus. Their father showed good judgement there. I only wish more parents could do that.

[salsa]

There are some kids and parents who shouldn't go anywhere until they learn some manners (and I'm not one to expect noiseless, compliant children). In my job, I've seen some pretty lazy parenting and people who are just plain inconsiderate - not tending to a fussy baby, allowing a kid to shriek periodically throughout an entire shopping trip, children running around, children stealing things and parents LAUGHING at it.

[emmiedahl]

I think there are places where you expect noisy children and places where you don't. It is reasonable to take your children to the grocery store or a family restaurant and for them to act like children (within parameters, of course). Babies and toddlers cry, preschoolers talk too loud, etc. As long as the parent is trying, I have no judgment.

Nice restaurants and Broadway are a different story. If you bring your children, it should only be because you have exceptionally well-behaved children who can enjoy the experience without disturbing others. I have a friend who brought her small children to Broadway matinees and they were fine, enjoyed the show, went out for a swanky dinner afterward. If your children can handle being impeccably behaved for a few hours, there is a lot they can get out of it. I would argue that the DNC is an adult event similar to a Broadway show. For many people attending, this is a once in a lifetime thing.

I have a friend with an autistic daughter who is regularly told that she should not take her daughter out in public. Her daughter is extremely high functioning but she does get easily upset. Unfortunately, a mother still has to go to the grocery store, the doctor's office, Sears, etc. Most people do not realize the child is autistic so they make all kinds of nasty comments about her parenting. It's a really sucky way to treat a mom who is struggling to keep her life together and teach her disabled child good public behavior.

[StarrieEyedKat]

I have a friend with an autistic daughter who is regularly told that she should not take her daughter out in public. Her daughter is extremely high functioning but she does get easily upset. Unfortunately, a mother still has to go to the grocery store, the doctor's office, Sears, etc. Most people do not realize the child is autistic so they make all kinds of nasty comments about her parenting. It's a really sucky way to treat a mom who is struggling to keep her life together and teach her disabled child good public behavior.

I used to work with kids on the spectrum and my BIL asked me one day "I made a comment to a mom that had an autistic daughter at the pool. The daughter was throwing a tantrum so I just joked and said "looks like she could use a nap" and the mom got mad at me!!" I told him that the mom probably gets comments about her daughter's behavior and her parenting skills every single time she goes out and he should probably just keep his comments to himself.

I agree there are places children do not "belong" but for regular every day life, I rarely judge parents at the grocery store or family restaurant, as long as they're trying. I completely understand that sometimes kids are just holy terrors, no matter how good of a parent you are, or how well behaved they are every other day.

[emmiedahl]

I agree there are places children do not "belong" but for regular every day life, I rarely judge parents at the grocery store or family restaurant, as long as they're trying. I completely understand that sometimes kids are just holy terrors, no matter how good of a parent you are, or how well behaved they are every other day.

Children will always choose the worst possible moment to be awful. My 5 year old has one tantrum in her life and it was in public. When my oldest son was about two, he chose his first day at a swanky liberal Montessori school as the place to try out a new word he had heard from my racist in-laws (he yelled it at a block set so I was able to successfully assure the administration that he honestly had no idea what it meant and would never say that again). It never fails--their worst behavior will occur when you are most depending on them to have normal, good behavior.

[YPestis]

I often express concern to my SO that we could turn into one of "those" parents----you know, the type that can't stop admiring everything little Johnny does and look on passively as he screams and steals other kids' toys. I have known parents who are so enamored with their children that they expect the rest of us to also laugh at their kids' annoying antics. I don't want to grow tolerant of my child's tantrums and misbehavior. I want to be embarrassed by their antics and discipline them appropriately. Maybe I'll get a continued reality check when I'm a parent and hanging out with other parents' kids and get appalled by their kids' behaviors LOL.