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  1. I know they disagree with the newest policies and I guess they feel they are right but if I was in their shoes I would try to kill them with kindness and show a true Christian acceptance rather than kick them to the curb. My nephew is a member of a church (Congregational) sponsored troop that is fully endowed by the church, he also has a lesbian troop leader. I think it is a great balance for him and I am happy to see the scouts headed in the correct direction but I believe they have a ways to go to complete the trip. Link to article: http://www.adn.com/2013/08/08/3014921/b ... orage.html
  2. http://www.ajc.com/news/news/local/mini ... uit/nTCRC/ There must be a special class in "minister" school (or the website where they print their ordination papers) that requires you to be a money grubbing louse to operate in public in Georgia. A little background, On November 21, 2006 police raided a house for a drug raid based on BS information. They lied to get the warrant, they made up facts, got a "no knock" which meant they just busted the door down, and went in. Inside they found katherine Johnston who opened fire on them as they entered. The police shot back, there were lots of ricochets etc, Johnston was hit and ultimitaly killed. I remember some media reports that they handcuffed her while she was still alive. The news was ALL OVER the case from the second it happened and one of the news stations had the alleged "informant" interviewed that night, where he said the warrant was BS. The next day one of the cops went back to the scene and planted some drugs. The "informant's" story is here, he's a real POS but it has good info http://www.nytimes.com/2012/07/01/magaz ... wanted=all All the cops involved were prosecuted and convicted both on the state level and federally. I'm pretty sure they're all still in prison. The police did a very thorough investigation, busted the unit, changed procedures, all kinds of stuff. All through it the family (who didnt even know how old she was when this started) argued over money. The city eventually settled with the estate for 4.9 million. Literally before the smoke cleared the air "reverend" hutchins was on scene. He had no prior relationship with the family, but jumped in front of every camera he could find. He gave interviews, held press conferences, had meetings... inserted himself into other cases where there were camera... then ran (unsuccessfully) for congress. Now he wants a 10% tithe and actually sued this family to get it. He should go work with creflo dollar and the other money sucking "ministers" around here.
  3. Behold... http://www.gracebaptistthailand.org/gbcmalefemale.html Sadly, this shows that christian fundie-ness is to be found in Thailand, one of the countries that I love and cherish... "Dr" Ronaldo C Gutlay is the senior pastor of Grace Church. I'm amazed at the original name that he chose for the church... He babbles on about male headship and is convinced that it isn't wine that Jesus drank at Cana, but grape juice (shades of Pa Keller here). He thinks that Catholics are Pagan Statues worshippers and that it is forbiden to have images representing Jesus Christ. I wonder how large is his flock; I hope it's very small. Sad to see Thailand being infested by this. That country is a magnet for crazy people from the outside enough as it is, it doesn't need dangerous faiths like Fundie Christianity taking hold. Hope that it won't become another Guatemala...
  4. So those crazy Calvinists are now posting clever little lists about why lesser Christions should not join a reformed church. The smugness, it burns. http://reformedbaptistfellowship.org/20 ... st-church/
  5. Sunnichick31

    Baptist churches

    What are the differences between the various Baptist churches. I know there is IFB and Southern Baptist (I was raised as an SB, but we stopped going to church when I was pretty young, like, 8 or so, then started going again when I was around 10, then stopped again a while later because we kept moving around and Mom hated finding new churches) Anyway, the other day when I was driving I saw a sign for the association of regular baptist churches and somehting about a regular baptist press too. What's the difference between SBs, IFBs, and regular Baptists? (I had never even heard of RBs before I saw that sign!)
  6. I haven't talked much about myself or my experiences in my old church much here. I think it's because I left almost five years ago and am largely over it; as a happy atheist I can look back with the ol' 20/20 hindsight and it's sometimes almost funny, yanno? But make no mistake, we all have our baggage and I guess we never really let go of it, we just learn to stow it well in the overhead compartment. My former fundy days are just one of my carryon bags. I am not sure why I am thinking about it today, I do still think about it occasionally and still do find a lot of things interesting about discussions of religion. Anyway before I digress further, I wrote a review of my old church on YellowPages and I thought you guys might enjoy it. http://www.yellowpages.com/bremerton-wa ... d=17780598
  7. So, someone quite dear to me has recently been baptised into the Baptist faith. Then she announced her pregnancy by her Baptist fiancee - which, by the way, is appropriately miraculous for this time of year as they claim to have been practicing abstinence . They got married last week. She tells me all the time that the Bible is the word of God and is to be taken literally. I'm quite familiar with the Bible, and I think it's for this reason that I've been having trouble wrapping my head around what biblical literalism really means. For instance, today it struck me that it means, presumably, that she denies evolution. EVOLUTION. It also means that the part of her vows where their youth pastor said that woman was made from Adam's rib and thus she was becoming a part of her husband's body, and therefore must always remember that she owes him (her new husband) her life - yeah, they meant that literally. I know this is something I need to ask her more about, but I just find myself so literally baffled by the stuff she says that our conversations don't often get very far - part of me is floored by it, part of me wants to be careful not to hurt her feelings so I clam up. These concepts are pretty incomprehensible to my generally rational self, so I'm wondering, fellow FreeJingerites - if someone takes the Bible literally, what exactly does that mean they believe? Please help me wrap my head around this.
  8. holierthanyou

    IFB Spectrum

    Question for former (and current, if there are any) IFB-ers out there: How wide is the spectrum of IFB churches? What does a "liberal" IFB church look like (obviously 'liberal' is a relative term), and what are the 'rules' and practices of the most extreme conservative ones? I went to one last week that seemed pretty 'liberal' (e.g. still KJV doesn't need to be 1611, women said "Amen" in response to the pastor's rhetorical questions, a couple women with hair above the shoulders, etc), but I'm not sure how wide the spectrum is.
  9. Now, I think Komen is a pile of crap charity, but I suppose preventing the chance someone might come in contact with someone who might happen to be affiliated with someone who performs abortion is more important than breast cancer screening and treatment.
  10. http://www.newsobserver.com/2011/11/21/ ... d-for.html i was quite surprised to see this, but a baptist church in north carolina has said that until there is marriage equality, they will not perform any marriages. i gotta say, i was quite proud of them when i read this. *edited* to add: now, they will perform ceremonies, but the pastor refuses to sign any marriage certificate.
  11. Poe or real? I can't tell! It reads like parody, but if you go to the site, they have photos of the kids... http://objectiveministries.org/creation ... efair.html Elementary School Level: 1st Place: "My Uncle Is A Man Named Steve (Not A Monkey)" Cassidy Turnbull (grade 5) presented her uncle, Steve. She also showed photographs of monkeys and invited fairgoers to note the differences between her uncle and the monkeys. She tried to feed her uncle bananas, but he declined to eat them. Cassidy has conclusively shown that her uncle is no monkey. 2nd Place: "Pine Cones Are Complicated" David Block and Trevor Murry (grades 4) showed how specifically complicated pine cones are and how they reveal God's design in nature. Honorable Mention: "God Made Kitty" - Sally Reister (grade 3) "The Bible Says Creation" - Aaron Kent (grade 5) "Pokemon Prove Evolutionism Is False" - Paul Sanborn (grade 4) Middle School Level: 1st Place: "Life Doesn't Come From Non-Life" Patricia Lewis (grade 8) did an experiment to see if life can evolve from non-life. Patricia placed all the non-living ingredients of life - carbon (a charcoal briquet), purified water, and assorted minerals (a multi-vitamin) - into a sealed glass jar. The jar was left undisturbed, being exposed only to sunlight, for three weeks. (Patricia also prayed to God not to do anything miraculous during the course of the experiment, so as not to disqualify the findings.) No life evolved. This shows that life cannot come from non-life through natural processes. 2nd Place: "Women Were Designed For Homemaking" Jonathan Goode (grade 7) applied findings from many fields of science to support his conclusion that God designed women for homemaking: physics shows that women have a lower center of gravity than men, making them more suited to carrying groceries and laundry baskets; biology shows that women were designed to carry un-born babies in their wombs and to feed born babies milk, making them the natural choice for child rearing; social sciences show that the wages for women workers are lower than for normal workers, meaning that they are unable to work as well and thus earn equal pay; and exegetics shows that God created Eve as a companion for Adam, not as a co-worker. Honorable Mention: "Mousetrap Reduced To Pile Of Functionless Parts" - Kevin Parker (grade 7) "Dinosaur & Man Walked Together" - Donny Findlay (grade 6) "Rocks Can't Evolve, Where Did They Come From Mr. Darwin?" - Anna Reed (grade 6)
  12. I know on a a Duggar episode, they visited this church. I was wondering if anyone knew if it had any Gothard or Fundie connections? Here it is... wwwDOTbethelministriesDOTorg/pastorsDOThtm
  13. On tonight's show, they mentioned that before they started "home-churching" with other families, that they belonged to a mega-church in Arkansas. Anyone know what church they were part of? Also-- I found it interesting that Michelle finally admitted to them being Baptists.
  14. I am still flummoxed how three different denominations could reach similar conclusions about what it means to lead a godly life. From my liberal perspective, Baptism is about emotion, Presbyterianism is about cold logic, and ATI is about works and proper behavior. So how is it that teh Botkins, Voddie Baucham, and teh Duggars can find anything to agree on, much less go into business together, as it were?
  15. I have a few questions for those who grew up IFB, or are still IFB, about your church(es) and Calvinism. I grew up in a pretty fundie IFBC that was split between Calvinists and Arminians. I would NOT call my former church fundie-lite, although some of the families (as was mine) were, albeit very covertly, but it wasn't full on hard core fundie like some of the other churches written about here. I wrote about one of my "favorite" examples of humiliation/torture I was put through in another forum, but briefly here that is- let me set the stage- I was a gawky 13 year old, just on the verge of turning "pretty," but I was still looking awkward and had not quite grown into my looks yet. It was Valentine's Day and it fell on a Sunday so I decided to wear a red dress that I'd (okay, my fundie mom) bought for the occasion. It was practically a frumper, came down almost to my ankles, didn't cling to my body, and it was the exact opposite of anything remotely immodest and I wore a white turtle neck underneath. So that's the kinda environment I was in. Now the weird thing about my IFB is that there was a 50-50% split between the Arminians and the Calvinists. The entire youth program leadership was Calvinist and the regular leadership were somewhere between 3-5 point Calvinists with the most "iffy" point being Limited Atonement (meaning Jesus only died for the sins of the elect and not for the sins for the world). But, with the exception of the youth group leaders who worked with kids ages 12-18, and who tried to indoctrinate the hell out of us with TULIP, Calvinism and it's tenants were never discussed unless a person specifically brought up in a one-on-one kinda setting. There were never any sermons given, not even one, that would have hinted or let any visitors know that lurking underneath the surface was a full fledged belief in the tenants of Calvinism. My IFB was all about "soul winning," "alter calls," missionaries, littering Bible tracts on Halloween, and including personalized notes on how to get "saved" in their monetary tips to waitresses at restaurants. So when I was first taught about Calvinism it completely screwed up my faith and started a many years long spiral into, what I now call, my religious pit of depression. My complete indoctrination of everything my church believed made it seem impossible for me to still be Christian yet somehow reject TULIP. If I rejected TULIP than I was rejecting the Bible and that meant fiery pits of hell. It took me years and then some plus a lot of researching to unravel the knots of damage that caused. Calvinism completely screwed up my faith and to be able to salvage it all, I did a lot of studying so that I can figure out what I actually believed and not what I was indoctrinated to believe. And here's where my real question(s) come into play: Did/Does anyone who was/is part of an IFBC ever go to one who that was also Calvinistic? Or like in my case, not so much "teach" it, but wholeheartedly believe it? And if so, how did that work out for you and were you able to reconcile it? In my church, many of the older members were full on Arminians, didn't want any part of Calvin and it was the younger members who had embraced it- although more quietly. The two factions were able to coexist as long as it remained relegated to the youth group and to yourself. Did this happen in any other churches? Sometimes I really wonder how I happened to be raised in the seemingly only Calvinist believing IFBC. Please tell me there are more of you! I am no longer part of an IFB church and I'm full on Arminian, probably to the point being the almost "heretical" semi-pelagian. I have a real love for CS Lewis' the Last Battle and believe (or want to believe more than anything, or as least as much as I've been able to unindoctrinate myself) that that's how it really is. For those who don't know, Emeth represents those who worship false gods and Aslan is the "real" deal. Emeth says, "Surely this is the hour of death, for the Lion (who is worthy of all honour) will know that I have served Tash all my days and not him. Nevertheless, it is better to see the Lion and die than to be Tisroc of the world and live and not to have seen him." But Aslan tells him "I take to me the services which thou hast done to Tash. For I and he are of such different kinds that no service which is vile can be done to me, and none which is not vile can be done to him." Basically, in the end, the only thing that matters is that you spend your life seeking truth and good. (I love how how hard core fundies love love love CS Lewis but pretend like this book, or at least this part doesn't exist!)
  16. homeschoolmomma1

    We have a home church!

    On our voicemail today it said... Pastor, This is Pastor Michael Catt from Sherwood Baptist Church. I urge you to tell your congregation to go to the movie Courageous. It will change peoples lives... then he kept going on about how awesome it is but never said anything about the Duggars The movie begins tomorrow nationwide! Please take the time to tell your congregation to go to this movie. It will change your life. Ya so I never knew we were a church... does that mean I don't have to pay taxes on the house this year? I did not listen to it again. I will see if I can post his whole message tomorrow just thought you would like to know you can join our church. tithe is 10% of everything you own and we eat Tater TOt Cass and drink cool aid. If you join the congergation you can add your own personal touch
  17. My daughter told me that her boyfriend's father, who is pastor of a major metro SBC "First Baptist" church is thinking about leaving to run a ministry for orphans. He is in a very important position where he is. He cosiders himself a consevative Christian and he is politically connected. He has given convocations before US Congress, etc. However, he also is the sort of old fashioned religious leader who reaches out to the community and participates in interfath initiatives for the people in his city. He considers Rabbi's and Priests and other religious leaders as friends and coleagues. I am wondering if he is not being pushed to give up his flock because of his relatively progressive policies. As the religious arm of the right wing pushes further and further right, is it possible that the pastor is too liberal for the SBC? I disagree with this man on many issues, but I totally respect how he lives and works and leads. I am quite certain that there are no scandals of any sort in his life. He is a true learder of his community. Could his acceptance of diversity be too much for the SBC?
  18. I don't know if anyone cares but I think there is a 'mystery' tonight is with a dude who belonged to a Baptist church- oh and they HOMESCHOOL! They prayed about it
  19. Ladies and Gents, let me introduce you to the Baby Baptist Buddies meant to teach your toddlers about how to be "real Christians." First up "Grandpa's Burning in Hell". Think your recently departed beloved Grandad is in heaven..hah think again, but don't worry this will provide instruction saving you from fate. youtube.com/user/mrswhitford#p/u/2/H8iiExnZSXs Belch. This lady has a whole youtube channel of animated crap. Rants against atheists, feminists, vegetarians, homosexuals and everyone else Jesus hates. The "Don't Judge Me" one is a great laughfest as well. youtube.com/user/mrswhitford#p/u/4/r2Np77Do78E
  20. twin2

    I'm Now KJV Only!!

    I know I have had a few snarky comment about the KJV only Bible. I've snarked about God not speaking in Shakespearean English, and that like all other versions it is just a translation, ect. ect. However I am not to proud to admit I was wrong. All it took for me to see the light was to hear this inspirational number, The King James Bible. It is sung to perfection by two defrauding Godly men. I encourage you all to listen to this masterpiece and see the error of your ways: youtube.com/user/fireballbaptist#p/a/f/0/vUD8XOr-P2A
  21. I was stalking people I went to high school with on Facebook and found an old friend. She's my age and apparently went to Mid Western Bible College. She doesn't get on much so I can't glean much fundie-wise. She's married and has 2 little boys. I went to the MBC website and didn't get much except KJV ONLY!!!ELEVENTY!11!! Anyone heard of the place?
  22. Heads up...I haven't seen this yet, but I wanted to let you all know. Links not broken, these guys will not mind. From The Revealer (http://therevealer.org/) newsletter that I just got: So yeah, not yet online. But, here's an additional description from the Fallen From Grace blog: http://fallenfromgrace.net/2011/06/17/j ... -magazine/ I knew someone who went to the Roloff "girls' home" in 1978. She was more rebellious than her older sister, but not THAT rebellious. She told me she figured out how to work the system so she could get sprung faster...and she couldn't wait until she turned 18. But it was crap then and as we know, it's crap now.
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