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    • Curious

      Guest Speaker 1.26.17 @ 8pm eastern   01/22/2017

      I am pleased to announce that we have are going to have a Q&A with an ex-evangelical on Thurs, January 26, 2017 @ 8pm.  The Q&A will last for approximately 1 hour.  I will be setting up a subforum for guest speakers as I hope to be able to get some other folks come talk to us. Our guest on Thurs will be Chris Stroop.  Here is his bio: Christopher Stroop grew up a rank-and-file member of the Christian Right in an Evangelical enclave community, Stroop's childhood social milieu consisting mostly of family and people associated with church and/or Christian school. From about the age of 16, Stroop found himself dealing with an increasingly acute crisis of faith that was not addressed properly by the people he talked to about it, and he was subjected to spiritual abuse. Stroop nevertheless went on to earn a BA in history and German from Ball State University (summa cum laude) in 2003, and then a Ph.D. in modern Russian History and Interdisciplinary Studies in the Humanities from Stanford in 2012. Subsequently, Stroop spent three academic years teaching in the School of Public Policy at the Russian Presidential Academy of National Economy and Public Administration in Moscow, where he kind of sort of almost got in trouble for "teaching Pussy Riot lyrics." Currently, Stroop teaches nineteenth-century European history and Russian Studies classes as a Provost's Postdoctoral Scholar at the University of South Florida and, as a freelance writer and public speaker, speaks out against the abuses of conservative Christianity in general and the the white Evangelical subculture he comes from in particular. You can find many of his writings in this vein on Religion Dispatches. If you would like to support this work financially, please click here (for monthly support) or here (to leave a one-time gift). Stroop's more academic writings can mostly be found here, and you can follow him on Twitter - @C_Stroop.   We are going to use the Q&A forum format.  I will be setting up a special forum just for Chris.  I will open the forum about 15 minutes before the Q&A starts so you can start asking your questions.   We have a few rules.  Failure to follow these rules will get you temporarily placed in the Prayer Closet so we can preview your posts.  If you get put in the PC during the Q&A you will be released once it's over, but lets just follow the few simple rules so none of that is necessary. Rules for Q&A: 1. Be polite.  This is not an event meant for snark.  Chris is taking time out of his busy schedule to talk to us.  He is an expert in the things we discuss here, so let's give him respect, please. 2. One question per post.   Please don't bog him down with a bunch of questions in one post.  We are using the Q&A format so he can easily answer questions.  Putting a ton of questions in one post defeats the purpose.   You can continue discussion on the thread as he answers and ask another question in the same thread if you have one after he answers. 3. Please try to keep thread drift to a minimum during the Q&A.  After it's over, if you want to continue discussion on the topics  and they drift, that's fine. 4.  Be polite! These rules are subject to change as I and the helpmeets think over possible loopholes (cause there is always one person that has to push boundaries)
lilith

Picture of Duggar and Bontrager girls at ATi conference

132 posts in this topic

I came across this pic on the Bontrager family blog and thought people may be interested.

 

The Bontrager blog is mainly about PR for their singing and pretty shots of kids, so not particularly snarkworthy, but they endorse ATI, Vision Forum, Above Rubies, the Pearls and all the usual suspects.

 

.bontragersingers.blogspot.com.au/search?updated-max=2012-05-16T10:09:00-05:00&max-results=7

 

ETA- I am really bad with links, esp on iPad. It links to a page on their blog, you need to scroll down a little for ATI photos.

 

Edited to break link

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I couldn't find that picture.

m I the only one who sees a startling resemblance between the Bontrager girls' concert dresses and the playclothes that Maria made for the VonTrapp family singers out of her bedroom curtains?

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I see Jessa and Jinger haven't yet learned to lay off the self-tanner.

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I couldn't find that picture.

m I the only one who sees a startling resemblance between the Bontrager girls' concert dresses and the playclothes that Maria made for the VonTrapp family singers out of her bedroom curtains?

Itsba little more than halfway down the page.

Whoever dresses them has an unhealthy obsession with green

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Here's another link, I think it should work.

bontragersingers.blogspot.com.au/2012/05/txokar-april-trip.html

And here are the pictures with the Duggars *crossing my fingers that this will work*

IMG_0658.jpg

IMG_0663.jpg

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Here's another link, I think it should work.

bontragersingers.blogspot.com.au/2012/05/txokar-april-trip.html

And here are the pictures with the Duggars *crossing my fingers that this will work*

IMG_0658.jpg

IMG_0663.jpg

Thank you, breaking my crappy link now

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Matching outfits on siblings over the age of ten looks tacky. That being said, I've watched some of the Bontragers' performances on YouTube and I like their music.

Historical trivia... The four daughters of Russia's Tsar Nicholas II always wore matching dresses, even when they were in their late teens and early twenties.

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IMG_0658.jpg

Is that Joy in the middle with her hair pinned up?

ARGH, NO WRONG PICTURE. The one where they're standing lined up. That's the one I was trying to quote.

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IMG_0663.jpg

This is the one I meant.

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That is Joy with her hair pinned up! I like the style.

Jinger looks....off. Like she's not had enough sleep and/or is sick. Her smile looks incredibly forced.

Left to right the Duggar girls are Jana, Jill, Joy, Jessa and Jinger, yes? The girl in the white blouse in the middle is not a Duggar girl. Jessa Blessa has a rather trendy outfit for a Duggar!

I don't mind the Bontragers' outfits individually, but together it's a bit much.

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So who wants to guess why JD has 2 iPhones attached to his hip? He's either THAT important or he's holding lazy ol' Smuggar's for him.

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So who wants to guess why JD has 2 iPhones attached to his hip? He's either THAT important or he's holding lazy ol' Smuggar's for him.

Maybe someone went and got theirs confiscated. :naughty:

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Jinjer's hair looks terrible in that picture.

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Jinjer's hair looks terrible in that picture.

If I recall rightly, Jinger has naturally curly hair. I reeeally wish she'd ditch the crispy ramen look and discover coconut oil.

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Jinger doesn't have naturally curly hair. I just watched the old On the Road special this morning and her hair didn't even hold the "Little House" overnight braiding that the girls were doing before the perms. I think Jinger is perming and putting pomade on it for shine. I remember seeing a pic during the Santorum campaign when she'd straightened it (the flatiron and the 2" barrel curling iron seem to be their devices of choice these days) and she looked just awful.

Jessa is the only one who has naturally curly hair and Joy got the thick gene from her dad. And right now, she really looks like Josiah facially now that she's lost her baby fat (and is in need of a looser shirt...holy boobies, Batman).

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Am I the only one who gets really confused by the Gothard rules about women's hair? Why do so many of them wear it down, when it's obviously not absolutely verboten to put it up?

Traditionally, young girls Joy's age wore their hair down. The only other women who wore their long hair uncovered were prostitutes. Gothard's supposed to be all about traditional roles so what gives? There's a great 19th century cartoon called "The Courtesan and the Drab" or something similar where the expensive courtesan is dressed as a respectable, upper-class lady riding through the park with tucked up hair and a form-fitting habit and the pox-ridden, cheap prostitute is standing in the mud dressed exactly like the Duggar women with awkward-length skirt, ratty untucked jacket and long, loose curls.

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Am I the only one who gets really confused by the Gothard rules about women's hair? Why do so many of them wear it down, when it's obviously not absolutely verboten to put it up?

Traditionally, young girls Joy's age wore their hair down. The only other women who wore their long hair uncovered were prostitutes. Gothard's supposed to be all about traditional roles so what gives? There's a great 19th century cartoon called "The Courtesan and the Drab" or something similar where the expensive courtesan is dressed as a respectable, upper-class lady riding through the park with tucked up hair and a form-fitting habit and the pox-ridden, cheap prostitute is standing in the mud dressed exactly like the Duggar women with awkward-length skirt, ratty untucked jacket and long, loose curls.

Long, loose hair is probably seen as more feminine. It's also more restrictive imo.

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Am I the only one who gets really confused by the Gothard rules about women's hair? Why do so many of them wear it down, when it's obviously not absolutely verboten to put it up?

But Daddy likes it long! (That's what she said?)

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Gothard likes wavy hair. Not straight hair. Not curly hair. Wavy. It is supposed to look nicer (in his opinion) than straight or curly and people will look at the countenance of the girl instead of her body. So wearing hair long, down, and in waves is encouraged. Joy needs to be sent to the prayer closet!

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I wince when I see them cooking with their long hair loose.

I have long hair, and even though I tie it back to cook the occasional hair makes it into the dish. I can't imagine how much of theirs must be in the meals they make.

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Gothard likes wavy hair. Not straight hair. Not curly hair. Wavy. It is supposed to look nicer (in his opinion) than straight or curly and people will look at the countenance of the girl instead of her body. So wearing hair long, down, and in waves is encouraged. Joy needs to be sent to the prayer closet!

But iz not trad-ish-on-al! I haz confuz! Do I follow cult leader or tradishonz?

But Daddy likes it long! (That's what she said?)

Long, loose hair is probably seen as more feminine. It's also more restrictive imo.

Those are really good explanations. But man, they all really, really put me in mind of that prostitute in the print whenever I see those 'made' waves.

*NB - I don't think normal women with long hair, even if they're wearing skirts, look like prostitutes. It's just the combination of the Gothard uniform of artificial, loose waves, plus ratty untucked shirt plus ankle-revealing skirt that looks exactly like the picture I'm thinking of. I wish I had the book here so I could scan it for you. Imagine an 1870s Jessa, Jana or Jinger standing on a corner in the rain and sticking one foot out while a gentlemen with muttonchops stares at her boot all like, "Hello, I could get me a piece of that sexy ankle!"

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It looks like John David is explaining something, and he has all the attention of the other boys at the table. He's so quiet on TV, but I bet he's more outgoing when the cameras aren't around.

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Jana looks downright miserable in both photos.

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