Willis Family 3: Toby Is Evil

[DaisyD]

From here:

 

[feministxtian]

Re: Shelters...they suck. The kids and I made it about a week in one. We all got food poisoning. You had to be out of the shelter between 8am and 6pm. There was no way to have any food stored there, we got restaurant leftovers that were not properly stored. We didn't "qualify" for the nice DV shelter since I didn't file a police report so the shitty homeless shelter is where we ended up. There was no help for anything other than applying for welfare (which I was rejected for since I was getting child support from my oldest 2 kids' father) and getting on a list for some shitty apartments. Yeah...no. 

[ChickenettiLuvr]

I'm up very much too late for my dog's bedtime but was trying to catch up on the new Jessica Willis threads.

I'm only on page 17 on part 2 but I must stop to ask you, dear @Hisey --

At the bottom of a post you mention about bad childhoods ... And that Toby's childhood was horrific.

If that was your personal statement, may I ask why you believe that ? (If I'm just reading incorrectly or loopy, please forgive & ignore.) Thanks.

Edited April 17, 2018 by ChickenettiLuvr
Sleepy riffles

[laPapessaGiovanna]

From FJ Guidelines: unless a victim or survivor has put their identity into the public sphere as a victim of a sexual assault, do not speculate on whether they may be a victim.

A reminder that all we know is that some of the Willis kids were sexually and physically abused by their father, except for Jessica we don't know who was and who wasn't. We akso don't know about Toby and Brenda. Alleging any of them was sexually abused is therefore to be considered speculation and as such it is prohibited by our rules.

[Jaeniduggar]

I read this article, where in my eyes 2 more victims clearly identified themselves, not sure about the third: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-5336675/American-von-Trapp-family-reveals-horror-rapist-father.html

Please feel free to delete if this goes against the guidelines!!

Spoiler

Quote

In fact Willis' control was so complete that each daughter thought she was the only one being abused. In a bitter irony, they now admit, they didn't speak up for fear of destroying the family.

Jasmine, 16, said: 'What held me back from talking all those years was the unknown. I didn't know what was going to happen. Everything that I had as a kid could have been taken away instantly…all my siblings. I had no idea if I was going to [still] have that if I spoke.

'I had no idea what was going on. I didn't know if I was gonna have my mom and my siblings there for me on the other side. I didn't know if there could be another side. I had no idea and that was a huge thing that I had to deal with and I was battling with that.'

Quote

According to Jeanette, 'You can view yourself as a victim or you can view yourself as a survivor. I choose to view myself as a survivor and go forward to live a beautiful life after all of this.'

 

 

[laPapessaGiovanna]

26 minutes ago, Jaeniduggar said:

I read this article, where in my eyes 2 more victims clearly identified themselves, not sure about the third: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-5336675/American-von-Trapp-family-reveals-horror-rapist-father.html

Please feel free to delete if this goes against the guidelines!!

  Hide contents

 

 

It's fine. It's in their own words.

[Lurky]

Please can we have the thread title changed @DaisyD @laPapessaGiovanna @Fascinated?   I know it's what was happening in the last thread, but to me, having this kind of title is taking the blame off Toby Willis, the convicted child rapist, and onto his wife.

I know this is a really common occurrence - that a husband/father commits unbelievably awful crimes, and the focus shifts from blaming him to deciding the wife/mother bears as much of the blame as he does - and I fucking hate this.  If someone is reading this, who's a victim of domestic abuse, or worries that their partner is abusing their kids, they should not have to be worry about being judged as an equal partner in the crime - and it acts as a barrier for people to try to get help.

The criminal here is TOBY WILLIS.  TOBY WILLIS is the rapist, the man beating his 20 year old daughter, the man threatening to murder his children.  We are talking about a blog Jessica specifically wrote about her own experiences, and it is unfair on Jessica as well as Brenda, to comb through this blog looking to blame Brenda, when it's not something Jessica has even suggested.    And as keeps getting mentioned, a thorough investigation was carried out here, and the police chose not to charge Brenda, social services decided she was not a threat to her children, while TOBY WILLIS 100% was. 

And co-signing what @Fascinated said on the penultimate page of the last thread.  I don't want to quote it directly, as I don't want it to look like I'm blaming Jessica at all either [ETA as I don't think Fascinated is doing either, I should stress], but this case is one where TOBY WILLIS clearly had the family controlled and terrified.  It is 100% his choice, his fault, and that should not be forgotten.

 

 

Edited April 17, 2018 by Lurky
Sorry, I have a lot of feelings about this, and am not expressing myself well

[DaisyD]

We'll get it changed. I was irritated at direction things were going. Clearly my attempt at smart-ass was a miss. I just need to come up with something else.

[Lurky]

Thanks so much, @DaisyD  - I appreciate it.

[livinginthelight]

Perfect new title.

Sometimes the line between good and evil seems blurred. But we can safely call Toby evil, IMO. My heart goes out to this entire family.

In a much smaller way, I have been in several #metoo situations where I felt all kinds of pressure to not speak up. Situations where I and others now are kind of dumbfounded when I talk about them. Like, why didn't I tell? Why did I put up with that? It truly boggles my mind. In one situation, I was even offered an opportunity to tell.. on a silver platter. I covered up. 

I get it. I was only operating on what I could do then, with the emotional tools that I had. And there were no threats to life or physical safety in my situations. I have compassion for all of them.

Edited April 17, 2018 by livinginthelight

[FleeJanaFree]

I'm catching up on what to me is a brand new family. I read Jessica's blog, which was vague. When did the rapes actually start? Sound like molestation was part of her first memories, so probably all of her life. Was she actually raped at ages 3 or 9? 3 seems so physically impossible ( though i know it is possible.) I'm just reading conflicting comments on here; were the police reports or court documents more clear? Did the mom literally know she was being raped, or suspect something was off?

[Alicja]

2 hours ago, FleeJanaFree said:

I'm catching up on what to me is a brand new family. I read Jessica's blog, which was vague. When did the rapes actually start? Sound like molestation was part of her first memories, so probably all of her life. Was she actually raped at ages 3 or 9? 3 seems so physically impossible ( though i know it is possible.) I'm just reading conflicting comments on here; were the police reports or court documents more clear? Did the mom literally know she was being raped, or suspect something was off?

The abuse started at 3. Not sure when exactly the rape started but I don't think we really need to know that. According to the blog post, Brenda approached Jessica at age 9 because she was suspicious of Toby's behavior. Toby denied everything and I'm sure Jessica didn't have the language to talk about what was happening, leading to Brenda letting it go, while still remaining suspicious. As time went on Toby started abusing the other girls which Brenda knew about, but how much she knew seems to be unclear.

[Eternalbluepearl]

2 hours ago, FleeJanaFree said:

When did the rapes actually start? Sound like molestation was part of her first memories, so probably all of her life. Was she actually raped at ages 3 or 9? 3 seems so physically impossible ( though i know it is possible.) 

I'm sorry but Jessica doesn't have to answer these very specific questions to anyone but the Police investigating her abuse. The parts she did share were incredibly brave. 

[neurogirl]

Jessica definitely does not have to answer but rape can include any type of penetration and I hate that I even had to write that word. Molestation is horrible enough and all we need to know is that Toby is evil.

[wild little fox]

What Toby did to Jessica when she was 3 does not necessarily mean rape. He was not charged for crimes in those years, so we have no way of knowing. There are many layers of inappropriate behavior(s) and or grooming behavior(s) that are/can be as damaging that she might be referring to.  

This is squicking me out even being this vague. 

[colacanth]

15 hours ago, ChickenettiLuvr said:

I'm up very much too late for my dog's bedtime but was trying to catch up on the new Jessica Willis threads.

I'm only on page 17 on part 2 but I must stop to ask you, dear @Hisey --

At the bottom of a post you mention about bad childhoods ... And that Toby's childhood was horrific.

If that was your personal statement, may I ask why you believe that ? (If I'm just reading incorrectly or loopy, please forgive & ignore.) Thanks.

Not that poster, but I'm guessing they're referring to the fact that most of Toby's siblings were killed and parents severely injured in a accident, which started an investigation that eventually led the governor of Illinois going to jail for corruption (the truck driver that caused the accident acquired his license through a bribe)

No excuse for his behavior though, other than I might expect his parents (also very religious) to have possibly also used a belt on him. 

[Gobsmacked]

Not knowing anything about Toby's parents/ childhood other than the horrific loss of six siblings, i feel sorry for his parents. They lost six children in horrific circumstances, now one of their remaining three has been discovered to be a monster. 

[justmy2cents]

While the accident and loss of his siblings was horrific it did not happen in Toby's childhood. He was already married, and if I'm not mistaken a father to several children by this point. It's definitely not an excuse for how he conducted himself. 

[Jana814]

3 minutes ago, justmy2cents said:

While the accident and loss of his siblings was horrific it did not happen in Toby's childhood. He was already married, and if I'm not mistaken a father to several children by this point. It's definitely not an excuse for how he conducted himself. 

He did have a few kids. Not sure how many though. 

[JermajestyDuggar]

1 hour ago, Gobsmacked said:

Not knowing anything about Toby's parents/ childhood other than the horrific loss of six siblings, i feel sorry for his parents. They lost six children in horrific circumstances, now one of their remaining three has been discovered to be a monster. 

I really wonder about their current relationship with Brenda and the kids. We saw what happened with the Smiths. They don't see their Smorton grandchildren anymore because they took Alan's side. I wonder if anything like that is happening with Scott Willis and wife.

Here is a link talking about the accident if you are curious. I believe Brenda was pregnant with their third at the time of the accident. 

https://www.google.com/amp/www.chicagotribune.com/news/opinion/editorials/ct-willis-children-ryan-illinois-corruption-edit-1107-jm-20141106-story,amp.html

[Briefly]

I read the article you linked.  That is awful, just a horrible thing to happen.

I'm not familiar with the Toby story, I have not looked up that thread and probably won't because it sounds very traumatic, but he is a monster, as someone said. There is no other word for it.

[Hisey]

It seems the accident happened when Jessica was 2.

[FleeJanaFree]

Eternalbluepearl I wasn't knocking on Jessica (I'm sorry you got that impression), I'd be vague too. She's been incredibly brave.  I was however very confused because I saw a commenter in this thread (don't know how far back) referring to her being raped at age three. Others were saying molestation. Both are terrible, but there is a difference. I was only looking for clarification to a new story I'm unfamiliar with. I'm a stickler for facts with legal stories, hard habit to break after my previous career. You're right though, it's enough that we know what we do- that man is evil.

as far as I know, Jessica is not  on this board, she certainly doesn't have to answer to me or any stranger. (Jessica, if you are here, I wish you the best! Enjoy your husband, new freedoms, and hopefully a sincere feeling of safety.)

[DaisyD]

Toby Wllis was charged and convicted of rape. At some point that happened. At which point it happened is unclear, and that's not for us to figure out. The people who needed that information got it and were successful in prosecuting it. As far as we're concerned the who, when, where, et al. is none of our business unless the person who's story it is decidesto share it. I understand the curiosity. Let's keep it in our own lane shall we?

[ChickenettiLuvr]

Thank you for responding, @colacanth.