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@Pretzel Jessica seems to have a new boyfriend. He appears to be a police officer, her instagram is full of photos of him/her and car selfies. 

 

 

 

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I sweartogod that I hate myself for being so shallow, but man---I wish my butt looked like hers.

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4 hours ago, Pretzel said:

@Carm_88 Isn't that the same boyfriend just with a different haircut? lol :pb_lol:

Could be! Hahaha! 

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On 3/22/2018 at 12:50 PM, singsingsing said:

And whose fault is that, really? The woman who had to give him up? Or the societal system that abused, oppressed, and punished her, and left her so traumatized that the idea of communicating with the child she had to relinquish is unthinkable for her?

I can’t imagine the rejection that kid must feel. I have two adopted teen girls. Their self esteem is slready fragile because they were “given up” for adoption. If they searched for their  birthmother and were lucky enough to find her, they would be devastated—absolutely devastated—if their birthmother refused to talk to them. I cant even imagine how much that would hurt them. 

OP’s mom is not in Ireland any more. She is hurting her own child in order to spare her own feelings. That’s not what good mothers do. 

I dont care whether it was society, the church, or patriarchy that was at fault for the adoption. It is always wrong to hurt your own child. 

Jeez, she could write a note at the very least. That poor guy must feel so rejected. 

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On March 17, 2018 at 10:07 AM, Toothfairy said:

This is what my own adopted kids feel and what some other adoptees feel. Their birth mom didn't want to parent them. She didn't want them. It's what some adoptees feel including  what some of my adopted kids feel. 

That's so sad they feel that way.  My Mom told me my birth mom  loved me and wanted what was best for me staying with her wasn't it .  Lot's of adopted kids grow up with abandonment issues .  Don't make it worse.  Not saying you are, just generalizing.:my_heart:

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On 3/22/2018 at 4:27 PM, Four is Enough said:

Bolding mine. The point you are missing here, @Ivycoveredtower, is that the adoptee's birth mother may have been as much of a    victim.. She may have been raped, as stated before, or she may have had an indiscretion, which happens, but during the time of her pregnancy, she was shamed, called a whore, taunted, told she was no good, told no"decent" man would have her, and those months of trauma  have probably stayed with her  for her entire life. Small wonder she would not want to be reminded of that time.. perhaps she does not want to display her "shame" or at least her discomfort, in front of the adoptee.. It is sad to think, but  not every adoption story has the happy reunification ending.

You dont know that any of those things have happened. You are just making stuff up that might have happened. In any event, women have gone through worse and still chosen to spare their children pain. This lady is putting her own feelings of shame ahead of her son’s feelings. She sounds very narcissistic. 

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After a bad break-up, and although my name is common, I used this: http://abine.com/deleteme/ to get my name of most databases.  I believe I paid for their services for an annual cycle or two.  I let it drop, but I rarely see my name pop up where it shouldn't and my spam email is def lessened.
As front hugs said: Remove yourself people!
 
I recommend this as well. I invested in it after being stalked, and it's well worth it. It can also help prevent people from learning enough to steal your identity.
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:pb_lol:

Nope, Jessica and the guy she was practically begging to propose for, like, two years recently broke it off and (as far as I can tell from a quick browse of her Instagram account) she has since deleted every trace that he ever existed from her social media. The cop showed up on the scene soon thereafter, about four weeks ago.

 

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15 minutes ago, Hisey said:

You dont know that any of those things have happened. You are just making stuff up that might have happened. In any event, women have gone through worse and still chosen to spare their children pain. This lady is putting her own feelings of shame ahead of her son’s feelings. She sounds very narcissistic. 

As are you. You have no idea what this woman may have gone through, or may still be going through, so how about reserving judgement? You can have compassion for her child's broken heart without needing to point the finger of blame in her face. I get that everyone wants a villain to blame, but you know what? Sometimes life is unfair and cruel and heartbreaking, and it may be that this woman is a narcissistic, unkind person, or it may be that she's a victim who suffered just as much at the hands of society as her child did. And she may be all of that at once. Or none of it. Her child can decide how he feels about her. You don't get to be the arbiter of how biological parents get to feel and react to the sudden reappearance of a child they thought was gone from their lives forever.

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10 minutes ago, Hisey said:

You dont know that any of those things have happened. You are just making stuff up that might have happened. In any event, women have gone through worse and still chosen to spare their children pain. This lady is putting her own feelings of shame ahead of her son’s feelings. She sounds very narcissistic. 

If it were all sunlight and roses, my guess is that she would talk to her son.  Her silence to me means that she is sparing pain--maybe her own, yes, but maybe for her son as well. I agree that it would be very nice if the mom could pass on some basic details. If I were the son, I think I would want to know medical stuff, at least.

From my own experience, I found out as an adult that I started out as an unwanted child.  I was born into a very Catholic family who had a lot of kids---5 children under the age of 5.  My very Catholic mother tried to get birth control pills from her very Catholic doctor, who refused (obviously, this was some time ago . . .) By the time she went to a new doctor, very shortly after haven given birth to yet another baby, she was already pregnant with me.  She was very unhappy about it. In the end, it turned out that she kind of liked me :) , so yea for that, but could I have gone the rest of my life not knowing about this? Yes, as a matter of fact, I could have.  It was not something I needed to know.

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My (soon-to-be former) daughter-in-law and her sister were both adopted. Her sister has no interest in searching for her birth parents but my DIL found hers when she turned 18. She and her birth mum formed an instant bond, no doubt in part because they look startlingly alike and have the same mannerisms, to the point that it is uncanny. This helped my DIL feel like she knew where she came from.  I am very happy for her but in her case I actually feel sorry for her mum (her adopted mum).  My DIL had her birth mum as her matron of honour at her and my son’s wedding and her birth mum gave a lovely speech thanking the parents for raising her. (These pronouns get confusing, sorry.) I cried then when my DIL’s mum stepped up and said, ‘we owe each other everything’. It was so beautiful. Then birth mum ruined it by saying, as she walked away from the mic, ‘I made that!’, pointing to my DIL.

Well, that’s just an anecdote of a happy reunion. It has worked out well, although I continue to feel bad for her mum. My DIL chose her birth mum to be with her in the hospital while she delivered their second baby, while mum stayed home to look after their older daughter. (We offered to do that, but DIL declined.)

I guess my point is that adoption is hard on everyone involved and I sometimes think we forget about the pain adoptive parents also go through. 

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47 minutes ago, Hisey said:

You dont know that any of those things have happened. You are just making stuff up that might have happened. In any event, women have gone through worse and still chosen to spare their children pain. This lady is putting her own feelings of shame ahead of her son’s feelings. She sounds very narcissistic. 

It may not have happened to the  person referenced in the original story, but all of what I said has happened to birth mothers, apparently the world over, who are shamed into relinquishing their parental rights for whatever reason.

So many of us FJ'ers have reported things that have happened to us during our teens/ early 20s.. that have stayed with us, causing us problems, causing us to lag behind in things we may have wanted to do, causing us to have bad feelings of inadequacy or shame.. I can have compassion for a woman who, for whatever reason, may not want to face this issue from her past. Not everyone is a rock of stability. Not everyone can take stuff in stride. It is difficult for the adopted child to find that the parent doesn't want contact, yes, but it happens, and that is the parent's right, as it is the adoptee's to refuse contact when a parent searches. That also happens

 

 

ETA "her son's feelings:... by the very act of signing away her parental rights, willingly or no, he became someone else's son.. perhaps she was able to put that behind her in a clear way and didn't want to resurrect any of that.

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4 minutes ago, Fascinated said:

My (soon-to-be former) daughter-in-law and her sister were both adopted. Her sister has no interest in searching for her birth parents but my DIL found hers when she turned 18. She and her birth mum formed an instant bond, no doubt in part because they look startlingly alike and have the same mannerisms, to the point that it is uncanny. This helped my DIL feel like she knew where she came from.  I am very happy for her but in her case I actually feel sorry for her mum (her adopted mum).  My DIL had her birth mum as her matron of honour at her and my son’s wedding and her birth mum gave a lovely speech thanking the parents for raising her. (These pronouns get confusing, sorry.) I cried then when my DIL’s mum stepped up and said, ‘we owe each other everything’. It was so beautiful. Then birth mum ruined it by saying, as she walked away from the mic, ‘I made that!’, pointing to my DIL.

Well, that’s just an anecdote of a happy reunion. It has worked out well, although I continue to feel bad for her mum. My DIL chose her birth mum to be with her in the hospital while she delivered their second baby, while mum stayed home to look after their older daughter. (We offered to do that, but DIL declined.)

I guess my point is that adoption is hard on everyone involved and I sometimes think we forget about the pain adoptive parents also go through. 

Adoption can be a great thing and it takes a strong person to do it.  you bring up a great point about adoptive parents. I know personally I would never be strong enough to be an adoptive mother for the very reason's you bring up I wouldn't want to fear my child finding their birth parents and being close to them and sharing those moments. 

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57 minutes ago, Hisey said:

You dont know that any of those things have happened. You are just making stuff up that might have happened. In any event, women have gone through worse and still chosen to spare their children pain. This lady is putting her own feelings of shame ahead of her son’s feelings. She sounds very narcissistic. 

You don't know anything about this woman. So you are making up that she is a narcissist. It's quite rude to assume you know everything about a person because they made a choice that is best for them. She signed away her parental rights, his Mom is the woman who raised him. She made the choice to not be his Mom. It may have been the best thing that she could do for him. You don't know her story and you don't know what pain could potentially be lurking. 

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42 minutes ago, JillyO said:

:pb_lol:

Nope, Jessica and the guy she was practically begging to propose for, like, two years recently broke it off and (as far as I can tell from a quick browse of her Instagram account) she has since deleted every trace that he ever existed from her social media. The cop showed up on the scene soon thereafter, about four weeks ago.

 

Every time I see her name mentioned,  I think of her dumbass facebook post about "no way am I getting a vaccine! 

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7 minutes ago, HarleyQuinn said:

Every time I see her name mentioned,  I think of her dumbass facebook post about "no way am I getting a vaccine! 

She's also a major Trumpie and now that she's dating a cop, she's posted a few things about the police that are very eyeroll-inducing. 

I want to be a bit proud of her for bucking a lot of the super-conservative stuff her family seems to be into, but she's just such an asshole. She's like a cinnamon roll filled with ranch sauce instead of icing: looks great, you get all excited...then you take a bite and it's all wrong. 

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1 hour ago, Hisey said:

You dont know that any of those things have happened. You are just making stuff up that might have happened. In any event, women have gone through worse and still chosen to spare their children pain. This lady is putting her own feelings of shame ahead of her son’s feelings. She sounds very narcissistic. 

So here's a story that did happen to close family of mine. A newborn boy was adopted by a family who had biological daughters about 65 years ago. All they knew was that his bio mom was a teen who couldn't care for him. Years later his adoptive sister was living in a small town and new neighbors moved in who bore a striking resemblance to her adopted brother. She gets to know them and eventually finds out the story of her brother's birth. His mom was 15 years old when she got pregnant by her father who repeatedly raped and beat her during her childhood. Abortion wasn't possible. She was forced to bear the child, made to give him up and was forced to return home to live with her father until she grew old enough to get out. Her entire life was a mess because of the trauma she endured so she wanted nothing to do with knowing about her son. A family decision was made not to tell him about what his sister had learned. He had never expressed an interest in his biological family  but if he had, what would it have accomplished to tell him that his grandfather raped his mom and that he was the product of incest?

Sometimes stories just shouldn't be shared as the pain of knowing may be worse than the pain of not knowing. And to blame the bio mother for hurting her child in cases like these is incredibly unfeeling as both mom and child are equal victims.

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9 hours ago, Carm_88 said:

@Pretzel Jessica seems to have a new boyfriend. He appears to be a police officer, her instagram is full of photos of him/her and car selfies. 

 

 

 

She is the selfie queen for sure!

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@Jessesgirl, thank you for telling your story and hanging in there for more reasoned responses.  I am glad you are in contact with and sympathetic to your half brother.  I'm sure he values that relationship beyond belief.  And for your empathy and understanding for your mother's experiences.  I hope he can reach a similar understanding.

@Satan'sFortress.  Fantastic posts on the subject.  Thank you.

Also thanks to everyone else who has posted about the situations of unwed mothers during the Baby Scoop Era, especially in Ireland, and preached compassion and understanding.

Adult adopted child here - adopted 1955.  I've posted this story before so I won't repeat it in depth.  All I will say is that I started to search for my birth mother and stopped.  Not all adoptees even feel the need to search.  

I'd encourage all adult adoptee searchers to seek therapy before they search to explore their reasons for doing so, to consider the effect on their birth mother, to prepare themselves for rejection, and to seek guidance in how to approach their birth family if they ever find them.  Oh.  And how to deal with their adoptive family who may have major problems with the search.

The reason I started a search was partly to try to find out medical information - but also a need to tell my birth mother that I was OK and that I hoped she was too. 

I stopped searching when I discovered that the only two candidates to be my birth mother were 13 and 15 in 1955. I left a letter in a repository so that she can find it if she ever looks for me.

I decided, there and then that her rights to privacy in a closed adoption, she was originally promised confidentiality, outweighed my all my rights to knowledge, even though UK law changed in 1976 to allow me access to my adoption file and to search.   It was my decision to let it go and I am fine with it. 

That doesn't mean that I agree that adopted children do not have rights to this information.  Adopted children do have the right to know about their birth parents.  Adopted children's rights have been screwed by the system.

On 3/22/2018 at 3:27 PM, allthegoodnamesrgone said:

 And unfortunately her son needs to realize that, it isn't him that is the issue, but he's not really the victim here, his mother is.

Bullshit.  They are both victims.  I have compassion for her but also for him.   They both have pain.  I don't shame either of them.  I see the pain.

Adoption always represents loss for one or more of the adoption triad.  Have some respect for the fact that his rights to knowledge about his heritage and his medical information have been screwed.  He also has to deal with his birth mother's rejection and the knowledge that his birth was so traumatic for her that she can't even talk to him.  Sheesh, of course he is a victim.

2 hours ago, Hisey said:

I can’t imagine the rejection that kid must feel. I have two adopted teen girls. Their self esteem is slready fragile because they were “given up” for adoption. If they searched for their  birthmother and were lucky enough to find her, they would be devastated—absolutely devastated—if their birthmother refused to talk to them. I cant even imagine how much that would hurt them. 

OP’s mom is not in Ireland any more. She is hurting her own child in order to spare her own feelings. That’s not what good mothers do. 

I dont care whether it was society, the church, or patriarchy that was at fault for the adoption. It is always wrong to hurt your own child. 

Jeez, she could write a note at the very least. That poor guy must feel so rejected. 

Honestly, your first post response to @Jessesgirl was brutal but I took it as ignorance about the position of unwed mothers in Ireland in the 70s.  Your second post doubled down on the nastiness.  And this one fills me with horror.

As the parent of adopted children, who may (not will) want to search in the future, and may (not will) be rejected, I suggest that you look into the valid reasons a birth mother might not want to reunite with a child.  Many of them have been explained above.

Exploring some of those reasons with them might help soften the blow.  Telling an adopted child that their birth mother (their blood relative) is ipso facto a horrible person will even further damage their self esteem. They will fear their heritage from such a bad mother. Believe me. 

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1 hour ago, Playagirl said:

So here's a story that did happen to close family of mine. A newborn boy was adopted by a family who had biological daughters about 65 years ago. All they knew was that his bio mom was a teen who couldn't care for him. Years later his adoptive sister was living in a small town and new neighbors moved in who bore a striking resemblance to her adopted brother. She gets to know them and eventually finds out the story of her brother's birth. His mom was 15 years old when she got pregnant by her father who repeatedly raped and beat her during her childhood. Abortion wasn't possible. She was forced to bear the child, made to give him up and was forced to return home to live with her father until she grew old enough to get out. Her entire life was a mess because of the trauma she endured so she wanted nothing to do with knowing about her son. A family decision was made not to tell him about what his sister had learned. He had never expressed an interest in his biological family  but if he had, what would it have accomplished to tell him that his grandfather raped his mom and that he was the product of incest?

Sometimes stories just shouldn't be shared as the pain of knowing may be worse than the pain of not knowing. And to blame the bio mother for hurting her child in cases like these is incredibly unfeeling as both mom and child are equal victims.

I agree with you one hundred percent.In cases of a traumatic rape and incest.These stories should remain secret.As you said so well,it could be worse to really know rather than not knowing.

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17 hours ago, Don'tlikekoolaid said:

@Palimpsest If I could give you a hundred loves for that post I would.

@Palimpsest I've also told my story before, and as someone who's been touched by adoption in 1960's Ireland, I'd like to thank you too, for expressing what I want to, but am too upset by this conversation to do.

Understanding the theocracy type government that led our country for far too many years is key in this, as is understanding the state of fear many people lived in because of this.

One of the saddest things is... The world and his mother knew what was going on in those mother and baby homes and about the illegality of many of those adoptions.

It really is little wonder that so many mothers and children are still traumatised to this day

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Unfortunately, my original post was deleted so I’m going to try this again...

I finally had a chance to catch up on this thread and read all the follow up comments since I posted my story.  I truly appreciate that so many of you have been so open minded and respectful  about my moms decisions and the reasons why she might not want to have a relationship with her biological son. Honestly, I don’t know exactly why she doesn’t or the circumstances surrounding how she got pregnant. I just know it’s an extremely painful part of her life she doesn’t want to talk about. She left Ireland with my dad shortly after giving my brother up for adoption and didn’t return to Ireland for almost 20 years!! I do know she went to see a therapist around the time my brother found my sis and I. So that tells me it was traumatic for her to know he had contacted my sis and I and was attempting to get to her.  

Clearly her actions have hit a nerve with some people who are only looking at adoption from the perspective of the adoptee.  When it comes to determining the rights of adoptees and biological moms, it’s an incredibly delicate and complex issue. I empathize with my brother and wish things were different for him. I do think adoptees should have access to basic information about themselves. However, I’m wondering if it’s reasonable or fair for adoptees to feel entitled to a relationship with biological parents. I’m also wondering how far adoptees should go in pursuing these relationships and looking for information. I think if biological moms and families don’t want to be found, adoptees need to back off and respect this. 

@Palimpsest thank you for the great post. I appreciate you sharing your story and your awesome advice for people in your position who are thinking of looking for their biological families. I think if my brother had done some of those things, he may have been better prepared for the outcome he had to face. 

@Hisey I’m pretty disgusted with you and your negativity at this point. You have extreme tunnel vision and I think it’s sad that you are so close minded and can’t see this issue from the birth moms point of view . If the birth moms of your girls don’t want a relationship with them are you going to bash them too?!  Why do you think biological moms owe their biological kids something after being  put up for adoption? Isn’t it enough that they are being selfless enough to give away their baby to someone who desperately wants kids because they aren’t in a position to take care of it the way they want to? Do you have any idea how painful that must be for someone to do? you also continue to refer to my brother as my moms son. This is incorrect! My brothers mom is the adoptive mom who raised him. My mom is the biological mom who gave him up for adoption. As someone who adopted two girls you should understand this! Don’t you want your girls to think of you as their mom?! Furthermore, you mentioned that your girls feel insecure about being adopted. What are you doing to help them accept that they have been adopted and gain confidence.? Are you preparing for them for all possible outcomes if they try to contact their biological moms? Hopefully for their sake, you will listen to some of the wise people who have posted here and have experience with adoption . Hopefully you’re not an asshole in real life too. 

Anyway, sorry this post is so long. Thanks for allowing me to vent and meaningfully contribute to this discussion. Xoxo 

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@JessesgirlI’ve been following along, but haven’t commented much because I don’t have direct experience with adoption. I think you’ve done a wonderful job in your posts here and you’ve done a fantastic job trying to see both your mother’s and your brother’s points of view. I feel very much for your brother, but I also feel very much for your mother as well - I can’t imagine this experience has been easy for her, but it’s wonderful that she has been supportive of the relationship you and your sister have with your brother. I hope that time brings her and your brother whatever peace and healing they both may need.

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