Joy and Austin 16: Touring the Texas Rodeo

[neurogirl]

I am a young adult making 30k in California. I consider myself not wealthy, but comfortable due to current life circumstances, and that my fiance and I are incredibly privileged as to come from upper middle-class (and in my fiance's case) or wealthy backgrounds. Here's my take on the divisions.

To me, being comfortably middle class (me) is not worrying about affording food or rent, but having to budget carefully for said food or rent. Being able to go out to eat 1-2x a week. Doing a bigger thing a few times a year but at the entry level (like cheap seats for a concert/show). Saving a little every month. Having to REALLY budget for things like plane tickets. Not having a gym membership but able to spend money on running shoes and a few races a year. I live in an apartment with roommates, have a data plan and a car. I'm also super fortunate in that my parents paid for half of my private college education, and the rest was covered by scholarships so I have no loans. Now obviously I have a safety net in that my parents would be able to bail me out. But for the most part I'm on my own and feel comfortably middle class. IF I were supporting a family, I might not feel this way!!!!

Being wealthy (my fiance's family) is putting 4 kids through private grade school, high school, and college (though for college the children have some loans). A historic home outside a city. International trips every few years. Wearing exclusively JCrew/Banana Republic/Gap. Lots of fancy electronics. Owning some old paintings or having an expensive hobby. Still not "afford whatever they want" wealthy, but definitely having a lot left over for the finer things, and a bunch in savings.

My parents have transitioned during their lives, as many people do, from poor to comfortable to upper middle-class/wealthy. My dad grew up as one of five kids in a trailer park. I (an only child) grew up in townhouses for half my childhood until my parents owned their first home. I went to public school, but lived in a nice area. My parents used their cars until they couldn't go anymore. Almost all of our vacations were to visit relatives. Now my parents have 3 cars (one for fun) and own a lake RV with relatives.  They vacation to see me once a year, and elsewhere only when my dad travels for work, but do travel domestically a few times a year, and internationally 1x/5 years or so. They live in a suburban home they had custom built, but isn't a mcmansion. They have gym memberships and hobbies that require some money, like biking and gardening. They are able to pay for a large portion of my upcoming wedding because they've saved. They are saving a lot for retirement. 

Relative wealth is so so varied. My fiance and I have very different opinions on what is "a lot" of money, and we both grew up incredibly comfortable-wealthy. So i don't think FJ will ever be able to agree on a definition. 

 

[Gillyweed]

I grew up very fortunate and upper-middle class/wealthy. A lot of my friends in school were not as lucky as I was, and ofte times my dad would ask why I didn't go do x with my friends, and I'd have to explain that they couldn't afford that. Even now, my friends and I are trying to decide where to live next year. My one friend can't afford to move off-campus, and my other is having a hard time understanding that, as he comes from a well off family. 

I just think it's really annoying and somewhat rude when a well-off person doesn't realize that not everyone is as fortunate as them. 

[MsSaylor]

Reminds me of that episode of friends where Phoebe, Joey and Rachel have to explain to Monica, Ross and Chandler that they cant afford fancy dinners and Hootie and the Blowfish concerts. The more well off friends dont really get it.

Theres a horrible childrens book series called the Top Notch Bears that soneone bought my kids once. These little Bear Bitches are spoiled rotten and theres no reasoning behind why someone would write this series. All it is is these Bear brother and sister playing tennis on their private courts, having a fabulous beach day, always having extra money for treats etc. its super weird but now whenever my husband and I joke about not having money for a frivolous luxury we always say " who do they think we are? The Top Notch Bears?!!"

[Glasgowghirl]

For me owning a private plane does seem something for the super wealthy but I work part time in KFC and have a student loan, circumstances have meant I had to drop to part time work and now at 30 I am just in a position to save up to move out from my parents house. That being said I don't think those who save up and can afford to pay for a plane should be made to feel guilty about it. 

[LovelyLuna]

@MsSaylor I love it.  We were at the zoo once (MIL buys the whole family passes for Hanukah, we live on seasonal income where half the year is a bit hard) and we heard a lady on the phone say “I had to take a little bit of money out of the Swiss bank account”.  Now whenever money comes up we say in a high pitched snooty voice "we can pay with a little bit of money from the Swiss bank account” and then laugh and laugh.

[jjmennonite]

Interesting discussion. I consider myself very privileged, although my retirement income is well below the poverty level. It helps that own my place, paid off my mortgage by downsizing to a tiny hotel room sized condo, downtown, close to a train station, so I don't have a car. 

I grew up poor, ended up paying for my degreewith student loans. My passion is traveling. I've indulged this passion hugely, in my life. I worked on a sheep farm, in New Zealand, went to Australia for three weeks and hitchhiker around NZ for 4 weeks, before I got my degree. Even then, I was aware that people were full of shit, when they told me I was so lucky I could travel. Yes, I am blessed with good health, but otherwise, travel was a choice, not luck. 

I worked in South Africa, travelled across Africa, and worked in the U.K. for a rediculously high income, when I got there, broke, after traveling across Africa. I did a few trips, from there. I bicycled around Turkey for 2 months, spending about $15 a day on food and accommodation. 

I came back to Canada, and at one point I was single and pregnant and unemployed and scared shitless, but I had the baby, knowing that the worst thing that could happen to us, in Canada, was we would be on welfare. We would still have hot and cold running water and a flush toilet. Those are luxuries, for most of the world. 

I raised my child, acquired a house and a mortgage and I had a good income and spent lots on sports for my daughter, and trips. She went to university on student loans, because they are interest free, and I have to pay interest on money that I borrow. Again, we are privileged to live in a place that provides that. 

Three years ago, I lost my job, and the economy took a downturn and it's hugely ageist and sexist out there, so no joy finding a new job. I rented out my place , to my daughter (she got free rent) and her boyfriend and a roommate, and went to Turkey and taught English for 8 months. The rent and my tiny tiny pension covered the mortgage and condo fees, and the flight and TESOL course to get me started, in Turkey. 

I decided to rebrand myself, as retired, instead of unemployed, so I came back, and sold my place and bought a small place, with no mortgage. My daughter and her boyfriend came to Turkey, and we traveled a bit there. I paid for her trip, because I had promised her a trip, before I lost my job. I paid for a three day barefoot cruise for the three of us and two crowns on my front teeth, with my with my (pitiful by North American standards) wages, in Turkey. Again, I'm privileged to have good health and a pension. I went to Sarajevo, overland to Venice, and flew to Amsterdam, on my way back from Turkey.

I spent 4 months in South America, early this year, and bought all my flights on points, that I collect by using my credit card for everything, and stayed in hostels. I just came back from a month in Albania. It cost about $20 a day there to stay in modest places and eat and drink as much as we could hold. So I have been away for about 5 months, this year.

I can't quite live on my pension, but after I 'spent my condo' I got a little part time job for a bit, and withdrew some of my retirement savings. Now I'm moving in with my boyfriend, and will have a little rental income, and might get another part time job. 

Such a long post, sorry. But I don't know where I fit, since my pension income is about $12000 a year, but I'm blessed with health. I'm very privileged, as I said, because I travel lots and have a great home. I was hoping to help my daughter with her student loans, but that won't happen, but she and her boyfriend will be accountants and will do very well. 

When my parents died, we each had to pay $500 to bury mom, and 5 years later, we each got abou $500 from dad's so called estate. 

Any of us who have a warm house and running water and a flush toilet are privileged. Those of us who have health and medical care are extra privileged. That in no way negates the anxiety and struggles to make ends meet, for some. 

JMHO. 

[Iamtheway]

9 hours ago, SapphireSlytherin said:

So, yeah - we have privilege, but compared to others - we don't.

Comparison is truly the thief of joy. When we had nothing other than the roof over our heads and a 20-year-old car, we were jealous of others - but there were people who were jealous of us. It's all relative.

It took me a LONG TIME to get over the "keeping up with the Joneses" mentality. Just because their house is bigger or their car is more expensive or their clothes are all name brand, doesn't mean they're better than I am. 

Or that they are happier.

I know that we are extremly well of compared to most of the people in the world. And I’d say we’re reasonably well of in Sweden too. I am so, so greatful for everything that I have. I was lucky to be born in a country where I have free healthcare and free education. My parents didn’t earn much but enough for us to never have to worry about anything important. And if there was any worrying going on they made sure us kids never knew about it. They were always loving and supportive. I’d say knowing that I have family that will always have my back is the biggest privilege I have.

Mr Way and I both earn a decent wage working jobs that we enjoy and we live in a part of the country that’s not that expensive. And in a country where child care is super cheap. We never have to worry about paying our bills or putting food on the table. We’re not big spenders and don’t have expensive hobbies, but we can eat out now and then, do a bit of shopping (actually that’s just me) and still save some money every month and afford to go visit his family in Australia.

I still often think about how I will spend my millions when I win the Euro jackpott though. I’ll be the best rich person! 

I never think about how I can’t actually win since I never play ...

[hand holder]

On 12/1/2017 at 1:05 PM, finnlassie said:

A cheapo Kool-Aid?

I need to get back to my cult game. I can't remember if Cults podcast already went through Jamestown or not... totally recommend it to people though, Jesus Christ do people get freaky and use Jesus Christ in their cultist shenanigans.

I'm currently very into this podcast! They haven't gotten to Jonestown yet but they are covering the FLDS which I find fascinating (my gateway to cults!) and I learned about a few I didn't know about before, like the Ant Hill Kids. 

HIGHLY recommend the podcast!

 

[SeekingAdventure]

does anyone know if J&A actually OWN the plane they fly?

 

I work for an airline and most of our commercial pilots have licences for smaller planes as well, and a couple of months ago, I was invited to fly with some of my colleagues, and the pilot would've rented a plane for about 5 of us. would've been about 100€ per person for going there and back, and take off and landing rights on international airports..

 

@jjmennonite it sounds like your life has been quite adventurous! Good for you doing all the things you wanted to do. I always hear 'you're so lucky you can afford to travel that much' as well, but then again, I save money by not binge-drinking and chain-smoking every weekend (or more often  than that) - compared to the people who think I am sooo rich that I can afford that. Nothing against chain smokers or anything..  just don't do it next to me  but if I decide to spend my money seeing the world instead of poisioning it, i don'T see how that makes me rich

[SilverBeach]

Wealth is defined by net worth, not income. Read "The Millionaire Next Door" for good illustrations of this.

[allthegoodnamesrgone]

49 minutes ago, SeekingAdventure said:

does anyone know if J&A actually OWN the plane they fly?

I assumed it was one of the planes Boob owns, they have what 4 or 5 of them. 

[SilverBeach]

Wealthy is when you don't work for your money but your money works for you.

Wealth cannot be identified by possessions. Warren Buffett lives in the starter house he bought in 1958. Look at all the broke-ass celebrities who had the trappings of wealth but no money. 

There was a time when if I made what I made now, I would have thought I was rich. Reality is far different. The middle class is America's bitch. I came from a family that had the necessities only, my mom raised four children on her own and it was a struggle. So, I appreciate where I am now, at 62, but it has not been easy getting here. I still have debt, so not wealthy at all, lol.

I kept my last car for 13 years (yay Toyota) and currently have a 2010 Camry that I will drive until the wheels fall off. Cars are not a priority to me, but everyone gets to choose their own priorities. 

[Furbabiesonly]

This is such a fascinating conversation, especially regarding planes and their feasibility. I grew up middle class, tending towards upper. My family was long time Air Force, so my grandpa and uncle having their own planes was normal. 

Of course, appearance of wealth and actually having it are very different things. While my parents got degrees and established themselves in well paying careers, my uncle coasted from here to there while relying on my grandparents reputation. To this day he is “retired” from a subpar career with a stay at home wife and a massive accumulation of debt.  Still has his plane. 

[Shadoewolf]

My dream car is a fully paid off 2017 or 2018 Toyota Camry. The redesign on it is gorgeous and they hold good resale value. That or a new Subaru Forrester. I would happily buy the house we are currently renting. It's older and needs updating but for the size and school district, I wouldn't feel like I'm losing out.

Wealthy to me is generational money or like, Mark Zuckerberg. 

My cousin I would consider upper class and she kinda drives me nuts. They get an IPhone and IPad every time a new one comes out, even if the old one is still just fine. She spent $1,000 EACH on her 3 kids just for pants for school. That didn't include shirts or shoes. She just bought her daughter a new Jeep Wrangler and is getting a custom paint job done on it, the kid isn't even 16 and doesn't have a license. None of her kids work because according to her they don't need to because she can provide what they need. I grew up with some kids like this, and when they were eventually cut off financially, they really struggled trying to keep jobs and llive within their means.  

Which brings up the Duggar kids. Will we see Ben or Derick actually work if TLC finally dries out? The end of the IPhones? A car for everybody? Would the planes get sold off? Jessa says she likes her little house so at least that's not a big deal but Jilly has had access to 2 huge houses just for the 3 of them. Downsizing to what looks like an apartment for the Cross Church program might be a bit of a shock. The older kuds remember the lean times but Jackson on down probably won't. How would they cope with such a change?

[sansan]

On 12/7/2017 at 4:06 PM, SapphireSlytherin said:

Wealthy means never having to ask the price of something before buying it.

Wealthy means not having to "save up" for a big expense.

Wealthy means not having to get a loan to buy a car or a house.

Wealthy means not having to choose between Option A and Option B - wealthy gets both.

Wealthy means exclusive private schools without loans.

Wealthy means college education without grants/scholarships/loans.

Wealthy means not having to work while you're in school/college.

 

Yes and no, kinda. We basically are fairly conservative so we don't spend willy nilly. We have been able to buy cars outright but also nice used ones. Put one kid through college without loans but she worked full time to cover her personal expenses and lived at home and went to local university. Other kid tried school but it wasn't for him. I think he makes more money than all of us, so good for him. Basically to some people where I grew up in the barrios, I'm frigging wealthy but in the general world we are not wealthy , I guess generally it is perspective . 

[Daisy0322]

1 hour ago, Shadoewolf said:

....if TLC finally dries out? ....

I always love this topic BUT I'm starting to think the duggars made a deal with the illuminatti and will never be taken off air haha 

seriously, their show is boring af, they hardly have anyone that'll advertise during their show times anymore, and I don't even think they getvthst many viewers compared to most shows. AND THEY ARE STILL GOING STRONG. how  does TLC even keep them on from a financial stand point? ...It's witch craft.

[Shadoewolf]

As a practising witch, I solemnly swear I have nothing to do with keeping them on air!! (Truly. No Pagan in their right mind would support Duggar insanity!)

[Daisy0322]

4 minutes ago, Shadoewolf said:

As a practising witch, I solemnly swear I have nothing to do with keeping them on air!! (Truly. No Pagan in their right mind would support Duggar insanity!)

Haha I'll stick to blaming the illuminati then  for real though, there's something going on behind the scenes it seems like keeping them as a "public  interest".

[Shadoewolf]

Agreed. I wonder (and this is wild speculation here, I might get smacked by the mods)  if it's things the crew and producers MIGHT have seen that maybe they should've reported and didn't, making them complicit. JB saying " you knew x, y, and z was going on and didn't say anything so keep the show or we throw you under the bus. And people will believe us because Jesus." I can't think of any other reason besides some sort of blackmail that TLC would keep them.

[Coconut Flan]

Carry on here: