Duggars by the Dozen 31: Dicky Duggars Do Damage

[laPapessaGiovanna]

4 minutes ago, Fascinated said:

 

@laPapessaGiovanna, my take on the Duggar victims is that they themselves have downplayed the effects of the abuse. It is not for us to determine how they should behave. It is up to them.  Their parents suck and no doubt contributed to some degree to this situation. But we have to let these women deal with it on their own terms. Just because we are outraged doesn’t necessarily mean that they are. Maybe they are struggling mightily with the repercussions, but they have not publically indicated such.

Exactly what I've said for many pages now and what Fluffy vehemently objected to. Did you read the thread?

[Ms Tilly]

3 hours ago, singsingsing said:

But saying that they don't 'deserve' compensation, or that they obviously weren't that badly abused, or obviously didn't experience trauma, because of the way they act or speak now, is wrong and (in my opinion) harmful to victims of abuse in general.

Yet. You did this exact thing to the OP. 

[laPapessaGiovanna]

Just now, Ms Tilly said:

Yet. You did this exact thing to the OP. 

Quotes please.

[Ms Tilly]

3 hours ago, VelociRapture said:

I feel they honestly deserved the pushback they got.

You define name-calling (asshole), multiple fuck yous and driving someone out of a forum....as PUSHBACK? Come on. 

 

2 hours ago, SamiKatz said:

Sometimes people should be called out for their shit. 

Again, 'calling people out for their shit' should NEVER resort to multiple "fuck yous" and childish name calling. 

'Pushback' and 'calling people out' is one thing; verbal abuse and bullying is quite another. IMHO.

 

[Ms Tilly]

1 hour ago, SilverBeach said:

I agree that absent the reprehensible content presented in this topic, there is no need for rudeness, condescension, or disrespect such as what happened in the discussion about calculating pregnancy duration. Some of us had no experience with including time before fertilization in the calculation, my ob way back when gave me a due date and never told me how many weeks I was in.

We caught hell in that thread, and were practically called stupid by other members.

There's a thread for FJ culture, that might be a good place for some of this discussion.

May I have a link to this thread? I would greatly like to read it. Thank you!

[singsingsing]

18 minutes ago, Ms Tilly said:

Yet. You did this exact thing to the OP. 

I absolutely did not. I can only assume that you're confusing me with another person, because I can't think of anything I said that could even be remotely construed as implying that.

[laPapessaGiovanna]

20 minutes ago, Ms Tilly said:

You define name-calling (asshole), multiple fuck yous and driving someone out of a forum....as PUSHBACK? Come on. 

 

Again, 'calling people out for their shit' should NEVER resort to multiple "fuck yous" and childish name calling. 

'Pushback' and 'calling people out' is one thing; verbal abuse and bullying is quite another. IMHO.

 

I'm still waiting for the quotes of "everyone" minimising Fluffy's abuse. Now you can add examples of bullying and all those nasty multiple fuck yous to my request.

[Ms Tilly]

43 minutes ago, laPapessaGiovanna said:

Quotes for "everyone" please or it didn't happen. Telling her that being a victim herself doesn't give her a pass for judging other victims isn't minimising her trauma.

Telling her that doing the Victimhood Olympics doesn't make sense and is very unhelpful isn't minimising her trauma.

It isn't. FJ doesn't provide support to victims nor is a self help group nor a safe space. It's clearly stated in the guidelines.

This didn't happen because she's a victim herself, nor because she needs help. This happened because she felt free to treat other victims as lesser victims just because their last name is Duggar. She accused then of "revictimising themselves", of "controlling their narrative" and so on. Do you think it was fine?

ETA I'd particularly appreciate if you provided examples of how she was shut out. She's under no restriction to post again whatever she likes and she wasn't told to shup up even if she was spewing some hateful shit.

Hey, if defending childish name-calling, telling other sexual abuse victims to fuck off, and being condescending is the hill you want to die on - don't let me stop you. 

You want examples? LOL

37 minutes ago, laPapessaGiovanna said:

Exactly what I've said for many pages now and what Fluffy vehemently objected to. Did you read the thread?

And there you go AGAIN with the condescension. 

When people show you who they are, believe them the first time - Maya Angelou 

I've no desire to argue with you. Ain't no body got time for that.

[laPapessaGiovanna]

3 minutes ago, Ms Tilly said:

Hey, if defending childish name-calling, telling other sexual abuse victims to fuck off, and being condescending is the hill you want to die on - don't let me stop you. 

You want examples? LOL

Still no quotes eh? Lol

[Ms Tilly]

8 minutes ago, laPapessaGiovanna said:

I'm still waiting for the quotes of "everyone" minimising Fluffy's abuse. Now you can add examples of bullying and all those nasty multiple fuck yous to my request.

There are none so blind as those who will not see. - John Heywood

[laPapessaGiovanna]

3 minutes ago, Ms Tilly said:

There are none so blind as those who will not see. - John Heywood

 no quotes and a lame excuse. And I am the condescending one of course. 

In any case we are disrupting the thread and guidelines forbid it. If you can't find those quotes I'm done with this. Should you want to go on I have to ask you post in the Community Discussion Forum, thank you.

[laPapessaGiovanna]

Note to members: posts have been moved to Community Discussion.

 

[Nikedagain?]

On 10/16/2017 at 8:43 PM, KelseyAnn said:

Let's move this thread along. 

Does anyone know of any fun Halloween crafts I do with my consumers? Keep in mind two of them are severely developmentally disabled. 

OH GOD thank you. Reading this has kicked in some severrreeee anxiety. yuck.

My daughter and my respite pal both have autism. So we got some rocks (the kindness rocks are a big thing around here, you paint them and hide them, etc) and we made candy corn rocks. Very easy because it's really just three colors and I did lines for them. They're drying now, and on Saturday, we will go hide them. 

[samurai_sarah]

Please take further discussions about FJ culture to the appropriate thread in Community Discussion to prevent further disruption. Thank you.

 

[JillsFlowerHeadband]

9 hours ago, Fascinated said:

my take on the Duggar victims is that they themselves have downplayed the effects of the abuse.

This is a common (albeit unhealthy) coping mechanism, especially if the victim is ashamed of what happened to them (as the Duggar daughters would have most likely been considering that IBLP culture shames the victims as somehow having tempted their abuser. But... unhealthy coping mechanisms =/= “revictimizing”. I don’t think it was fair or necessary for the poster in question to equate the two, especially because the Duggar daughters were children who received no real therapy or counseling beyond “pray and don’t be bitter”. That just seemed ugly and unnecessary. 

My other point of anger was that if we are going to call out fundamentalists on things like downplaying the effects of abuse or forcing everyone to react in a cookie cutter fashion to external events (“work on your contentment” “cheerful countenance” etc) then it is beyond hypocritical for us to engage in the exact same behaviors. I believe that itself does make FJ look bad. 

Aaaaaanyway, yes, I got pretty heated at the dismissive and self righteous tone of the posters in question and I probably should have dialed it back... but as the wife of a survivor it hit so close to home. 

ETA I didn’t see the last mod post because the pages are loading so slowly on my phone (our internet is spotty this morning because the company is doing some work in our neighborhood) so if this isn’t the appropriate place for the content I apologize and can it be moved? 

Also my nails are now a pretty copper because fall has kicked in, Mr JFH has the day off so he’s on Dad duty and I got some time to re-polish them (yay!) 

[SassyPants]

2 hours ago, JillsFlowerHeadband said:

Also my nails are now a pretty copper because fall has kicked in, Mr JFH has the day off so he’s on Dad duty and I got some time to re-polish them (yay!) 

UG, the nails. I need to do my toes- when is it EVER a good time to do the nails? Too early in the day? No, I have too much to do and I'll F them up. Too late? No, too close to bed time and I'll F them up. It is impossible I tell you!!!!

[Jaeniduggar]

Also, if the nails would stay pretty, say for 6 days, I'd do it more often. But honestly my nails look bad on day 3 (don't have a dish washer). So for me it's not worth it most of the time.

[cascarones]

My toenails have been painted continuously since I was 12 or so, I just don't like how my feet look bare. Unfortunately, our kitty's favorite toy in the world is said toes, she doesn't bother Mr. C's feet. I now have to lie on my back legs straight up in the air to let the polish dry before she loses her composure, attacks them and runs away trilling. 

A girl I know is using constant nail painting to lose weight for her wedding, she's lost quite a bit from it since wet nails prevent her from absent minded snacking. She's down 90 lbs at her last post and it's the only thing she's kept constant, going on and off diets, not always making it to the gym. Plus, now she's really good at painting her nails!

[JillsFlowerHeadband]

2 hours ago, Jaeniduggar said:

Also, if the nails would stay pretty, say for 6 days, I'd do it more often. But honestly my nails look bad on day 3 (don't have a dish washer). So for me it's not worth it most of the time.

I hear you, I usually don’t polish my nails much because I’m constantly washing my hands at work (CNA). Right now I’m on maternity leave (although still washing my hands just as much, ha!) and even though I know they probably won’t last I just wanted a little pick-me-up. (My polish from last week was admittedly pretty gross but hey, it looked nice when I first put it on  ) 

[Chickenbutt]

Getting back to the lawsuit for a minute. I have a very honest question....no snark.

If the Duggars profess to forgive, including their own molester, why are they not forgiving and praying for the people that have wronged them? Does forgiveness only extend to "their own"?

[2manyKidzzz]

15 minutes ago, Chickenbutt said:

Getting back to the lawsuit for a minute. I have a very honest question....no snark.

If the Duggars profess to forgive, including their own molester, why are they not forgiving and praying for the people that have wronged them? Does forgiveness only extend to "their own"?

Excellent question actually. I don't know how that works for them. 

[Eternalbluepearl]

14 minutes ago, Chickenbutt said:

If the Duggars profess to forgive, including their own molester, why are they not forgiving and praying for the people that have wronged them? Does forgiveness only extend to "their own"?

I truly have this same exact question. How can Josh be forgiven because of Christianity, but not someone who told what Josh did?  My only guess is that if dollar signs are involved, no one is forgiven. I have no clue though. The Duggars brand of religion/spirituality/theology/bullshit sucks. 

[Jess]

Just now, Eternalbluepearl said:

I truly have this same exact question. How can Josh be forgiven because of Christianity, but not someone who told what Josh did?  My only guess is that if dollar signs are involved, no one is forgiven. I have no clue though. The Duggars brand of religion/spirituality/theology/bullshit sucks. 

I guess they could say because they haven't asked for forgiveness. As far as I know they haven't said they regret it. (And I doubt the lawyers would let them). Josh asked god to forgive him. 

*please note I don't believe this is good enough but it's what they are taught and what they were likely told by the adults in their lives for years.

[Jinder Roles]

@Chickenbutt I think it's because they have strong feelings to being outed (rightly so).

The thing about ideology is that you can never 100% follow it all the time. This is probably something the Duggars will never openly acknowledge and so, to us, they go about contradicting themselves. If you asked them, they probably would give an answer relating back to scripture and justice about why they sued. They can't ever just be angry. 

Edited to say: Some of the repsonses to Fluffy14 (like insinuating they were lying about their own abuse) were out of line, but Fluffy was completely out of line, and the people who responded were totally reasonable in their anger. 

The idea that you have to be 'nice' when someone offends you is some respectability politics bullshit. 

[SilverBeach]

I hope all of you read the lengthy description Fluffy gave of her abuse prior to her edit, before admonishing anyone who questioned it. That is all.